Talk:KFC/Archive 7

KFC in Zambia
KFC came to Zambia in mid 2011 ?? By the end of 2011, there were 4 outlets! All outlets are in shopping malls in the capital city, Lusaka !! The first was in the Manda Hill Mall, the first "proper" South African-inspired mall in Zambia & were followed in quick succession, in 3 newer malls in the last quarter of 2011, Freedom Way Southgate Mall, Levy Mall & finally, the Makeni Mall !! The unique feature, at least at the Manda Hill Mall, is the availability of a Mash substitute, white cornmeal/mealie/polenta mash, locally called "nshima" !!("ugali"in E.Afica/"pap" in South Africa)

On verification, these facts should be added to –the main article & the map amended !!

Stella (02/01/12) Bonafides: Lusaka resident & KFC consumer — Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.223.119.129 (talk) 12:21, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Finger Lickin' Good
No mention in the article. nuff said.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 01:55, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

PFK
Is it notable that in Quebec, Canada, KFC is known as PFK ("Poulet frit Kentucky")? This is an exception to France and other Francophone countries, where the international corporate brand "KFC" prevails. See http://www.kfc.ca/home/fr/. 71.67.98.1 (talk) 01:31, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

What Happened?
Somebody has removed a massive amount of detail from the page, like menu items. I was going to revert their edits but maybe they're correct in what they've done.--Mjs1991 (talk) 04:06, 18 June 2012 (UTC)
 * A lot of that info was unsourced; and the menu items come right up against WP:UNDUE and WP:TRIVIA. We're not here to duplicate their website. We should discuss their menu items in general, and discuss major launches that have gotten reliable coverage (for example, their repeated failures to launch non-fried chicken would probably be fine if sourceable, as would the faux outcry over the Double Down). Qwyrxian (talk) 07:16, 18 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Yup, it was me. Cite WP:UNDUE and WP:TRIVIA. A lot of that stuff was just company promotional stuff, or trivia, or unsourced. It's really not that important what they sold in April 2006 across every individual country in the world. Also the menu detail was a little too US-centric. I have done quite a lot of tidying up in the last 24 hours on that page, menu item removal being the most conspicuous.Farrtj (talk) 20:23, 18 June 2012 (UTC)

Advertising and logos
I would like to sugesst you look at the US Patent and Trademark office for information on its logos and trademarks. The TESS system has quite a large database of this stuff. --Jeremy (blah blah • I did it!) 05:35, 2 July 2012 (UTC)

Ambiguity
I fear that the American use of "sandwich" to mean what the rest of the world would call a chickenburger may be un-necessarily ambiguous. In British English, a sandwich refers exclusively to a cold snack, almost exclusively between two slices of thin sliced bread. Surely in America people understand what a "chicken burger" is? If so, I propose changing back to the term, to broaden understanding, and reduce ambiguity. Farrtj (talk) 22:32, 10 July 2012 (UTC)


 * I understand your concern, but the rules on varieties of English take precedent. As the company is American, the terminology usage should follow the American form. In the US, a "burger" is a hot sandwich made from ground meat that has been formed into a patty. A sandwich is any food that is served between two pieces of bread, this also follows the form of chicken sandwich, fish sandwich, etc. A whole piece of meat that has been breaded and fried is not a considered burger. --Jeremy (blah blah • I did it!) 05:14, 11 July 2012 (UTC)


 * The American use of sandwich is peculiar to the USA. It should not be used except in an exclusively US context. KFC is international, and so the American term should not be used.  Incidentally the word "critiques" is incorrect - in the context the correct word is "criticism".203.184.41.226 (talk) 07:52, 12 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Its the US and Canada, actually. The issue here is that there are multitudes of international companies based in the US and in all of those articles, the US terminology is used. That is again the rules of WP:Engvar. --Jeremy (blah blah • I did it!) 16:41, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Why not mention both of them and provide the reasoning for using them in Notes section. Regards,   theTigerKing   17:06, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Tiger King makes a fair point. As per WP:Engvar, "Wikipedia tries to find words that are common to all varieties of English. Insisting on a single term or a single usage as the only correct option does not serve the purposes of an international encyclopedia." Farrtj (talk) 17:07, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * You could always use the second name in parenthesis ie, chicken sandwich (burger). Also, the market size for KFC is for profits China, US, then others. The Chinese market actually is the fastest growing market for the company and now has almost as many stores as all of Europe. The amount of store locations is US, China, then the others. (based on the half dozen articles I just read)
 * In similar articles the international section used the English varieties of the particular market. We could do chicken burger (chicken sandwich [US]) or the like.--Jeremy (blah blah • I did it!) 17:28, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, almost three quarters of KFC's sales are outside of the USA now. I like your "chicken burger (chicken sandwich [US])" suggestion Jeremy. Farrtj (talk) 17:48, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I believe notes would be the best thing to do. Regards,   theTigerKing   19:14, 12 July 2012 (UTC)

Works for me. --Jeremy (blah blah • I did it!) 20:10, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I have affected the change. Not throughout the whole article, as that would be unnecessary, but on the first few examples. Hope that suits everyone. Farrtj (talk) 21:16, 12 July 2012 (UTC)

Spelling error
I think the word 'my' in the phrase "largely my car" in the history section should actually be the word "by". byahhh

KFC in East Africa
KFC also opened restaurants last year in Kenya as well as one in both Tanzania and Uganda. This information needs to be added and the map updated. Useless when an article is locked and therefore goes quickly out of date. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.135.178.69 (talk) 01:40, 12 August 2012 (UTC)
 * IT has to be protected because it is the subject of regular vandalism. In order to add the info you mention, please provide a reliable source. Qwyrxian (talk) 03:25, 12 August 2012 (UTC)

Discerning choice in the UK
There's a rather suspicious statement in the UK & Ireland operations section - 'In the UK, KFC is considered to be the more discerning choice for fast food compared to its major rivals McDonald's and Burger King.'

This seems to be rather anecdotal at best. Anecdotally, as someone in the UK, I would suggest that the popular perception is in fact the complete opposite. I would suggest the existing statement either needs tagging as 'citation needed' or for it to be stricken from the article on the grounds it is an opinion rather than factual information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.15.180.106 (talk) 15:46, 22 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for noticing that. I've removed it per WP:NPOV as an unsourced personal opinions. Qwyrxian (talk) 22:35, 22 August 2012 (UTC)

KFC Argentina
KFC is scheduled to open a restaurant in Argentina before the end of the year. Can someone please mark Argentina in this map http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/03/KFC_world_map1.png/800px-KFC_world_map1.png ? Here are my sources (spanish): http://negocios.iprofesional.com/notas/130690-Tras-el-regreso-de-Wendys-Kentucky-Fried-Chicken-llega-a-la-Argentina, http://www.lanacion.com.ar/1504484-las-segundas-partes-pueden-ser-buenas , http://www.facebook.com/KFCArgentina (official facebook page). --Gonzaloges (talk) 14:57, 18 September 2012 (UTC)

Biggest KFC in the world. The biggest KFC Restaurant was opened in Baku, Azerbaijan on 25 October 2012. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.132.99.135 (talk) 18:10, 29 October 2012 (UTC)

His Wife AND his Wife
"It is believed that Sanders only ever shared the recipe with his wife Claudia, Pete Harman and his wife, and Jack C. Massey." There is either a redundant backup wife, or just the same word mentioned twice... Someone might wanna correct that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.188.49.62 (talk) 21:32, 5 November 2012 (UTC)
 * It's clear from the grammar and punctuation that the second wife is Pete Harman's. Farrtj (talk) 21:38, 5 November 2012 (UTC)

"Less than a handful"
This phrase is ridiculous - ambiguous and meaningless. A 'handful' in itself is an ambiguous word so to qualify something as being 'less than' a handful is absurd. I haven't got the necessary privileges to edit the page so could somebody change "Less than a handful of employees..." in the Original Recipe section to "Only a handful of employees..." — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chazwozzler (talk • contribs) 23:16, 5 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Well spotted. Edit made. Farrtj (talk) 23:24, 5 November 2012 (UTC)

Poundstone
Poundstone is helpful when it comes to Sanders' cooking methods (which were never actually a secret: every single KFC cook obviously knew what they were), but his claim to "reverse engineer" the secret recipe is bogus. You can't reverse engineer herbs and spices. Farrtj (talk) 15:56, 5 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I haven't read the book (nor have I worked at KFC) but it's not the methods or steps of the recipe that's a secret; it's the 11 herbs and spices. And it is possible to take the mixture and scientifically discern what the ingredients are. --Musdan77 (talk) 19:21, 5 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Well he's wrong. If KFC say that the herbs and spices are in there, then they're in there. What are Poundstone's credentials anyway? All sorts of conspiracy theorists can get books published. Farrtj (talk) 19:32, 5 December 2012 (UTC)


 * That's a rather specious argument. Corporations make dubious assertions regarding their trade secrets all the time; the only thing that matters is whether Poundstone's results have been independently verified. Given that Poundstone's primary claim to fame is the Big Secrets series, it seems sensible to afford his claim some mention in the article body. As for "reverse engineering", I'm not sure what you're trying to claim here. Are you nitpicking over what constitutes "reverse engineering"? I'm sure in the modern sense a majority would agree that taking a given mixture and deducing what its ingredients are (which is what Poundstone did) falls under that category. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) (talk) 05:16, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

Extraordinary claims such as Poundstone's, deserve extraordinary references. And it is 30 years since Poundstone's book was published. How come no other evidence has emerged during this time? Farrtj (talk) 20:01, 7 December 2012 (UTC)


 * And if the spice bags that KFC franchisees pay top dollar from the company to obtain contained only salt and pepper and flour, do you not think these franchisees would have clubbed together to sue KFC for fraud by now? Farrtj (talk) 20:02, 7 December 2012 (UTC)


 * That's not for us to decide. We need not present Poundstone's findings as fact; however, if they have been remarked upon by reliable secondary sources, then we ought to at least note that he published research on them. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) (talk) 12:20, 8 December 2012 (UTC)

Sandwich/burger
This was discussed a long time ago here, and we agreed to compromise on "chicken burger", with "(chicken sandwich [US])" mentioned for clarity in the first instance. Burger is preferred over sandwich, after a brief check, in the UK and Ireland, Australia, Singapore, New Zealand, Hong Kong, South Africa, Malaysia, the Phillipines, India, Turkey. The issue here is clarity.

         

"Chicken burger" also seems to be the term in popular use in Canada

Farrtj (talk) 21:26, 5 December 2012 (UTC)


 * How is this for "clarity"? (by the way, you're first link redirects back here) --any more than how I had it? To the contrary, everyone knows what a sandwich is, but "burger" is obscure. The use here does not follow any dictionary definitions I've read (as well as the article that it's erroneously linked to). And, as this article states, KFC is headquartered in the U.S. and its largest market is the U.S., so the article should be mainly from the American perspective (including using American English).


 * Also, you've explained your reason for reverting the first part of my edit but not the second part. --Musdan77 (talk) 02:59, 6 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Our preference for the use of US English in this article does not mean we should unduly confuse international readers. "Chicken sandwich" is a uniquely American idiom (in the UK, for instance, this would unambiguously refer to cold chicken and sliced bread, as stated previously), and the foodstuff in question is known predominantly around the world as a chicken burger (nitpicking about the precise definition of "sandwich" or "burger" is neither here nor there, as we simply follow prevailing us rather than trying to be normative) as Farrtj has indicated with the above references. The only real question is whether to say "chicken sandwich (chicken burger outside of the US)" or "chicken burger (chicken sandwich in the US)". Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) (talk) 05:07, 6 December 2012 (UTC)