Talk:Katy Perry/Archive 6

Semi-protected edit request on 2 January 2018
Hello--

In the intro of this article when you talk about Witness at the end of paragraph 2, it should be mentioned that it debuted #1. I know you mention it further down on the page but its an important piece of information to reiterate for people who need a quick snapshot of the significant details. It is mentioned in almost all other artists' first few paragraph summaries when talking about their most recent works, why not Katy's? It would be nice to keep the consistency.

Under the "2013–2015: Prism and Super Bowl XLIX halftime show" subheading, you should note that Katy entertained 2 million fans throughout the Prismatic World Tour.

In the "2016–present" subheading, it should be noted that Witness has accumulated over 2 billion global streams since release. It would also be greatly appreciated if you mention that Witness World Wide was critically acclaimed, as it was named one of the Top 10 Television Shows of 2017 by Time.

Lastly, I believe that there should be some sort of Impact or Legacy tab for Katy. If for some reason you decide not to, at least use the information I provided in some way. Despite how one may feel towards her, she does have a legacy and it is Wikipedia's obligation to keep things non-bias. If needed, I can provide some basics for you to potentially utilize:

Katy is one of the best-selling music artists with over 129.3 million certified units sold worldwide. Some of her singles including Dark Horse, Firework, Roar, and I Kissed A Girl are also among the best-selling worldwide. Spawning nine #1s through three albums is legacy worthy. Throughout three albums, she's tied with Janet Jackson with 33 weeks at #1.

Katy is one of the largest living forces on social media with over 245,576,549 combined followers across channels. Her impact doesn't go unnoticed, as Time named her among the 25 Most Influential People on the Internet.

In a 2011 Women's Impact Report by Variety, Katy was named "Billboard’s Queen of Pop". Billboard Magazine named Katy the "New Queen of Pop" in the July 31, 2010 issue of the magazine. In a 2015 article, Christopher Rosa of VH1 described Teenage Dream as "The Most Important Pop Album Of The Last 10 Years". The legacy Katy left behind with Teenage Dream is undeniable. In an interview with Billboard, it was said that "Katy gave a soundtrack to a generation and provided music that clearly defined the spirit of the American public in those years".

Both Teenage Dream and Prism were named among the Greatest of All Time Billboard 200 Albums by Women. Additionally, Dark Horse was named among the Greatest of All Time Hot 100 Songs. Katy is considered to be a hitmaker, as she is recognized as the #4 Greatest Pop Songs Artist of All Time with only 4 studio albums under her belt (Katy Hudson is not recognized by Billboard). The Frisky credits Katy with resurrecting pop from the early aughts doldrums and serving "the freshest pop anthems since Mariah". Four songs by Katy are featured on Billboard's Greatest of All Time Hot 100 Songs by Women list, which is the most for any artist since Mariah Carey who has six songs featured on the list. Itsevren (talk) 15:42, 2 January 2018 (UTC)--Itsevren (talk) 18:09, 2 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Yellow check.svg Partly done: Added first two sub-requests, left the rest for discussion., this is a really, really large edit request and the whole "legacy/impact" section you'd like to add needs discussion and to gain consensus form other editors before it's added. You are almost able to edit this page yourself, so I suggest that you wait a week until you get autoconfirmed and discuss adding this yourself. Good luck.  Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 18:31, 2 January 2018 (UTC)


 * Regarding the other points:
 * Album streams are probably better for the Witness album article if anywhere, though I'm not convinced they're worth mentioning when it's not like she had any record with its total.
 * The Time TV Shows list is actually talking about her Witness World Wide live-stream, and doesn't even mention the tour. While that ranking could perhaps be included in the page, I'm not sure whether it's better for the "Witness and American Idol" section or "Public Image" (which mentions its "Most Influential People on the Internet" ranking along with Twitter stats). Either way, I'll add that link for social media totals into "Public image" as the fourth highest combined number is quite a feat (seems OK when it's run by RIAA).
 * We need sources specifically indicating the songs you've mentioned are among the globe's best-sellers in order to mention such a claim (preferably including worldwide totals).
 * As for a legacy section, Katy making the "Most Influential People on the Internet" list certainly makes the case for having one stronger than it otherwise would be (particuarly before Witness was released). Like Eggishorn said, though, such a section would first need consensus to include, especially given how the idea was previously rejected for insufficient evidence of having a societal/industrial impact. While I personally would prefer something along the lines of "defined the spirit of the American public" influence to come from someone that wasn't from Capitol Records (who is naturally inclined to praise her given the positive relationship she has with the label), that could also be used if such a section is in fact warranted. I'd like further input from other editors before starting that up. If using VH1, then what we should highlight is how it said Teenage Dream "surged a brand of silliness into the dance genre that had been dominated by Lady Gaga's Fame Monster edge" and "brought the sun out", adding "For the first time that year, we could finally roll down our windows and enjoy a warm, no-pretense breeze. A rare, simple pleasure." and later "made pop music both fun and harmless" as well as how "it completely influenced the wave of plastic robo-dance fare that soon followed". While that article from "The Frisky" definitely argues she's a big musical influence that deserves to be taken more seriously, I don't know if that's overall considered a legitimate publication. It might be worth taking the site to WP:Reliable sources/Noticeboard where others could assess its accuracy levels as a whole. In any case, keep in mind that a musician's legacy section is supposed to talk about how one influenced/impacted society and/or the music industry, and shouldn't just be a collection of praise or chart/sales stats. The "Queen of Pop" dubs don't really demonstrate that. Those "Greatest" rankings Billboard gives could fit well within the "Achievements" section. Unless someone else has a better idea of where to place these, I'll probably add them in there.
 * It already is mentioned in the lead and "Achievements" section how she's one of the world's best-selling artists along with US certifications (which include streams). Given how many (if not all) music markets include streaming in their certifications these days, it's hard to tell how many of those are actual sales and how many are streaming equivalent units.
 * Thank you for the points brought up, and I can already say you've helped improve the article. Snuggums (talk / edits) 22:32, 2 January 2018 (UTC)
 * UPDATE: I've now added the Billboard "Greatest" lists mentioned here to the "achievements" section as I can't think of any better place for them to be and there doesn't seem to be any objections to that over other sections. Snuggums (talk / edits) 04:53, 4 January 2018 (UTC)

External links modified (January 2018)
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Infobox image
Katy Perry has drastically altered her appearance for her current era and I feel it might be helpful to change to a more recent image to reflect that. Unlike with, for example, someone like Taylor Swift, where a five-year-old picture still seems to be the most suitable due to the subject's appearance not having changed much, I think it could be a good idea to use a more recent picture of Katy in the infobox. Several other versions of Wikipedia use pictures taken on Witness: The Tour on their versions of the article, and I also have other suggestions that, I think, could work as replacements for the current one, which I sorted in a gallery below. (I did not manage to find the archive of the talk page, so I'm not sure if the topic was already covered, and I apologise if a consensus was already reached in the past.)

Bizarre BizarreTalk modern to me 20:48, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

To the IP (186.14.173.20) who suggested the fourth image: Is there anything in particular you feel is better than the one just inserted? I don't have anything against it per se, but would like to know what benefits it has over the other pic. Snuggums (talk / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 21:08, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Hi, i suggested the image, because i don't understand why in the section of "216-present", i not understand why they had to eliminate it and place a picture of Katy taking pictures, doesn't makes sense for the era, the picture that i suggested is the right choice, trust me — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.14.173.20 (talk) 22:45, 17 February 2018 (UTC)


 * When we already have a Witness: The Tour image in the infobox, having another one in the "Witness and American Idol" section was overkill, plus it still does accurately represent her appearance during the era. We could use that other tour pic in blue outfit for infobox if you'd like. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 23:31, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Well, I would like that the picture that i suggested, place it in the lead infobox trust me, is better for Katy and her image, and leave the other picture of katy taking pictures in the witness and american idol section. It's possible? Like a true fan of katy, i care about her image, and her wikipedia page is very important to peeople who wants to know more about her, and btw thanks for your time and the answers! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.14.173.20 (talk) 23:59, 17 February 2018 (UTC)


 * Before any further changes, do you have any objections, ? Sorry if this seems rather soon, but I figured you should have some input as the one who first started the thread for an image change. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 00:12, 18 February 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm a little confused about what this new suggestion has that the current image doesn't. I'm not necessarily against a change, but I don't really understand and I would appreciate an argument that goes beyond "it's the right choice, trust me". Besides, while I'm a fan too, Wikipedia is not here to promote Katy, so "it's better for her image" doesn't hold much weight as an argument, in my opinion. We're here to be an encyclopedia, not be Katy's free PR. Bizarre BizarreTalk modern to me 09:55, 18 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Quite true. Please elaborate further, IP. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 19:13, 18 February 2018 (UTC)

But what is the problem about the change? It's almost the same picture, the blue outfit of the tour, only that Katy looks so much better in the picture that i suggested than the other one, it's my opinion and i know wikipedia is only an encyclopedia but why Katy has to look bad, that photo does not do it justice for her, makes her look old. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk) 19:31, 18 February 2018 (UTC)


 * We'd like to know what specifically you find better about it (i.e. lighting, background elements, camera angle) <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 00:53, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

Camera angle, for sure! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk) 01:04, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

Hello, i'm waiting for the answer for picture change. I wanna know if it's possible to change the picture. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk) 20:15, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

I'm not a fan at all of the current picture being used. There are so many possibilities.--Itsevren (talk) 20:29, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

Thanks God, someone agree with me! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk) 21:49, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

Please answer me! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk • contribs) 22:14, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

Sorry for not getting back sooner. Opting for the camera angle in File:Katy Perry at Madison Square Garden (37436530942) (cropped).jpg is fine. I'll go insert that if there are no objections from anyone. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 22:33, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

But when? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk • contribs) 00:02, 20 February 2018 (UTC)

Waiting until others have commented before changing to that. Please be patient. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 00:24, 20 February 2018 (UTC)

Hi, do you have any final objections, ? for change the picture in the infobox? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk • contribs) 01:47, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Hi, sorry the late reply, for some reason I did not get a notification that I was being tagged. To be honest, I first made this suggestion thinking it would be refused and the previous DNC image would be kept. I'm not necessarily super dead-set on the image I picked, it was merely a proposition, and if the consensus seems to be that IP's image is better than the current one, I don't mind it being changed again. Bizarre BizarreTalk modern to me 18:55, 20 February 2018 (UTC)

Don't worry, and thank you so much for your answers! Well, it's time to change the image in the infobox since nobody has any objections! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk) 20:13, 20 February 2018 (UTC)


 * Now changed accordingly. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 22:40, 20 February 2018 (UTC)

American idol
Hello, it is appropriate to emphasize in the infobox that Katy will serve as judge on the reboot of American Idol — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.207.89.39 (talk) 13:57, 21 February 2018 (UTC)
 * It's actually more of a revival (a reboot is when one resets the timeline to something), though I would wait at least until the new season has aired. Too soon at the moment when it hasn't begun. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 15:10, 21 February 2018 (UTC)

Alright, i understand, thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk) 17:29, 21 February 2018 (UTC)

Hi, it's time to emphasize in the infobox that Katy will serve as judge on the revival of American Idol, since it has begun! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.176.145.27 (talk) 21:59, 12 March 2018 (UTC)
 * ✅ now updated. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 23:13, 12 March 2018 (UTC)

Teenage dream
Hello, I think it's important to highlight in "Teenage dream and marriage" section, that teenage dream is the first album has exceed 50 million singles sold in USA.
 * that claim would need to be sourced, and even if someone could provide a citation supporting it, I have a strong feeling that's an inflated total. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 17:19, 22 February 2018 (UTC)

But, i'm talking about digital certification, a that's a fact, teenage dream is the first album ever to surpass 50 million digital singles sales based on certifications alones, it's not a lie. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk) 19:18, 22 February 2018 (UTC)


 * RIAA certifications also include streaming equivalent units, so to say 50 million sold is misleading when not everything certified was actual sales. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 19:27, 22 February 2018 (UTC)

Endorsement
Hi, in the section of "Other Ventures", why not create a section that speaks exclusively about the products that Katy has launched as perfumes and her shoe line, like the pages of other artists? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.82.129.72 (talk) 20:21, 22 February 2018 (UTC)
 * I've thought about that, but am not sure whether they'd collectively be enough (i.e. more than a paragraph) to warrant their own section. You can either way find them interspersed within the "Life and career" section. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 21:25, 22 February 2018 (UTC)

Katy Perry's Net Worth
Hello, i thinks it's time to change the net worth ok Katy Perry, according to this link, her net worth is about 290m$ https://www.celebritynetworth.com/richest-celebrities/singers/katy-perry-net-worth/ or 280m$ according to this link https://www.bankrate.com/lifestyle/celebrity-money/katy-perry-net-worth/,
 * Celebrity Net Worth has repeatedly been rejected as a dubious reference on various Wikipedia pages as it gives many questionable-at-best numbers, and Bankrate is no good either in this case when it bases its figure off of Celebrity Net Worth. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 06:00, 25 February 2018 (UTC)

And now what? wait for forbes for update the net worth for the next two years or something like that, and that's it?? Has no sense!!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.8.94.29 (talk) 02:44, 26 February 2018 (UTC)


 * For better or for worse, unless a more up-to-date figure from a source that's actually reputable comes along, this is the most recent usable thing we have. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 03:30, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

Fourth best selling digital artist
Hi, RIAA update all of eminem singles, and now he's the second best selling digital artist and katy is the fourth, also eminen has now three diamond song, so katy is not the only one. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.14.219.49 (talk • contribs) 16:03, 28 February 2018 (UTC)
 * ✅ thanks for the notice; I've updated accordingly. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 16:16, 28 February 2018 (UTC)

Impact
Why Katy doesn't have a section about her impact? I think she has a impact or at least a legacy in about 10 yeas of carrer. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.14.219.49 (talk) 20:27, 28 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Her career technically started in 2001 with the release of Katy Hudson, and as noted in a previous thread, such a major section would need consensus go add given past rejection as premature at that point (two years ago). <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 21:46, 28 February 2018 (UTC)

It's not fair! I think I can speak for everyone that katy at least deserves to have an impact section at least, and if it is for the information I think we can all collaborate — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.14.219.49 (talk) 22:05, 28 February 2018 (UTC)

Her career started in 2001, fine, well i think 17 years of carrer deserves a legacy or impact section! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.14.219.49 (talk) 22:07, 28 February 2018 (UTC)


 * Duration of career doesn't automatically indicate whether such a section is warranted. If it is to be created, then we would need specific demonstration of impacting/influencing society, the music industry, various musicians, or any combination of those. Read for more. I'm not saying this is out of the question, but it would need discussion from multiple people in addition to you, me, or the user who started that thread. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 22:16, 28 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Currently no, I have not seen any journalistic, academic or scholarly material on Perry discussing her impact on society, politics, religion, music, etc. — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b> [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 04:08, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

Are you serious? Are you tell me that katy doesn't have impact in music? is this a joke or what? tell me you're not serious! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.14.219.49 (talk) 18:01, 4 March 2018 (UTC)
 * IP user, specify about sources that discuss her impact on the above perspectives that I have noted and then we can have a discussion on an impact section. — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b> [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 04:22, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

Controversy
Should there be a part that discusses when she kissed that boy who was auditioning on American Idol? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Redandsymmetry (talk • contribs) 14:30, 16 March 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm not so sure about that when it so far hasn't jeopardized her career or anything. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 17:21, 16 March 2018 (UTC)
 * WP:RECENTISM applies. — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b> [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 14:56, 17 March 2018 (UTC)
 * So because it hasn't harmed her career like it does male careers, it's not valid to mention she abuses her position and power to sexually assault random victims? 67.170.135.201 (talk) 00:13, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Only if published, independent sources state that she "sexually assaults random victims". So far, to my knowledge, none of them have. <span style="font-family: Gill Sans MT, Arial, Helvetica; font-weight:140;"> General Ization  <i style="color: #000666;">Talk </i> 00:16, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Would linking to online groups and communities who posit that she has sexually assaulted this contestant constitute enough material to mention a controversy on the page? Or does it require publication in a mainstream news agency? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 49.255.174.70 (talk) 02:57, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * In general, no, "online groups and communities" are not reliable sources. <span style="font-family: Gill Sans MT, Arial, Helvetica; font-weight:140;"> General Ization <i style="color: #000666;">Talk </i> 03:00, 19 March 2018 (UTC)

Sorry for my poor editing, I'm on a mobile. What about this article published by The New York Times? https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/03/14/style/katy-perry-kiss-american-idol.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 49.255.174.70 (talk) 03:22, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * The phrase "sexual assault" does not appear anywhere in that article, and the only expression of anything close to it ("a forced sexual act") is quoting one (anonymous) viewer's tweet as an example of the controversy surrounding the act. There is no reason to attribute any expertise, concerning the law or sexual misbehavior, to that one anonymous viewer. The fact that it is controversial does not make it a criminal act (which sexual assault is, by definition). <span style="font-family: Gill Sans MT, Arial, Helvetica; font-weight:140;"> General Ization  <i style="color: #000666;">Talk </i> 03:32, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Okay, so if we refraim from the use of the words "sexual assault" but instead refer to "unwanted sexual act" and list it only as a controversy, as published in the New York Times; would that be allowed? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 49.255.174.70 (talk) 03:50, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * If someone was to describe the event and the controversy in fully neutral terms, with citations of multiple reliable, published sources that likewise reflect that neutrality, it would likely satisfy our policies concerning neutral point of view. See also the discussion there of due and undue weight, which would require that all widely-held perspectives on the event be accurately discussed.  However, based on our discussion and your demonstrated bias, I consider it unlikely that you are the one to do it, and, as already mentioned above, it is unclear that the event is notable in terms of its long term significance. <span style="font-family: Gill Sans MT, Arial, Helvetica; font-weight:140;"> General Ization  <i style="color: #000666;">Talk </i> 04:06, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * How are you to judge the long term significance when the significance of an event is often measured by it's citation in wikipedia? How is the New York Times article biased?
 * The significance of an event should never be based on its citation (or the absence thereof) in Wikipedia. And I did not say that the New York Times was biased, I said that you have demonstrated that you are. The Times article very clearly included the controversy as a footnote to the larger article, which appeared in the Style section covering popular music and media -- not crime or sexual abuse. Please sign your posts; I have already left you instructions as to how to do this on your Talk page. <span style="font-family: Gill Sans MT, Arial, Helvetica; font-weight:140;"> General Ization <i style="color: #000666;">Talk </i> 04:42, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * As for how we judge long term significance, read the article at the link (those exact words) in my message above. <span style="font-family: Gill Sans MT, Arial, Helvetica; font-weight:140;"> General Ization <i style="color: #000666;">Talk </i> 04:53, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * For what it's worth, the contestant has refuted allegations of assault/harassment, and stated that the situation was misconstrued. See this post from him for details. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 04:11, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * This seems pretty clearly written from fear of the reprisals to his future career.
 * Looks like this is the blocked edit warring user's IP going on trying to add the content. Give it up, it has been refuted and done with. Your total biasness and inability to see the situation from both end fails one of Wikipedia's core neutral point of view policies. — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b> [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 05:04, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * What is the other end of the situation here? Yes, I'm biased toward ensuring that sexual assault is recognised as such (whether or not the victim tries to protect their career by denying it). That doesn't exclude me from being able to write from a non-biased perspective. However, I'm failing to realise how people at wikipedia can continue in a mob mentality to prevent edits to articles that would then contain factual information. I can link to the definition of sexual assault and link to the video. I don't need an unbiased article written by multiple mainstream organisations to show it happened. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 1.152.107.73 (talk) 05:51, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * The other end of the situation is that you are blocked for edit warring and you are continuing to ignore the WP:BLP and WP:SYNTH warnings placed in your talk page, rather choosing to waste editors time here, by using multiple IPs. Any further comment here will lead to an extension of your block, including all your IP addresses. — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b>  [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 08:33, 19 March 2018 (UTC)

relationship with orlando
I think something should be done about the sentence about her relationship with bloom. I don't think it belongs where it is now plus the excess of citations and the fact that no template is used. ArturSik (talk) 09:51, 1 July 2018 (UTC)
 * I was the one who placed all those citations there because people around here are in a state of denial. So if it takes 6+ citations from Billboard, Telegraph, Vanity Fair, USA Today, etc. including official statements then so be it. Why is it that no one has removed the same cites on his page about their relationship? When one person is more popular in the union, there’s more scrutiny.Trillfendi (talk) 18:37, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

Break and situational depression
Should the article include information about Perry taking a break from music, as cited in this source (NME)? Also, should the article include something about Perry's experience with "situational depression" after the poor reception of Witness, as cited in this source (Vogue)? Aoba47 (talk) 01:35, 9 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I think we should have a one liner about it and that's it. Seems like a temporary hiatus from music tied with the Witness reception. — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b> [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 13:03, 9 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Agreed, it should only be a short sentence. It is also uncertain if she will really take this hiatus or not or how long it would really last. Aoba47 (talk) 21:03, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

Net worth estimate
Her estimate needs changing, that’s 2016. She is worth at least 300 million Harrison1233 (talk) 14:12, 21 February 2019 (UTC)


 * @Harrison1233: Have you got a link to the updated Forbes list? Have they done one for 2019 yet? —C.Fred (talk) 14:17, 21 February 2019 (UTC)

Clarification
"the record for Spotify's most streamed track by a female artist within 24 hours upon its release. " Is the record for "most streamed track by a female artist within 24 hours of release" or is it "for most streamed track by a female artist" in general and she set the record within 24 hours? --Khajidha (talk) 12:31, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
 * It refers to streams within 24 hours of release. That can be rewritten accordingly if you'd like. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 14:37, 9 April 2019 (UTC)

New main image
I think this image provides a much better and clearer shot of her face than the current image. Thoughts on changing it? SAM  talk  21:58, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * No objections from me, but let's wait for further input as I don't want a dispute over image changes like there was before the current one was settled upon. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 22:07, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
 * You can hardly recognize Katy in the pic, it might as well be a drag impersonation of her. The lower portion of her face looks terribly swollen due to the duck face-lips she is making in the pose. To be frank I don't even think the current pic being used is any good. — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b> [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 03:43, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * In that case, what would you recommend using? Something from the Witness era would be ideal at this point and there's tons of tour pics available in commons. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 04:07, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Snugs, I will have to check once and confirm back ok? — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b> [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 04:40, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Fair enough. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 09:38, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * What do you guys think of this one? Hear my reason. The short pixie haircut image we already are placing in the Witness section, which makes sense there as it is kind of an iconic look of that era. But I believe an infobox image should be much more timeless and display the person at their absolute gorgeousness. Given the attire, the smiling face and the general look of happiness in this image, I believe this one or a crop of it should be the infobox one. The current image just does not cut for me as something which will immediately draw attention to the article. I know very well that infobox images are for identification purpose, but aesthetic is also a part of it. Just look at the difference guys! — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b> [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 15:50, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Not gonna lie; that IS far better. Seeing her happiness and smile is quite pleasing to the eyes :). Unless anyone objects, I say we use your suggested pic. <b style="color:#009900">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 16:50, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Yeah that one's nice. SAM   talk  17:52, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Since we seem to be in agreement, I went ahead and changed the pic. I hope that's ok. SAM   talk  17:59, 29 June 2018 (UTC)

(→) Thank you guys for agreeing with the pic. It looks amazing indeed. — I<b style="color: #FF033E;">B</b> [ <b style="font-family: Tempus Sans ITC; color: #1C1CF0;">Poke</b> ] 18:03, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Really cool picture choice! Aoba47 (talk) 01:46, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

her net worth estimate needs changing, Harrison1233 (talk) 14:11, 21 February 2019 (UTC)

All these photos and we couldn't find one that was flattering in the least? Sad. KP has hit the wall 66.141.235.58 (talk) 20:09, 1 May 2019 (UTC)

IMAGELOC
I don't watch this page, so if you want my input, please ping me. I applied MOS:IMGLOC: "Most images should be right justified on pages, which is the default placement. If an exception to the general rule is warranted, |left can be used". This is followed by, "Mul­ti­ple im­ages can be stag­gered right and left." That is what was done here, but right justifying images make it more predictable. Perhaps one or two images could be left justified in the middle of a section, but there was this zig-zag pattern where one image was right, the next was left, and that is bad layout. Walter Görlitz (talk) 04:09, 24 May 2019 (UTC)
 * , what exactly becomes "more predictable" with aligning all images towards the right? Having them all to one side feels monotonous. At the very least, I would alternate alignment of images within "Life and career" to give more diversity. Keep in mind that MOS:IMAGELOC also reads "It is often preferable to place images of people so that they 'look' toward the text", and we'd achieve that with certain left sidings as opposed to the right. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 10:52, 24 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Predictable means the images will always be on the right side of the screen. I missed the look text. For instance, in the image used in the infobox, she's looking to the right: away from the text. The "spinning peppermint" is looking slightly to the right, but it's also at the start of the a section and so should not be on the left. All of the others are mostly looking straight ahead or have an image where two subjects are looking straight ahead. I suppose the other two looking right should be on the left. Walter Görlitz (talk) 13:37, 24 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the clarification. I presume by "the other two looking right", you mean File:Katy Perry–Zenith Paris.jpg and File:Katy Perry Myer Syndey.jpg. Those either way are the ones I'd ideally align left. If you'd like to move the latter a bit downward within its section, then I have no objections. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 14:45, 24 May 2019 (UTC)
 * I've boldly gone ahead and shifted those towards the left, . Any objections to just those now given my previous comments? Leaving everything else aligned right for the moment. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 13:32, 26 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Sure. I don't think they're needed, but it's not a problem for me either. Walter Görlitz (talk) 16:45, 26 May 2019 (UTC)

Charles M. Schwab
Katy Perry is the great, great niece of Charles M. Schwab. Could someone with a kind heart put it in, please ?. Best wishes ! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:E7:4F1F:7D00:6816:E868:C63D:709D (talk • contribs)
 * That would need a supporting citation in order to be included. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 11:36, 7 August 2019 (UTC)

Dear SNUGGUMS, could, would this help a little bit ?:


 * 

Best wishes & sunny greetings from Europe/Germany!. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:E7:4F1F:7D00:B469:7437:4486:6970 (talk • contribs)


 * No because if the lineage presented there is accurate and your URL can be trusted, then she's actually not related to Schwab when (according to that link) her grandfather's first wife was Schwab's niece (with whom he had son Frank) before remarrying to Katy's grandmother (not related to Schwab) and having daughter Mary, who gave birth to Katy. Either you've misread the link or it has the wrong idea of her family. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 11:48, 8 August 2019 (UTC)

Dear SNUGGUMS, thank you very much for your reply, your time You give me, and please keep your passion for this biography up! (nothing is self-evident). My my question is: If her uncle Frank Perry is related with Charles M. Schwab, Katy would be too ?. Anyway, SNUGGUMS, much love & greetings to You from old Europe, Jesus Christ with us! :O) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:E7:4F1F:7D00:1D86:EDE3:848:7F2E (talk) 13:18, 12 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Not necessarily if Frank is a half-brother of Mary (Katy's mother) as opposed to a full brother. In a case of half-siblings, it is possible for a grandparent to have one child with one person and another child with someone else completely unrelated. Suppose Frank Sr. (her grandfather) has his son with someone in Schwab's family and then has Mary with another woman not connected to the Schwabs. That would mean Katy isn't related to them. Of course, this assumes that the link presented above is accurate. If Frank Sr. had both of these children with someone in the Schwab family, then Katy by extension would be connected to them. I've since looked a bit further into the matter and it seems there's conflicting reports on any possible connection to Schwab. To be specific, I've seen a claim of granduncle (which sounds rather dubious based on when he lived), one that could be interpreted as granduncle or great-granduncle (its exact phrasing wasn't clear and this may have led to a misunderstanding where someone else called him a granduncle), and the idea that he isn't related at all. At least for now, it's safer to leave him out of here unless we know for certain whether he's related or not. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 16:11, 12 August 2019 (UTC)

Dear, SNUGGUMS.

OK...thank You ♥...much sunny greetings & always with best wishes!. :-D — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:E7:4F1F:7D00:E893:9752:3A3B:3DF0 (talk) 10:35, 14 August 2019 (UTC)

Sexual misconduct
She has been accused of this by model Josh Kloss. Where will it fit? -- <b style="color: black;">Kailash29792</b> (talk)  03:16, 13 August 2019 (UTC)
 * And a fair bit more it seems. Alssa1 (talk) 22:20, 16 August 2019 (UTC)


 * Someone better rephrase the sentence where Tina Kandelaki accused Perry of misconduct. Something was lost in translation. <b style="color: black;">Kailash29792</b> (talk)  17:55, 19 August 2019 (UTC)

Having a whole section and letting this be a defining part of an era seems ridiculous considering Kandelaki has clarified it wasn't harrassment and she was using her experience to call Kloss out...

https://theinnersane.com/2019/08/21/russian-tv-host-tina-kandelaki-says-katy-perry-did-not-harass-her/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:8003:5472:FB01:D98:8DAA:30E1:10EF (talk) 12:52, 22 August 2019 (UTC)


 * IP, I'm guessing you mean we shouldn't put allegations in the same section title as Witness and American Idol, which I agree with and have removed it here. From what I can tell, Kloss' claims haven't affected her life in any major way so far. This isn't like how Michael Jackson got sued during the 1993 sexual abuse allegation against him (which was settled out of court) or how Asia Argento was dropped as a judge from X-Factor Italy after Jimmy Bennett alleged that she sexually assaulted him in 2013. As for what Kloss alleges, it has been printed in legitimate media sources and is appropriate to mention, we just shouldn't put undue emphasis on it right now. Unless it leads to legal actions, a change in her career/personal life, more allegations from other people in the future (Tina Kandelaki doesn't count because her comments were mistranslated as previously noted and she's not accusing Perry of any sexual misconduct), or any combination of these, I wouldn't highlight such claims in a section title. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 21:35, 22 August 2019 (UTC)


 * SNUGGUMS, I believe you are coloring this article with personal observations and judgments, then drawing conclusions from same. e.g., "From what I can tell, Kloss' claims haven't affected her life in any major way so far." Snit333 (talk) 01:05, 29 August 2019 (UTC)


 * If you think I missed something or jumped to any conclusions too quickly, then feel free to elaborate. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 02:20, 29 August 2019 (UTC)

Transcendental Meditation
Hello everyone. I have recently run across an article in the Washingtonian that talks about Perry's upcoming participation in a October 11 concert to benefit Transcendental Meditation. Initially, I was going to ask if this should be mentioned in the article, or if it is considered too minor of an event, but I noticed that aside from Perry being classified under the "Transcendental Meditation practitioners" category, the article does not mention Transcendental Meditation at all (at least from what I can see). Perry's relationship with this type of meditation has been covered in Vogue. I was wondering a brief sentence should be included in the article about Transcendental Meditation with the Vogue source used to support the information? It seems odd that a category is used without any information included in the prose. Aoba47 (talk) 02:17, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
 * Hello Aoba47. I've removed the category not because it's false, but because this practice isn't very defining for her. See WP:Overcategorization for more. As for the concert mentioned, I'd say wait until it happens and see how much attention she gets for participating in it. If there's lots, then we can come up with a way to implement that. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 12:15, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the response, and that makes perfect sense. Aoba47 (talk) 18:22, 6 October 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 October 2019
Her met worth estimate is wrong. She is work 320 million 2601:243:C502:32C0:C4FD:6DC2:600E:4ABC (talk) 04:28, 11 October 2019 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. <span style="font-family: Gill Sans MT, Arial, Helvetica; font-weight:140;"> General Ization <i style="color: #000666;">Talk </i> 04:31, 11 October 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 31 October 2019
Katy Perry is a very well known and loved person. Katy Perry has become very popular and has written many songs. Macwilliams2456 (talk) 02:02, 31 October 2019 (UTC)


 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: These changes are either vague or are subjective. —C.Fred (talk) 02:05, 31 October 2019 (UTC)
 * You must state specifically what you want to change in the article. This talk page is to discuss specific changes to the article. Praising Katy Perry is not the purpose of this page. Please read WP: NOTAFORUM. <b style="color:#070">Cullen</b><sup style="color:#707">328  Let's discuss it  02:07, 31 October 2019 (UTC)

Pop rock and disco
Looking in the artistry section of the article, I'm not sure where the information that her music incorporates pop, rock and disco is sourced. If anyone knows where this is sourced I would appreciate a response. Thanks. Billiekhalidfan (talk) 03:29, 8 November 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 December 2019
Katy Perry is engaged to Orlando Bloom (2019-) 93.109.36.118 (talk) 16:32, 1 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Pictogram voting wait.svg Already done The Perry-Bloom engagement is already noted in article. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 19:27, 1 December 2019 (UTC)

Contralto?
Katy Perry by most music analysis sources is not a contralto. Most of her songs range from around A3 to E5 and she has a very womanly, even girlish belt — hardly masculine or androgynous. You can't just say that a woman is a contralto because she has a strong chest voice. It's a misunderstanding of what voices can do. Most sources cite her as a soprano of some sort (Vocal View, Critic of Music, Diva Devotee, therangeplanet).

Her voice does have weight but not to the extent of contralto, especially not the lower range. Many of these sources deduce her to be a light-lyric soprano, which I also think is false. I might argue that this is a mistake based on her lack of projection below A3, and current pop music's tendency toward a conversational style that isn't as friendly to weightier voices. I think she is a full-lyric soprano. I know, this can get pop science-y but if we're going to handle voice types for a pop singer like her there is an order to how we deduce them. A contralto would have a rich, mature, veering on masculine tone, often reaching C3-D3 with amplitude, and often sounding strained if belting past B4 (not Katy), and a head voice that sounds either disconnected and overly bright relative to the chest voice, or like a lower soprano's head voice disconnected from the modal voice. A mezzo-soprano will have a strong middle voice, heftier belts and a heavier head register than a soprano, often singing down to E3-G3 with projection (could be Katy if she worked on her low notes more). A soprano will have a light belt register that extends easily to around C5-E5, and can be pushed much higher; her head voice will extend into the sixth octave (Katy, though underused by her), and her chest voice will begin to taper through the third octave (much like Katy's, though strong down to A♭3. A lyric voice would be warm and gentler than a spinto or dramatic voice.  A spinto voice will be a lyric voice that can push to dramatic volume (possibly Katy, though she mainly just has a rich timbre), and a dramatic voice will fill a room at default comfort (she may have a thicker timbre but her voice isn't that loud or cutting).  A coloratura voice is relatively more agile, whether lyric or dramatic (so not Katy, though if she were she would be dramatic coloratura).  Her voice is more like Lara Fabian's than Chrissie Hynde's.  I think the category needs to be changed. Wikipedia is the only consensus source citing her as a contralto. She just has a richer voice than light-lyric sopranos. —CPGACoast (talk) 13:26, 11 December 2019 (UTC)


 * If you have any accompanying URLs to support non-contralto ranges, then please list them as that would help decide which is best to use. The ones currently used were both from over a decade ago during her One of the Boys era. In all fairness, people's voices often change over time, and these were the best things that could be found for her vocal range at the time they were inserted. I admittedly have struggled in the past to find a trustworthy source for anything else and may have missed something, or perhaps a new viable piece came up since I last checked. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 15:04, 11 December 2019 (UTC)

"Cozy Little Christmas" release
Is it worthwhile to mention that "Cozy Little Christmas" was released on all platforms this year? The article only mentions the initial Amazon Music exclusive release last year so I was uncertain if it should be updated or if it is too trivial for this page and should be reserved for the article on the song. Aoba47 (talk) 04:44, 23 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, sorry this didn't get a response sooner. The wider release detail seems to be better for that song's page, but I removed the exclusive part since it's outdated. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 02:13, 6 January 2020 (UTC)
 * No worries. Thank you for the response. Aoba47 (talk) 20:33, 15 January 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 January 2020
Please change in section 1999–2006: Career beginnings: "She briefly studied Italian opera at the Music Academy of the West in Santa Barbara." to "She briefly had music lessons in facilities rented from the Music Academy of the West." (source ) The source quotes Tim Dougherty (misspelled as Tim Docherty), communications manager for the Music Academy of the West from 2006 till 2015.
 * Neither "Katy Perry" nor "Kate Hudson", "Katheryn Hudson" or "Katheryn Elizabeth Hudson" have ever been listed as alumni on the official Music Academy of the West website. (Compare the first archived version of voice alumni, up to 16 October 2008, the archived version from 2009, the year the claim was added to the article, and the academy's current alumni search. Note that the current alumni search allows to search for names across instruments. For example, pop-artist Burt Bacharach is listed to have attended the piano program in 1950.
 * The original source for the claim doesn't allow the conclusion that Hudson got lessons in operatic singing in the Music Academy of the West facility. --OrestesLebt (talk) 17:24, 17 January 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ thank you for pointing this out. I've corrected it accordingly. One question I do have, though, is this: what page number is used from the Montgomery book you cited? It doesn't seem to show up in the given URL. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 18:05, 17 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you, SNUGGUMS! I'm sorry, I did not see any page numbers either. According to  this old discussion, the quote appears on pages 11–12. I'm fact-checking for the Music Academy of the West article, Katy Perry has repeatedly been added and removed on the articles alumni list over the years. The google books excerpt is good enough for me, I don't really want to buy the book. --OrestesLebt (talk) 18:39, 17 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Hadn't seen that thread before. Very enlightening. Anyway, nice to have page numbers, and I'll insert those accordingly. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 23:33, 17 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Great, thanks! Her "opera lessons" at the Music Academy of the West have apparently been cited from this article for a decade. If I might request an additional change, could you please move the rev to the end of the changed sentence? Right before "Her singing caught the attention of rock artists Steve Thomas ..." Thank you so much! --OrestesLebt (talk) 23:56, 17 January 2020 (UTC)
 * No problem at all. Just moved it. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 00:13, 18 January 2020 (UTC)

Genre mistake
In the article says that she is pop, rock, and disco but at the top of the page it says pop, pop rock, and disco. Someone please fix this — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dojazervas (talk • contribs) 18:41, 26 March 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ thanks for pointing out the discrepancy. Any future changes should be made in both infobox and prose for consistency (assuming they can be adequately referenced). <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 21:54, 26 March 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 April 2020
"please change Katy's networth from $125 million to $330 million because her networth has grown since 2016 and due to recent reports her networth is appeared to be around the 330-360 million mark" Taylor131312 (talk) 12:11, 27 April 2020 (UTC)
 * , at least not yet; updated net worth numbers would need new citations to support them. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 13:36, 27 April 2020 (UTC)

Pop rock vs rock
User:BawinV Hummingbird Heartbeat is a hard rock song, Circle the Drain is a disco-rock/gothic rock song, Dressin' Up is a dance-rock song, One of the Boys is a pop rock/soft rock album, Teenage Dream is a pop/rock album, and Katy Hudson is a Christian rock album. So I think she's made rock songs. And most importantly, rock is sourced, pop rock is not. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kingswool (talk • contribs) 14:23, 12 May 2020 (UTC)

it's not about what you think. it's what about what the critics say about the album. One or two songs don't define the genre of an entire artist's career. Katy's debut album is described as "Pop rock". Not Rock. But I'd like to here what others have to say in this

BawinV (talk) 17:14, 12 May 2020 (UTC) "It's not about what you think". You're kidding, right? You are the one labeling Katy's music as a whole as pop rock with no source. This isn't the article for One of the Boys. You can't use the fact that One of the Boys is a pop rock album as evidence that she's a pop rock singer. That's not how it works. Everything I said above comes from the articles. Also, the "I think she's made rock songs" was obviously sarcasm, I know she has made rock songs because that's what the sources say. Look at the music style and themes section. And if we're gonna use pop rock (which we shouldn't) in the infobox, then why not dance or electropop? Kingswool (talk) 17:53, 12 May 2020 (UTC)


 * In addition to what Kingswool wrote, Template:Infobox musical artist says we should aim for general genres as opposed to subgenres, so I'm changing "pop rock" back to "rock". <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 19:41, 12 May 2020 (UTC)

Actress and business woman?
Is she still also an actress and businesswoman?


 * No, never was. Her filmography is minimal, and I don't see much coverage of her business endeavours in the article. —C.Fred (talk) 22:05, 30 June 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 August 2020: birth of Daisy
Content: Life and career Section: 2019–present: Smile and motherhood Paragraph: 2nd 1) Change "is expecting her first child..." to "was expecting her first child..." 2) Add a sentence at the end of P2: "On August 26 2020, Perry gave birth to a healthy baby girl, Daisy Dove Bloom." 173.68.101.238 (talk) 06:36, 27 August 2020 (UTC)
 * First part done. Second has some different phrasing, but the update still is mentioned. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 14:40, 27 August 2020 (UTC)

Should we mention her decline in popularity in the lead?
Since around the time of her "Witness" album, her commercial performance has objectively gotten worse. Prism sold 286k U.S. first week, U.S. number 1, Witness sold 180k U.S. first week, U.S. number one, which is over 100k less than Prism but not too bad. Smile sold 50k U.S. first week and debuted U.S. number five which even Witness sold more than three times that. For comparison, Madonna sold 90k first week with her last record in 2019 and got a U.S. number one with none of her songs charting and she's over 25 years older than Perry. Janet Jackson's last record sold 116k first week and went number one and her peak is long behind her. Katy's contemporary Lady Gaga sold more than 5 times Smile with her latest and got a U.S. number one. Cher, who has been around for over 50 years and is in her 70s, got a #3 with her album from 2018 that sold 153k first week and that doesn't even have any original material (it's an ABBA cover album). Brittney Spears sold over double what Smile did with her last record and Christina Aguilera, while her debut chart position for her last record was actually worse than Smile (#6), still sold 68k compared to 50k for Smile. And Spears and Aguillera's peaks were in the late 1990s-2000s even before Perry came onto the scene.

Perry's song "Never Really Over" was a moderate hit at U.S. number 15 and her song "Daisies" did get into the top 40 but just barely at position #40. But her single "Smile" didn't even chart on the Hot 100 and didn't even crack the top 20 on the "Bubbling Under". Her last top 10 was "Chained to the Rhythm" 3 years ago (but that was partly due to comeback hype) and her last number one was in 2014. Smile sold less than 10,000 copies the first week in the UK and debuted top 5 there as well as in Canada. Top 5 isn't horrible but for the woman who was arguably the biggest pop star in the world in the first half of the last decade, you would think she would have done better.

I say all this because Mariah Carey has a bit in her article's lead section that says, in part:

After eleven consecutive years charting a US number-one single, Carey parted ways with Columbia in 2001 and signed a[n] $80 million recording contract with Virgin Records... However, following her highly publicized physical and emotional breakdown, as well as the critical and commercial failure of [a film she made] and its accompanying soundtrack, her contract was bought out... by Virgin... After a relatively unsuccessful period, she returned to the top of music charts...]

(emphasis mine)

Carey's lead section addresses the more unsuccessful period but does so in a relatively unbiased manner, and makes sure to talk about her comeback. The problem I can see for doing this with Perry is that she doesn't have a comeback to speak of, at least not yet, and it shouldn't seem like we're hating on her, so to speak. But her commercial performance is objectively worse than it used to be and sure, artists become less popular with time, and probably ageism also plays a part. But she's been around less than 15 years and isn't yet 40, so for her to get outsold by Madonna, Janet Jackson, and Cher who are all at least over a decade and a half older, and Lady Gaga, who is roughly the same age, says a lot.

Should we do something like in Mariah Carey's lead section talking about her commercial success struggles? The brave celery (talk) 16:29, 10 September 2020 (UTC)


 * You mostly seem to be focused on US numbers. While Smile and Witness certainly haven't reached the heights of Prism or Teenage Dream or One of the Boys even when factoring other nations (the Canadian peaks for example where much higher for "Bon Appétit" and "Swish Swish" than in America), I'm not sure how to talk about any sort of decline without it coming off as trashing on the more recent material. Witness also wasn't an outright commercial failure, especially with "Chained to the Rhythm" peaking within the top 5 in many countries and topping the charts in Hungary and Latvia. Perhaps with future material becoming much more popular, we could then come up with an appropriate way to show a career resurgence. As for Smile, both its title track and "Daisies" have reached the top 30 in Croatia and Scotland, for what it's worth, so this hasn't fully flopped either even though neither charted well in North America. I'd say differently if all of its tracks only got peaks of 31 or lower in all nations they charted in. A common problem I've seen (not just with Katy's material) is people only focusing on US numbers when calling something a commercial failure and overlooking what was achieved in other nations. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 21:55, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

Vocal Range Mistake
The claim that Katy Perry has a Contralto vocal range is a mistake and refuted by many trained in music and in the music community. Here is a reference example: https://vocalview.tumblr.com/post/150768262494/katy-perry-voice-type. Please provide musical evidence, and not articles siting hearsay to substantiate a musical claim. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.179.137.205 (talk) 18:03, 30 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Tumblr links like the one you provided aren't reliable enough to be used as sources within articles, and by that user's own admission, they are not an expert on the matter. You'd need something much stronger than that for any non-contralto ranges (and that was based on these articles cited in the "Voice" section. They admittedly are both over a decade old and from her One of the Boys era, but nothing credible that I'm aware of has since come along for any other vocal types or I already would've implemented such references upon finding them. If you think I missed some other more recent trustworthy piece that talks about her vocal range, then feel free to post it here. Socal media posts from fans are user-generated content and thus are inadequate citations to use per WP:USERG. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 19:27, 30 September 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 January 2021
Add a wikilink to the song "Not the end of the world" at the end of the 2019-present section Pseudononymouse (talk) 18:10, 15 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done  EN  - Jungwon  18:24, 15 January 2021 (UTC)

"Katy (singer)" listed at Redirects for discussion
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Katy (singer). The discussion will occur at Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 February 5 until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Ivanvector's squirrel (trees/nuts) 13:50, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 18 March 2021
change "combination of his sarcastic approach to writing lyrics and his 'I don't give a fuck' attitude" to "combination of his sarcastic approach to writing lyrics and his 'I don't give a f---' attitude" 68.174.231.177 (talk) 16:50, 18 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia is not censored, and as that is a quote it should remain as is. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 16:55, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Genre
Years ago, I suggested adding Christian as a genre. After a long discussion, the consensus was not to add it, saying that Katy Hudson (her Christian album) was not notable, and only an artist's primary genre should be listed. I also pointed out that some of her secular songs have Christian influences, but the consensus was that influence does not mean genre. However, I notice that Christian Rock is now listed as a genre, and there does not seem to be any discussion about whether or not it should remain. I have no strong opinion either way at this point. Have the criteria for listing a genre changed over the years? Or, has Katy Perry perhaps release more Christian music that I'm not aware of (unlikely, since she seems to be going further from her Christian roots). I'm asking more out of curiosity, I have no strong opinion at this point as to whether or not Christian Rock should be listed as a genre. Mitsguy2001 (talk) 16:39, 6 April 2021 (UTC)
 * It's been removed per my comments here. If there ever comes a day where she makes another album of Christian rock music (or at least another with multiple tracks of that genre), then maybe it could later be worth including, but not right now. It's not nearly as prominent in her career as the other type of material Katy has worked with. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 17:13, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

Sixth studio album
Katy Perry has stated on various occasions that SMILE, her latest release, is actually her FIFTH studio album, not her sixth. Her first album was not even promoted to markets and did not receive a proper release, therefore it is inappropriate to deem it a studio album (besides the fact that it was released under the name Katheryn Hudson). Please change it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.177.138.38 (talk • contribs)
 * Not sure what your criteria for a "proper release" is (that sounds subjective), but when Katheryn "Katy" Hudson and Katy Perry are the same person, it would be misleading and unfair to exclude Katy Hudson just because it was recorded and distributed under her birth name. It also totally was released for sale on March 6, 2001 (no matter how few copies were sold). Whether one uses a stage name has no relevance to overall album count, and neither does promotion (and for the record she actually did promote it when joining Phil Joel's "Strangely Normal Tour" along with solo performances of her own). This means One of the Boys is Katy's second album, Teenage Dream is third, Prism is fourth, Witness is fifth, and therefore Smile is sixth. I'm not going to pretend otherwise by downplaying its existence. Furthermore, the album was recorded within studios and isn't taken from live performances at a concert or anything of that nature. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 12:54, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject Songs has an RFC
Wikipedia:WikiProject Songs has an RFC for the use of radio station/networks' playlists being cited in articles. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. Heartfox (talk) 00:05, 29 April 2021 (UTC)

Abuse allegations
Are we just going to gloss over the fact that she has sexually harrassed at least two people (one male, one female)? Or is this just going to be airbrushed out? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.184.137.217 (talk) 17:27, 30 May 2021 (UTC) ‎

change picture
Hi, this picture's a bit old and looks a bit tacky, might it be better to replace it with a better and more recent picture? I've given two options below.

-> http://assets.fansnet.org/2021/0518/6-06501371.jpg -> https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/images/katy-perry-mermaid-1619421776.jpg — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zain1133 (talk • contribs) 03:05, 31 May 2021 (UTC)


 * I don't know that either of them are usable. The second looks like a screen grab, so it's almost certainly copyrighted. The first, there's no indication of what the source is or its license status. —C.Fred (talk) 17:02, 31 May 2021 (UTC)


 * https://www.gettyimages.in/detail/news-photo/jimmy-kimmel-live-airs-every-weeknight-at-11-35-p-m-est-and-news-photo/1231085052 - I'm not sure if this as helpful but this is what I found, I'm guessing we'd have to request permission first. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zain1133 (talk • contribs) 17:54, 31 May 2021 (UTC)
 * There's zero chance of that happening. They're selling the image; I don't see how they're going to give away even a low-res copy of it for free. —C.Fred (talk) 17:58, 31 May 2021 (UTC)
 * Wondering if we could do this one. She looks much better and imo is one of her most recognisable pictures. current one doesn't exactly fit or look appropriate if that makes sense.

File:Katy Perry - Part Of Me Australian Premiere - June 2012 (3).jpg

I disagree; not only is that 2012 picture quite outdated, but I fail to see anything wrong with what's currently used. She looks happy there and it's not a copyright violation. On another note, I've adjusted the image display so your suggestion doesn't clutter the talk page. <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 14:17, 16 June 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 23 July 2021
Katty perry starred in an episode of how i met your mother (s6 ep15) BiaoGlow (talk) 14:26, 23 July 2021 (UTC)
 * This is already mentioned within the 2010–2012 section, and the episode was titled "Oh Honey". <b style="color:#009900">SNUGGUMS</b> (<b style="color:#009900">talk</b> / <b style="color:#009900">edits</b>) 14:34, 23 July 2021 (UTC)