Talk:Kelsey Grammer/Archives/2013

Sisters Murder
Parade Magazine of Aug. 26 '07 has a 2 page article on him. In it it says his sister was raped and slashed, and left to bleed to death in the summer of 1975. She was 18 at the time. I know there was some discussion of this in prior comments, so there is a sourced location for information on it (and other facts obviously).

Thanks, good info easytiger (talk) 11:27, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

reference right on here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freddie_Glenn —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.24.5.112 (talk) 17:48, 10 April 2011 (UTC)

Drug Addiction
HE's in people treated for drug addiction category, but no mention of it anywhere in the article - remove/sources please?!?88.104.138.16

This Article looks like it has been Ninja'd
This article is in terrible shape, note the odd dates (the 1800's), the odd ages, and the seemingly random information. Note the following paragraph taken from the article for evidence: "Born in St. Thomas in the Virgin Islands, Grammer moved to New Jersey with his mother after his parents' divorce. In 1968, when Kelsey was 47, his father, whom he had only met twice, was murdered on the front lawn of his home in the Virgin Islands; in 1875, his sister was raped and murdered after leaving a Red Lobster restaurant in Colorado Springs, Colorado. Kelsey, who was 81 at the time and enrolled in the Juilliard acting program, stopped attending classes and was expelled. In 1999, his twin half-brothers were killed in a shark attack while SCUBA diving."

So Kelsey was 47 in 1968, his sister was raped in 1875, he enrolled in Juilliard at 81? Finally, I do not recall Mr. Grammer ever saying "Wat tiggers like to do best!! bounce"

I have restored this article to the last apparently respectable version before it was hijacked. To the previous editor, who I think added some detail or two in good faith but did not notice the hijacking, please re-add what you had submitted. I am sorry about that, but the article was in terrible shape and it needed to be returned to a responsible form.

Wtlegis 15:34, 16 May 2006 (UTC)


 * The article now says "Grammer was born in Decatur, Texas", when the side-bar and eveywhere else says St. Thomas in the U.S. Virgin Islands - which is it?Jock123 (talk) 09:20, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Birthday?
Born on February 20 or February 21? Sources differ. --rbrwr

The sources listed in the Google search lean toward the 21st, and he's been listed as February 21st as long as I can remember (that's my birthday, too, so I do remember!). I'm changing it back... --TobyRush 14:58, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

She left a crustacean? And Rape Stories
"His sister was murdered after leaving a Red Lobster in Colorado Springs, Colorado". Sorry for being stupid, but what does this mean? -- Cortina


 * Well, "Red Lobster" is the name of a chain restaurant in the US. Colorado Springs, Colorado is a city in the US, but I assume you were referring to the reference to "Red Lobster". Does this answer your question? I'll edit the text to clarify the meaning in the article... &mdash;Frecklefoot 15:22, 23 Feb 2004 (UTC)

"In 1996 Grammer was accused of the statutory rape of his son's 15-year-old babysitter by the girl's step-parents."

But right before that it says "They have a daughter, Mason Olivia (born October 24, 2001), and a son, Jude Gordon (born August 28, 2004), both born via surrogate mother"

So where was this son in 1996? Fucked up contradicting statements, classic Wikipedia. You fix it, and don't tell me to.

a role like one of Mom's henchmen in Futurama?
I cleaned up the note comparing his upcoming role in The Fairly OddParents Movie to the character in Futurama, but I'm still pretty confused by it and it seems out of left-field. I'm tempted to remove it altogether. Anybody know how significant the relation between the Futurama character and Grammer's new role is? -VJ 19:51, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Substance Abuse
"Grammer's life has been marked by tragedy and, as a result, occasional depression and substance abuse" is the only mention of his substance abuse - more detail could be given. Didn't he spend some time in jail for cocaine, and I think he also crashed his car while drinking. I don't know the details of it all. - Matthew238 08:29, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

Resemblance
I removed this from the page: "He also bears a striking resemblance to Formula One driver Rubens Barrichello." Is that someone's opinion or an accepted fact?? I doubt it belongs on Wikipedia.
 * Holy Crap! - That's borderlining fact! =)
 * Indeed, the resemblance is striking. However, I'd say that Barrichello looks more like a cross between Kelsey Grammer and Hank Azaria.

Education
Many of the characters portrayed by Grammer are highly educated and sophisticated, is this also true of Grammer himself ? Jackpot Den 06:40, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

Kelsey was enrolled in Julliard, was expelled after skipping classes (apparently distraught over his sister's death) and trained at the Globe Theater in San Diego. So highly educated as portrayed on television, no... but you have to hand it to him for making us believe that he is.

Time spent being Dr Frasier Crane
Grammer spent 20 years playing this character: - In episode 11x15 Naneette Goosman (played in this episode by Laurie Metcalf) says to him "Do you have any idea what it's like to play the same character for 20 years?". A nice reference. - He joined the Cheers cast in 1984, 2 years after the official start of the show. Frasier ran until 2004, therefore it is 20 years. Greggykins 02:13, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

This article has been seriously vandalized by stealth vandals
I just read through this article and have concluded that it has been seriously vandalized.

For example,
 * 1) I did the page List of fatal, unprovoked shark attacks in the United States by decade. During the month or so I researched that article never once did I encounter any reference to Kelsey Grammer's twin half-brothers being killed in a shark attack while scuba diving. This sounds like a crock of bullshit to me.
 * 2) The facts surrounding his sisters murder are suspect. I don't remember her being raped. She was an employee of Red Lobster (not a customer) and was killed during a robbery.
 * 3) There are all kind of quotes attributed to him that I don't ever remember him saying, and there are all kinds of anecdotal stories about him that I don't remember ever hearing before.

This article is also noteworthy for what it leaves out. He grew up in Pompano Beach, Florida in Broward County; however, the article mentions nothing about this fact.--Hokeman 19:31, 22 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't think it's vandalisms; it's all true - reported in a variety of sources - but maybe we should list some sources here. - Matthew238 02:10, 23 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Of course it's all true - I read it here in Wikipedia... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.64.0.252 (talk) 16:13, 21 June 2011 (UTC)


 * I agree. I've seen and heard all the facts listed in a variety of places, not just here on Wikipedia (just because it sounds like B.S. doesn't mean it's not true).  But this article suffers from the same problem as many other articles on Wikipedia, it just lacks sources.  We should look into sourcing the facts, but shouldn't outright revert the information until then.  Until sources are found, we can just use the  tag, which will encourage others to provide sources. &mdash; Frecklefoot | Talk 14:41, 23 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Grammer's sister was NOT an employee of Red Lobster and was NOT killed in a robbery. She was waiting in the parking lot of Red Lobster at closing time waiting for her boyfriend who was an employee to get off of work. Three men attempted to rob the restaurant and fearing that she might be able to identify them, they abducted her and raped her numerous times before killing her and leaving her bleeding to death in an alley. [url]http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/classics/karen_grammer/8.html[/url]
 * His twin half-brothers Billy and Stephen Grammer were killed in a scuba diving accident off of St. Thomas, Virgin Islands in 1980. It is still unclear the exact nature of the accident but authorities suspect it was a shark attack. [url]http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0103/16/lkl.00.html[/url]
 * So not vandalized or completely bullsht. -BeckieS 209.121.248.192 10:46, 23 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Well, it looks like you did your homework and even have sources. Bravo!  You can go to the article and fix the facts and can even provide sources (like this: ). Steve Dufour 13:34, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

Filmography
Why not have the complete filmography available from the IMDB? I copy and pasted the information to this article with a wikify tag because I haven't the time at the moment to format it. The filmography is complete (including some miscellaneous archive footage) all from the IMDB. VandalHunter 14:08, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

Politics
Just a little comment: That section could really, really use some sources. That is all. 199.126.137.209 01:19, 7 November 2006 (UTC)


 * The reference to the Maxim article is undated, making his suggestion that he might run for office “in 15 years” difficult to fathom (fifteen years from when?); the link to the article no longer seems to take you there, and using Maxim’s own search didn’t bring it up, so I couldn’t update the link or add a year.Jock123 (talk) 09:25, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

I removed the Maxim quote, for that reason. It already says he's mentioned running for Congress (in a 2003 interview on Fox).67.117.145.183 (talk) 19:50, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Kelsey's IQ
I've deleted the following part of the page:

Genuis
Kelsey Grammer has an estimated IQ higher than 200.

Whoever typed this has failed to give a reference for it. It is highly unlikely for any individual to have such a high IQ. To put it in perspective; you're gifted when you have an IQ above 130. Professors at the better universities are likely to have an iq around 150, Nobel prize winners (not including the peace and literature Nobel prizes) are likely to have an IQ around 160 (like Albert Einstein). So, if Kelsey Grammar would indeed posess such a high IQ the difference between his intelligence and that of a ordinary nobel prize winner would be even bigger than the difference beween a normal and gifted individuals' intelligence.

IQs of 200 are extremely rare (in the neigborhood of 1 in 30,000 people). If true about Grammer, a citation would be needed.

By contrast the incidence of an IQ of 150 ranges (depending on the source as well as interperetation of study data) anywhere between 1 in 300 people and 1 in 1,200 people.

Sean7phil (talk) 09:50, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Though I agree you were right to move this statement (as it is unsourced) - you're justification for doing so seems bizarre. IQ tests are a poor measure of intelligence, but a very good measure of how good one is at answering IQ tests (training and practice can improve performance). It may simply be that, though he may lack the intelligence of a Nobel prize winning physicist, he is very good at IQ tests. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 139.153.13.68 (talk) 12:11, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Political activism section
Here is what it says:


 * On September 21, 2003, during an appearance on Hannity & Colmes on Fox News, Grammer expressed an interest in running for United States Congress as a Republican. He indicated that it was something he would consider when his children were older. During an interview on the The Today Show, he told Matt Lauer that he wouldn't enter politics until he felt he was more knowledgeable on the subject.


 * He was a celebrity guest at President George W. Bush's first inauguration and has endorsed Rudy Giuliani for president in 2008.

I don't think this amounts to notable political activism. It would be better if there was one sentence somewhere in the article that says he is a Republican and has said he might run for Congress someday. It doesn't need a whole section. Steve Dufour 13:34, 12 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I went ahead and shortened the section, merging it with the personal life section. No important information removed. Steve Dufour 13:49, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

More examples of political activism - I received this in an email today and this is the link to the "web page" version of it. http://www.nrsc.org/emails/2008/10/29/sixpack.aspx From the National Republican Senatorial Committee.
 * Take it from me. For 20 years, I played Dr. Frasier Crane on TV, and it is not easy being openly Republican in a Democrat town like Hollywood. But even when the odds are against us, we must never stop fighting for this country.


 * Will you help stop liberals from seizing total control of our government?

Protect feelings?
A user just recently revised this sentence:


 * They have a son, Jude Gordon, and a daughter, Mason Olivia, together via a surrogate mother.

to remove all references to a surrogate mother to "protect the feelings of the children". I'm sorry, what? Is this an unusually harsh thing to mention? Obviously this was mentioned in the media or it wouldn't be in the article. Do we have to leave out this piece of information in the interest of good taste? &mdash; Frecklefσσt | Talk 02:11, 13 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes. In the world of medicine, and surrogate parenthood is at least "para-medical", there is a tradition of protecting people's privacy. I feel that WP tries (and should try) to have a higher standard than the media, and certainly than the Internet in general. Also, what possible importance does this fact have to do with Mr Grammer's notability? Steve Dufour 02:44, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Okay, anyone other than the person who deleted the information in the first place have anything to say about this? I'm not sure what you mean by WP having a "higher standard".  WP is not censored, and deleting information like that is censoring.  Clearly Grammar doesn't have qualms about this information being public, since he's probably the one who mentioned it in the first place.  And it was made public in the media.  And if he does have a problem with it, that's part of the price of being famous.


 * I don't really feel obligated to explain or defend Wikipedia policy to you. But, in short, the information is relevant, referenced and presented in a neutral tone.  It's not original research and it's not untrue.  I think the only person it seems to bother is you.  It's not like we're divulging the name of the surrogate mother (though if it were reported, we certainly would).  I'm waiting for more responses. &mdash; Frecklefσσt | Talk 14:44, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


 * True, sourced, encyclopedic information should not be removed due to someone's "feelings". —Nricardo (talk) 03:41, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Kelsey Grammer died?
If i'm not mistaken, this article suggests Kelsey Grammer has died? I can't find information on this on any other site. Some kind of 'prank' ? :s —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.131.95.133 (talk • contribs)


 * I can't find the information you refer to, so it probably was just some vandalism that was promptly reverted by a watchful editor. If Grammer died, we'd no doubt hear a lot about it in the press. &mdash; Frecklefσσt | Talk 13:25, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

Accent
What is that accent he has?--Loodog (talk) 18:56, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
 * As of right now, it's in the article - it's a Mid-Atlantic dialect, sort of a cross between North American and English. 4.242.108.83 (talk) 04:25, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Heart Attack
cnn is reporting he checked himself in to a hospital today for heart attack-like symptoms. should this be mentioned? 66.235.9.15 (talk) 21:28, 28 July 2008 (UTC)


 * His heart attack is old news. See "Health" section in article. &mdash; Frecklefσσt | Talk 11:40, 29 July 2008 (UTC)


 * He had another on July 28 of this year66.235.9.15 (talk) 03:33, 1 August 2008 (UTC)


 * No he was admitted with shortness of breathe related to medication, not another heart attack - Mike Beckham (talk) 03:57, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Substance abuse
After a brief review of the article I couldn't see anything about his substance abuse. CorleoneSerpicoMontana (talk) 15:04, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Parole of sisters murderer
The source we cite: Fox - says "Glenn has until December to decide whether to waive or pursue the January parole hearing." Since this was dated Sept 07 we should update the article if the hearing occurred with the outcome, or the fact that it didn't and the next possible date. Rich Farmbrough, 13:50 22 August 2008 (GMT).

Removed Death of Mother
Whereas his mother died at 80 years old recently and of natural causes, her death can hardly be seen as a "family tragedy" as his father's murder or his sister's murder/rape. --Elysianfields (talk) 17:07, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

He owns Dr Pepper?
Acquired Dr. Pepper after the former CEO lost it in a poker game?

I haven't seen anything along these lines, though he is in the new commercials. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.84.192.189 (talk) 00:05, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

i think there should be something about the Dr Pepper commercials in here. the dr peper Wikipedia says so Stuntman crow (talk) 18:10, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

Duplicate Information
Information in the "Television" section is duplicated, almost word for word, in the "Other Work" section. Does this need removing? This article is terribly badly written... Any volunteers to help rewrite it? AltitudeJunkie (talk) 05:13, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Did he really get this nomination??
In the list of Emmy nominations it says "including one for playing Frasier Crane on three different sitcoms". Did he really get a nomination for that (in which category - a special award?) Or does it mean (as I think it does) that he received Emmy nominations (pl) for playing the same character on three different shows?Jock123 (talk) 09:07, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

No, he did not win an Emmy for playing Frasier on three different sitcoms. While he has appeared as Frasier Crane on Wings, Cheers, and Frasier, he only won Emmys for that character on Frasier. He won another Emmy for his voice work as Sideshow Bob on The Simpsons. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.70.124.122 (talk) 08:34, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

Kelsey Grammer - Does he like dealing with fans?
Has anyone ever met Kelsey Grammer? I've wrote to him on 2 occasions and have never even recieved a courtesy response. Just curious. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.172.16.190 (talk • contribs)

How much fan mail can you reply to without letting it rule your life. Get over it. If your lucky you will meet him at some social event one day and get to say a few words. It happen sometimes, but if you try to make it happen then you are probably close to being a stalker. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 210.56.95.170 (talk • contribs)

Journalists have. Their description of him is not flattering, but pretty much what you would expect of an overpaid Bachman-endorsing asinus.81.178.153.135 (talk) 17:36, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

Other Work
The following paragraph needs fixing. I don't know enough about Grammer to do so.

'Recently he went onto the Internet and started www.KelseyLive.com and developed a new concept which he refers to as a "Branded Social Television Network". The site is a cross between Facebook and MySpace but branded to him then mixed with Amazon as there is shopping and Television where you can find all his old Frasier and Cheers episodes plus other film and TV projects he has done in the past. From his site he plans on developing new content for the net and also the studios. His most current project involves an animated cat called Gary Geezley which is in pre-production currently.' —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.147.205.67 (talk) 17:50, 20 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Done --Tenebrae (talk) 18:26, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

Ginny Dougary
The early footnotes to journalist Ginny Dougary's blog go to an article of hers that the site says was published as "A suitable case for treatment" in the newspaper Irish Independent on November 12, 2005. A search for that article, under a variety of search terms, on the Irish Independent website turns up no such article, and no Grammer article on that date. This put the veracity of that citation -- coming as it does from a private blog and not a vetted newspaper column labeled as a blog -- in doubt. The information it provides should come from an unimpeachable WP:RS source. If it's true, it should be readily available elsewhere. --Tenebrae (talk) 18:31, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

Kelsey's "problems" mentioned on Letterman Jan 14th 2011 ?
Just watched him talking to Letterman and they both joked about the big problems he'd had recently. What were they referring to? The audience seemed to all know.

Update article
Grammer started a TV network called RightNetwork. Please update article. Thanks! Lionel (talk) 01:24, 26 February 2011 (UTC)

To paraphrase Glinda the Good Witch you already have the power to do this yourself. Isn't Wikipedia wonderful? If you need help, contact me on my talk page. --Javaweb (talk) 03:33, 26 February 2011 (UTC)Javaweb
 * I don't see the channel being added to major cable systems but if and when it does, it should be reconsidered for addition. I'm removing the "Update, please" note from the article since it was in regards to this. --Javaweb (talk) 19:55, 27 April 2011 (UTC)Javaweb

Frasier "curse"
I think the article is referring to Mr Grammer being typecast as Frasier after 20+ years of playing him. However, some of the most popular shows have Frasier talent behind them (Modern Family, for example). --Javaweb (talk) 02:34, 16 October 2011 (UTC)Javaweb

Right Network still notable?
It has been almost 2 years since it was announced. Two years later, it looks like nothing much came of it. I would like to remove it. If it becomes significant, we can re-add it. --Javaweb (talk) 19:13, 28 February 2012 (UTC)Javaweb