Talk:Kevin Costner/Archive 1

Another baseball film?
I remember reading something that said Kevin Costner was going to do another baseball movie, but I can't seem to find information on this. Anyone have an idea?

Chasing Dreams (He appears only briefly in the film)

Inconsistencies in the article
The last sentence of the "Bio" section reads:

"He booked one of his first leading roles in the softcore sex comedy Sizzle Beach U.S.A., a film which prompted the actor to swear off doing that kind of film to wait for a proper break which came years later with Silverado."

Meanwhile, the "Filmography" reads:


 * 1) Stacy's Knights (1982)
 * 2) Chasing Dreams (1982)
 * 3) Night Shift (1982)
 * 4) Frances (1982)
 * 5) Table for Five (1983)
 * 6) The Big Chill (1983) (scenes deleted)
 * 7) Testament (1983)
 * 8) The Gunrunner (1984)
 * 9) Fandango (1985)
 * 10) Silverado (1985)
 * 11) American Flyers (1985)
 * 12) Sizzle Beach, U.S.A. (1986)

Huh?


 * "Sizzle Beach, U.S.A." was made in 1974 but never released. After "Silverado" came out and was a hit, "Sizzle Beach" was quickly released to try and capitalize on Costner's success. Michael24 18:52, 5 September 2006

Hallo What it is with the series 500 Nations, in year 1995, hosted from Kevin Costner, and directed from Jack Leustig? A link would be appropriate?--91.115.170.61 (talk) 14:55, 13 March 2010 (UTC)


 * That appears to be a quote in that article, but it isn't mentioned here. You'd have to ask at that page. Wildhartlivie (talk) 18:40, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

What about the young girl Elizabeth Eleanor Sanchez, he married in Mexico before Cindy? Susan Idalia Anderson-Costner (talk) 20:45, 24 February 2016 (UTC)

Kevin Costner's ancestors are German??
The article says that Kevin Costner's father was of German descent.

I maybe wrong, but I presume that this assumption is not correct: "Costner" (or "Kostner") is a very common name in Val Gardena (German: Grödnertal) in South Tyrol/Italy. South Tyrol was not part of Germany, but part of Austria until 1919 and then became Italian. So, Costner may be of Austrian instead of German descent.

One cannot even say that Costner's ancestors come from a German (or Austrian) speaking area, although today about 70% of all South Tyroleans speak German as their mother tongue. In Val Gardena most people (today about 95%) speak Ladin (not Latin!), a roman language (related to Rhetoromance, French and Catalan), as first language. Due to the isolated location of the valley in the Dolomite mountains, German (the major language in South Tyrol) and Italian (the national language) here are still regarded as foreign languages.

Finally the surname "Costner" is not a German, but a Ladin name that derives from "costa", meaning "edge" or "rim" ("Costner" = a person coming from the edge of the mountains). The ladin word "costa" is related to Latin/Italian/Spanish "Costa" and even to English "coast".

I do not know Costner's true family background, but his last names leads directly to Val Gardena in Italy and surely not to Germany.


 * AFAIK German American is a historic term also used for Austrians and Swiss Germans. South Tyrol was surely still a part of Austria when his ancestors immigrated and has still a German speaking majority. The ladin familyname has no big relevance, e.g. one quarter of the German family names are of slavic origin!


 * Well, you are right that South Tyrol was part of Austria when Costner's may have emmigrated to the US. And you are right that South Tyrol was and still is a German speaking area. But the family name "Costner" is a name from a valley, where the great majority does not speak German but Ladin, a Roman language. Even today about 95% of the valley's population speaks Ladin as mother tongue. I think the Ladin family name "Costner" has a certain relevance, because in the most Ladin valleys there was never an immigration or emmigration of a great number of people to or from other German speaking areas.


 * So, you cannot compare here with German family names of Slavic orgin. The mountain valley communities are still very homogenious, and you can very often easily identify the place of birth of a South Tyrolean or Ladin, if you know his family name.


 * My question now is the following: Is a person regarded as "German American" only because of geographical reasons, even if his ancestors never spoke German as mother tongue? On the other hand (due to the close relation of the Ladin and the Italian language), "Italian American" would be the wrong term as well, as the Val Gardena was not Italian at that time.


 * Unfortunately, we could not yet verify the assupmtion that K. Costner's ancestors actually came from this valley. All discussion about Costner being Ladin or not may be ended by locating his ancestors in Germany, Austria or where ever.
 * You cannot say that an american whose name is today Costner also had ancestors with this name. Many people changed their names slightly or totally to adapt to the english language. For example, there where germans of the name Kastner who changed it to Kostner or Costner. Also there is the german name Köstner. Perhaps his german ancestors had a totally different name like Schmidt and Costner has a different origin. Without true sources that is all speculation.--CosmoKramer09 (talk) 04:29, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Also the family might have a connection to this area, but not come directly from there. Ie. someone named Costner may have moved to Germany a long time ago and then his relatives later emigrated to the USA. So the family may be German in the sense that they have lived there for generations even if the name is of Ladin origin. 5.45.62.139 (talk) 11:35, 8 July 2017 (UTC)

German ancestry
Does anyone have a source that he's of significant German ancestry? I've removed the category until someone provides one. I realize he has "some" German ancestry, but unless it's a full parent or he somehow identifies with it, the category isn't fully appropriate. JackO&#39;Lantern 05:11, 5 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Costner [Kostner] is a German surname.
 * These various trees give his full ancestry. His last German ancestor was in the 18th century. Mad Jack 18:45, 28 August 2006 (UTC)


 * Unfortunately, I cannot find his ancestry on this website. Can you say something about the Ladin valley discussion from above? Where did his ancestors come from? Germany, Austria, South Tyrol?


 * It was me, who started this "Ladin discussion" years ago. Meanwhile, I found out that the Costner family is anything else but "Austrian German", "Tyrolean" or "(non-German, but Roman-)Ladin". The family's surename was "Kastner" in the 18th century, when they came to the US, and they are from Han(n)over. I recommend to delete my former hypothesis :o)

Casino and businesses
I added the Midnight Star information, but Kevin and his brother Dan are also developing a larger resort, "The Dunbar" (after his DwW character), outside of Deadwood, SD. I don't have sufficient info about the resort to add anything verifiable or substantial.

Additionally, I know he was a major part of a movement to finance and build a rail line from the airport near Rapid City, SD (the nearest airport of decent size) to Deadwood to help ferry in more tourism. This movement appears to have died out after a few years of effort. Again, I don't have the details.


 * From what I know, the movement is completely dead. It is still talked about from time to time but I understood it to be a matter of inadequate financing and the state not wishing to contribute.  I know of no verifiable sources to substantiate this however.  --151.151.73.165 15:50, 14 July 2006 (UTC)CostnerM

I moved this here:


 * Costner owns 93.5% of the "Midnight Star" casino in Deadwood, South Dakota. The casino, its sports bar "Diamond Lil's", and its restaurant "Jake's" are all named after characters and locations from the movie Silverado; and the facility contains posters, costumes, and other memorabilia from Costner's films. In July 2004, Costner fired Francis and Carla Caneva, who managed the "Midnight Star". A judge subsequently order Costner to pay $6.1m to buy out the Caneva's as his business partners. In November2006, the South Dakota Supreme Court overturned the lower court's verdict. The SDSC ruled that the casino be appraised and if found to be worth less than $4.9 million, the amount the Costner has put into the hotel, he will not be force to pay his former partners.

This desperately needs a) references, b) copyediting.--Eloquence* 08:27, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Trivia?
What happened to the trivia section? There were some interesting facts about his films and his penchant for baseball / water based films - but now it all appears to have vanished. Is there a reasonable explanation for the removal? --Costner 20:11, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Cal Ripken
the urban legend concerning kevin costner possibly sleeping with mrs. ripken has reached cult status and should be somehow noted. WillC 23:06, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

The Explorers Club
There seems to be an interesting project looming. I'd suggest Explorers Club (film) (which would cover the animated series of shorts and feature. Does anyone have any extra information before I get the stub rolling? (Emperor 12:29, 1 July 2007 (UTC))

No Way Out
While Wikipedia no longer includes spoiler warnings in plot descriptions, I didn't think it right for an entry on an actor to blow a movie's surprise ending, so I removed that detail regarding No Way Out from this article. TJSwoboda (talk) 06:40, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

Obviously everyone editing this article is blind...
or how else do you explain that references to him being a 'cow rider' and giving 'smashing lessons' have been sitting in the article since 4th October 2007. We really need to do better than this. Exxolon (talk) 18:52, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Food
Since I don't know how to make my own comment right now, I'll add it here:

Where would one fit in a section on Kevin's refusal to buy food for a person who is IMMENSELY less fortunate than he is? A new heading named Career Lows perhaps?
 * Nowhere, unless it was well-documented by reliable sources. Sarcasticidealist (talk) 19:33, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

"Lewd Act" Incident
I seem to remember there was incident where Costner had a wank after a massage and upset the masseuse who complained, was fired and then launched an unfair dismissal claim against her employer. Why is there no mention of this? I'd say it is as important as the Oscar he won for Dances with Wolves
 * The incident used to be on this page, but I guess somebody deleted it. From what I recall, I don't think the identity of the celebrity involved was ever confirmed to be Costner. His name was likely attached to the story because the spa where it happened is owned by a friend of his and he was an occasional visitor. Michael24 12:34, 17 February 2007
 * His identity was revealed conclusively, it was probably deleted by a fan. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.61.16.14 (talk) 05:46, 8 May 2007 (UTC).
 * I put it back, with its ref. Rgds, --Trident13 23:26, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I put it back, with its ref - AGAIN!!! Rgds, - Trident13 23:28, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
 * And AGAIN!!! I wish the fans would stop trying to hide a well referenced but unfortunate incident. Rgds, --Trident13 (talk) 23:46, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

(outdent) And AGAIN??? You went back almost two years to restore a section in the exact format that you last edited it in August 2007? With no improvements to the referencing format or attention to what reference might or might not be still online. no attention to any improvements of the formatting or referencing done after your restoration then? Well referenced? No. It contains four references for the last sentence in the article, all of which are essentially the same story repeated. One other statement was referenced to some site called celebitchy.com, which I removed. That doesn't even come close to the standard for WP:RS. You haven't bothered to present half the facts in the sources. The first sentence is worded to sound as if Costner himself is involved in some way in a legal case, said that an employee complained, presented as matter of fact, not that there was ever substantiation that he actually did the thing involved, even though the actual sources only said "alleged", "allegedly" (twice), "accused". The section as written goes on to say "When she informed the hotel management, she was dismissed." The four sources all make it clear that the incident was supposed to have happened in October 2004 and she wasn't fired until August 2005 and that the legal issues were over her claim of unfair firing, not whether there was any conclusive evidence that Costner in fact did what she claimed. Finally, it does not bother to mention any statements regarding the incident from Costner or his representatives. The section doesn't come near to standards for neutrality and had been removed from this article for nearly a year until it was returned in its faulty entirety today. As it currently exists, it's a WP:BLP concern because of its biased slant. Wildhartlivie (talk) 03:41, 17 July 2009 (UTC)

I'm not a fan of Costner, so before anyone tries to take an easy shot, I personally do not care one bit about him, but I do care about Wikipedia. When there is any doubt over WP:BLP, the sensible and prudent thing to do, is to remove the offending material, and leave it removed until all parties are agreed on its suitability and the manner in which the information is presented. We have a responsibility to get it right. Just restoring it on the assumption that Costner's fans don't want to see their hero in a bad light, does not assume good faith. The way it is written is unacceptable because it adds a bias that is not contained in the source material. The external articles present it as an allegation, which is even more reason for us to be cautious. He's allegedly committed a criminal act, and despite his high profile, the story has died in the intervening three years. If three years have passed and the incident is still no more than an allegation, how seriously is Costner's connection to the incident being taken in a wider forum? Probably not very. The external articles come to the conclusion that ultimately it was a dispute between an employer and an employee. Costner's alleged involvement eventually becomes a side issue to the main case, and in the final settlement, Costner is not involved at all. The way it exists in our article is not well written, and the references mean zero when they are used to support material that is substantially different in both tone and weight to what the references actually say. We can do better than this, and we must. Rossrs (talk) 05:13, 17 July 2009 (UTC)

Oh, I see while I was writing this, someone removed the offending material. I agree with this, and with the edit summary that says what User:Wildhartlivie and I have been saying, only more succinctly. Rossrs (talk) 05:31, 17 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree with the removal and the very explicit reason why it was removed. I was considering going ahead and removing it based on WP:BLP, but hesitated. I'm glad my instinct was right. Thanks, User:Steve Smith. Wildhartlivie (talk) 06:46, 17 July 2009 (UTC)

I'm watching a Craig Ferguson clip and this incident is referenced which I didn't remember, not that make it habit of reading shit like TMZ or such. So I came here to Wikipedia to see what the fuss is about. CUE crickets SFX. Then I think better check the talk and sure enough I find exactly the kind kind of mods-on-power-trip shit that drove me away from editing Wikipedia many moons ago. This incident was clearly widely reported and made it into the cultural zeitgeist whether it was unfounded or not. To not list it is simply whitewashing history.

It's shit like this that keeps me from ever donating to Wiki and I know that I'm not the only one...

Documentaries ... not movies!
All the documentaries listed in the actor's filmography should be listed under a separate category because those are not movies. They should be under a section called "documentaries".

ICE77 (talk) 21:25, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Documentaries are movies. There is no precedent for creating separate tables for documentaries. They are correctly listed and designated as they are. Wildhartlivie (talk) 01:33, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

I don't agree. Stuff like episodes from television series and things that are not shown in cinemas are not movies. A documentary where the actor is showing up for a few minutes is not a movie but it's a documentary and should be listed separately from stuff like The Untouchables or Dance with Wolves. Documentaries are generally designed to educate. Movies are definitely designed to entertain.

ICE77 (talk) 20:35, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
 * What a production is designed to do has nothing to do with it. Don't you ever sit and watch awards events like the Academy Awards? All those awards that Michael Moore won were for documentaries that were shown at the movie theater. They are shown for pay, just like movies. In any event, you're wrong. Documentaries are listed in the tables along with films and I'm not lying to you. They properly belong with other work and if a table is made separately for documentaries, I will revert it. There are only four listed, Madonna: Truth or Dare was a widely released documentary shown in theatres, so was A Century of Cinema. Separating four items into a separate table, when two of them were released like films is wrong, pointy, and inappropriate. Wildhartlivie (talk) 04:26, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

Movies and documentaries have different goals and nature. A movie has a real or fictional plot whereas a documentary is mostly about history and events. I never watch the Academy Awards. They are just like the Grammy Awards. It's all about marketing and marketing is disgusting. Some movies and musicians get awards for trash. It's all controlled by the system, particularly the American movie and music market. I suspect at least 80% of people don't care at all about going to watch a documentary in a cinema. In fact, that's what you watch on TV on the History Channel or similar channels. Documentaries break away from movies and this is why they should be in a different list. Nobody will ever call A Century of Cinema a movie but a documentary.

ICE77 (talk) 07:18, 9 February 2010 (UTC)
 * And what's your point? No one needs a primer on the difference between a feature film and a documentary and I don't much care whether you watch awards shows or not. That isn't the point here. The point is, for purposes of Wikipedia, they are listed together and if necessary, notated as a documentary. There is no precedent for pulling out four items for separate listing. The rest of all of this is essentially flotsam and jetsam. We don't do that is sufficient here. Wildhartlivie (talk) 07:24, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Dude, you asked me if I watch the Grammy Awards and I told you that I don't. I didn't make a point out of that. I just answered your question.

ICE77 (talk) 19:04, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Oil Seperation
It seems he funded a company called Ocean Therapy Solutions to build oil seperation machines. I've added this to the article. Problem is, there are two sources and they kinda disagree on how the company started. The NYTimes (http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/05/19/if-you-build-it/?dbk) says he brought it, while the Independent (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/bp-calls-in-costners-26m-vacuum-cleaners-to-mop-up-huge-oil-spill-1979976.html) implies he founded it, I suspect it's a combination thereof. Can anyone figure out the truth to this and update as required? The independent definitely reads like a better source. 86.139.162.98 (talk) 23:28, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Costner spent his early years in Compton
That is, according to this article. The word "Compton" does not yet appear to be in the article. --82.171.70.54 (talk) 11:38, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Still true, and still not in the Wikipedia article. --82.171.70.54 (talk) 19:05, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Son plays for CU Baseball?
No evidence of this exists on the official University of Colorado Baseball club website. http://www.colorado.edu/StudentGroups/baseball/roster.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.225.17.34 (talk) 17:11, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Public speaking
Surely this section isn't really appropriate? The speech at the funeral was personal and something many other people do, I don't think it is classed as public speaking. 01:15, 2 March 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.108.212.88 (talk)

Qualitative Analysis
I think it should be noted somewhere in this article that Costner is *not* the worst actor of all time. That distinction belongs to Nicholas Cage. Costner is a close 2nd. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bileman (talk • contribs) 14:12, 29 April 2012 (UTC)

Neil Youngs Ranch,
Had a adventure with the Buffalo several years ago on Neals property. It was fun to watch.. Buffalo looking thru window and I .. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.127.49.234 (talk) 16:02, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

Years Active
Years active	1974–present? Is this correct - I cannot find anything to verify this.

Uncle uncle uncle 03:01, 12 March 2014 (UTC)
 * Had same question. Reset to "1977–present" based on rough estimate: "[L]ast year of college" + "graduated 1978" = last college year 1977-78. Still unverified but better I think. Could be better dated to the Burton moment; or first role as recorded in Wiki article. Swliv (talk) 13:24, 4 February 2015 (UTC)

His music & his writing
Someone should add something about his non-Hollywood activities, such as his fiction writing. Glacierman (talk) 05:12, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

His "Accent"?
I've always been "bemused", and a little enchanted, I might add of Mr. Costner's accent. I've noticed, that though this page lists his "distant " ancestry as mainaly German-Irish, more immediately I would suspect that his origins (or, at least his parents and perhaps grandparents',) would most likely be from the "western states", east of California, most notably Oklahoma, in which case would may make him the son of the historic, "Depression Era" forced mass migration to the west coast, called "Okies"! Costner's accent is neither quite "Southern", nor "Mid-Western", but seemingly a blending of the two. The fact that he was raised in Compton for the first, formidable years of his life, yet never seemed to acclaimate to one of the more 'colorful' of standard english accents of the Los Angeles sprawl, indicates the kept close to his arents roots! I also noticed this (Western-states) acccent inmany actors, such as Sally Fields, and Sanday Duncan!!! --184.207.21.245 (talk) 19:49, 18 January 2016 (UTC)Veryverser

Biggest moviestar of 87?
If you Google “ Biggest moviestar of 87”, it says Steve Guttenberg. Kevin Costner comes in at 17. 188.178.169.206 (talk) 16:09, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
 * That unsourced claim was added in Nov 21; I've restored the wording it had before that edit. Schazjmd   (talk)  16:33, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 9 March 2023
On September 25, 2004, Costner married his girlfriend of four years, model and handbag designer Christine Baumgartner,[57] at his ranch in Aspen, Colorado. Baumgartner is the proprietor of "Cat Bag Couture" which features prestigious handbags carried by many celebrities. Crittercritter (talk) 21:33, 9 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the template. Although your request is unclear, I think you're asking to add Baumgartner is the proprietor of "Cat Bag Couture" which features prestigious handbags carried by many celebrities. I'm declining the request for now as it's merely advertising and puffery. You're welcome to open a discussion this talk page to try to get consensus from other editors that it should be included.  Schazjmd   (talk)  21:49, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

Movie not listed
Kevin was in a 1985 movie called American Flyers Mostyn47 (talk) 22:35, 16 April 2023 (UTC)
 * @Mostyn47, it's mentioned in the lead and in the career section. Schazjmd   (talk)  22:37, 16 April 2023 (UTC)
 * I saw that after I posted my comment. Thanks! Mostyn47 (talk) 06:19, 27 April 2023 (UTC)

Number of kids wrong
It says he has 7 kids. Four with his first wife, three with the second wife, and one with a woman between the wives. That's 8. 50.38.74.34 (talk) 18:29, 3 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Article says 3 with first wife, 1 in between, 3 with second wife. Schazjmd   (talk)  18:35, 3 May 2023 (UTC)

Kevin Costner Dances with Wolf
A strange twist to the Black Hills story is the recent attempt by Kevin Costner, director and star of Dances With Wolves, to build a 838-acre recreation resort, including ski runs and a railroad, in the lands of the people who were the subject of his film. Since the mid-1990s, Costner and his brother have been planning the resort and dismissing Lakota concerns. In April 2002, Costner met with Lakota leader Arvol Looking Horse and agreed to reconsider his development plans to better serve the Lakota. Costner has also cleaned up a trash pit dump area which was left by the Homestake Mine. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cesiedoggie (talk • contribs) 00:41, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

Sourcing issue
The current foonote #9 is a problem. It simply reads, "Stated on Inside the Actors Studio, 2001." The sections on Costner's early life and early career lean heavily on this source, which is cited a total of 13 times. I am not sure how to locate this source to see if it supports the information for which it is cited, and then there is the question of whether it is reliable. I have tried to find better sources as alternatives, but more are needed. Help would be appreciated. MonMothma (talk) 18:19, 3 July 2023 (UTC)
 * @MonMothma, biographical details are likely to be in the questionnaire portion of the episode, which is on YouTube, if you want to watch it and verify the specific information. Schazjmd   (talk)  19:04, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Kevin costners bodyguard
@Hdkeeper 95.146.233.40 (talk) 11:14, 9 July 2023 (UTC)