Talk:Killer Instinct (1994 video game)

Thanks
I appreciate the detailed information that has been provided here. I have a very special friend from The Netherlands who is a computer programmer called Darth Koala www.sellaband.com/believer/darthkoala who rates the game highly. He has also sent many people to this artice, me being one of them. Thank you for taking the time to write it! :) Vegas dragons 19:40, 6 January 2007 (UTC) vegas_dragons

snes port revealing
what about the revealing of the snes port in the donkey kong country revealed video by nintendo power. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Braddirt (talk • contribs) 04:56, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * That would be trivia, and not needed.--Drat (Talk) 05:53, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

i disagree i think that piece of trivia would be a welcome addition —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.184.41.50 (talk) 12:00, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Ultra 64
KI did not use the real "ultra 64" hardware engine. I mean, it did, depending on how you think about it. It certainly did not use the hardware that was in the nintendo 64, nor did it use the hardware of cruisin USA, another game that claimed to use the ultra 64 hardware. So essentially it was a lie payed for by nintendo.


 * It used the Ultra 64 hardware engine - the only problem was that the Ultra 64 hardware was not identical with the Nintendo 64 :) It's explained in the Ultra 64 article, which is a redirect to Nintendo 64 --Tjansen 21:24, 13 Oct 2004 (UTC)

You didn't pay close enough attention to what I said. Ok, your calling the system in KI THE Ultra 64 hardware engine. Cruisin USA, which also called itself "the ultra 64 engine", used a completely different engine. Its obvious Rare and Midway were seperatey paid by nintendo to create games claiming to be on the U64 without Nintendo even thinking about what the N64 would be.

--128.119.132.42 17:58, 21 June 2006 (UTC) guys. the wiki says "Arcade [hardware]: Ultra 64, essentially a Nintendo 64" in the profile sidebar. that is completely wrong. the nintendo 64 hardware was nothing like the KI arcade hardware. so certainly it wasn't "essentially" a nintendo 64 inside the cabinet.
 * Cleaned that bit up.--Drat (Talk) 18:33, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

article completeness
is horrible and i will not contribute anymore, bc of drat have fun finishing the article that you (drat) know nothing about. also kawks. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.96.241.16 (talk • contribs).
 * So be it. You were wrong to put comments in article space. I was not wrong to remove them. If you are who you claim to be, you would not engage in such behaviour (IMO). Besides all that, you need to cite a source for your information. Hundreds of articles have been made good without any direct input from anyone involved in the production. This won't be the first, and certainly not the last.--Drat (Talk) 11:12, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

i was only leaving a note to let people know it would be complete in the next day, so they could come back if they were interested. and this article has been around since at least 2004 with little to no progress, that is the only reason i took it upon myself to give information i have. also, i do not care if you believe i had a boring job before, but for some reason the changes i made are still on the page. there are still bugs in combo system that people dont notice because it doesnt affect gameplay, its just not how it was intended. actually some of the bugs were even tweaked and added as features. well, have a nice day cro drat. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.96.241.16 (talk • contribs).
 * There is no need for such notes in an article. People who are interested in the article and have accounts can set it on their watchlist. Even if you are a dev/tester, additions should have citations. Otherwise others may challenge them. All we have to go on is your word.--Drat (Talk) 03:08, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

and now you will have nothing more to go on —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.96.241.16 (talk • contribs).
 * Do you think I really care? All I did was remove an out-of-place message, so now you refuse to help. Frankly, I believe your attitude to be childish. When this page becomes much better, whether it is a matter of months or years, it'll happen with or without your help.--Drat (Talk) 06:03, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

Good job drat, this article is a huge piece of fail because of you. Im not sure what this article looked like back then, but you shouldnt have shit talked a dev/tester whoever, the article is missing alot of info still. Just scanned through the article again, the auto combo part is completely wrong. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.184.41.50 (talk) 12:06, 12 May 2008 (UTC)
 * There was no proof that the person worked on the game, and was not just spouting BS. It doesn't matter if they worked on the game or not; sources are needed. They were also inserting inappropriate comments into the page.--Drat (Talk) 13:18, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

bunch of hogwash
"The game also suffers from many glitches due the complex system, players (and AI) can simply defeat an opponent by quickly tapping low punches or kicks, and when playing against AI."

there's no such as low punches/kickes in Killer Instict. there's crouching moves. but in that case, which strength of [crouching] strike might we be talking about here? i find it extremely improbable that an ADULT HUMAN player could be defeated by "quickly tapping low punches or kicks."


 * Unfortunately, original research like that sometimes creeps in.--Drat (Talk) 18:21, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I've now deleted that whole paragraph.--Drat (Talk) 18:33, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Copyright
Does anyone know who holds the copyright on Killer Instinct; I've heard rumors that said Rare has it, and rumors that Nintendo has it. Does anyone know for certain? -- VederJuda 15:19, 7 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Rare for all intents and purposes was owned by Nintendo until Microsoft bought them, and when they left, as part of the agreement Rare (and thus Microsoft) retain their own IP except the Donkey Kong Country series and the StarWing/StarFox/Lylat Wars license which remained with Nintendo. - UnlimitedAccess 06:24, 26 August 2005 (UTC)
 * A search on http://www.uspto.gov/main/trademarks.htm shows that Nintendo still owns the Killer Instinct trademark. I think if Microsoft had gotten ahold of the rights to do a KI3 for Xbox/Xbox360 they would have said so by now. -- Hardgoodbye 09:03, 8 November 2005 (UTC)
 * Nintendo still owns the trademark for Killer Instict, the title for the arcade and SNES. However, the doesn't necessery equals owning the rights to publishing future titles under that name.

TJ Combo
Just as a note, I've only played the Snes version. Anyway the manual and game conflict on why TJ was disqualified. One says brutality, the other says cyber-arms. What does the arcade version say?--Drat (Talk) 05:40, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Well...The Gameboy version says Cybernetic arms in the game, so I'd say cybernetic arms, since it's mentioned most often... Lordofallkobuns 10:34, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Yea, I don't know. I've heard both from within the game and in the booklet. I don't think Rare really cared much to double check if the two matched up!

Rounds
I changed the description of the rounds within the game. Previously it claimed there was technically one round and that the fight would continue immidiately when the losing player recieves their second life bar. The fights KI in fact are composed of 2 or 3 rounds like in other fighting games, since there is a clear pause in the fighting. The only major difference is that the players continue from the exact spots where they were standing at the end of the round, and the winning player continues with the life-bar he had in the previous round (unlike where in other games they usually continue from the centre of the arena with full life-bars). Also the fight doesn't continue immidiately since the announcer clearly announces the beginning of the next round (the message is also Ready, but this is still a pause in the fighting, the article made it sound like the second player just got his second bar and the fighting continued). (Hannu M.)

I think the fact that life bars don't fill are the rationale behind counting it as 'one round.' Traditionally speaking fighting games up this point had the life bars fill totally, with the exception of KOF 94.

Character similarities.
I deleted this section as it is pretty much all original research. Not to mention, the fact that some characters appear similar to others from other games hardly distinguishes it from hundreds of other fighting games, does it?--Drat (Talk) 04:21, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Super Tennis
I removed this from the page: *Some Killer Instinct cartridges shipped with Super Tennis loaded into the ROM instead of Killer Instinct. This was common of Walmart issues. The person who added it put the citation tag there themselves and a Google search for "Killer Instincr" "Super Tennis" turned up nothing exccept pages that mentioned both games. If anyone has a source, re-add this. Ace of Sevens 01:32, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Sequel
I removed the folowing from the page as it's unreferenced and a lot of it speculative and therefore unverifiable. Please re-add if you fidn references for the verifiable parts. Ace of Sevens 03:10, 19 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Ever since Microsoft purchased Rare, there have been strong rumors of a game called Killer Instinct 360 being published by Microsoft Game Studios for the Xbox 360. This has generated a lot of hype, because consumers have been asking for a sequel to Killer Instinct for a long time. Rumors suggest that Microsoft will release Killer Instinct 360 in the home and the arcade simultaneously, and both versions will allow people to play online and use Xbox 360 Memory Cards--similar to the performance of the SNK Neo Geo.


 * The performance of the arcade game will be identical to the home version (only load times will differ), because the arcade hardware unit will be based on the Xbox 360. This is similar to what Sega did when they released an arcade hardware unit called, N.A.O.M.I, which stood for New Arcade Operation Machine Idea. Releasing arcade hardware architecture similar to the Xbox 360 would allow Microsoft to reduce hardware costs for both the arcade hardware needed for Killer Instinct 360 and the Xbox 360 system in the home. This is an excellent business model that would help Killer Instinct to achieve a tremendous level of popularity in the home and the arcade at the same time, because the two versions would be identical in performance and released at the same time.


 * At this point in time, Killer Instinct 360 is the only game rumored to use a hardware architecture based on the Xbox 360. It is suspected that the home version of the Xbox 360 will allow consumers to download all sorts of extra clothes and outfits for their characters. Up to 1,000 Achievement Points could also be earned for the Xbox 360 home version. The Xbox 360 home version will allow online fighting to occur between members of Xbox Live Gold. These are tremendous features that would generate a lot of popularity for the Xbox 360 among gamers worldwide.

KI 2?
There's already a page dedicated to KI2 and KI Gold. Therefore I don't think we need the sentences in the opening paragraph, "The Nintendo 64 version of the same game is called Killer Instinct Gold." Does anyone plan to do a series page?

207.172.52.41Carmen

His/Her and s/he
I had my corrections changing his/her to his and s/he to he reverted. Please can the reason for this be stated here or otherwise I will repeat the edit. The use of his and he is a well established part of the language and automatically implies her and she. Writing his/her is ugly, wordy and inappropriate for an encylopedia. 161.142.24.130 00:43, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Original Research/Other
The article mentions some details about the combos, as well as character storylines. Although these things do seem accurate, a lot of material seems to have been written by someone familiar with the game and doesn't cite the source. Perhaps a simple sentence, like "The arcade included the following descriptions" would be more precise. Meltdown's name is probably able to be cited from a Nintendo Power.

Winning the game with Eyedol does have an ending storyline that clearly parodies Blanka from Street Fighter II. Another note is that the SNES version had a different ending (saying something about Eyedol's bracelet) whereas the arcade version mentioned the club.

Some notable game play features: I think the sky stage is perhaps noteworthy, as it could lead to some very short games on the arcade (although the Tekken series was known to have even faster fights). Also, in the arcade Eyedol had a notably easy infinite combo (when the opponent was at the edge of a stage), plus a much more difficult infinite combo (running back and forth), and the SNES version didn't have these things.

The comment above about tapping a low button might be referring to the easy repeatable combos in KI Gold, which would be another game.

KI1 and KI2 used the exact same motherboard (the model # / name / whatever was identical on both motherboards), and the software was different only by the chips installed in the motherboard and the hard drive. (Surprising, perhaps, considering how different the games graphical feels look from each other.) These games used the Ultra 64 hardware, which was the correct name for the hardware at the time of KI1's release. Rare had said (in some unofficial strategy guide) that they had no concerns/reason-to-worry about KI Gold matching the performance of KI2, making some smart remark about those concerns only being needed when moving to a less powerful machine. (KI Gold was initially also going to have more characters, but the memory limitations of the cartridge later proved to prevent this.) Therefore, it's not out of line to think that the N64 is really significantly different than the Ultra 64, other than the lack of the hard drive. Cruisin' USA is known to use some other motherboard, and reference the Ultra 64 just as an unrelated advertisement.

Bugs in the game could probably get their own section, including Orchid's attacking after turning into a frog, opponents shrinking with Thunder's combo, Riptor being unable to get a high hitting combo when the Ultra misses, and the fight being able to continue on after Orchid initiates her Ultra (if initiated after hitting the opponent into the air and then backflipping, and having the opponent hit her out of the Ultra).

Also, I've heard KI was the SNES's best selling game. If so, that'd be a great thing to quote if someone knows a source to quote.

Edit: Made the previous paragraph say "easy repeatable combos in KI Gold", as it was KI Gold, not KI2, which had those easy infinites. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.124.136.170 (talk • contribs)

"Also, I've heard KI was the SNES's best selling game. If so, that'd be a great thing to quote if someone knows a source to quote." Definetly not man. Not by a LONG shot... the game was never even sold in Japan (where SFC games sold way more then US) and even if that was not part of the equation, it would definetly be under a slew of games (DKC, Street Fighter II, Super Mario World.)

As for the rest, it appears to be original. However I think the combo system is much, much more important then 'character bios.' Information about the flow of a game is much more pertinent in an encyclopaedia article then this obsessive detailing of characters' professions: 'well, Cinder used to be a convict....' 207.172.52.41 06:44, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

Backgrounds..
"It featured animated backgrounds that were pre-rendered movies which changed angles depending on the character location." Look at game, it's clearly see, that backgrounds are 3D, not pre-rendered movies. It has semi-free cam on some stages, typical gfx artifacts (affine-like texture mapping), dropping polygons (look at any 'KI glitches' movie on youtube), and so on. And it even has frame-in-frame effect on Orchid stage, which impossible for pre-render movie;) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 89.178.133.209 (talk) 12:30, 28 February 2007 (UTC).


 * Some of the levels were pre-rendered movies, such as Combo's stage, but others, like Orchids were 3D. Then Thunder's stage was a combination of both, although the pre-rendered background was really just a non-parallax looping sky movie.  I'll take a look at correcting this article to state something to that effect, although in a simpler manner. Ccntech 08:35, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Character bios...
Really ought to be cut down. I don't want to go ahead and delete some with out some sort of consensus but when biographies detailing the characters' professions (which is something a speciality fan site should be tackling rather then Wikipedia) outweighs a scant section on game mechanics (mechanics that mention only a few of the numberous aspects of the system), then we've got a real priority problem. 207.172.52.41 06:51, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

Play as Eyedol go Cinder, at VS screen hold right, press L R X B Y A u will hear Eyedol after it is done. Rakarno.

Confusing description
"This technique causes the backgrounds to have an unprecedented three dimensional look giving a visual impression more advanced than current realtime rendering hardware had permitted."

This sentence is confusing to me, I had to reread it a couple times. At first, I thought it was saying that the backgrounds in KI are more advanced than the real-time engines of today. I think the use of the phrase "current realtime rendering hardware" is confusing. I don't really have a suggestion for a better wording, but it should be more clear that we are talking about contemporary hardware at the time KI was released. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Yjmfan (talk • contribs) 23:55, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Unsourced information removed
This information was removed by another editor, but I believe if it can be sourced, it should make it's way back into the article, in a cleaner manner.

"Developed using SGI computers and 3D modeling software from Alias, Killer Instinct'' used many techniques never seen before its release and have yet to be replicated in another title. It featured animated backgrounds that were pre-rendered movies which changed angles depending on the character location on many of the stages.

This technique causes the backgrounds to have an unprecedented three dimensional look giving a visual impression more advanced than current realtime rendering hardware had permitted. (Bram Stoker's Dracula for the Sega CD later used this technique.) Killer Instinct was the first arcade game with an internal hard disk."

AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 13:01, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

The bullshit about the hard drive is pointless. There were many other games that even used boot floppies in addition to the roms to allow for quick game changes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.185.70.110 (talk) 19:31, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

Unsourced misinformation about Spinal
Under Spinal's section: "It is also revealed that he is Thunder's brother, Eagle." and "--- to the point of *overloading* if he stores too many skulls." are seriously disputable. I tossed "Need Citations" into those statements and challenge active Wikipedians to find verifiable sources to these statements and correct the preceeding misinformation. White Mage Cid —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.167.234.84 (talk) 00:39, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

-- He can store up to five skull tokens, to the point of overloading if he absorbs any more energy.......(this is correct, i have elaborated in the main text. Personal testing backs this up) .....Upon attempting to sheild absorb a sixth skull spinal will not block the projectile, it will cause normal damage and also knockdown. Spinal will be left with one remaining skull.

. -- user : from killerinstinctonline.net/forum. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.7.33.13 (talk) 17:03, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

SPINAL
in the gold version they say that spinal fights because he have a curse
 * I might be wrong, but in the SNES version I think he fights because it's the only memory he has left fron when he was alive. Ricardo J. R. Silva (talk) 19:50, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

TUSK
WHAT HAPPEN WITH TUSK?
 * Tusk isn't in the first Killer Instinct. Ricardo J. R. Silva (talk) 19:49, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

B. Orchid
Does anyone know an official source for the B. standing for Black? I've wondered this ever since the game came out but no one has ever been able to show me a citing from Nintendo/Rare. It seems reasonable of course, it's just that I've only heard it through word of mouth and fan sites. (What is also odd is at the time I read Nintendo Power magazine religiously and never saw mention of it there either.) It would be great to finally see an actual source, just to ease my mind. Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.179.190.64 (talk) 22:51, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Animated series
According to IMDB, there was a Spanish animated series based on Killer Instinct called "Instinto del asesino", and it was made by Almena Films and directed by Pascal Morelli. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.230.133.247 (talk) 22:54, 7 September 2012 (UTC)
 * That IMDB listing is a hoax. The same person is responsible for the listing for a supposed Hong Kong animation based on Toshinden 4, which also doesn't exist. I've had to remove or fix a ton of hoaxes or grotesquely inaccurate listings perpetraded by this one guy.--TServo2050 (talk) 16:18, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Rare Replay - The Making of Killer Instinct
One of the unlockable featurettes in Rare Replay is a video on the making of the original KI, as seen here. Is there any detail we can pull from here that we can use to further build out the development section? -- 68.37.227.226 (talk) 15:14, 8 August 2015 (UTC)

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Game being listed as available for the Xbox One
We don't count game-within-a-game as the game being available for a given platform, do we? I think the answer to whether the 1994 KI is available as an Xbox One game is no. If at all, it could be added with a footnote clarifying so. --uKER (talk) 16:00, 1 February 2022 (UTC)