Talk:King Charles

Requested move 8 September 2022

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 

The result of the move request was: not moved. WP:SNOW (closed by non-admin page mover) – robertsky (talk) 16:03, 11 September 2022 (UTC)

King Charles → King Charles (disambiguation) – And redirect King Charles to Charles III. The primary topic for King Charles in our day and age is the King of the United Kingdom, especially in the English-speaking world. A Spanish king from 500 years back can not change that. Kebabpizza (talk) 19:49, 8 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose going off of precedent, Queen Elizabeth targets a disambiguation page despite Queen Elizabeth II being who most people would refer to when saying Queen Elizabeth. It also does seem like some of the other King Charleses of past especially King Charles I were themselves pretty notable and while Charles III is the current king, he's not necessarily the most notable King Charles. TartarTorte 20:05, 8 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose - There have been many kings called Charles, in many realms, and I don't think it's sensible to send everyone to Charles III's page just because he's the UK's current monarch. And the propose change would unnecessarily complicate the hatnote on Charles III's article, too. GenevieveDEon (talk) 20:21, 8 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose. There are many, many kings named Charles, and the one who was named monarch of the U.K. less than a day ago is in no way the WP:PTOPIC when compared to all of the rest of them. Especially when compared to Charles I of Spain, Charles III of Spain, and Charles I of Austria, there is no primary topic here. As such, a dab page is most appropriate. —  Red-tailed hawk (nest) 20:33, 8 September 2022 (UTC)


 * Soft oppose. Queen Elizabeth seems to set a reasonable precedent. However, the page certainly mustn’t stay as is, with those looking for the current UK monarch having to follow another redirect. So Charles III (leading to the UK monarch) certainly needs to be on its own, probably on top, perhaps separated from former Kings Charles using heading such as Reigning/Former. —ThorstenNY (talk) 20:58, 8 September 2022 (UTC)


 * Oppose Even treating the current UK king as the primary meaning of Charles III, although it was ultimately upheld, proved controversial. Treating him as the primary meaning of King Charles, when there are a pile of other monarchs of this name, including two well-known previous British monarchs, is surely going too far. PatGallacher (talk) 01:18, 10 September 2022 (UTC)


 * Oppose Too many important Kings Charles exist to pick one, even the most current Anglosphere one, as the default. Bayonet-lightbulb (talk) 06:32, 10 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose as there are many monarchs known as King Charles. cookie monster   755  03:31, 11 September 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
 * Oppose if there is a primary topic, it would be Charlemagne (Charles the Great); and amongst sovereigns from Great Britain, Charles I of England (the executed king) and Charles II of England (the restored monarchy) are both more prominent than Charles III of Great Britain. Let us not forget Charles VII of France, for whom Joan of Arc died for, another very famous Charles -- 64.229.88.43 (talk) 04:55, 11 September 2022 (UTC)

followup to move discussion
I wanted to check some navigation changes discussed with @Neveselbert in the latter half of February, as we have a full month of stats since, but I also realized the top section was also changed since, in the first half of March. So the picture isn't necessarily clear, but whatever:


 * https://wikinav.toolforge.org/?language=en&title=King_Charles
 * 13739 total incoming views
 * clickstream-enwiki-2024-03.tsv:
 * 10044 total identified outgoing clickstreams
 * King_Charles Charles_III    link    8299 (~60% / ~82.6%)
 * King_Charles Charles_III_(disambiguation)   link    460 (~3.3% / ~4.5%)
 * King_Charles Charles_I      link    342 (~2.5% / ~3.4%)
 * King_Charles Charles_II     link    196
 * King_Charles Charles_X      link    96
 * King_Charles Charles_I_of_England   other   61
 * King_Charles King_Charles_(news_program)    link    60
 * King_Charles Carl_XVI_Gustaf link   59
 * King_Charles Charles_II_of_England  other   55
 * King_Charles Charles_VIII   link    47
 * King_Charles Charles_IV     link    44
 * King_Charles Main_Page      other   37
 * King_Charles Charles_V      link    37
 * King_Charles Charles_VI     link    34
 * King_Charles Charles_IX     link    29
 * King_Charles King_Charles_Spaniel   link    28
 * King_Charles Charles_VII    link    27
 * King_Charles Prince_Charles_(disambiguation) link   24
 * King_Charles King_Charles_(musician) link   19
 * King_Charles Diana,_Princess_of_Wales       other   17
 * King_Charles Monarchy_of_the_United_Kingdom other   16
 * King_Charles Charles_XI_of_Sweden   link    16
 * King_Charles Queen_Elizabeth_The_Queen_Mother       other   14
 * King_Charles Charles_XV     link    14
 * King_Charles Charles_XII_of_Sweden  link    13

That's 25 identified destinations, and it's clear that we come down to the anonymization threshold of 10 there. At WT:D I have a thread where I collated some other cases where the top link gets ~60% incoming, overall it seems fine as is. --Joy (talk) 19:04, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

In all-time monthly page views for King Charles we can see the recent spikes. In the last couple of months, the top items are:


 * April 8863 incoming views, and clickstream-enwiki-2024-04.tsv shows:
 * King_Charles Charles_III    other   4952 (~55.9% / ~79.9%)
 * King_Charles Charles_III_(disambiguation)   other   325 (~3.7% / ~5.2%)
 * King_Charles Charles_I      other   235
 * King_Charles Charles_II     other   174
 * King_Charles King_Charles_(news_program)    other   148
 * total: 6197 to 19 identified destinations
 * total: 6197 to 19 identified destinations


 * May 6978 incoming views, and clickstream-enwiki-2024-05.tsv shows:
 * King_Charles Charles_III    link    4073 (~58.4% / ~77.2%)
 * King_Charles Charles_III_(disambiguation)   link    320 (~4.6% / ~6.1%)
 * King_Charles Charles_I      link    254
 * King_Charles Charles_II     link    162
 * King_Charles Charles_X      link    59
 * total: 5276 to 22 identified destinations
 * total: 5276 to 22 identified destinations

--Joy (talk) 09:30, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

BTW, this amount of clicks on Charles III (dis) may indicate that the Kings section heading causes blindness to the common section on top, the one that has no heading. This might be driving the clicks towards the current king at https://wikinav.toolforge.org/?language=en&title=Charles_III_%28disambiguation%29 IOW that small contingent of readers was sent on a bit of a ride instead of getting navigated efficiently. It's also possible that some of them drop off along the way. --Joy (talk) 20:22, 18 June 2024 (UTC)