Talk:Kinky Friedman

...to Jewish parents
Why is it noteable that he was born "...to Jewish parents"? Does the religion of a person parents always merit coverage in similar types of articles? --NightMonkey 23:37, 7 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Follow his campaign as well as his persona and you'll realize that being a "Jewish cowboy" is important to him.
 * Is his current religion Jewish, messianic Jewish, or Christian?

People who knew Kinky before he was Kinky will probably agree with me that ever since he and his sociologist brother Roger put on Saturday Night Live type sketch comedy -- "I Want My Burpo" -- for Echo Hill Ranch summer camp children in the mid 1960's, Kinky has since his youth and before he was a well known entertainer had the same sense of humor he has today. That has included, for example, telling an interviewer some years ago that he was raised on a ranch called "Rio Duckworth", when in actuality he was raised in Austin, Texas for most of his childhood, while spending summers at the Echo Hill Ranch Summer Camp for mainly Jewish children mainly from Houston, Dallas, San Antonio, and Austin. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.55.97.232 (talk) 07:04, 20 September 2007 (UTC)


 * I read sometime awhile back that he is Jewish Conservative congregation.-- Dakota ~   °  01:11, 24 February 2006 (UTC)


 * I believe he does identify as Jewish, although his works and interviews indicate that he is a very secular Jew. Further, he tends to use his Jewish identity to lend him outsider status. Heck, you don't call your band, "Kinky Friedman and the Texas Jewboys" without SOME good reason. Even back in the 1970s, if he'd used that name for the band WITHOUT being Jewish, he would've been in for a world of trouble, even from Texans.

OZ COMMENT from central Sydney Kinky's work first sprang into my life just before last Christmas. As the child of a half Jew half Irishman and quarter jew anglican mother whose mother was a Scot, both parents with the surname instantly recognized for its extreme jewishness, Dear reader: google "cohenine"&"national geographic", Friedman's analysis of his heritage with a post modern almost secular appreciation and chef like rehashing of the relevance of his strange adventures to the eternal renewal of the moral recommendations of and examples set by Jesus, overlaid with a humour not just present but literally steeped in funny shit,is massive! I'm hooked. If the Kinkster becomes President of the USA, in 2008, I predict that he will make Cuba the 51st state, in order to lower the price of premium stogies. I can't wait to procure copies of his vinyl records, as no one I know owns any. PS I always wondered how a god fearing, christian of liberal and jewish upbringing might think. I get you loud and clear, Oh very late arriving babyboomer intellectual. AC BA LlB (uniSyd-1978) 60 Park Street, Sydney Feb 3, 2006

We NEED a page on Little Jewford. 24.13.86.24 10:21, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

Notable fact, or campaign slogan?
A user has attempted to wipe out the following from the article, saying "Removed campaign slogan; this article is virtually indistinguishable from Friedman's own press releases."
 * If successful, Friedman would be the first Independent candidate elected to the post since Sam Houston in 1859, as well as the first Jewish governor of Texas.

I reverted the change, noting "Revert. Statements are factual and notable." The user reverted back, saying "The comparison to Sam Houston is not objective; it's a campaign talking point. Please don't put that line back in! It's biased!"

Rather than engage in a revert war, I am following the suggestion in Resolving disputes and asking for suggestions.

Would it be fair to point out that this user has all of three edits to their credit -- two of which are noted above? Perhaps it's more fair to point out that the user has not bothered to create an account, which makes his/her contributions hard to trace. The campaign is going to be heated -- we should expect opponents of all five candidates (R, D, Libertarian, and Ix2) to attempt to make inappropriate tweaks. I'm no expert, but I tend to give more respect to the opinion of someone with an edit history and a username ahead of an IP address with three edits total. That doesn't mean that logged-in users are devoid of bias, of course -- it just makes the bias easier to track.

I say that the statement of fact, that there hasn't been an independent candidate elected Governor since Sam Houston, should remain. Both on Kinky's page, and on Carole Keeton Strayhorn's as well. In fact, I'm going to add the statement to the introductory paragraph of her page. It's a defining element of both campaigns. --Robertb-dc 20:08, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

To be fair, its not the most significant statement, nothing ever happens until it happens the first time. BUT, since when do we remove statements just because they are campaign slogans. Often, the major slogans are defining points that need to be put in the article. For example, a quick check of the Rick Perry article shows this quote, "If he is reelected, and serves a full second term, Perry would become the longest serving governor in Texas history, with 10 years of total service." Its his slogan and its an 'if then' statement. And noone is suggesting that it should be removed. I vote that we should restore Kinky's statement to the article. SteveHopson 20:40, 4 August 2006 (UTC)


 * Agreed. I've placed it back in. - TexasAndroid 12:58, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

Go Kinky, Go!
If this man wins, I will take back every bad thing I've ever said about Texas. And there's been quite a few of them. Wandering Star 04:21, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
 * And I will take back every bad thing I've said about overuse of Userboxes. :) --Robertb-dc 22:20, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Updated Poll numbers (newbie don't shoot)
I posted an update of poll numbers. (I tried to copy the style from the previous sentence as much as possible)

I wasn't sure about the old numbers, so I left them intact. (It may help giving an idea of a trend, but the 2 poll sources are different).

Should this be broken out into a separate section apart from the main intro? (Possibly called 2006 Polls/Results (results would eventually go here))

James968 07:05, 21 September 2006 (UTC)james968

Tagged without discussion
An editor who was frustrated with the lack of discussion of Kinky's recent, racially-tinged comments, saw fit to add the tag to the article. That tag says "Please discuss this issue on the talk page", but the editor chose not to do so. Without anything more than his edit comments ("I will probably vote for Friedman. Article is not NPOV and it is like supporting him. Especially no mention of critics that called him a "racist" for some remarks. article needs to clean up.") to work from, I'm removing the Cleanup tag. The article is probably about as cleaned-up as is possible for an active candidate in an election that's 5 weeks away. --Robertb-dc 16:11, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Not to mention that the person who added the clean-up tag then proceeded to add a fairly good paragraph on the whole controversy himself. So his complaints that the page did not mention the problems were invalidated by him shortly thereafter. - TexasAndroid 16:22, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Hey now, I'm not doing a wiki-hit job on Mr. Friedman. All because only one of my edits in this article is "Criticism" section doesn't mean I'm "frustrated" about the state of the article. If it is in the recent news article reported by major news media, it should be at least mention in the person's bio article. I'm not a low-life person who just edits Wikipedia just to criticize a person. Heck if you read the Los Angeles Times overview of the Texas gov race, they mentioned it in a paragraph. The reason why I put the clean up (which is my fault for not following directions), this article in the second half is mostly one sentence paragraphs (A lot of them for an "encyclopedia" article. Some of one sentences could be merged into one paragraph to represent a "main idea."), many bullet points (Not an article but an unoriginal designed PowerPoint presentation?), and some of the quotes should only be in Wikiquote. That is my "Point of View" it fits the "poorly formatted" criteria of a clean up. I don't care. I wouldn't mind if you just delete the clean up tag just with an edit summary. I'm sort of insulted by this by mentioning it in the discussion page. --Oskar Mayer Nguyener 23:51, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Oh I had to get this out of the way, I'm not like currently mad at you for putting this in the discussion. :-P --Oskar Mayer Nguyener 00:08, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Problem is, when you added the tag, you gave us none of the above information to build off of. The only thing you left for us regulars to have even the slightest hint of why you felt the clean-up tag was needed was the comment about the criticism, which you then fixed yourself.  None of the rest of the above was stated.  How are we supposed to know what you feel needs to be cleaned up if you do not say what feel needs to be cleaned up? - TexasAndroid 13:19, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Very good points, Mr. Mayer. I'm sure the article will get a nice shiny polish after the elections.  I'll admit, the use of bullet points is probably a bit of a crutch.  But the quotes are apropos, I believe, because Kinky is largely *defined* by his quotability -- a fact lauded by his supporters and derided by his detractors.  I don't think it's time to move them out of the article, at least not yet. --Robertb-dc 14:42, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

"Crackheads and thugs" Racism by editor
I see that one section says that "Friedman has been accused of making racially offensive remarks by his critics. In 2006, Friedman referred to some of the Hurricane Katrina evacuees as "crackheads and thugs" during a speech about Houston's rising crime"

That's pretty racist. Not by Kinky, but by the person that wrote that. He never mentioned a race and obviously you think that all crackheads and thugs are of a different race than white. Let's grow up people. I'm in favor of removing that section. Any takers?
 * Okay, I will repeat again, I wasn't doing a wiki-hit job. (see a previous discussion) Have to defend my editing. I rarely do political articles. (see my contributions which is mostly North Texas regions-related articles, American pop culture, NFL, geek culture, and video games) Yes, I should have phrased that better and it could be portrayed point-of-view. Plus, I actually sourced my material which are well known i.e., The Los Angeles Times and an Associated Press article hosted by Fox News. It is not a weblog or some radical media group. Do a Google News search: "Kinky Friedman".  Excerpts of a well-known news source article (Reuters) overview Mr. Friedman's  on his stands and supports. They also mention this: "Such comments could be construed as code for race-baiting -- most evacuees are black -- but Friedman says he is an "equal opportunity offender" and that attempts by other candidates to tar him with the brush of racism on past comments were unfair." Oh well I'm a racist even though I'm in a minority race in Texas (not white and Hispanic) and not African decedent. --J. Nguyen 02:22, 7 November 2006 (UTC)


 * My claim still stands the same. I don't care what sources you got it from. The fact that you got it from a mainstream source just shows how racist they are. It is an opinion and opinion does not belong on Wikipedia. Plain and simple.

--Original author of "'Crackheads and Thugs' Racism by editor"
 * Okay, then we shouldn't source any mainstream respectable (oh my gosh, an opinion!) sources such as the New York Times who posts these information just blogs or even worse Wikinews on any factual events that you don't agree with. That is pretty much censorship that you're trying to promote. It isn't like I'm only promoting one side of the argument when I wrote the section. --J. Nguyen 02:18, 8 November 2006 (UTC)


 * No, you are promoting the spread of lies and bigotry. What you posted was a racist comment and it should not be there in the first place. --Original author of "'Crackheads and Thugs' Racism by editor"


 * When Kinky refers to the "Katrina evacuees" as "crackheads and thugs" the accusers obviously believe we know who he means, not because all members of a particular race are crackheads and thugs, but because we know what the racial makeup of the displaced is, particularly the poor and displaced. Also modern racists often speak in vague terms but specific phrasing, relying on mutual understanding between like-minded poeple who pick up on the phrasing and recognize one of their own. I'm not positive this was Kinky's intent, and I'm positive he didn't mean for anyone not racist to pick up on it if that was intention. However, note the comment didn't say that he did make racially offensive comments. Only that he was accused of them. Although I know it's irrelevant here, personally I think whether consciously or not his comments were clearly racially motivated. -Gripdamage 16:46, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

I think an equally, or even better case can be made for the comment was something other than racially motivated. New Orleans did have high crime rates and the highest murder rates in the country. There is also a history of awful unemployment and poverty rates. It could be argued that Kinky was being dismissive of the poor or more specifically the urban poor, without regard to race. To accuse someone of subconscious or unconscious racism and sending vague, racially coded messages borders on the paranoid. Cuvtixo 15:02, 6 March 2007 (UTC)


 * The thing is, he has a history of making racist remarks... search on +"kinky friedman" +racist, you'll find any number. Шизомби (talk) 02:03, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Bowling ball
Should we include in the controversy section, the joke about Houston's absence of bowling balls? "Then I come down to Houston, I went to a bowling alley. I couldn't go bowling, there were no bowling balls. The people here throw 'em all in the sea—they thought they were nigger eggs."Xparasite9 17:13, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
 * If you could come up with a reliable source for that that shows that Friedman actually said that joke, then yeah. But I'm very skeptical that you will be able to provide such a source.  That is not the type of joke that I would expect from him in the slightest.  Also, given the play that was given to the things he *did* say, if he had made a joke as inflamitory as that, I suspect it would have come out big time during the campaign. - TexasAndroid 17:41, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, no offense, but if you didn't hear about that on the news, you must have been under in a spider hole, under a rock. It was talked about on the radio talk shows so much, I couldn't find a station that wasn't discussing this. However, I don't know where I could find such proof, but he did say it.Xparasite9 19:07, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I may have heard someone on the radio say that Kinky parted the Galveston Bay so he could get some fresh shrimp, but that don't make it true. --Robertb-dc 16:24, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
 * They actually had a recording of that. They played it once, then they bleeped the "N-word" every time they played the audio clip afterwards. -24.155.172.0 01:22, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Then you should really be able to easily able to find a link to a source that fulfills WP:RS, and establishes that Friedman said this joke. - TexasAndroid 21:26, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Clean-up
As someone mentioned, the political section, particularly a lot of the quotes, was useful and important during the election, but does not really add much on a going-forward basis. So I plan to start trimming out a good bit of that stuff within the next few days. I wanted to toss a notice up here, first, in case anyone wanted to protest this action ahead of time. - TexasAndroid 18:29, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
 * OK. I said I would do it well over a year ago, and I finally got around to it.  IMHO, in the grand scheme of thing, Kinky's failed 2006 run for govenor does not require anywhere near the space it had.  I have left the issues and positions section, as those will still be relevant if he runs again in 2010, but most of the rest was IMHO really not needed. - TexasAndroid (talk) 17:43, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

"Big Dick"
Seem to recall that for awhile in the 70's and/or 80's he was identifed as Kinky "Big Dick" Friedman (and magazines were able to get away with it because his given name is actually Richard = Dick). Anyone got a source for this and can put it in the article. It's why I came to it in the first place, because he was trivia question on Cash Cab. RoyBatty42 07:46, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

When he calls into the Imus in the Morning program, Don Imus introduces him as Richard "Kinky" "Big Dick" Friedman. I also did a quick Google of the full name (Richard Kinky Big Dick Friedman) and found an article that says he uses the second sobriquet on his answering machine. I think it should be added. 74.72.114.52 (talk) 20:23, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Bot report : Found duplicate references !
In the last revision I edited, I found duplicate named references, i.e. references sharing the same name, but not having the same content. Please check them, as I am not able to fix them automatically :) DumZiBoT (talk) 05:45, 2 August 2008 (UTC)
 * "cbsnews" :
 * http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/08/19/sunday/main788935.shtml CBS News, Aug. 21, 2005: Kinky Friedman Turns To Politics
 * Kinky Friedman Turns To Politics, Humorist, Musician, Writer, Is Now Gubernatorial Hopeful In Texas - CBS News

Looking ahead
When the 2010 campaign starts to have actual news, I envision a bit of a restructuring of the politics section. I envision:
 * The line for the Justice of the Peace run
 * A section for "2006 Texas Gubernatorial Campaign", consisting of the rest of the current politics intro section.
 * A section for "2010 Texas Gubernatorial Campaign", consisting at the start with what is now in the "Future plans" section.
 * Finally, the "issues and positions" section, which applies to both, would come last.

Anyone have any issues with this structure? (I'll take silence as a lack of issues. :)) - TexasAndroid (talk) 14:04, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

Perry/Friedman in 2012
I was reading that if Perry gets the Republican nomination one of the challenges will be to find a vice president who does not out do Perry, meaning Perry will need someone who is less intelligent than he is. Some people are speculating a Perry/Friedman ticket, sort of a Dumb and Dumber combination. Should something like this be put in the article, or would that make Rick Perry look bad? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.183.68.48 (talk) 01:05, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Chess relevance
Re: "Friedman had an early interest in both music and chess, and was chosen at age 7 as one of 50 local players to challenge U.S. grandmaster Samuel Reshevsky to simultaneous games in Houston. Reshevsky won all 50 games, but Friedman was, by far, the youngest competitor."

I'm not convinced this information is sufficiently significant to warrant inclusion in the article. If Friedman had faced a grandmaster in real tournament play at any age, that would be an accomplishment, but participating in informal play in which a grandmaster takes on fifty opponents simultaneously and defeats them all is really no distinction--even if you're only seven. The passage seems to be implying that the distinction rests on having been chosen, but the article doesn't even hint at how he was chosen, and if that method did distinguish Friedman then the method should be what is described in the article, not the game with Reshevsky. There's nothing here that I see to indicate that the contestants weren't chosen more or less at random. TheScotch (talk) 06:25, 27 September 2015 (UTC)

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External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070928093038/http://digital50.com/news/items/BW/2001/07/14/20070720005009/concert-to-save-town-lake-dedicated-to-lady-bird-johnson.html to http://digital50.com/news/items/BW/2001/07/14/20070720005009/concert-to-save-town-lake-dedicated-to-lady-bird-johnson.html
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 * Added tag to http://wcco.com/politics/kinky.friedman.jesse.2.361880.html
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"Muttering like a Crack Addict Nigger in His Cell" Quote from Friedman's Book
When Friedman was a candidate there was a significant kerfuffle in the media over a quote in one of his books. The Media tried to paste the label "racist" on Freidman because in one of his books, a fictional character was described (very roughly, remembering as best as I can here) "...muttering to himself like a crack addict nigger in his cell...", or thereabouts. I came here hoping to get the full quote (to use elsewhere), and the entire incident goes unmentioned in this Article. So, 1) Can we get the full & correct quote, and it's source, for future possible use, and 2)  Does anyone else agree with me that the quote and the media blow-up is significant/noteworthy enough to be included in this Article?Tym Whittier (talk) 01:48, 11 April 2019 (UTC)


 * Can you can find any related citations to better support and explain this point about it affecting his political campaign? Jooojay (talk) 18:36, 11 April 2019 (UTC)


 * No, and I looked. I remember it made a media "splash" for a few days during the campaign, but I can't find any references to it.  It was talked about quite a bit on a.m. talk radio.  It never occurred to me that it might not have made it into any kind of TV or print media.Tym Whittier (talk) 01:41, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

A "full-blooded Jew"?
Under the heading "Other work and references in popular culture", it states "Friedman claims to have been the first full-blooded Jew to take the stage at the Grand Ole Opry." The phrase "full-blooded Jew" is nonsensical. The closest thing to a "full-blooded Jew" would be someone whose DNA is 100% Semitic, which Friedman's clearly isn't; as the descendant of Russian Jews, he's Ashkenazim, so most of his genetic background is actually European. It doesn't matter if the editor is saying that Friedman was merely making a claim; that would be no more notable than any other claim he might have made. Like much of the article, which is unsourced and reads like a promotional piece, that claim needs to be removed. Bricology (talk) 18:55, 28 August 2019 (UTC)

Does kinky Friedman still tour with his band? 70.44.235.79 (talk) 02:01, 2 November 2023 (UTC)


 * @70.44.235.79 Hope Kinky can come to Maravilla to talk to our people. Would be great. Can contact me. Ken Rochlen 248 701 9660
 * Thanks
 * Hi to Kinky. Good health 2603:8080:2CF0:77A0:66C6:7D7F:5E9D:4AEC (talk) 15:17, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Death date
Does the problem stem from his having been found dead on the morning of June 27 with no medical or other indication of whether he died before midnight or after midnight? If so perhaps the text could be June 26/27.

It doesn't really help here, but since Jewish days are from sunset to sunset the Jewish date is certain. Mcljlm (talk) 02:26, 1 July 2024 (UTC)