Talk:Kuru (disease)/Archive 1

Michael Alpers
There would be many who give primacy to Michael Alpers in the discovery of Kuru THis piece is worth referencing perhaps Michael Alpers story — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mdjkf (talk • contribs) 00:11, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * This link is not working. Alpers is mentioned in the article with citations to other sources. -- Beland (talk) 00:02, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

Western Medicine
I've removed the term "in Western Medicine" from the discussion of the causes, since it's weasle wording. Medicine is (or should be) based upon consideration of the evidence - whether the medics are "Western" or otherwise is irrelevant. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 163.1.176.253 (talk) 12:35, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

Comments
This is one of the best articles I've read. Nicely done. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.103.41.201 (talk • contribs) 12:31, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Permissions
Original author's permission to adapt.

Hi Rohan- I would be happy to allow the use of my Kuru paper for the encyclopedia. Is there anything further you need me to do? Do I need to copyright the paper, or do you just need my permission? I'm not quite sure how to handle this type of situation. Let me know and I will assist you in anyway possible.

Thanks! Stacy McGrath

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Viz (talk • contribs) 18:43, 2 January 2004 (UTC)
 * The 2004 version was deleted; see next section. -- Beland (talk) 00:29, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

Copyright issues
This article was created (check the history at the link) with content adapted from another author, and used with permission for the encyclopedia as far as the authors statement above references. "Hi Rohan- I would be happy to allow the use of my Kuru paper for the encyclopedia." This means that it's used as fair use under WP:NONFREE and WP:NFCC. Needs to be deleted for the time being, if we can get a free content liscense from the author we can always restore. -70.161.199.196 18:31, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
 * That makes no sense. If the copyright holder granted permission, why delete? Catchpole 20:39, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
 * It wasn't licensed, making it just fair-use. Since we are a free encyclopedia, we are supposed to have free articles and not fair-use articles. --Hemlock Martinis 20:53, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I cannot see what practical difference it makes in this case. Seems like cutting your nose off to spite your face. Catchpole 21:00, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
 * It makes a huge issue, we distribute the encyclopedia to others, and give them rights to change, distribute, and charge for it if they wish. Look at the logo in the upper right, "The Free Encyclopedia" means free content. -70.161.199.196 22:47, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I have tried to find contact information for Ms. McGrath (the original author of the work that the deleted version is a derivative work of) but have come up dry. I have sent an email to the former Professor whose page the work is hosted on requesting contact information. --Jeremyb 00:45, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Translation
The first paragraph gives two translations for kuru. --Savant13 21:20, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
 * This version was deleted. -- Beland (talk) 00:29, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

In-line references
This article would be better it if were clear which reference supports which statements. The is greatly increases verifiablilty. ike9898 16:36, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree about the referencing. But it is an excellent article. I know a lot about prions and have gone a bit mad editing all the prion pages but I haven't touuched kuru because there's nothing to be done -- Purple 02:17, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
 * This version has since been deleted. -- Beland (talk) 00:29, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

Kuru and Cannibalism - the evidence doesn't fit
The connection just isn't there. 1. Kuru has never been successfully transmitted to animals via the alimentary canal, only by direct invasion of the bloodstream. Even Gadjusek, toward the end of his life, stated that there must be some other mode of transmission other than cannibalism. This rather straightforward fact is ignored by those anxious to promote either prion theory or Fore cannibalism. He proposed that handling human brains and then rubbing eyes or picking noses could have caused the spread of the disease. (This is handling corpses, not eating them.) Remember, this is a disease that was causing more than half the deaths in the Fore community, and it seems unlikely that the illness could that widespread given such a haphazard mode of transmission. 2. Neither Gadjusek nor Lindenbaum nor any other researcher ever observed Fore cannibalism. In fact, Gadjusek's journals consistently lament the absence of cannibalism, and when it had occured it "certainly did not involve brains." Even allowing for a prolonged latency period, even Gadjusek admitted that there is no way that the youngest victims had ever eaten human flesh. 3. Kuru is a varient of Creutzfeldt-Jakob's disease, which leads to the question, how is it, and other suspected prion diseases, spread in the West? No one has serious proposed that mad cow disease in England is contracted by cannibalism. 4. Remember, prions are just a theory, and a controversial one. In terms of their relation to theories of universal cannibalism among our ancestors, those theories BEGIN with the potentialy unfounded assumption that the Fore were cannibals, they don't prove it.

-As of now prions are the best explanation we have for many diseases like kuru or mad cow. As for mad cow, most theories suggest that it was caused not by cannibalism among humans, but cannibalism among cows. Many sheep and cattle ranchers found it cheaper to provide protein to their livestock by feeding them ground up meat from other livestock, often including the brain and/or spinal cord. It is also inaccurate to suggest that kuru isn't caused by cannibalism, but by handling bodies. Prions can find their way into the bloodstream through any obvious orifice like eyes etc, but also (because prions are misshapen proteins they are tiny pieces of subcellular machinery) through any minute cuts or scratches at any point in the alimentary canal. Due to their misshapen structure it is easily possible that prions are nonresponsive to the changes in temperature and acidity of the stomach, finding their way in through any breaches in the digestive system. Also, cannibalism leads to an inordinate amount of "handling corpses," so cannibalism is still to blame, even by proxy.


 * I do not believe that it is possible to have "spontaneously developed some form of Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease (CJD)". However Kuru certainly is a similar disease. As CJD can be transmitted by eating contaminated meat, so could Kuru.  It is well known that cannibalism was common in PNG.  So-called endocannibalism was common amongst Australian aborigines as well.  So it is logical that any disease like CJD would be spread by humans eating human flesh.  So there is a connection between Kuru and cannibalism.  The suggestion that the youngest victims could not have eaten human flesh is not necessarily correct. Cannibalism is not unknown in PNG even now. The Wikipedia article on Gadjusek expressly refers to his linking kuru with cannibalism amongst the Fore!203.184.41.226 (talk) 06:26, 31 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Let's address these issues in order.
 * First, if a disease is vectored during preparation of a corpse as food (which cutting the brain up into portions during a mortuary feast would be), then, yes, it's ingestion of the tissue, whether through the oropharyngeal tract by wiping the nose while handling infected brain, or eating it. I don't see this as a convincing disproof of the cannibalism vector for kuru.  The fact is, when the cannibalism stopped among the Fore, the number of kuru cases dropped precipitously.  Also, Prusiner, McCaughey and other researchers of transmissible encephalopathies have recorded passage of these diseases by ingestion.  It's slow, but it happens, and it's happened very fast in the case of mink encephalopathy, which appears to be linked to mink ranchers feeding their mink meat from "downer" cattle which fall over and die for unexplored reasons.
 * Second, the practice of mortuary feasts (cannibalism of those who have died for other reasons than murder with the object of cannibalism as a motive) is well-established by the work of Shirley Lindenbaum, in her 1979 work Kuru Sorcery: Disease and Danger in the New Guinea Highlands. Dr. Lindenbaum lived among the  Fore People at the same time that Zigas and Gajdusek studied kuru among the Fore, and actually was the person who'd first alerted Gajdusek to the possibility that kuru was being passaged through the Fore mortuary feasts.
 * Third, it's true that the prion hypothesis is controversial. The standard textbook on virology, by Fields, once listed in side-by-side columns articles by Prusiner and Gajdusek on causation of the transmissible encephalopathies, to reflect the rift in the community researching these diseases on their assessment of the evidence pointing to a specific cause for the illness.
 * However, even though Stanley Prusiner approached his research in such a way as to raise questions about his objectivity (confirmation bias being the least troublesome thing of which he's been accused, and rubbishing competitors' papers as a reviewer for scientific journals one of the worst), the prion hypothesis has survived because other people besides Prusiner and his team have done work which affirms the hypothesis.
 * Fourth, "sporadic Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease" is called that specifically because it DOES appear sporadically, with little or no family history or history of exposure to what are now recognized as the etiologic agents of transmissible Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease such as human growth hormone made from cadaver human pituitaries or transplants of nerve tissue from cadavers of patients who expired from CJD or other brain disorders which might have been misdiagnosed as not being CJD. So yes, people do spontaneously (as far as consideration of those patients' medical history permits) fall ill with Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease.
 * Fifth, actually, theories about prehistoric human cannibalism precede the Fore, and are affirmed by anthropologists' discovery of human bones at early human settlements showing tool marks indicating they'd been cut for meat.
 * For anyone reading this discussion who'd like to learn more, a good broad-audience cultural and scientific history of kuru and other transmissible encephalopathies is Richard Rhodes' Deadly Feasts. Rhodes describes in great detail the evidence linking kuru to the practice of mortuary feasts.  Rhodes also lists the evidence pro and con for the prion hypothesis, including possible sources of bias in Prusiner's work (mostly, probable confirmation bias), and overlooked alternative hypotheses for the transmissible encephalopathies. loupgarous (talk)

Additional Info
I remember that the PBS Nova documentary on prions mentioned something about why the women and children were afflicted more often by Kuru than males were. It had something to do with the "good" parts of the corpse and the "bad" parts of the corpse. The males got the "good" parts, which usually consisted of the muscles and fatty organs. The females and children got the "bad" parts, which included the brain and the other less desirable parts. Thus, the women and children directly ingested the prion, which would explain the disproportional distribution of Kuru occurrence between the males and females. I'm adding this info into the article. I also found the source at the PBS site, so I'm fairly confident in the info.  Jumping cheese  Contact 03:39, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
 * This is now mentioned in the article. -- Beland (talk) 00:29, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

Reasons for GA Delisting
This article's GA status has been revoked because it fails criterion 2. b. of 'What is a Good Article?', which states;


 * (b) the citation of its sources using inline citations is required (this criterion is disputed by editors on Physics and Mathematics pages who have proposed a subject-specific guideline on citation, as well as some other editors &mdash; see talk page).

LuciferMorgan 22:58, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

So what does it mean?
The opening paragraph translates kuru as both "shaking death" and "trembling with cold and fever" - which is it? --NEMT 04:57, 29 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Probably both. Words often have multiple translations as they have multiple meaning, just look at a dictionary. 131.91.92.184 (talk) 14:28, 28 January 2008 (UTC)


 * You're replying to a year-old comment. The only sourced translation is "trembling with fear." Xihr (talk) 23:54, 28 January 2008 (UTC)


 * «The term kuru derives from the Fore word kuria or guria ("to shake")» Guria is a Tok Pisin word, and according to Wiktionary, it comes from Tolai, an Austronesian language, not from Fore, a Kainantu-Goroka language. phma (talk) 12:25, 8 October 2020 (UTC)

incubation period
"All of the victims were born before 1950 indicating that the disease has a long incubation period. The minimum incubation period for many of the victims was between 34 and 41 years.(Collinge, et al., 2006)"

"In humans, kuru had an incubation period with a minimum of two years and maximum of twenty-three (Gajdusek et al., 1966)."

Which is it?

Or should the first quote above be changed to read:

"All of the victims were born before 1950 indicating that the disease has a long incubation period. The incubation period for many of the victims was between 34 and 41 years.(Collinge, et al., 2006)"

SLATE 03:59, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

"This possibility was eventually ruled out because kuru was too common and too fatal (Lindenbaum, 1979) — such a lethal genetic disorder would drastically reduce the fitness of a population and soon die out of the gene pool."

I'm not sure a disease with such a long dormancy period can provide a large enough selection on indiviudals within a population to eliminate such individuals, especially within the timeframe considered here. In other words, the argument Lindenbaum makes (I have not read the original work), that kuru cannot be a genetic disease because it would be eliminated if it were so, is weak at best. Diseases that occur after an individual reaches reproductive age are often very long lived in a population; if not indefinite, they can last many generations.

Zamftb 21:05, 27 February 2007 (UTC)


 * The question is: did cannibalism end with the 1950s ban? The PRNP and other prion-relatied articles suggest it didn't. Which would fit with the 2006 paper's findings. Dysmorodrepanis (talk) 23:54, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Cannibalism phased out with the 1950's ban (and with improved transport into the area, and with other social changes). There was small resurgance later. There was also a strong inclination to believe that (a) cannibalism had stopped, (b) it had never existed anyway, and (c) it certainly didn't have anything to do with kuru. I wouldn't take any of the incubation period estimates as prescriptive.218.214.18.240 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 10:53, 2 November 2010 (UTC).


 * This version of the article has been deleted. -- Beland (talk) 00:29, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

The Laughing Sickness in Mayan civilisations
Just saw Apocalypto and there was a scene with a man they described as having "the laughing sickness". He was emaciated and laughing manically. Just curious to know if there is any evidence that kuru was in Mayan cultures, and was this a reference to kuru or is this just Mel Gibson making things up again. Nomadtales 08:58, 19 February 2007 (UTC)


 * It's a movie. Get over it.Viz 03:57, 9 March 2007 (UTC)


 * It's a question. Answer it. Nomadtales 09:03, 9 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Mel Gibson making things up again. Dysmorodrepanis (talk) 23:50, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

Origin of the term "laughing disease"
I first became aware of kuru in the mid-70s as a result of an article in a (now defunct) local magazine that – though aimed at the popular market - was respected for its well-researched reporting on medical issues.

Although it mentioned the inappropriate laughter exhibited by some sufferers, it attributed the term “laughing disease” mainly to a characteristic that I have not seen mentioned in any recent papers: According to the article, end-stage sufferers experienced facial contortion that bared the teeth in a permanent grimace. The accompanying photographs showed both humans and experimentally infected chimpanzees affected in this way.

Niki 19 August 2008 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chirpybird (talk • contribs) 05:25, 19 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I have since come across a site where the phenomenon is described in an interview with pioneer researcher DJ Gajdusek:

http://www.astralgia.com/webportfolio/omnimoment/archives/interviews/gajdusek.html

The gist of it is that, while this grimace did give rise to the name, it is not a constant feature of the disease, nor is it fixed - rather, the muscles are slow to relax after contracting. Chirpybird (talk) 10:14, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

Kuru in syria ? Hoax or not
The year of release of this paper from michigan univercity  http://anthropology.msu.edu/anp204-us14/2014/08/08/kuru-in-syria/ is 2014. until now, no confirmation ? no peer review information ? Is it an hoax ? Best regards Michel1961 (talk) 17:21, 20 September 2016 (UTC)
 * I can't find a "paper" there; just a class post from a student which uses examiner.com as a "source" (it's not even a reliable source for wikipedia, much less a scientific work). The other reference is to a paper that does not refer to Syria in any way. A quick search shows this claim is popular tabloid fodder and not worth your time. Kuru   (talk)  22:04, 20 September 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks ! today i receive hoaxBusters's answer :

Thank you for contacting Hoax Busters. It is interesting that you came across that particular Michigan State University (MSU) article. It is kind of obscure, unless you're specifically searching for kuru-related items. Be that as it may, your assessment is correct. Although, kuru is a real thing, that MSU story is a hoax in that it talks about kuru in Syria. Shirley Lindenbaum, whom the author mentions as a reference, has written extensively about kuru. Yet, there is no mention of Syria in any of her books or papers. The other reference, Examiner.com, was not a real news source (it is no longer operating). They did not employ actual reporters. Rather, they used "independent contributors." In other words, people would submit articles based on their own opinions, much like writing a "letter to the editor" of your local newspaper. They often posted made up stories, or material copied from some of the fringe sites. It functioned much like a clickbait site (see "Clickbait" on the BIG LIST for more information). They used to publish less-than-honest stories just to get folks to click on their links. The author of that MSU article is clearly Islamophobic, trying to tie kuru with the Muslim population in Syria. There was a video going around in 2013 that supposedly showed a Syrian rebel cutting out a soldier's heart and eating it. Real news agencies like CNN and Reuters could not verify that the video was legitimate, however. Regardless, whether true or not, that was a one-time thing. There was no evidence that anyone else participated in a similar act. The author of the MSU article falsely claimed that cannibalism was rampant amongst the rebels by writing that "Kuru resurfaced in the Muslim community recently among Syrian rebels who were rumored to be eating the hearts of victims." Also, his use of the word "resurfaced" implied that the disease had been observed in the Muslim community at an earlier time. His mention of Shirley Lindenbaum was made completely out of context. Although it is true that she did "clarify the history, origin and medical relevance of the disease kuru," as mentioned, she never wrote about Syria.

Michel1961 (talk) 06:10, 26 September 2016 (UTC)

Sourcing
This article is not sufficiently researched. There is considerably more information on kuru and CJD that should be at least mentioned, and Shirley Lindenbaum's work among the Fore women should be given the attention it merits. There is an attempt by certain anthropologists and political groups to cover up unpleasant information about primitive peoples. oldcitycat (talk) 00:45, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
 * This seems to have since been fixed. -- Beland (talk) 00:29, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

First noted contradiction
In the 'history' section, both the first and second paragraphs give a 'kuru was first noted...' statement but give different years and different occupations of the people noting it. Am I misreading? Syrthiss (talk) 17:59, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
 * This seems to have since been fixed. -- Beland (talk) 00:29, 11 March 2023 (UTC)

Kuru History
I've recited and reorganized the section about the scientific researchers Kuru (Gajdusek, Alpers, Berndt, Pfarr, and Gibbs). Added these researchers in a more chronological timeline flow of when the scientific discoveries happened.

Some the citations are broken or no longer exists so deleted the E.J Fields and Alpers section.

Section about Berndt is completely plagiarized so rephrased and reworded into the first section Isabelptejada (talk) 04:54, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

BACKGROUND: Kuru is a transmissible spongiform encephalopathy that was identified in Papua New Guinea in the late 1950s. Several thousand cases of the disease occurred during a period of several decades. Epidemiologic investigations implicated ritual endocannibalistic funeral feasts as the likely route through which the infectious agent was spread US Anonymous community (talk) 05:43, 26 October 2019 (UTC)

BACKGROUND: Kuru is a transmissible spongiform encephalopathy that was identified in Papua New Guinea in the late 1950s. Several thousand cases of the disease occurred during a period of several decades. Epidemiologic investigations implicated ritual endocannibalistic funeral feasts as the likely route through which the infectious agent was spread US Anonymous community (talk) 05:43, 26 October 2019 (UTC)

Cannibalism is a secret
This means, some people will be convinced they are eating Human meat when they are not, and vice versa. Hence, facts do not match and hypothesis are failed systematically. This body assumed prions are a contagion, it does not examine the hypothesis that prions are a consequence of autotrophic digestion. So consuming Human brain will create those prions (mis-folded proteins), that reach the brain and cause the disease. It should not be called a disease, but a health condition. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.30.56.204 (talk) 14:20, 29 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Wow! Get a medical degree, specialize in prions and the Fore people, write an article, get it published in a reputable journal, and then cite it! Grandpallama (talk) 20:39, 31 August 2017 (UTC)

Exactly Wütender Thunderbolt (talk) 05:25, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Not on disambiguation page
This page does not show up on the disambiguation page when searching “kuru” in Wikipedia. I’m not sure how to edit disambiguation pages, so it still needs to be done. UsersLikeYou (talk) 16:46, 21 December 2021 (UTC)
 * This has since been fixed. -- Beland (talk) 00:29, 11 March 2023 (UTC)