Talk:LGBT themes in American mainstream comics

Creation
This page was created due to undue weight concerns at LGBT themes in comics, as the Maistream American section there was by far the largest and still growing. Yob  Mod  18:54, 1 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Fair enough but the section over there is almost identical to this article, so that needs trimming right back to a summary as it looks strange at the moment to click from that to this and get the same content. (Emperor (talk) 20:31, 7 October 2009 (UTC))
 * Jepp- I'm waiting on the GAN, and once this article is reviewed and stable, then i'll rewrte the section in the parent article to be a summary of this. In the mean time, i started trimming out detail from the parent article. Yob  Mod  06:42, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Further expansion
Characters (here's a useful list: http://www.pinkkryptonite.com/2009/06/pkpride_09_the_state_of_gays_i_1.html State of gay in mainstream comics):
 * Valiant Harbinger rumours?
 * Freedom Ring and death
 * Watchmen minor characters
 * Sandman details.
 * That Trans street?

Other: Boy own adventure comics subtext? Jimmy Olson corssdressing and rumours? Try to find some Comicon panel titles? Have another go at finding secondary sources for trans characters  Yob  Mod  18:54, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Additions
Have you looked at Shade, The Changing Man, Enigma and Doom Patrol (especially Danny the Street, whose name is a literal translation of Danny La Rue)? I think Alan Moore's run on Swamp Thing had something too, didn't the woman Chester was interested in start seeing a woman? Oh, and see Promethea, too. Also, I think for interests of balance it needs to be mentioned that Wertham's Seduction of the Innocent is widely criticised for the naivety of his scientific method. Also, this link may be of use: Homosexuality in Comics. It's more about creators, but there might be some things in there you can use. I can't think of much else right now. I'm sure there was a lot of LGBT themes in the books Vertigo launched with though. Rachel Pollack was taken on to do Doom Patrol. Hope that helps. Hiding T 10:51, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the tips. I limited the examples to those that had reliable sources, (avoiding sources that tried to list every known example), and think that is enough for GA. But i agree, to go further than that would mean searching for sources about individual titles and characters. As there are a number of sites that do try to list every LGBT character in mainstream comics, I had to put the limit somewhere, so i've only included major characters or those with mainstream news or acedemic sources. I re-read the cbr article, to see if there are important examples missed (it's already used in the article, but more can be extracted). Yob  Mod  10:58, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Pete Milligan's Enigma is mentioned in Alternative comics: an emerging literature, which makes the point that the work dismantles the superhero genre using sexuality. Um... "The series' crowning moment occurs when Michael consummates his relationship with the Enigma in a sexual sense". p.157 The book is about Michael coming to terms with his homosexuality, and the Enigma is a superhero from the comic books of his youth. Shade is discussed in Heroes of Film, Comics and American Culture. Danny the Street is discussed in Grant Morrison: The Early Years. It's a sentient transvestite street which "talks", see Danny the Street, most of that is verifiable to Grant Morrison: The Early Years. Have you any thoughts about addressing the Wertham quote to note that Wertham's widely criticised for the naivety of his scientific method? I can add this with cite if that's okay. Hiding T 13:56, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I checked the Seduction of the Innocent page, but didn't see anything there, and havn't had time for further research. If you already have the source, feel free to exapand it with balancing viewpoints! I'll check out those sources - thanks again! (Added Doom Patrol paragraph, will write something about Vertigo imprint, covering Shade, Enigma, Sandman, etc) Yob  Mod  15:05, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I'll add it to the Seduction of the Innocent page first and then you can see what I mean and if it is appropriate here. Hiding T 14:04, 16 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Just a quick note that there have been a few problems over Rachel Pollack and her gender, see Talk:Rachel Pollack. The consensus was that it was OK to mention in context and when sourced but someone seemed intent on jamming it in all over the article. The discussion here seems fine but it is worth keeping an eye it. There may also be sources on the Rachel Pollack article which could be useful here.
 * While on Vertigo then The Invisibles probably warrant a mention, especially Lord Fanny. You can search Anarchy for the Masses on Google Books. (Emperor (talk) 13:41, 9 October 2009 (UTC))
 * I'm fine with mentioning Pollack's situation or not. I put it is, as the character is transexual and her (Coagula's) article mentions Pollack's identification too, so it seemed of some interest. But then i didn't write anything about Judd Winnick's sexuality, even though he does a great job of covering gay issues, so i'm not fussed. I always think Pollack's situations is strange (assuming the editors at her page were correct about her preference per privacy). I've read two of her novels and one of her non-fiction books, and various of her comics, and it's difficult to imagine she wouldn't be proud or her life story, as all these works are very inclusive. AFAIK, LGBT project policy is that it only needs mentioning outside of the biography if relevant to the article: So do people think it is relevant here? Yob  Mod  17:59, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I think it is fine here as it is in context, relevant and can be sourced. There was a lot of sock puppet activity trying to jam unsourced mentions of her gender into other parts of the article (as part of a much larger pattern). If I've understood correctly it is all about emphasis - so she isn't a transgender writer, but a writer for whom being transgender has been part of the inspiration for certain works. (Emperor (talk) 14:10, 10 October 2009 (UTC))

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Not sure if it's much use...
...but Amazing Heroes ran a two-issue feature on LGBT characters in comics in #143-144. Being written in 1988 it's a bit of a time capsule, but the issues are available at the Internet Archive and make for some interesting historical writing on the subject. BoomboxTestarossa (talk) 11:32, 6 April 2023 (UTC)


 * Sure, I'll take a look into it. Historyday01 (talk) 13:20, 6 April 2023 (UTC)