Talk:Lady Zhen

Took out a dumb word
Took out the word "nylon" in "However, she is also depicted as arrogant and snobbish, with each successive title exaggerating these characteristics further. Physically, she is a beautiful woman who is tall, slender, and wears revealing dresses accented by fur or nylon. " and replaced it with silk. They obviously didn't have nylon 2000 years ago.

-intranetusa


 * You can explain that in the small section below the editing box if you wish. You don't have to explain minor edits in such detail unless you wish to do so.  Also, when signing your name, use four "tildes" (that's the key next to the "1" key and directly below the "Esc" key.  That will be quicker for you and easier for somebody else to access your talk page should they wish to discuss edits with you.  Cheers. Gamer Junkie 13:26, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

The year of born can be found in SanGuoZhi, "漢光和?年?月?日", After converting to AD, it should be the year in a previous version.

(Or the editor of this version think that it may not the true date od birth?)

Also, for the literal meaning of wen zhao, according to 逸周书 卷六 谥法解第五十四主,

经纬天地曰文，道德博闻曰文，学勤好问曰文，慈惠爱民曰文，愍民惠礼曰文. 锡民爵位曰文. 昭德有劳曰昭，容仪恭美听昭，圣闻周达曰昭.

I think it is quite posible that the 昭 means 容仪恭美 in this case.

For the Year of born, in 三 國 志 卷 五 　 魏 書 五 　 后 妃 傳 第 五

〔 一 〕 　 魏 書 曰 ： 逸 娶 常 山 張 氏 ， 生三 男 五 女 ： 長 男 豫 ， 早 終 ； 次 儼 ， 舉 孝 廉 ， 大 將 軍 掾 、曲 梁 長 ； 次 堯 ， 舉 孝 廉 ； 長 女 姜 ， 次 脫 ， 次 道 ， 次 榮 ，次 即 后. 后 以 漢 光 和 五 年 十 二 月 丁 酉 生.

If it is reliable, 182 AD

Move
I know this discussion has happened already but I spent most of the day trying to track down the historicity of "Luo" as a forename for Lady Zhen and all I turned up was a legend about a secret romance expressed through allusions Cao Zhi's poem 洛神賦, which seems like pretty weak factual footing to me.

Although Lady Zhen is named "Zhen Luo" or "Zhen Fu" in several non-authoritative sources (including popular modern sources like Hudong), I don't see a historical basis in the name, and as such I cut out most of the references to her as "Zhen Luo" in the article body.

I would like to take things a step further and copy this information into either Lady Zhen or Mistress Zhen and redirect this article and Zhen Ji thither.

I'm particularly interested in hearing from User:Nlu, the first contributor on the article, on this proposition and possibility of a historical, rather than popularly associated, personal name for this woman. Snuge purveyor (talk) 14:36, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
 * After some thought, I agree. "Zhen Luo" was used by Bo Yang, and that was the reason why I initially created it that way, but I think I agree that it is insufficiently attested as the true name.  Of the options that are listed, I suggest "Lady Zhen."  ("Mistress Zhen" has the wrong connotation.)  --Nlu (talk) 15:56, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Since no one has voiced any objections, I've requested the current "Lady Zhen" redirect page be deleted so this page can be moved there. We'll have to fix the double redirect from Mistress Zhen afterwards. No other pages redirect here, "Empress Zhen" being about 慈禧太后. Snuge purveyor (talk) 12:56, 18 March 2011 (UTC)


 * Move to Lady Zhen. To add on, for those who're thinking of moving the page to Zhen Ji (as per the name used in Dynasty Warriors), "Zhen Ji" wouldn't be significantly different from "Lady Zhen", because the Ji (姬) in "Zhen Ji" is not a given name. It means "noble lady" or "imperial concubine". Lonelydarksky (暗無天日)  contact me (聯絡) 13:09, 18 March 2011 (UTC)


 * Moved from Zhen Luo to Lady Zhen as per three people's uncontended agreement. I placed some notes at the end of the first paragraph about different terms used to refer to her, and redirected Mistress Zhen and Zhen Ji to Lady Zhen. Snuge purveyor (talk) 01:45, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

有傾國之色
When I first quoted this from 三國演義, I translated it as "had beauty that could ruin kingdoms". I don't have any English translations of the book with me, and I'd be glad if we had one, but I feel the current "her beauty could overturn a kingdom" is a bit literal. Liu Daren's Chinese-English Dictionary of Idiom-Phrase (成語) has several examples of "傾國" translated as "ruin a state". The basic 成語 of "傾國傾城" goes back to the 漢書, but the near-equivalent phrase "傾城" goes back to the 詩經, no 264, where Legge glosses it as "overthrow".

"有傾國之色" can also be translated as "an unparalleled beauty", but that's much less evocative; we might as well quote the 世說新語, where her beuty is described simply as "非凡": unusual, uncommon.

I prefer the translation "ruin kingdoms" to the more literal "could overturn a kingdom", but if anyone has a translated copy of the book available that would be the most authoritative and preferable. Snuge purveyor (talk) 07:36, 19 March 2011 (UTC)


 * How about "could cause a kingdom's downfall"? Lonelydarksky (暗無天日)  contact me (聯絡) 08:37, 19 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Good question, but the traditional Chinese historians believed that beauties could, in fact, cause a kingdom's downfall, as illogical as that belief was. I think we either stay faithful to the text literally, or we don't use it at all.  "Unparalleled beauty" is actually incorrect as there would be many "paralleled" description of such beauty throughout history.  --Nlu (talk) 15:09, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

Images taken from Gongjin's Campaign Memorials
Hello all,

I've noticed one of your contributors has taken a lot of Zengxian quanty Sanguo yanyi images (a Qing Dynasty Ro3K text) from Gongjin's Campaign Memorials. The scan "marks" and edits afterwards done with Photoshop to remove those marks a bit clearly show that the images here on Wikipedia are the same as on Gongjin's Campaign Memorials, where they were originally uploaded (which took a lot of work). I would greatly appreciate it if in some way the name Gongjin's Campaign Memorials could mentioned somewhere on Wikipedia. I know, GJCM is a Wiki(a) and thus everything can be copied/pasted from there as you please, but, given the amount of time and effort to upload them I think it would be fair to leave a mention somewhere to the original uploader.

regards, a GJCM contributor. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.213.209.197 (talk) 15:37, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

Add a new drama
I want to add the tv series The Legend Of Goddess Luo. I can add synopsis and cast but I need some help in the sound track. Azwa Khan (talk) 17:20, 19 May 2018 (UTC)
 * You can create a separate article for the TV series. LDS  contact me 03:24, 20 May 2018 (UTC)