Talk:Lake Tohopekaliga

Is this protected?
Is the lake a protected area, or inside of one (like a park)? If not, the Infobox lake should probably be used, IMHO. :) --Ebyabe 21:15, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

love  it  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.11.196.246 (talk) 23:43, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Etymology
One or more editors inserted contradictory information about the etymology of "Tohopekaliga" in the body of the article. The first insertion explains the name as follows:


 * Tohopeka [from tohopke /(i)to-hó:pk-i/ fence, fort]


 * Tohopekaliga [from tohopke /(i)to-hó:pk-i/ fence, fort + likv /léyk-a/ site]

This suggests a meaning of "fort site" or "fence site." (Likv is from the Creek/Seminole verb liketv, meaning to sit or to be situated/located.)

The second insertion contradicts the first one, stating that the place name means "We will gather together here." Assuming that the name comes from the Seminole language, this claim is incorrect. The editor supports it with an argument from authority:


 * The Seminole Tribune 2 March 23, 2001 On Misinformation


 * James E. Billie
 * The Partin Ranch borders Lake Tohopeliga (we will gather together here) and gives birth to the great Kissimmee. The name Kissimmee originated between the 1750s and 1850s when soldiers were pursuing Seminoles along the shore of Lake Tohopekaliga and commenced to massacre the Indians when a brave Seminole woman began screaming “Kish-a-me. No kill. Kish-a-me. No kill!” Miraculously, the soldiers did heed to her offer and this lady sacrificed herself to save the remaining Seminoles who escaped to the wild lands along the shores of what is now known as “kish-a-me” or Kissimmee River. This lake is also the origin of the Seminole’s legend of the Kissimmee River. It is about a man who eats a fish found in a hollow log away from the water. Though he is warned never to eat anything out of place, he eats the fish and turns into a huge snake. He crawls down to Okeechobee Lake and then to the Gulf, leaving a winding river in his path. The towns known as Orlando, Hollywood, Apopka, Leesburg, Ocala, Lakeland, Winter Haven, Winter Park, Mount Dora, Avon Park, all the way up to Gainesville are all areas where people known as Seminoles and Miccosukees and Tequestas – and many other groups of indigenous peoples – used to inhabit.


 * — James E. Billie has been publisher of the Seminole Tribune and chairman of the Seminole Tribe of Florida since 1979.


 * http://www.semtribe.com/SeminoleTribune/Archive/2001/Seminole%20Tribune%20~%20March%2023,%202001.pdf

The article by James E. Billie misspells the name of the lake on first reference, and the derivations for both Tohopekaliga and Kissimmee make no sense when compared with a Seminole language dictionary. (The same goes for Sho naa bish, the final words in the linked article, which are interpreted elsewhere in the Seminole Tribune as meaning "thank you." This too contradicts the practice of other Creek and Seminole speakers, who say mvto \ mʊˈdō \ to express gratitude. BTW, the "misinformation" referenced in the title of the cited article is not about this place name; it is about an editorial in the Orlando Sentinel newspaper.)

Yet the Seminole Tribune is the "official newspaper of the Seminole Tribe of Florida," according to both the the newspaper's website and the tribe's. Maybe Billie is using a different Muskogean language, different from the Mvskoke spoken by a majority of Florida Seminoles? Mikasuki, maybe?

I am completely baffled. I cannot see how Billie's word derivations can be correct for the Creek-Seminole (Mvskoke) language. Yet I hesitate to accuse a prominent Florida Seminole official of being an unreliable source re the Seminole language! I'll try to resolve this by looking up info for this place name in Jack Martin & Margaret Mauldin's Creek-Seminole dictionary, which is more authoritative than any individual speaker of Creek or Seminole.

It would be great if we could have input from native speakers of Seminole, esp. from Florida. But the fate of the Mvskoke Wikipedia project, now languishing on a Wikimedia Incubator site, makes me think this is unlikely to happen. Heres cē, y'all! -- ℜ ob C. alias ALAROB 17:24, 3 August 2020 (UTC)