Talk:Laylat al-Qadr/Archive 1

Evidence for Layat Al-Qadr as the 23rd of Ramadhaan
1. The Quran was revealed over 23 Hijri years. That means the Prophethood was 23 years.

2. Surat Al-Qadr is written using ONLY 23 letters of the Arabic alphabet.

3. Surat YaSeen (the heart of the Quran) is spread across parts 22 and 23 to show that we should stay up both nights in case of starting Ramadhaan late (as usual). In 2013, this corresponds to 29/30 July AND 30/31 July.

4. Allah swt swears by the indivisible numbers (Al-Watr) in Quran 89:3 "By the co-dependents and by the indivisibles"

5. Indivisible numbers (prime numbers) are Keys in Public Key Cryptography.

6. Al-Fatiha is built using prime numbers (7 verses, 29 words, 139 letters) All are primes (not odds but indivisible) and their digit sums (7=7, 2+9=11, 1+3+9=13) are also primes. Such prime numbers are called Additive Prime Numbers. Also note that concatenating these Al-Fatiha numbers left-to-right 729139 and right-to-left 139297 also produce additive prime numbers.

7. Allah swt has built the Quran into two parts, Al-Fatiha, and the Great Quran in Quran 15:87 "We have given you seven of the oft-repeated verses and the Great Quran" The Book    = Al-Fatiha (Key)  + The Great Quran (Message) 114 chapters =         1       +         113 6236 verses =          7       +        6229 where 113 is prime, 1+1+3=5   prime too so  113 is additive prime number. 6229 is prime, 6+2+2+9=19 prime too so 6229 is additive prime number.

8. 23 is a prime number with a prime digit sum (2+3=5) and even the digits themselves (2 and 3) are primes too.

9. The number of human chromosome pairs is 23

10. 23 ones (11111111111111111111111) is additive prime number.

11. The sum of the indivisible numbers from 1 to 23 (1+2+3+5+7+11+13+17+19+23 = 101) is additive prime number.

12. Left-to-right 123571113171923 is additive prime number.

13. Right-to-left 231917131175321 is additive prime number.

These last two statements (12 and 13) are unique to 23 only (and if any similar case exist then it is for a larger prime than 30 which is the max days in a lunar month). It is incredible to have these two huge values (123571113171923 and 231917131175321) as primes let alone additive prime numbers.

Subhaan Allah wa al-hamdu liAllahi Rabbi al-3alemeen.

Ali Adams

God > infinity

www.heliwave.com

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.125.58.225 (talk) 21:17, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Translation
The translation of Laylatul Qadr into "the night of power" is very wrong. Qadr has nothing to do with power. Qadr could mean "destiny" or "status" or "honor" or "size" but not power.


 * A significant amount of people refer to the Event as the Night of power, as such a mention in this regard should stay., , , , . --Irishpunktom\talk 15:02, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

The authors of those artlces are mostly unknown. 5 pages do not constitute "significat" amount of people. Night of power is the wrong translation of laylatul qadr. All of those who refered to laylatul qadr as "the night of power" relied on Yusuf Ali's translation. Yusuf Ali literal translation has done a lot of damamge to Islam. Add to it that even if you you want to literally translate laylatul qadr it can not have the meaning of Night of power. Shafi3i 01:16, 22 September 2005 (UTC).


 * Islam online, and the MSA at USC are far from unknown. The fact is, this name is applied to this night by a significant amount of people, whether you like it or not, and as such, warrants at the least a mention. --Irishpunktom\talk 11:38, 22 September 2005 (UTC)
 * indead, "Night of power" gets significantly more Google returns that "Laylat al-Qadr". Likewise on Yahoo!  --Irishpunktom\talk 11:43, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

Google decides what Muslims call that night so if somehow one day google get mistaken and somebody tampered with its results then all muslims get mistaken? Muslim do not take their religion of google. I can spam google with 200 articles then will you be convinced that the majority do not call it night of power? If somebody understands arabic he will know that Qadr has nothing to do with power. Open any arabic dictinary and you can check that what i am saying is correct. We can say that "some translated it to Night of power" but to just say "night of power" is unjust to the readers especially those who do not understand arabic.

MSA at USc is unknown. They are not a scholarly reference nor has Islam online - the wahhabi mouth piece - ever been a scholarly reference. The reference should be Arab languistics and not MSA. Nothing supports what Yusuff Ali translated it to. They all called it Night of power relying on Yusuf Ali. Yusuf Ali did a lot of damage by translating the Quran literally still Qadr does not give the meaning of power even if literally translated. Shafi3i 19:47, 22 September 2005 (UTC).


 * Right, So you at least admit that the Wahabbis refer to it as such? The MSA at USC has the single most referenced internet resource out there.  The fact is this night is known as the night of power to a great many Muslims, wheter this is the literal translation or not. --Irishpunktom\talk 20:16, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

Even if it literally translated it wont give the meaning of "Power". Still I propose to say that some translates it to "Night of Power" and not to give one translation. As to the MSA having the most referenced resources it still holds no meaning other than they have the resources and time and money and means to do it. I have over 6 thousands Arabic and English book for real scholars saved on my commputer and do not have the time nor the means to post them. If i do it would i be quoted as a reference? Come on man. Shafi3i 21:13, 22 September 2005 (UTC).


 * I also thought i was "power" to till my father corrected me, it mean "planing" or something like that... Dont trust wahabies :P --Striver 03:44, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

What is this? Arabic terms are not referred to in dictionaries anymore? "Qadr" rendering into English is very proximate to "quantity"/"amount". It ("Qadr") cannot be destiny, nor power. By extension, it may be rendered as "status" or "honor" (as indicated above by Anon), speaking of a person. That is, not exactly in this context.

Literally, "Qadar" is destiny. It might be etymologically related to "Qadr" in the sense of "alloted portion/quantity. The association stops here, in an archaic dimension.

Literally, "Qodrah" is proximate to power, or ability. It might be etymologically related to "Qadr" by extension to "with a [big] quantity". The association stops here, also in an archaic dimension.

To conclude, we cannot keep the translation "night of power", nor "destiny". Further research into Asb&#257;b al-nuz&#363;l is needed. The editor at Sacred Texts used "Majesty". By extension to "great amount". A similar rendering into English is more acceptable.--Connection 18:19, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

isn't Qadr = fate in english? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.179.82.67 (talk) 14:46, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Some more details
One day prophet Mohammed (PBUH) was narrating stories about Nuh (AS), Musa (AS) and how their ummat lived for hundred of years, during this discussion one of the sahabas questioned then in this case, since they had long lives, they would have done more salaat, prayers and zikr and then will have loft positions in Paradise.

This lead to another question then in this case Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) ummat lives about 65/70 years and will get less time for ibbadat (therefore lesser position in Paradise).

Our Prophet was concerned about this.

Allah then revealed the Surah (Inna anzalna hu fi laylatul-qadr)

What is laylatul-qadr (this night is better then thousands months)

Thousand Months = 1000/12 = 83.33 years

Therefore even if we get 25 such laylatul qadr nights we will have 25 X 83.33 = 2083.25 years of ibbadat.

Our Prophet then came out to tell us when is the date of this night, but there was a fight between 2 people and because of this fight Allah made the Prophet to forget the date.

We now have Hadiths in which the ummat has been advised to seek this night on the 21st, 23rd, 25th, 27th & 29th night of Ramadhan. Some other Hadiths saying to search this night in all the last 10 nights of Ramadhan. But the most followed is to seek this night in the odd number nights i.e. 21st, 23rd, 25th, 27th & 29

Please spend some time even if you cannot spend the full-night.

reading Quran Saying Salaat, nafil salat, salat al hajat, salat-tasbeeh

Dua for yourself, your family, your parents and the ummat

Ask for blessing in your wealth, children, peace at home

Do Zikr etc —Preceding unsigned comment added by Saudiqbal (talk • contribs) 02:20, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Rename
Since this is english wikipedia, can we rename this article to Night of Destiny (holiday), redirect Laylat al-Qadr there, and have a section named "etymology" where we go through the Arabic name and its meanings and translations? --Striver 20:54, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Nopes, Even in English it is more referred to as Laylat al-Qadr --Irishpunktom\talk 20:59, 7 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Nop. As a striving encyclopedia, researchers and students are using it. They need the englicized term.--Connection 17:46, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Compare:


 * Should i proced with the rename?--Striver 19:36, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
 * never mind that. --Striver 16:17, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Get a date
OK, it's pretty obvious what I've seen is wrong, but maybe somebody can clarify. I've seen Laylat al-Qadr dated as 1 Shawal; how so? Another calendar? 03:12, 30 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Probably some sort of mistake. The first of Shawwal is Eid ul-Fitr. Pepsidrinka 03:20, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

What's all this crap about chakras and lotus petals? Removed it b/c it's complete nonsense :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.143.218.147 (talk) 17:04, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

When is it in the year 2009?
When is it in the year 2009? Did I missed it already? --92.74.31.46 (talk) 13:33, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

alternative interpretation according to Christoph Luxenberg
According to Christoph Luxenberg, Sura 97 is misinterpreted by mainstream Islam. In his book The Syro-Aramaic Reading Of The Koran, he traces the Sura to much older Christian liturgical writings and sees the story of the nativity in it. In addition to the fact that the Sura has striking similarities to the traditional Christian legends about the birth of Jesus ("Night", "Angels", "Destiny"), Luxenberg's interpretation also explains why the word "spirit" (or "ghost") is used in the text, though Islam rejects the idea of trinity. According to Luxenberg, the original Koran was not written in Arabic but in Aramaic and many of its words have been misunderstood by later Arab-speaking scholars. That's the reason why Muslim scholars have problems to give the exact meaning of "Qadr". Luxenberg traces the word to Aramaic and translates it as "destiny". "Night Of Destiny", or according to the Thesaurus syriacus "beth yalda", is the oriental name given to the night in which Jesus was born. Luxenberg asserts that this interpretation of the Sura (i.e. it talks about the birth of Jesus and not about the Koran) makes more sense, since the Koran was revealed in a process that took some 20 years (= it was finished ca. 20 years after the first revelation). Someone with more knowledge of the subject should add this to the article.


 * This should absolutely NOT be added. Christoph Luxenberg's work has been almost unanimously rejected by academia globally. While his word games and semantics make fun exercises, they have absolutely no corroboration in historical, archaeological, epigraphical evidence, nor do a single one of his peers support his methodology in restructuring the lexemes of Qur'anic vocabulary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.136.104.21 (talk) 18:29, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

"History" properly changed to "Orientalist View"
It was ridiculous to start the entry with Orientalist critiques and name it "History". I have changed this to "Orientalist View" and placed it at the bottom of the Wiki entry where it belongs.

It is good to entertain all viewpoints, but to pass off criticism of orthodox beliefs in any faith as the actual "history" of a given tenet is duplicitous at best. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.136.104.21 (talk) 18:33, 15 September 2009 (UTC)
 * As the person who added this information, I agree with this move. There are no written records of what Arabs believed before Islam so it is all speculation. Shii (tock) 04:54, 2 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I have left the section at the end, removed an unsourced assertion, and changed the title to "Pre-Islamic origins". I hope the speculative status of it is now clearer. Also, while avoiding original research, making plain the reason why Muslim scholars have no interest, i.e. it simply doesn't come in the period of their interest. Richard Keatinge (talk) 14:34, 31 May 2010 (UTC)