Talk:Line of succession to the former Ottoman throne

Merge from Sultans:Imperial Princesses?
Yes, but how much needs keeping? Johnbod (talk) 00:55, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * That's the same as a deletion, as femals had no place in the succession at all. --85.226.43.165 (talk) 18:10, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

Bayazit I and Şehzade Mustafa
I'd like to add two remarks: Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 14:40, 15 February 2010 (UTC)
 * 1) It is claimed that fratricide had begun by Mehmet II. What about interregnum which was half a century before Mehmet II ? Even before interegnum, Bayazid I killed one of his brothers and caused the execution of his other brother by means of conspiration.
 * 2) Prince Bayazit was not Süleyman's only victim. What about Prince Mustafa ?

Violation of WP:BLP
I am concerned that this article, which has no citations for any of its mentions of living people, violates the policy Biographies of living people. I have started a section about it at Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard. Chick Bowen 21:00, 26 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I have overhauled the article. Hopefully, it's okay now.Anythingyouwant (talk) 03:04, 27 February 2011 (UTC)
 * The article was reverted today to the problematic version without discussion, and I changed it back.Anythingyouwant (talk) 23:28, 10 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Despite the BLP discussion, IPs keep reverting. Please discuss here instead.Anythingyouwant (talk) 04:55, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

Why is the heir apparent to be deleted? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.136.109.73 (talk) 04:59, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Because no reliable source is cited. You would need a footnote describing a reputable newspaper or book, or something like that.  Please see WP:BLP for details.  Thanks.Anythingyouwant (talk) 05:02, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

That really is a joke The heir to the throne are everywhere on the web And even there, the official homepage The other members also exist and it has everything its accuracy. http://www.ottomanfamily.com/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dilek2 (talk • contribs) 05:11, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
 * It's not a joke. It's just the way Wikipedia works.  Wikipedia articles should be based on reliable, published sources. See WP:RS.  That helps not just to ensure that the information is accurate, but also helps to ensure that only the most significant information gets into Wikipedia.  I could start a website that says all kinds of things, but that doesn't mean it should go into Wikipedia, even if it is all true.Anythingyouwant (talk) 05:18, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

Well, does not matter if you delete it These people exist and have home pages and there are better sites than Wikipedia Delete what you want ... but I am not active in it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.136.109.73 (talk) 05:21, 13 March 2011 (UTC)

Line of succession to the Ottoman throne???? All the descendants are deleted????
 * There is no Ottoman throne anymore, so this article is necessarily a historical description of the line of succession, except where other info about the subject is well-sourced and inserted by consensus. There is now yet another discussion at BLPN at WP:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard.Anythingyouwant (talk) 19:40, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Ottoman Prince's


— Preceding unsigned comment added by Dilek2 (talk • contribs) 22:07, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

I know a lot of the Princes...But why deleted it in this Article? Ahmed303 (talk) 00:08, 9 April 2011 (UTC)
 * The list has been removed from the article (and redacted from this talk page) as a violation of WP:BLP policy concerning unsourced names. The issue has been discussed numerous times, including Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard/Archive110, Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard/Archive111, and Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard/Archive113. It can not be re-added without proper reference to reliable sources. — Cactus Writer (talk) 06:14, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

Unfortunately, here is a racist at work

I've posted the official website of the Dyastie, and yet, this interesting article deleted

Dilek2 (talk) 17:58, 9 April 2011 (UTC)So many months it was ok ONE HAS TO KILL THE RAPIST PRETENDER IN THE RIBATEJO BECAUSE HE IS AN UNNATURAL OR MEDICALLY CONCEALED RAPIST AND THINKS SOMEONE CAN EVER LOVE THAT SUBHUMAN EXCREMENT OF A CREATURE — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.166.110.126 (talk) 01:21, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

For all People

http://www.ottomanfamily.com/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCSxG3szB1A&feature=related

In My Talk,there are the List of this Prince's...

Evereyone can show it

Dilek2 (talk) 18:27, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

Are today's Ottoman prince Circumcised?
A legitimate question, are the prince in exile were also circumcised? The members of the Ottoman dynasty are not practicing Muslims today.


 * I think they are Circumcised

Selim78 (talk) 16:16, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

AfD discussion
There has been a closely related article deletion discussion at Articles_for_deletion/Heir_to_the_Ottoman_dynasty.Anythingyouwant (talk) 20:58, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

Who is vandalizing this page?
Recently sections have been added which contain no verifiable sources and are not true. For example, the section on Eligibility is incorrect. Unfortunately I don't have any sources except my own knowledge but as there are no references in this section, does it matter? How do I remove sections containing information that I know to be in error? MissyMaddie (talk) 00:01, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Eligibility A male person born to parents who are not married to each other at the time of birth is not included in the line of succession and passes no rights to their descendants. The subsequent marriage of the parents does not alter this. At the time of accession, the male heir to the throne must be a Muslim. Any Ottoman Prince who has changend Islam is excluded from the line of succession.

Edward321, is the Vandalizer...

Dilek2 (talk) 15:50, 13 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Please refrain from personal attacks, Dilek2. At no time did I add any unsourced material to this article.Edward321 (talk) 23:52, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Oh yes you do it...You are the Vandalizer...

There is no sehzade's of Yussuf who's is illegetime...

This is the official website of the Ottoman dynasty http://www.ottomanfamily.com/

Dilek2 (talk) 01:11, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Ottoman Family and Relative's
No any Offspring of an Ottoman Princess is a Heir of the Ottoman Throne.

There is today 27 Shehzades, and any other Person who are claimed to be an Ottoman Prince is false and a liar.

But there is also Descendants of Cem Sultan today, there are Christian-Catholics for Century's, and no longer Heir's of the former Ottoman Throne.

Also there is the Amuca Kabilese = It mean's Uncle's Clan (Amuca/Amca = means Uncle of the Paternal Branch...So Osman Gazi are the Paternal Uncle of this Clan. The Amucas are the descendants of Osman Gazi's older two Brother's: Gündüz Alp Gazi and Saru Batu Savci Bey. This Clan was settled in Thrace, who is today in three Country's---Bulgaria,Turkey and Greece. Mostly of the Amucas settled today in the Turkish Part of Thracem since the Balkan War's ... My Grandfather was a Amuca. I have my Family Tree, a lot of male relative's made a Y-DNA Test, and show's as J2 This interessting now, because mostly Turks in Turkey are not of Central Asia... J2 are same Haplo as the Brahmanis (Higher Upper Class of India), than migrated to Tadjkistan and what we know today Kirgizstan...

So the Ottoman Sehzades have the same J2 Y-DNA.

Below are Y-DNA haplogroups Cinnioğlu's team found among Anatolian Turks:

E1b1b1 = 10.7% (common in the Mediterranean region)

G = 10.9% (common in the Caucasus, also found in the Middle East)

I = 5.3% (common in Central Europe, the Western Caucasus, and the Balkans)

J1 = 9% (common in Arabia and Daghestan)

J2 = 24% (common in Western Asia and Southeastern Europe and also found in Central and South Asia)

K = 4.5% (common in Asia and the Caucasus)

L = 4.2% (common in India and Khorasan)

N = 3.8% (common in Eastern Europe and North Asia, including Siberia [e.g. Turkic-speaking Yakuts], the Altai Mountains region, and the Ural Mountains region - the article however did not consider N to come to Turkey's Turks from North Asia)

Q = 1.9% (common in North Asia including Northern Altaic peoples)

R1a = 6.9% (common in Central Asia, the Caucasus, Eastern Europe, and among Indo-Aryans)

R1b = 14.7% (common in Western Europe)

T = 2.5% (common in the Mediterranean, South Asia, and Northeastern Africa)

Dilek2 (talk) 15:25, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Dilek2, this is very interesting research regarding the Haplotype of the Anatolian Turks. Was it published in a scientific journal or other source? If so, can you please provide the name and date of publication? Also, can you let me know which of the Shezades contributed to this study as is stated in the entry? I have spoken to some of them and they are not aware of it. Thanks! MissyMaddie (talk) 23:40, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

Dear MissyMaddie

It was Prince Sertan Sultan, a descendant of Sehzade Yussuf Izeddin

Prince?
Is he a' legitime Ottoman Prince

Şehzade Mehmed Selim Orhan Efendi (1943) (II. Abdülhamit)???

Mehmed Selim Orhan is the son of Şehzade Mehmed Orhan Efendi, who was a descendant of II. Abdülhamit, but he is not listed as a Heir...Isn't it?

First marriage: Şehzade Mehmed Orhan married in January 1933, the Egyptian Nafiye Yeghen, the marriage ended in divorce. From this marriage he have a daughter: Fatma Necla Sultan (b. 1933), reconized by the House of Osman.

Second marriage: Şehzade Mehmed Orhan married, in 1943 the French Irma Margaret Fournier, the marriage ended in divorce. From this marriage he got a son: Mehmet Selim Orhan (b. 1943), reconized? What it's happend?

Dilek2 (talk) 21:15, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

Yakub Alemsah
Yakub Alemsah is not sourced as a prince...he isnt a prince... i look this sources there in turkish and they is abosutly not of talking this person

Dilek2 (talk) 15:47, 2 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Yes Yakub Alemşah Osmanoğlu Efendi Hazretleri (b. 1973) is not in any of the sources that are given for him. - dwc lr (talk) 17:28, 4 July 2012 (UTC)

I know, but Edward321 always made it...Why? why he does it?

Strange this Person.

Dilek2 (talk) 00:02, 6 July 2012 (UTC)

Excluded from the Imperial House in 1931
(Shehzade) Mahmud Shevket (1903, Istanbul - 1973, France) was expelled and deprived of the title of Prince and the style of His Highness from the Imperial House of Osman by His Imperial Majesty, the last Caliph Abdülmecid II. in 1931. He d.at in France 1931, having had issue:


 * (a) HIH Princess Hamide Nermin Nezahat Sultana [1923 - 1998] by his first Marriage with a Grandaughter of Abdülhamid II.

Second Marriage, Children and descendant's not recognized by the Imperial House and his Tail Male line not Heir's of the Ottoman Throne:  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.46.126.99 (talk) 23:38, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

Shehzade Mehmed Selim Orhan (1943)
This person Sehzade Mehmed Selim Orhan (1943) is not on the official list of the Ottoman princes. Although his father Shehzade Mehmed Orhan Efendi was married to his mother, the French Lady Irma Marguerite Fournier. They divorced four years later, he had never contact with his son, which he himself said in an interview with the Turkish historian Murat Bardakci in 1992. Why now Selim Mehmed Orhan is no a heir apparent? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.46.116.147 (talk) 01:00, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Support for restoration
The statement that "Ertuğrul Osman said "Democracy works well in Turkey" is not an indication of support or otherwise of a Ottoman restoration. It is contrary to an Ottoman sultan with absolute power, but sultans and democracy can be compatible. After all, the empire did have elections and was broadly democratic, particularly after 1908.Royalcourtier (talk) 20:40, 6 October 2014 (UTC)