Talk:List of Ace Attorney characters/Archive 1

Franziska's Whipping Record
Just so you know, she does whip Miles Edgeworth in Case 3-5 if you press Bikini during a certain portion of her testimony (the bit where she mentions her bath). Edgeworth HAS been whipped in-game, though it's clearly a much rarer occurrence than the rest. Unsigned because I'm too lazy to log in. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.113.220.245 (talk) 15:22, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I take it that I'm not the only person with a vendetta against logging before I post comments, though I don't leave them unsigned... Anyhow, ignoring irrelevant factors in the argument, he also gets a whipping in case five of game three, Bridge to the Turnabout, after the earthquake when Franziska insists upon him stepping outside for a bit of fresh air. I hardly think that he belongs on the list of non-whipped people at the hand of von Karma, though she does seem to prefer whipping Phoenix instead.

- So say Mew Blackberri, who is currently too lazy to log in; 24.96.183.29 (talk) 22:05, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Spoilers?!
Shouldn't there be a warning for spoilers on this page?! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.70.158.78 (talk) 16:23, 29 November 2007 (UTC)
 * There really should be a strong spoiler warning, especially since Godot's real identity is revealed within the article, along with many other spoilers (Phoenix's adoption of Trucy, etc...) Falindrith (talk) 03:46, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Yes! I was just reading through this for more info on Godot and it said it as if it is general information... It should either be taken out or spoiler tagged. --204.248.58.85 (talk) 23:47, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

This article is done very poorly, it should not have any spoilers in it at all. Character descriptions are meant to be read by people that have not played the game yet and therefore have no background information on the game's characters.

I removed the fact that Misty Fey is Elise Deuxnim, and I also removed the info about Godot's past from his character info, only leaving what his actual name is, since that isn't really a spoiler. Dahlia Hawthorne and Iris's descriptions need to be changed to remove any connections to the Feys, since that was a big plot point that wasn't revealed until the last case of the last Phoenix Wright game. User:mvidmaster 24 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually it seems that was written by
 * There doesn't seem to be a user mvidmaster at present.


 * We don't remove facts from Wikipedia, at least not the kind of fact you mention. Articles on Wikipedia, by definition, are intended to provide full coverage of all important facts.  If some fact isn't a spoiler (that is to say, it isn't important) then perhaps it can be removed, but obviously the reverse doesn't apply otherwise we'd have nothing to write about except stuff that only matters a little bit. --Anticipation of a New Lover's Arrival, The 00:07, 15 May 2008 (UTC)

As per previous post there should be no spoiler warnings on this page nor should anything be removed as per WP:SP Getting upset about Spoilers on Wikipedia is like getting mad when you look up world war 2 and it tells you who won.--Drewder (talk) 17:12, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

Character images
I'm not sure if these images are from the game or not, so I'm not sure if they can be used on WP. Can someone clarify?  Bl a  st  15,01,07 1905 (UTC -5)

Yes, those are from the game. The first picture they have, the artwork, that's on the cover of Phoenix Wright: Justice for All. But I remember those from the game. It seems like the only difference is that they're in Japanese. ForestAngel 18:19, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

The Judge won't be returning in GS4, eh?
That wasn't the impression I got from this video. Is there a source that contradicts this claim (ie: corresponds to what the page already says)?

In other news... man, that guy really gets around. --Shadow Hog 03:35, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * He's the judge in the demo, too. But appearing doesn't mean he's the main judge.—ウルタプ 03:38, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, at the very least, I think you would agree that we can ditch that "it's unknown if he'll even show up" quip - it's pretty obvious that he is present.
 * Though I'd still like a source for him not returning. In due time, I'm sure (certainly a little longer than the past two hours, at any rate). --Shadow Hog 04:59, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * The judge is back. He's the judge all the way up to Case 4. However, a jury system is implemented for the final case, and I don't know what happens with him. --Twilight in Zero, not technically a member. 12:52, 14 April 2007
 * One would come to assume, mainly by the fact he's kinda the judge for all the cases in the fourth game, that The Judge is still judge-ing.


 * MewBlackberri (talk) 22:53, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Once again, ridiculously out of date...—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 22:56, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

It's Godot, not Godo.
The meaning in his name has been well established; it is based on Samuel Beckett's "Waiting for Godot." Thus, I'll be changing his name to match that. His name is also listed as Godot on the Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney - Trials and Tribulations page. If anyone objects to this, I apologize in advance. --Twilight in Zero, not technically a member. 12:54, 14 April 2007
 * I don't know whether "Godot" is established for the English version or not, but it's officially spelled "Godo" for Japan even though ゴドー is technically the transliteration for the name "Godot". So, for the time being, I'm reverting. (Just so you know—I know it's "Godo" because of a Japanese postcard. It's on that Court Record site, but it seems to be down at the moment; I'll post it later.)—ウルタプ 05:17, 14 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Never mind, I saw that forum thing. But keep "Godo" anyway.—ウルタプ 05:28, 14 April 2007 (UTC)


 * It's called waiting for Godot. It's spelled with a 'T' but pronounced as Go-doh. There are plenty of names out there with silent letters, so it would be Godot, not Godo.


 * - Mew Blackberri who is too lazy to log in; 24.96.183.29 (talk) 22:10, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Um, this post is over a year old. Obviously out of date.—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 22:26, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Simply clearing a point. =.= Didn't notice the dates... Bah, I'll just have to pay more attention to that sort of stuff. ^^


 * MewBlackberri (talk) 23:15, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Tone and cleanup

 * WP:NOR
 * WP:WAF
 * WP:FICT

First, we cannot interpret anything. That isn't our job. We need to remain cool, objective, and above all, encyclopedic. So terms such as "the cool, hot-looking prosecutor" is not encyclopeidc; "the prosecutor" will do just fine. Don't say stuff like what a certain character's likes and dislikes are. Second, WP:WAF. Don't write a character description like a biography. Mention the games and cases in which they appear. Take Godot for instance. It currently doesn't say what game he first appears in, or what case, or how many cases he appears in. hbdragon88 04:23, 20 September 2007 (UTC)


 * This is article is really bad and I will be cleaning it up myself. First of all, there are way too many spoilers. When you write a character description, write about the character, not the plot. Character descriptions are useless to people that have already played the game and know the plot, so your just ruining the story for people that would use this article. Second, and I'm going to capitalize this because I see too many people doing this, WRITE ABOUT FICTIONAL EVENTS AND CHARACTERS IN PRESENT TENSE. If your going to talk about how Mia Fey was killed in the first game, then write "Mia is killed in the second case of the first Ace Attorney game". You do not write "Mia Fey was murdered by Redd White in the second case". The only time you write somethin in past tense for fiction is if the fiction mentions the even exclusively as being historical. So the event where Phoenix is accused of stealing Edgeworth's money would be discussed past tense, because it is only mentioned in flashbacks. Writing something happened in past tense means it ACTUALLY happened in the real world or it only happened in the game's fictional past. That's why you always see complaints about articles being written In-Universe. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.235.160.192 (talk) 20:34, 24 April 2008 (UTC)


 * If you remove spoilers, don't use the "we don't spoil" excuse; that no longer flies, and someone will revert on the "we don't censor stuff" basis. Second, this will ALWAYS BE IN-UNIVERSE until we can source some creation information.  Always.  No question.  CR has some great information on what the developers originally wanted to do, but we can't use Court-Records as a source because the webmaster is not a reocgnized authority as she doesn't even use her real name (per WP:SELFPUB). hbdragon88 (talk) 23:13, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Is this really an encyclopedia standard article??
"Iris / Ayame (あやめ, Ayame?) Iris is Dahlia's twin. After getting involved with, and then chickening out on, a fake kidnapping/robbery scheme plotted by Dahlia..."

lol.. surely there's a better word than chickening out? 69.144.184.243 18:22, 2 November 2007 (UTC)


 * *sigh* Yeah, I'm aware that the tone of this article is a bit fluffy and unencyclopedic, though with the influx of edits it's really hard to make edits stick. Come pitch in for the good fight. hbdragon88 22:48, 2 November 2007 (UTC)


 * not to mention "except the playa-hatas" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.17.174.184 (talk) 02:06, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Manfred von Karma
Is Manfred von Karma German? He has a typical German name. But is his nationality somewhere mentioned? 91.12.83.99 (talk) 11:24, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I quite think it is mentionned in the first game, but in "Justice for all" Franziska is clearly described as coming from Germany. I guess this has been modified for the german version of the game. I believe we can assume her father is german as well. Kwyxz (talk) 13:54, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
 * But in the Japanese Version of "Justice for all" Franzsika von Karma comes from America. So, you should not overestimate the names. As is known German words (and names) are quite popular in Japan because of their sound. 91.12.122.78 (talk) 15:58, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
 * What a foolishly foolish fool. Her name is not Franziska von Karma in the Japanese version, it's Karuma Mei which isn't German sounding at all. Manfred is Karuma Go in the Japanese version where it is exclusively stated Mei/Franziska studied law and hails from America. In the English version, it is stated just as boldly that she is from Germany. One would assume that her father comes from the same place as her, but I do not recall that being stated as far as my knowledge. Court-Records.net mentioned that Franziska's name was picked to have a German sound like that of her father, so one would assume that the intention was for both of them to be German. >Insert Franziska-style curtsy here<


 * - So says Mew Blackberri who is currently too lazy to log in; 24.96.183.29 (talk) 22:19, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * i think that the best course of action for this would be to say something like "Franziska comes from Germany(America in the Japanese version)" etc etc for all the localizations, like whatever country they come from in the different non-english versions —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.233.244.244 (talk) 03:54, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Comparisons to Rival Schools characters...
Don't you think that's a little too subjective? SuperSonicTH (talk) 16:04, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I would say so. The biggest probelm would be that without reliable sources any comparasion would be original research. If you do have a reliable source making the comparasion I suggest that you add that before adding. --76.69.169.197 (talk) 21:28, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Only reason I haven't done anything about it yet is because I never feel comfortable just deleting something because I don't agree with it. But no one else seems to be doing it... SuperSonicTH (talk) 12:15, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I removed it. It was clearly OR. --76.71.212.216 (talk) 23:51, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Furio Tigre, Not Recurring
I have removed Don Tigre in the Recurring Characters section as he's not a recurring chracter and has no direct relation to any of the main characters in the series. Adrian Andrews would be a much better choice but I'll leave it to other people.

Edgeworth's Father's Name
I have a theory that they named Edgeworth's father "Gregory" as a tribute to Gregory Peck who played defense attorney Atticus Finch in the movie adaption of To Kill a Mockingbird(1962). This might not be the best place to post this but I wasn't sure where else I could try.--Spaced35 (talk) 23:15, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Would this theory be "borrowed" from Court Records, perhaps? Regardless, it's just fan speculation and has no credibility or evidence to back up the claim, to put it in universal terms.


 * - So says Mew Blackberri who is too lazy to log in as of this moment; 24.96.183.29 (talk) 22:23, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * No, I didn't "borrow" this theory from anyone, it's just something I've suspected ever since I played the first game. It just seems so obvious.--Spaced35 (talk) 00:10, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

Non-Recurring Characters
while they arent as important to the overall series as, say, Phoenix or Edgeworth, i think these other characters should also have some sections, like "Characters in Ace Attorney", "Characters in Justice for All", "Characters in Apollo Justice", and so on. like have short sections to describe Redd White, Damon Gant, Will Powers, Yanni Yogi, etc. it would be less comprehensive if they just excluded them —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.233.244.244 (talk) 03:58, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Phoenix' Record
In Phoenix' character profile, it states that he lost twice. I know he lost in the final case of JFA, but can you really consider the Zak Gramarye case in AJ a loss? The game states their was no verdict. In other words, it isn't a loss. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.1.158.218 (talk) 20:10, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

Morgan Fey?
Well to start, it's obvious that her (English-version) name is a reference to Morgan le Fey of Arthurian legend, but would it be worth noting that much of her plot is also seemingly inspired by the mythological Morgan? (Usurping the rightful throne with her own bloodline) —Preceding unsigned comment added by NonaSuomi (talk • contribs) 11:20, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Damon Gant
Without getting into the lack of citations, the amount of original research, and the general low-quality of this article there are major characters missing from it. For example, Damon Gant is not present in the article despite being very notable for being the adversary in Case 5 of Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney and for having strong connections to Ema Skye through her older sister and the events of the case. However, extremely minor characters who don't even have speaking roles such as Gregory Edgeworth are prominently included. Let's get some consistancy and fill in some gaps. 216.185.77.30 (talk) 20:02, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

Winston Payne first rival?
isn't Winston Payne is the first rival in courtroom of Phoenix Wright? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.2.128.170 (talk) 18:00, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

More than one appearance should not mean a character is "recurring".
I edited the list given because I felt that the way it was currently set up, namely with every character to make more than one appearance being considered a "recurring" character, was quite messy and, to be honest, not very accurate. Whilst a character like, say, Marvin Grossburg might appear in the first and third game, he only had a slight supporting role in the first game, and an extremely minor role in the third. He's certainly not a character I would consider "recurring".

The characters I would consider to be "recurring" are those who make multiple important appearances throughout the series. As of Dual Destinies, the only characters I'd consider to fit this role are Phoenix, Mia, Maya, Edgeworth, Gumshoe and the Judge. Maybe Pearl. 85.210.190.11 (talk) 19:58, 18 December 2013 (UTC)
 * I would argue that it's misleading to place Larry only in the AA section because he has important roles in the third game, too. Same with Oldbag. And Lotta Hart. And so on. Even Payne shouldn't be just stuck in the AA section, and while he doesn't really have an important role in JfA and onward, you could say the same for his "role" in AA, too. And then there's the judge, who could be considered relatively unimportant even though he's present in nearly every case. I understand if you want to distinguish between "main characters" and characters who just happen to show up in multiple games, but this is not the way to go.
 * The very definition of a "recurring character" would be "appearing more than once". To argue that characters whose sections you moved don't count as "recurring" seems a little silly to me.  TheStickMan  [✆Talk] 20:58, 18 December 2013 (UTC)


 * OK, fine, so "recurring" means they appear more than once, but lets be honest here, it just makes the article look messy. That's why I changed it to the characters that were GENUINELY recurring...as in, appeared multiple times with important roles. I listed characters like Larry and Oldbag under "Ace Attorney" because that was the game they debuted in, not because they were limited to that game.
 * If you look at the character list from Professor Layton, you'll see it's a lot more organised. There's certainly no wish-wash like what we currently have. I appriciate the attempt at a compromise, but even now it feels messy. 85.210.180.109 (talk) 11:01, 19 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Oh, it was by the game they debuted in? Didn't realize that, oops. I guess you could organize the article as such, but you'd need to specify in the article itself that recurring characters are being grouped by debut. And even then, I still think there are some characters who, despite not being main characters, are notable enough to not just be sorted game-specific sections. I realize that the article as it is right now isn't ideal, but I don't really see how ordering recurring characters by debut is that much better.
 * And what, Larry has never had multiple important roles in the games? I strongly disagree.  TheStickMan  [✆Talk] 15:21, 19 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Then in that case, we simply don't use "recurring characters" because by default it makes the article look awkward and trashy. And besides, what happens when/if another Ace Attorney comes out? What happens when/if other characters make a reappearance? Then there'd be a whole bucketload of characters in the "recurring" part and everything else would be pointless. And to answer your question, no, Larry isn't a "significant" character by that definition. 85.210.180.109 (talk) 16:06, 19 December 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't see where the "awkward and trashy" is coming from, it's simply another section. I'm starting to feel that some character sections should be deleted entirely, though. (I don't think we really need to cover Powers, Grossberg, April May, and so on.)
 * I still disagree about Larry, but that's a conversation for another time.  TheStickMan  [✆Talk] 16:31, 19 December 2013 (UTC)