Talk:List of G8 summit resorts

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 * The following was copied from Categories for discussion/Log/2008 September 25.


 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete, listify if desired. Kbdank71 14:34, 1 October 2008 (UTC)


 * g8 summit resorts


 * Nominator's rationale: Delete, over-categorization by a non-defining detail. --Eliyak T · C 23:41, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete - This doesn't rise to the level of importance that warrants a category. A nav-box template would be better in this case. Cgingold (talk) 01:15, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * See below .... Keep -- As of 2008, there are be 34 plausible entries in this category; but the process of developing this category is understandably slow.  Sufficient merit is demonstrated by the rationale which has motivated a host country in choosing the location -- as is demonstrated by the the Japanese government's decision to site the 34th G8 summit in economically depressed Hokkaido.  A similar story can be seen in the current development of articles about the 35th G8 summit and the 36th G8 summit. --Tenmei (talk) 02:12, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Just to be clear, the number of potential entries in the category isn't the issue here. In fact, that number indirectly bears witness to the fact that hosting the G-8 summits is a transient occurrence, and thus not worthy of a category. Again, this would be better served by a nav-box template. Cgingold (talk) 06:33, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Perhaps I am simply misconstruing concepts and terms?
 * Eliyak considered this category a non-defining detail?
 * Cgingold's points seem conceptually different in several ways: Doesn't rise to level of importance? Nav-box template would be better in this case? Transient occurrence?
 * Could it be that Eliyak and Cgingold are each correct in that each is considering this issue from the disinterested perspective of a wiki-taxonomist -- see, e.g., Zirn, Cäcilia, Vivi Nastase and Michael Strube. "Distinguishing Between Instances and Classes in the Wikipedia Taxonomy" (paper); (video lecture). 5th Annual European Semantic Web Conference (ESWC 2008).
 * At the same time, could it be that Tenmei is not incorrect in identifying this and other wiki-categories as plausibly useful tools? In this case, Category:G8 summit resorts becomes a potentially helpful device for developing the array of articles about G8 summits (which includes the early G6 and G7 summits as well) ...?  The "useful tool" argument arises from different grounds than what I take to be an interesting, but functionally barren taxonomy-focused discussion? The utility of Category:G8 summit resorts is informed by the reasons the different Japanese governments chose 34th G8 summit/Toyako, Hokkaido and 26th G8 summit/Nago, Okinawa for G8 summit meeting sites ... which turns out to be somewhat similar to the rationale expressed by Canadian governments which chose 36th G8 summit/Huntsville, Ontario and 28th G8 summit/Kananaskis, Alberta?  Research reveals that the location decisions of host nations were informed by perceived pre- and post-summit economic benefits.  This common factor might not have been considered by Eliyak.  The serial accounts of these summits have tended to focus on international macro-consequences; but the host-country's decision-making has also seemed to focus on micro-consequences which have been otherwise overshadowed or overlooked. I created this category when the research began to reveal it, but other matters drew me away from the subject.  Perhaps Eliyak and Cgingold are suggesting that I've put the cart before the horse?


 * I'm wondering if Wikipedia's broader goals will be best served by allowing this category to persist, especially in light of those who are likely to be consulting 35th G8 summit/La Maddalena, Italy and 36th G8 summit/Huntsville, Ontario/Deerhurst Resort? Perhaps I'm mistakenly conflating apples and oranges, but I understood the concept of "category" to have a significance beyond mere navagational convenience?--Tenmei (talk) 14:58, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep strong characteristic that usefully groups these locations for one of the most important international meetings. Alansohn (talk) 16:06, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * While it is valuable information for Wikipedia to have, it's not particularly a defining characteristic of the resorts. Probably better compiled as a list than a template — a list can also include contextual information, such as when the resort hosted a G8 summit and where the resort is located, but a category just alphabetizes the resorts' names. Listify. Bearcat (talk) 18:14, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment. I have nothing much against the category, but the arguments given for it I think would be far more applicable as an article on the topic. A list would have the same effect here and such an article with the list could go into the kind of detail that is above that could make an interesting read. The category could accompany that article maybe, but on its own the interesting notes given above a rather meaningless as that isn't conveyed through a simple category.- J.Logan`t : 18:38, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete - This is just another list and this fails not a directory. THis catagory is just another nothin catagory and is not highly notable, in its own right.--Lucy-marie (talk) 23:18, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * It's a category, which is inherently different from a list in that it isn't subjected to WP:NOTDIR as you've used it (it doesn't fall under NOTDIR's scope at all, for that matter). All categories are directories &mdash; therein we could say categories shouldn't exist. Your argument is therefore flawed. --Izno (talk) 05:37, 27 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep or listify &mdash; the reasons put forth by Bearcat are persuasive in my opinion in creating a list of this information, though I think I would much prefer a straight keep. There is something bugging me about this category though... :/ --Izno (talk) 05:37, 27 September 2008 (UTC)


 * See below .... Responding to Bearcat's proposal, I did create a stub List of G8 summit resorts. From the outset, I wondered above about putting the cart before the horse.  In light of Izno's comment, I'm uncertain about what's best ... :/
 * At this point, maybe it makes sense to abandon category in favor of the list? When or if further research clarifies the relevant factors, a category might be re-created in early Summer 2009?
 * Alternately, maybe it's better to leave the category as is until Spring 2009, and then we can re-visit questions like the ones raised here?
 * I'm ready to cooperate with whatever consensus decision is reached.--Tenmei (talk)
 * To clarify, Tenmei, I nominate this category for deletion in line with this guideline: OCAT. If you browse that page, you will see that this is consistent with the general idea that articles should be categorized only by points that describe the essence of the topic at hand. --Eilyak T · C 10:47, 28 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep / Rename &mdash; I believe there were good reasons for creating this category, although perhaps instead of being exclusively focused on resort communities that have hosted G8 Summits, it could be renamed to something like Category:Locations of G8 summits or Category:G8 summit locations which would be more inclusive of resort and non-resort host communities. Any such categories should also be included under the Category:G8 parent category.Plasma east (talk) 16:04, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Listify and delete Non-defining characteristic, venue by event. Otto4711 (talk) 21:32, 28 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete per OCAT as argued by Eilyak. If further development of List of G8 summit resorts seems to support re-creating this category in early 2009, we can revisit the issues.  In the meantime, I'll copy this thread to Talk: List of G8 summit resorts.  Also, I'm persuaded by Plasma east's proposed alternatives -- Category:Locations of G8 summits or Category:G8 summit locations -- which imply a plausibly better framing strategy. --Tenmei (talk) 15:58, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete per the various discussions. If kept rename to Category:G8 summit locations.  Vegaswikian (talk) 05:41, 30 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

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