Talk:List of NHL statistical leaders/Archive 1

Mark Recchi
Recchi's acquisition by the Thrashers should be reflected in the page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.80.233.147 (talk) 00:40, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I disagree because the stats that are listed here are through the 2006-07 season and none of the statistics he has earned are from the Thrashers through that season. At the end of the season, the page will properly be updated reflecting the Thrashers. --Pparazorback (talk) 01:24, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Dave Dempsey?
Under the heading for most playoff goals, someone's put a codebox with the name Dave Dempsey, and 468 goals. Pardon me for my lack of trivia knowledge, but I *am* pretty sure that The Great One still holds the distinction of having the most playoff goals in his career.

Fight!
Shouldn't this page also include 1-season records, averages, & more unusual things, like (say) most fights in 1 season (Paul Lausch {sp?}, 39, 1996-7)...? Trekphiler 00:04, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

agree partially. not sure about records for things like fighting, but season scoring, goaltending records are certainly needed.e.g. most goals, left winger, season: a. ovechkin, wsh, 65. does'nt the league discourage fighting? ;) Toyokuni3 (talk) 15:07, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Errors
Folks, Messier does not hold the record for scoring and he certainly doesn't have over 18,000 points. Someone with more html knowledge (and time) than me needs to go through this list and correct it. Given that such a gross error is present, it may be worth going through all of this data.


 * Those of us who regularly maintain this page been pretty careful about making sure the data is correct, except that it may be slightly off for some active players depending on how many games they've played since they were last updated. Sometimes smartasses who think they're funny like to come in and randomly change numbers around, and that's probably what happened here. If/when you see that, you can just revert it back to the most recent correct version.

up to 2005-06?
Some of these statistics have been updated (into the 2006-07). These numbers should be reversed, to match pre-season (2006-07) numbers, as the section heads says -up to 2005-06--. This article shouldn't be updated until afther the 2006-07 NHL reg.season. GoodDay 00:49, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

I corrected a few, but it's not worth checking over a couple dozen players to remove 10 points from their stats. (In a perfect world, information like this would be updated automatically at the end of every day.) Twas Now 06:30, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Retirees
I have updated Joe Nieuwendyk's stats to include the 2006-2007 season as he has retired and will not be playing any further games this season. The consensus is to only update end-of-season stats, but I believe it should also be acceptable for players who retire and stop playing midseason. (The exception to this would be if they declare their retirement, but decide to play the rest of the season before hanging up their skates.) Twas Now 07:03, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I Believe that Ron Tugnutt has retired and should no longer be considered for active player lists. Cowboyx 15:30, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
 * He's actually a UFA & hasn't made an official annoucement of retirement. Do what you wish. GoodDay 18:51, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Declined protection
I requested this page for semi-protection, since the page is constantly vandalized by IP addresses who update stats daily and make unnecessary changes. However, the protection was declined, the reason being that the administrator questioned why the page should not be updated until the end of the season. Anthony Hit me up... 18:16, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Update - page has now been semi-protected. Anthony Hit me up... 18:33, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Have just read stats for goaltenders. Brodeur's shutouts are not up to date. He now has 84 regular season shutouts. Table should be updated. Hockey rules!141.150.73.200 20:15, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The page will not be updated until the end of the season, so as to prevent statistical inaccuracies during the course of the season and an unnecessary number of edits. Once the season is finished, the page will be updated accordingly. Anthony Hit me up... 21:23, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Brain Alay
Brian Alay doesn't exist! Gordie Howe is number two behind Gretzky. This is ridiculous. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Nsfreeman (talk • contribs) 01:55, 9 February 2007 (UTC).

Major revert to October 4, 2006
I've reverted the article 'way back to' October 4th, 2006. All statistic are now as they were before the 2006-07 NHL season began. Hopefully, this article will be semi-protected from now on. GoodDay 20:43, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Peter Forsberg..?
"Has led the NHL in playoff scoring twice (1999 and 2002) and ranks 17th on the NHL's all-time playoff scoring list with 162 points (61g-101a) in 139 games." - http://www.nhl.com/nhl/app?service=page&page=PlayerDetail&playerId=8458520
 * This players regular season stats, will be updated at the end of the 2006-07 season. The players playoffs stats will be updated, at the end of the 2007 playoffs. Let's wait until then. GoodDay 16:15, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Loi Brannen
It looks like someone substituted him in for Gretzky in a few of the tables, but I don't have time to revert it, so someone else probably should. Omega Graecisso 16:19, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
 * It was (and continues to be) a vandalising anon editor(s). Hopefully the trouble-maker will be blocked soon. GoodDay 21:30, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Regular Season updates
Wow! All season, editors (usually anon) have attempted to update this page. The regular season has ended, where are they now? Just when we need them? GoodDay 18:23, 9 April 2007 (UTC)


 * I am starting to update. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 22:31, 10 April 2007 (UTC)


 * (Though I was not one of those who attempted to keep this updated throughout the season). − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 22:32, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for making the updates. PS- It was the anon-users, who were so anxious during the season. GoodDay 22:36, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Completed the Goaltenders regular season stats. GoodDay 19:25, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

2007 Playoffs stats
We should wait until the 2007 Playoffs are completed, before updating the stats in those sections. At least wait until each round has ended. GoodDay 17:15, 15 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Let's do it this way: once a team is eliminated, we update players from that team (if they are on the list). If a team moves to the next round, then we leave their players. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 19:45, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed. GoodDay 21:03, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

Czechoslovakian players
Since User:Puffy25 has added flag icons for virtually every name on this list, it occurred to me that every player from either the Czech Republic or from Slovakia was actually born in Czechoslovakia—which existed as a single country between 1918 and 1992/3. However, the articles for the players from those countries (e.g. Jagr, Mikita, Stastny, Hasek, etc) show either Czech Rep or Slovakia for the flag. I used this convention to decide to change all instances of the Czechoslovakian flag to either the Czech Rep or Slovakia (and I realize that the flag of Czechoslovakia and the Czech Republic are the same). − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 01:56, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Diacriticals
As this is an NHL related article, would it be better to remove the diacriticals from the names? I'm neither 'for' or 'against' them, as long as they're consistant. GoodDay 21:58, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Does it matter if it is NHL related? I'm not familiar with any decisions made at WikiProject Ice Hockey. I think that an article must be internally consistent, not necessarily consistent with all of Wikipedia (for example, when mentioning the U.S.A., one could use 'U.S.A.', 'USA', 'U.S.', 'US', 'United States', or 'United States of America'). This means that one NHL page could have all correct diacritics, and the next one could have none. I went through this page about a month ago to add all the proper diacritics, so I would like to see them stay. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 15:37, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Selanne was diacritised, while Hasek wasn't etc. I didn't have the keys to add them, so I removed them (for consistancy's sake). If ya wanna add them, be sure to add all of them. GoodDay 17:02, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I've fixed the wiki-links to Jaromir Jagr, since his article is non-diacritical (Note, I've left the dios on the viewers version). GoodDay 17:47, 18 May 2007 (UTC)


 * That was a redundant move, since the one redirects to the other. The diacritic characters should appear below the editing box, in another box under the "Save page / Show preview / Show changes" buttons, or you can copy and paste the letters directly from the article. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 10:54, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Diacritics, are such a sensative issue. Very well, revert my edits. GoodDay 15:34, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Hid diacritics (again). WikiProject Hockey calls for the hiding of diacritics, on all North American hockey related pages. GoodDay 19:02, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Jeremy Roenick
JR has not officially announced his retirement (he's contemplating). Until he decides, he should be listed as 'active'. GoodDay 22:53, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Dominik Hasek's GAA
Dominik Hasek's Goals Against Average is listed as 2.21, however, 2.2052 is a more exact measure. We shouldn't round numbers, it needs to be exact. Besides, why does the rounding have to take place if the number exceeds only by .0002? So I believe the more accurate number should be 2.20, as that the fact is, the first three numbers are more important than the decimals. Does anybody agree? --Hasek is the best 01:03, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
 * However, 2.2052 is closer to 2.21 then 2.20. It's a darn good career average eitherway. GoodDay 19:11, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I believe that despite it's closer, it's the number itself (2.20) that should be selected. The declining reason is like saying the numbers 51-99 don't exist. Again, .0002 is on the edge. --Hasek is the best 21:06, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
 * What the heck, go ahead and add it. Who am I? to stand in the way of the 'Dominator'. GoodDay 21:53, 2 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Ok then...Thanks, it was just for accuracy. And I only think Hasek's GAA is off, well because he's my favourite player, and because of that, I know his stats. 2.2052 GAA...I'm sure other goalies' GAA around here have this situation too, we just didn't do exact calculating to get decimals... --Hasek is the best 22:45, 2 August 2007 (UTC)


 * If you want accuracy then 2.21 is more accurate than 2.20. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 02:24, 28 August 2007 (UTC)


 * And to be technically correct I have reverted the change. It's simply mathematics and the numbers shouldn't be manipulated. Don't worry: in a couple years when Brodeur's average drops, Hasek will move ahead of him. (Unless Hasek sticks around for a few more years, too). − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 02:35, 28 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Lol, I guess. --Hasek is the best 20:47, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Denoting active players
I propose that we simply bolden the names of active players, rather than mark them with an asterisk (*) and rather than highlight the background in yellow. This will Thoughts? − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 02:22, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
 * 1) conform to the same convention as List of NHL players with 1000 points and List of NHL players with 500 goals,
 * 2) be more visible to readers than a small asterisk,
 * 3) make it easier for editors to update table cells than having the change the colour code.


 * In agreement, makes sense. GoodDay 17:21, 28 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Done. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 03:09, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Coaches (active)
These sections concerning the playoffs, need updating (the 2007 playoffs have ended). I'm not the one, to do this. GoodDay 22:25, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

The only coaches (active) affected by the 2007 playoffs that are high up on any list are Ruff, Lemaire, and Hartley. There are some mistakes throughout. I corrected the mistakes I've seen. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.76.157.200 (talk) 22:54, August 29, 2007 (UTC)
 * Changed 'recent playoffs', as 2007 post-season has ended (months ago). GoodDay 23:00, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Length of lists
These lists should be in 'conformity': Top 10, 15, 20 (whichever we choose). I suspect 'player favouritism' in some of these lists (example: a top 15 becoming a top 17). GoodDay 15:51, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

For coaches, I'm updating to top-15 for all-time lists and top-10 for active lists. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.76.157.200 (talk) 21:06, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Ties
When multiple players are tied at a specific number, the next player should not have the next number ranking, i.e. if two players are tied for first, the player with the next-lowest total should be in third. I would go ahead and fix that, but I can't figure out how to easily make it go another number down. This would cut off some players from the bottom of lists, just FYI. bmitchelf•T•F 17:56, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I too am stumped. GoodDay 18:44, 10 October 2007 (UTC)


 * You would have to use HTML to do that, or simply manually type in each number. Instead, it seems the general practice is to put the players on the same line, like so:
 * # 🇨🇦 Luc Robitaille, 🇨🇦 Scott Mellanby, 1,431
 * Which will display the following:


 * 1) 🇨🇦 Luc Robitaille, 🇨🇦 Scott Mellanby, 1,431
 * − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 03:01, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I think the maker of the lists wanted to display the top 10, top 20, top 50 etc of a given category, so renumbering the lists the correct way would just 'bump off' some players from the bottom. Juve2000 (talk) 23:42, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Brodeur's career reg wins, before 2007-08
Isn't Brodeur's totals 495 (pre:2007-08); Remember, we don't update article 'til after 2007-08 season. GoodDay (talk) 23:17, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
 * According to historical edits, it was listed as 494. I edited accordingly and put a note comment next to his win total hopefully to discourage other edits in the near future.  Pparazorback (talk) 23:32, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Is there any reason to why this article isn't locked? --Krm500 (talk) 23:36, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Atleast semi-locked, to block the anons (the anon's know not what they do). GoodDay (talk) 23:38, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Semi-Protection
Who removed the 'semi-protection' of this article? Please put it back. GoodDay 18:40, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Nobody removed it themselves. Please look at the Edit history of the page, you will find the following -  17:43, November 23, 2007 The-G-Unit-Boss (Talk | contribs) m (Protected List of National Hockey League statistical leaders: Ip van [edit=autoconfirmed:move=autoconfirmed] (expires 22:43, November 30, 2007 (UTC))) (undo).  The block was only put in there for 1 week, ending Nov 30 at 22:43.   It took less than 30 minutes for the protection to expire for the anon edits to continue.  As for the note you left on my talk page, I am not an admin so I do not have the ability to add or remove protections.  --Pparazorback 19:57, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Is there a way to get permanent 'semi-protection'? GoodDay 20:04, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
 * It tends to get progressively longer. Just nominate it for protection again. --Djsasso 21:48, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Where does one make that nominaton? GoodDay 22:07, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Requests for page protection. --Djsasso 22:18, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I've just nominated it. GoodDay 22:58, 1 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Protection has been turned down, a template has been offered in its place. GoodDay 00:47, 2 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Ahhh, much better. We've got at least two weeks of peace. GoodDay 01:40, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

There I just got it protected for 4 months, so till the end of the regular season. -Djsasso (talk) 03:59, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Active Goaltenders
Evgeni Nabokov should be on that list of active goaltenders' shutouts with 34 shutouts as of the end of the 2006-2007 season. He should be tied with Kolzig and Lalime.

Seems like there should also be some sort of restriction on listing goalies in the career GAA leaders, for instance requiring at least 100 career games. This in effect would exclude Chris Mason and Ilya Bryzgalov from the 2006-2007 season. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.229.85.160 (talk) 23:47, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't think so (on both suggestions). GoodDay (talk) 00:01, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Regarding Anon's suggestions - 1) Nabokov does indeed have 34 shutouts as of the end of the 2006-07 season. I have added him to the list as he is correct.  If I am wrong, please let me know.  I used hockeydb as my source.  In reference to #2 - I would agree that there should be some sort of qualifying for that listing for GAA, but a consensus would have to be made on number of qualifying games or minutes.  I do think, however, that 100 games would be high only because a goalie who plays one entire season (probably 50-60 games considering backups would play some games) should be eligible for the list.  But that is not for us to decide here, consensus would need to be made.  --Pparazorback (talk) 03:44, 9 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Fifty sounds good. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 07:24, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
 * OK, guess I was too rough on the anon. GoodDay (talk) 16:46, 9 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Ed Belfour isn't active in the NHL (only in Europe). GoodDay (talk) 20:07, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

Curtis Joseph IS active in the NHL. Make him bold. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.121.21.140 (talk) 17:35, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
 * However, this article doesn't get updated until the end of the 2007-08 season. As of the 2006-07 season? Joseph is listed as not active. GoodDay (talk) 17:50, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
 * The numbers don't get updated, but its valid to have him bold. That is actually part of the point of bolding them. -Djsasso (talk) 17:52, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Not to mention he was active at the end of last season, he played for the Coyote's remember? -Djsasso (talk) 17:54, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Err yeah. How the heck did I forget that? GoodDay (talk) 17:56, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

Re: Flag display
Have a look at the flag display at Associated Press Athlete of the Year. That display would work well on this page (and others where we had the same problem), but instead of only showing flags for non-Americans, we would show flags for non-Canadians. The "Athlete of the Year" does this for a different reason than we would, though (its American-biased voting, compared to the saturation of Canadians in the NHL). − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 03:17, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't really think its apropriate as NHL players while heavily Canadian are not just Canadian. -Djsasso (talk) 17:17, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
 * That's why it could work. If they were just Canadian then my suggestion wouldn't even make sense. Take a look at a sample of what this might look like. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 22:28, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I think what I meant is that the NHL isn't only a Canadian based institution. While the Elitserien is only Swedish. So in the case of the SEL it would make sense to only mark foreigners. Whereas with the NHL I think it would be too biased to only show the flags of countries other than Canada. I do agree however, that it does look much better. I am just not sure how apropriate it is. -Djsasso (talk) 22:30, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't see the bias. What do you mean? − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 17:24, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * We are assuming people know those people are Canadian. Not a huge bias or anything. But it is still an assumption. -Djsasso (talk) 17:25, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * We would put a comment at the top, explaining it, similar to the Associated Press Athlete of the Year. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 17:48, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Ok sounds good to me then. -Djsasso (talk) 17:50, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Thoughts on the flag display
Hey, what are your thoughts on the new flag display? I would like to implement the same style at thee pages: − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 11:36, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
 * List of National Hockey League players with 1000 points
 * List of National Hockey League players with 500 goals
 * List of National Hockey League players with 100 point seasons
 * List of NHL players with 50 goal seasons
 * List of National Hockey League players with 1000 games played (where flags for all players all still displayed)
 * List of players with five or more goals in an NHL game (where flags for all players all also still displayed)


 * Silence is consent. I guess. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 21:45, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I think it's highly unnecessary. It also can lead to disputes because you can be guaranteed that people will add American flags to Yzerman and Shanahan, but then someone else will come along and also add Canadian flags to them, then another person will also come forth and add more Canadian flags. The reason the nationalities of others is noted at the AP page is that it is an award given primarily to Americans, and it is worth distinguishing the foreign born winners. Here, however, it is just fluff. -- Scorpion0422 21:49, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
 * We can argue whether a player should be considered American or Canadian, or Slovakian or Canadian, but if we explicitly say it is based on place of birth, then there should be less argument. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 21:55, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I still don't see the point, a players nationality has nothing to do with their stats in the NHL. -- Scorpion0422 21:58, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
 * It is still a helpful guide, as you can see at list of billionaires (2007). While the AP award primarily goes to American, so NHL records are primarily held by Canadians. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 22:04, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Well there already is a standard in all cases of it being the country they most recently represented internationally or their place of birth if they have not played internationally. This standard is used on pretty much all hockey pages in circumstances like this. Personally I don't think they need to be there just cause I see no point to it but if people want them there then I have no problem with it. -Djsasso (talk) 22:00, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

List of All-time Goal Scorers
If two players are tied for 31st, the next guy is NOT 32nd but 33rd. Juve2000 (talk) 23:33, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree with this. The point of these lists is essentially a quick reference to where a player or coach ranks and it's misleading to number them the current way. The number next to the player or coach should be where they rank. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.76.157.200 (talk) 19:11, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Coaching Wins
The Career regular season wins for coaches is missing Crawford and Hitchcock (470). They should be ahead of Sutter.
 * Got it. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 01:23, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Hitchcock is currently listed at 464, but should be tied with Crawford at 470.


 * The stats at Hitchcock's page for the 96-97 season were incorrect; they didn't even add up to 82 games. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 19:13, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

The tradition continues
Yep, the regular season has begun & so have the updating edits (which have to be reverted, again & again & ...). GoodDay (talk) 21:52, 20 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Psst, complaining about it doesn't help. Just business as usual. Drive-bys won't look at the talk page to realize they shouldn't update the page considering they don't look at the big notes on the sections saying don't update them. -Djsasso (talk) 05:22, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

Player Statistics explanations
Hi, Is there a Wikipedia page with an explanation of player statistics? This would help new people to hockey. And a link from this page to my proposed Explanation of NHL Player Statistics page would help. I was trying to review some player statistics and wanted to understand them better. What do these acronyms mean? GP 	G  	A  	P  	+/-  	PIM  	PP  	SH  	GW  	S  	S%

I'm sure I could figure it out eventually, but it seems like a good Wikipedia page. Thanks. -Jtmoon —Preceding undated comment added 02:17, 10 April 2009 (UTC).
 * There are individual pages for each of the statistics. -Djsasso (talk) 03:45, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for replying Djsasso Could you provide links please? After 10 minutes of searching I couldn't find any Wikipedia pages on hockey statistics. The closest I found was Penalty_(ice_hockey) --J T Moon79 (talk) 03:52, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

I found it! Ice_hockey_statistics I'm going to add it to the 'See Also' section. --J T Moon79 (talk) 03:54, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

... on second thought, Ice_hockey_statistics doesn't quite fit well because Ice_hockey_statistics is from category Ice_hockey [Category:Ice hockey] whereas this page pertains to NHL Ice Hockey. Maybe someone who's a regular contributor could add Ice_hockey_statistics to See Also. I recommend it for newbie-hockey fans like me. --J T Moon79 (talk) 04:15, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Split proposal
The discussion is taking place at WT:HOCKEY Alaney2k (talk) 13:48, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Active coach Peter Laviolette
I removed Laviolette as he is no longer coaching, but read everywhere else in the article that changes weren't to be made until the end of the season. Although this section didn't contain this warning, I have re-added him to the list of active coaches with Stanley Cups. I figure someone involved in the ice hockey project will change it if he feels inclined. Sorry for overstepping.Kingdomcarts (talk) 02:04, 11 March 2009 (UTC)


 * The guideline "don't update until season is over" is more for statistics. Things like a player being active or not, or what teams they have played on, can be updated any time. That's not something that will be constantly changing like their statistics. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 20:59, 22 April 2009 (UTC)


 * It is actually for everything on the page so that one thing isn't updated while another thing is not. So yes it does include things like active and inactive coaches. -Djsasso (talk) 12:49, 23 April 2009 (UTC)


 * This was discussed at Talk:List of NHL statistical leaders by country, and the consensus was that these edits are fine. Rules aren't made so we can mindlessly enforce them, they are made because there is a problem. If certain things break the rule but aren't part of the problem the rule was meant to address, there's no need to enforce it. I wouldn't have even noticed Laviolette was inactive if this hadn't been brought up. When I updated everything over a week ago, I left him on the list. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 20:15, 23 April 2009 (UTC)


 * The whole point of the rule was that so that one thing wouldn't be up to date and another would not be, teams are one thing but active and inactive is different the top of the page specifically in viewable text says the page is as of the end of last season (or rather the regular season now that the regular season is done). To have some parts of the information up to date and others not up to date is confusing. -Djsasso (talk) 20:53, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Diacritics
Just a reminder to all, who edit this article. This is a North American based article (NHL), therefore we exclude the diacritics. GoodDay (talk) 14:38, 24 April 2009 (UTC)


 * You're doing an alright job at hunting them down. Gotta keep you busy. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 19:52, 24 April 2009 (UTC)


 * LOL I was biting my tongue not to poke fun at him. ;) hehe -Djsasso (talk) 21:10, 24 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Do you guys have similiar problems on the Non-North American based articles? Are there diacritics being removed, where they shouldn't be? GoodDay (talk) 14:44, 25 April 2009 (UTC)
 * I haven't noticed anything. But I don't watch many non-NA hockey articles. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 18:18, 25 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Like I have said before, I don't obsess about it like you, I tend to leave whatever is there there. -Djsasso (talk) 19:43, 25 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Ohhh no. To the best of my ability, I'm gonna continue to keep up the North American half of the compromise. GoodDay (talk) 17:21, 26 April 2009 (UTC)


 * PS: Djsasso, ya would obsess about it like me, if I were to remove diacritics from thos birthplaces on the NHL team rosters. GoodDay (talk) 17:50, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
 * To be honest, I don't actually pay attention to diacritics one way or the other unless I see someone purposefully going through articles changing them. So yes I would revert you if I noticed you changing a bunch of pages. But a random IP changing one page...probably wouldn't notice. -Djsasso (talk) 18:00, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
 * You're a tough cookie, Djsasso. GoodDay (talk) 18:04, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

The Latest coup attempt, turned back
Hiya folks, it's that time again. To those who (once again) added those foreign objects to this article? PLEASE STOP. This article is North American based, therefore NO DIACRITICS. GoodDay (talk) 14:44, 19 May 2009 (UTC)


 * It's still me. And I still think you're doing fine. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 14:59, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks, Twas Now. I used to pipe-link, but I lost my patients 'bout 2-months ago. Now, I obliterate them. GoodDay (talk) 15:10, 19 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Why are you thanking me? I'm the one who adds them to this article in the first place. I prefer having them displayed. ...It's also fun to see your annoyed responses ~:) — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 15:13, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh, then please don't do it again. Take into account, that I don't remove diacritics from the Non-North American hockey based articles. GoodDay (talk) 15:15, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

Which flags to display
I almost reverted this recent edit to our list of National Hockey League players with 1000 points, which added a Canadian flag beside Mikita, just after the Slovak flag. I hesitated on this revert because I realized there is some internal confusion among the main NHL topics editors about displaying the flag of birth country versus the flag of acquired citizenship. In this article, the list of National Hockey League statistical leaders, we first show the flag of the birth country, then the flag of acquired citizenship. We need to standardize this across the NHL-related lists, which I think will only apply to the list of National Hockey League players with 1000 points and the list of National Hockey League players with 500 goals.

It is just confusing to say "you can only show the birth country flags on these lists" and then say "but you have to show BOTH flags on this list". (The exception to this is the list of National Hockey League statistical leaders by country, which of course should only show the one flag.) − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 03:19, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Alternatively, we could display only the flag of the birth nation. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 03:36, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
 * What's even more confusing, is the Peter Stastny case. He's gone from Czechoslovak-to-Canadian-to-Slovakian. I've often preferred the flag usage at the NHL team articles current rosters. GoodDay 16:26, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Pretty much all NHL players from Slovakia or the Czech Republic are going to add to that confusion (Mikita, Jagr, Bondra) since Czechoslovakia didn't split until 1992. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 03:14, 15 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I made the changes. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 03:22, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

This page looks ridiculous. All of the red is so distracting and unnecessary... It really ought to be removed. -- Scorpion0422 03:35, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * If the American flag is removed from Steve Yzerman, then the Canadian flag should be removed from Brett Hull. GoodDay 15:52, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Remove all flag? I was just gonna bring that suggstion to WikiProject Ice Hockey, -if in doubt, throw'em out. GoodDay 16:06, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Well I would just remove all the flags, however, our standards are pretty consistant. You use the flag of the country they played for internationally otherwise you use their birth flag. --Djsasso 16:13, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

There have been plenty of discussions about this and usually the consesnsus is to remove them, but people keep readding them. Nation of birth has little to do with a players skill, and if we're going to display the flags countries of origins, why not state and provincial flags? Either way, the page looked terrible as 90% of the names listed are Canadian and having the same flag over and over again is redundant. -- Scorpion0422 16:22, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I could restore the flags (for now), but I've no interest in 'edit warring'. GoodDay 16:28, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Hey dudes I am very aware that the current page says the flag represent the place of birth, however this is beyond misleading when it comes to Slovak players. Czechoslovakia split 1. jan 1993, so 2011 will be the first year there will be even a possibility of a Slovak coming into NHL who is born in the Republic of Slovakia. However this does not under any circumstances mean that Peter Stastny, Hossa, Bondra, Demitra and Satan are czech. Also take into notice that the czechoslovakian flag is the same as czech flag, and this creates GREAT confusion. This is my main point and argument why I think in this case it should show a slovak flag and not the czechoslovak/czech one. The only special case is Stan Mikita, who I believe should have no flag under his name as he is completely canadien trained. This whole idea with place of birth is just silly and I would be thankful if it got changed to the old way. Now it just confused me to no end when I looked at the page and saw all the czech flags next to Slovak players. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.102.89.230 (talk) 15:39, 16 September 2009 (UTC)
 * It actually becomes more confusing when you start trying to make exception for the rule. It's for this very reason that we use location of birth. -DJSasso (talk) 16:24, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

Nabokov under Kazakh flag?
Why Nabokov under Kazakh flag?
 * While Nabokov plays for Russia internationally and has Russian citizenship, he was born in what is now Kazakhstan. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 20:35, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Chuck Gardiner
This is such a minor nitpick I can't even believe I'm pointing it out... but, note 14 says "Chuck Gardiner and Andy Aitkenhead were born in Scotland, United Kingdom, but both came to Canada at a young age and gained Canadian citizenship". This isn't true in Gardiner's case. Poor Charlie died in 1934, independent Canadian citizenship wasn't created until 1947. While it's certainly standard to refer to people associated with Canada who lived before this time as Canadian, I feel like the note should be brought more in line with reality. --MichiganCharms (talk) 06:51, 6 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Got it. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 09:31, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

Semi-Protection
Just about everyday, IPs are dropping in, changing birth countries to current countries. It's getting rather tiresome. GoodDay (talk) 00:33, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I can't semi-protect for that. If we get a massive influx in a single day I will probably do it. But not the once in awhile changes. And its probably only happening so much right now because of the Olympics. -DJSasso (talk) 15:28, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Alright, I was in a bad mood yesterday (infoboxes). GoodDay (talk) 15:33, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I've changed the edit notice to the playoff version. Because as of tonight people can update the pages regular season stats. So anyone that wants to tackle that go for it. Anyone that does might also want to update List of NHL records (individual)‎ because a few records fell this year. -DJSasso (talk) 00:16, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Definition of active
There's some inconsistency about the definition of active. The page says "as of 13 April 2010". Chris Chelios was not in the NHL on that date, he was sent down on April 7, 2010 so he should not be active according to that definition. Someone said playing in 2010 is sufficient to be active, so there's no need to specify April 13. Can we pick one definition and stick with it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.119.19.211 (talk) 03:48, 7 June 2010 (UTC)


 * For me, playing in the NHL in the 2009–10 NHL season is sufficient for me. I therefore think it should be changed to "as of the end of the 2009–10 NHL season", since this list shouldn't be updated until then anyway. –Schmloof  04:22, 7 June 2010 (UTC)


 * Basically we consider it the NHL season. He played during last NHL season so he was active last season. We use April 13th because that was the last day of the NHL regular season. Until the playoffs are done we can't say the end of the 2009-10 season because the season is not done yet. The problem is people get impatient and want to edit this page before the season is done. So they update till the end of the regular season claiming the regular season is done, which then for a couple weeks sometimes causes questions like this to come up. In 4 days we will switch it to what Schmloof mentions above and all will be normal again until next season. -DJSasso (talk) 11:26, 7 June 2010 (UTC)


 * My issue is that "as of the end of season" doesn't imply "played during the season". Why have a description that is misleading?  How about something similar to "played in 2009-10" as I tried earlier?  This would be valid and clear until changed to played in 2010-11.—174.119.19.211 (talk) 02:25, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
 * That is a matter of opinion, but like I said once the season is completely over we put, these records are from the 2009-10 season which indicates they happened in that season. So anyone marked active would have been active in that season. -DJSasso (talk) 11:29, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
 * My issue isn't with the statistics or records, their description "The statistics listed include the 2009–10 NHL regular season but not the 2010 playoffs." is correct. My problem is with the incorrect "as of 13 April 2010" description of active.  Whether it is that date, or the end of the regular season or the end of the playoffs doesn't change anything.  Chris Chelios ceased to be an active NHL player on 7 April 2010 prior to all those descriptions.  If active means "during 2009-10", the description should indicate that. —174.119.19.211 (talk) 05:13, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

Edit notice - add country of birth?
Can we add a note about country of birth to the current edit notice? It's getting rather tiresome reverting all those edits, and hopefully it would cut down on a few of them. Or even a notice within the article, with the other notes regarding nationality. –Schmloof (talk · contribs) 10:49, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
 * There is a notice in the article, right at the top of the page...people ignore the edit notices so it probably won't help so much. But we could do it. -DJSasso (talk) 10:52, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

Ken Hitchcock
Somebody had re-added Hitchcock into the records as active. Well he's no longer an NHL head coach, so I've reverted those additions. GoodDay (talk) 15:13, 22 October 2010 (UTC)
 * I think Hitchcock should remain on the "active" list. He was active during the 2009–10 NHL season for which these lists apply.  He's still under contract.  He hasn't announced any official retirement.  According to reports he's still entertaining offers.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.92.76.79 (talk) 19:26, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Active means currently on a team. Doesn't tie in to being retired or not. In otherwords he isn't actively adding to his totals which is what being labeled as active is meant to get across. -DJSasso (talk) 19:30, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * This contradicts the description given above and in the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.92.76.79 (talk) 19:38, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * No, its because of introduction. The stats themselves are as of last year, the bolding indicates people that are still adding to their totals. In otherwords the people whose stats as listed are no longer up to date. -DJSasso (talk) 19:45, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Although looking close either someone changed the wording or didn't update it at the end of the year to indicate that. -DJSasso (talk) 19:47, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I have fixed the wording. -DJSasso (talk) 19:51, 21 December 2010 (UTC)