Talk:List of Toronto Transit Commission bus routes/Archive 1

List of Toronto bus routes article
Hello, I thought I'd create a page with a full list of all bus routes operated by the TTC. It was inspired by the list of bus routes for New York City's five boroughs, London, and Greater Vancouver. Please feel free to go beyond what I have made and improvise the list of routes (such as adding colour codes, improving the current format, etc.). As you can see it is currently incomplete (as of 15 February 2010) but I will surely try to finish it off soon. Eelam StyleZ (talk) 19:26, 15 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Added accessibility info from TTC site/transit summary, also added the rocket routes for you. eja2k 22:20, 15 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Awesome. Thanks! Eelam StyleZ (talk) 12:47, 23 February 2010 (UTC)

List format
I've proposed a redesign to this list. The current chart uses "rowspan" which, according to this, is not supported by WP:ACCESS. Also, since it is a large, lengthy chart, it is hard to browse and read. Which is why I've created a new format to list all bus routes as sections and have a short description about them, with a bit of history if can be found. I already experimented with creating dedicated pages for routes with this, which I don't know would if it would make a good encyclopedia article. However, this new list format is inspired by the format used at List of roads in Toronto. Any thoughts on this? EelamStyleZ (talk) 02:19, 6 May 2011 (UTC)


 * The new list format should be easier to read than the old format, which can be confusing to the reader. Johnny Au  (talk/contributions) 02:35, 6 May 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't think you have made a correct interpretation of the reference given, as to the problem with rowspan. It only affects sortable tables. Having said that, I really have no problem with the tabe or with using headings either. The advantage of your new page is that it is much easier to wikilink directly to individual routes from other articles (or from the TOC) using that format. The disadvantage is that it is going to be much larger. I don't think that there are any TTC routes deserving of a separate article, and it would be disruptive of the overall article to have the information on some routes split out like that. Note that the subway and RT are not bus routes. If you wish to include all Toronto transit routes, which are already extensively covered elsewhere, you would have to change the title and include streetcars too. I think you should stick strictly to bus routes. Secondarywaltz (talk) 16:08, 6 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Could you give an example of a full entry for a series of bus routes. Try a simple one like 6, 6A and 6B. Secondarywaltz (talk) 16:16, 6 May 2011 (UTC)


 * I'll remove the shuttle routes. This page should contain bus routes only as suggested. I'll try giving an example right here (this is inaccurate, just coming out from the top of my head, I don't (yet) know their histories or where these routes exactly really take you):

6 Bay

6 Bay is a bus route operated by the Toronto Transit Commission. It generally runs in a north-south direction along its dedicated route, Bay Street, in Old Toronto. The route terminates at Dupont Station at its northern end while terminating at Union Station while southbound. The route passes through the Financial District and serves the Toronto Coach Terminal. It runs at a distance of ?? km during a one-way trip with regular service occuring between the times of ??:?? and ??:?? from ? to ?. It was founded in ???? by the William Omnibus Line as a horse carriage route.

6A Bay

6A Bay is a branch route of the 6 Bay bus route, operated by the Toronto Transit Commission. It mainly serves Bay Street. Its southern terminus is ? while its northern terminus is ?, while travelling through ? Street and ? Avenue. The route operates during rush hours only.

6B Bay

6B Bay is a branch route of the 6 Bay bus route, operated by the Toronto Transit Commission. It mainly serves Bay Street, while also travelling through ? Street and ? Avenue. Its northern terminus is ? while its southern terminus is Union Station. The route operates on a seasonal basis, during the summer time only. This route was created in ???? to serve ridership to ????.


 * Hope this is clear. Of course, not all the entries would be as small/large as these - some may be shorter and some may be longer, depending on significance and verifiability. If a better example is needed, I'll try and write a correct/accurate description with sources for a few notable routes at the subpage I created. The main pieces of information that each entry should contain are its termini and operating frequency (seasonal, rush hour, etc.). EelamStyleZ (talk) 03:31, 7 May 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't see the need for every route or branch to have "operated by the Toronto Transit Commission" that seems a little repetitive considering the article only covers bus routes operated by the TTC. Otherwise I guess I support the move to the new format, as it would allow inline linking from say, the station pages which have the "connecting surface routes" category to the small blurb here about said bus route on this page. eja2k 13:48, 7 May 2011 (UTC)


 * The new format is much more descriptive than the old format, which is much more readable. Johnny Au  (talk/contributions) 15:52, 7 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Very well, I'll complete the entire list and shift it into the mainpage soon. I agree about "operated by the Toronto Transit Commission", that was just a space filler for the example I guess. I'll write up something more concise and descriptive in the real ones. EelamStyleZ (talk) 17:02, 7 May 2011 (UTC)


 * How about changing up the level of headings to give a line between every group, since we don't need divisions between different modes any more. I think that you could probably do without so much information in the sub-routes. Once you have described the main one, you really only need to describe the differences or deviations from the norm. This would stop the article from being repetitive and cumbersome, and perhaps not as easy to read as you seem to think. Secondarywaltz (talk) 19:51, 7 May 2011 (UTC)


 * That's true, but there are still other divisions with the type of bus routes, such as the rocket routes, downtown express routes, blue night and community bus routes. Also, does this mean not listing branch routes under sub-headings? I think it would still be a bit helpful listing branch routes as sub-headings, since they can easily be linked from station pages (preventing piped links like 6A Bay ). I'll definitely prevent repetition in info between sections. EelamStyleZ (talk) 01:04, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the proposal was moved. --BDD (talk) 21:44, 13 September 2012 (UTC) (non-admin closure)

List of bus routes in Toronto → List of Toronto Transit Commission bus routes –

I propose renaming it to "List of TTC surface routes" as: 1) GO also runs routes in the city AND 2) Streetcars are more like busses than rail transit in Toronto (so add streetcar routes also

Ashkljma (talk) 23:19, 22 August 2012 (UTC)


 * I suggest moving it to List of Toronto Transit Commission bus routes, which is clearer and more appropriate and we should not include streetcars because the information about those routes is already in Toronto streetcar system and could be linked to but not duplicated. Secondarywaltz (talk) 00:18, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I agree with Secondarywaltz. It would be consistent with Toronto Transit Commission buses as well. I found out that there is a problem with moving the article to List of Toronto Transit Commission bus routes, since the page already exists.  Johnny Au  (talk/contributions) 02:08, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * MiWay, York Region Transit and Viva also operate bus routes into Toronto, in addition to GO Transit. Secondarywaltz (talk) 21:25, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I must agree. In addition to those you mentioned, there are also privately-operated bus routes in Toronto. Johnny Au  (talk/contributions) 02:00, 24 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Support with the proviso, a new list of Toronto bus routes should be created to point to all the articles that concern bus routes of Toronto (such as the GO bus list) and any historic non TTC bus routes that have articles or exist as parts of articles -- 76.65.128.252 (talk) 04:22, 24 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Support according to my comments above. Johnny Au  (talk/contributions) 02:38, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Support Too many bus routes in Toronto are not run by the TTC. Hill Crest&#39;s WikiLaser! (BOOM!) 02:45, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

List revamp
I'm planning on revamping this list to better serve the TTC's changing styles (i.e. incorporate new rapid transit line numbers, better differentiation of services according to this system, better colour coding and labelling for descriptiveness, etc). I think it would also be useful to introduce redirects from bus route links to this article (for instance, 97 Yonge would redirect to the row on the chart which lists that route). I shall introduce the changes within the next month or so. EelamStyleZ // TALK 19:45, 15 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Do you mean according to this Legend? What else do you have in mind? Do you intend to distinguish between Frequent, Regular and Limited service? Blue Night and Express would both be blue. Remember that Wikipedia is not a travel guide and this should not be overdone. Secondarywaltz (talk) 20:00, 15 April 2014 (UTC)


 * The purpose is to cut down on worded details (route descriptions, accessibility, garages, etc.). Night bus routes will be moved to Blue Night Network. It will kept in accordance to WP:!. EelamStyleZ // TALK 20:18, 15 April 2014 (UTC)


 * There are no extensively worded details. All that is shown is Route No. and Name, Terminii, Accessable icon and Division, with most of the entries being one item. Nice and clean! How do you aim to reduce that? Secondarywaltz (talk) 20:29, 15 April 2014 (UTC)


 * For instance, the destinations include the streets travelled which seem trivial and redundant. Extra fare routes and seasonal routes can be denoted using symbols. All bus routes are now accessible and equipped with bike racks according to this link so denoting their presence is no longer necessary. Terms like "Kennedy Subway/RT Station" or "Rouge Hill GO Station" can simply be reduced to " Kennedy" or " Rouge Hill". EelamStyleZ // TALK 00:09, 16 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Some shorthands and formatting can be borrowed from List of bus routes in Manhattan, although the worded detail in that chart should also be avoided. EelamStyleZ // TALK 00:21, 16 April 2014 (UTC)


 * OK. If you don't include the end points of each route what do you have? What streets travelled? The Manhattan list is the one that is overly detailed about that. Secondarywaltz (talk) 01:16, 16 April 2014 (UTC)


 * You have already done a very good job of compiling this list and formatting it simply. I agree that accessible icons have become redundant. I have standardize colour choices in TTC color so that any subsequent change can be made once in that template, rather than recoding every line in the list that may need to be amended. Note that 140s and 190s are now all Express routes. Colours abstracted from the Legend for the maps. 02:17, 16 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Thank you very much. They are much easier to read.  The subway shuttles are unnecessary.  Johnny Au  (talk/contributions) 03:02, 16 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Looks good. This can be kept for now but over the upcoming weeks I'm going to be experimenting in my user space with a new kind of table that I think would rather distinguish the main routes and branch routes in a unique manner and allow for links to the routes to effectively redirect to their positions in the table. I'll share it here once its ready. EelamStyleZ // TALK 03:07, 16 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Please take a look at this. Will be working on this over the upcoming weeks. EelamStyleZ // TALK 04:18, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

December 17 service adjustments
Adjustments to routes that take effect on December 17, with the opening of the Line 1 extension, should not be made to this article before that time. Echoedmyron (talk) 22:54, 14 December 2017 (UTC)
 * The extension has opened, the first train south has departed Vaughan Metropolitan Centre station as of 7:50 AM EST. I have changed most of the routes impacted by the subway extension. If anyone sees any mistakes or formatting errors, feel free to fix.

Thanks, Toreightyone (talk) 12:59, 17 December 2017 (UTC)
 * 106, 107, 108, 116 were renamed.
 * 196 removed
 * 105, 107, 165 no longer service York Region
 * New 60E
 * 35, 41, 60, 84, 106, 107, 108, 195 now service Pioneer Village station
 * 36, 41, 107, 199 now service Finch West station
 * Also, if anyone could check the times and colour codes associated with the new/changed routes, that would be great. Thanks, Toreightyone (talk) 13:08, 17 December 2017 (UTC)

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