Talk:List of U.S. state and territory abbreviations/Archive 1

Untitled
I'm pretty sure that someone is confused about the difference between a traditional abbreviation and a modern postal code. I'm pretty sure that no one ever used "Ak." as an abbreviation for Alaska before the Post Office suggested AK for the two-letter code. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.107.0.25 (talk • contribs) 22:20, 4 November 2005

Is there really a state called "Canal Zone"? On 50states.com there is no mention of it, nor is there with a quick google search. Robertvan1 — Preceding undated comment added 16:15, 2 May 2006


 * So how did people abbreviate Alaska back in the day? "Alas"? &mdash;Chowbok 09:38, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
 * According to Webster's it was indeed "Alas." will edit accordingly Kmusser 19:32, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

Canal Zone
The US-administered government of the Canal Zone was referred to as "CZ." It was established in 1904. The earliest reference to the usage of CZ I could find was: President Roosevelt's Address to Employees, Culebra CZ, Nov. 16, 1906 Twalls

Merge
List of U. S. postal abbreviations and List of U.S. states by traditional abbreviation should be merged. The two lists deal with basically the same thing, abbreviations. Neither list is particularly long, and the postal abbrs. could easily be merged with the table on the tradtional abbrs. article. The other postal codes take up much more space than necessary and could easily be simplified. I'd be willing to do everything in merging the articles with no removal of information and the new list would not be very long, as much of the info overlaps in the first place and the table would be no longer than it already is. Reywas92 Talk 00:05, 1 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Actually, no, they are not the same thing: the postal state symbols are a different sort of thing from the traditional abbreviations. 121a0012 (talk) 17:52, 2 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, one is used when sending mail and the other is more commonly used by the media, but they really are the same topic: state abbreviations. When I merge the articles I will be sure to be distinct in the uses of the two types, but they really are the same.  If a reader wanted to know about abbreviations of states, he'd want to know about the different styles of them together, right?  Reywas92 Talk  21:29, 2 November 2008 (UTC)
 * No, the things used in the mail are symbols, not abbreviations. 121a0012 (talk) 01:49, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Please explain. If so, then List of U. S. postal abbreviations should be moved. An abbreviation is a shortened form of a name, which is exactly what these are. If one were to be labeling a map with abbreviations, he could use either FL or Fla, and MN or Minn. When reading list of abbreviations, I'd want to know both forms at once and not have to go to another article. Reywas92 Talk  01:57, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm all in favor of combining the two pages and appreciate Reywas92's offer to do the heavy lifting. YBG (talk) 10:15, 23 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, both of these articles are relevant to each other and would make the article on state abbreviations more thorough and absolute. User:Popndopalis8 (talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 16:37, 27 November 2008 (UTC).

When these pages are merged (and I assume they will be, as only 121a0012 has objected), I believe they should be merged into a more generally named page, maybe List of U. S. state codes or List of U. S. state abbreviations or the US state codes redirect page. Also, from the links to List of U. S. postal abbreviations, it seems like the merge will create a lot of double-redirects to deal with. YBG (talk) 03:16, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
 * As there now seems to be consensus that the two articles are related and should not be separate, I will work on a merge in the next few days. Reywas92 Talk  04:10, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
 * As there is much more info in the postal article, I (YBG talk ) suspect the merge will work better if the traditional article is merged into the postal article and then renamed to a more generic name. Here's my take at a merged outline:
 * Lead: Image from traditional article, new lead paragraph, table of contents
 * New combined (sortable?) table, combining the traditional article's table with all of the tables in the postal article, with these columns:
 * State or Territory name 50 states & DC first, then the others
 * USPS and FIPS columns from postal article
 * GPO and AP columns from traditional article
 * Other abbreviations (status) column from traditional article, plus other information:
 * Parenthesized comments as appropriate: (Freely associated state), (Insular area) , (Federal district), (Obsolete code), (US military mail).
 * USCG vessel prefixes -- followed by (USCG) for states where they differ from the USPS codes, plus all territories whether they are the same or not.
 * U.S. Minor Outlying Islands comment: UM is the FIPS alphabetic code.  See here for the numeric code for individual islands.  The U.S. Postal Service does not employ the term U.S. Minor Outlying Islands, as mail for any of these islands is routed indirectly (use PR, HI, AA or AP).
 * ==Traditional abbeviations== 3 paragraphs from traditional: Lead, GPO, AP
 * ==Postal abbreviations== Imagemap, 2 lead paragraphs, comment re Canadian overlap, 2 sub-sections: ===Example of address===, ===Methodology===
 * ==Other abbreviations & codes== A new section which I have drafted, to include information about FIPS, USCG and other stuff as it comes along.
 * Combined end matter: See also, References, External Links, Templates, Categories, Translations (? – they require tweaking)
 * Don't forget to check into the issue of double-redirects – I looked into it enough to know that I'd be in way over my head. Happy merging!!! YBG (talk) 17:49, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your suggestions! I hope the job isn't too big; I intend on starting this evening. Reywas92 Talk 19:38, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Great! If you like, after you're done I can take care of the fine tuning -- the USCG stuff, the 'Other' column and the ==Other== section.  The two biggest jobs are the table and figuring out double-redirects; most of the rest is verbatim from one of the two articles.YBG (talk) 22:15, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I've reordered stuff and added (Status) and USCG info. I'm not satisfied with the order of the columns in the table, but I'm not sure what would be best.  It seems like the 'Other' column should be last, and the GPO and AP columns naturally fall immediately before these.  Then the USPS column before this -- but what about the FIPS numeric code?  I think I prefer this order:  FIPS, Name, USPS, GPO, AP, Other.  Or maybe AP before GPO?  Any other ideas?  YBG (talk) 06:49, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I've finished the merger by redirecting the postal list and then moving it here. Thanks for your help finishing combining the tables. I agree with your order, but that does seem like a lot of work of copy/paste, so the current order is really fine. I have updated the state navbox template, but I believe there is a bot that will correct double redirects, so I will let it do that. Reywas92 Talk  02:10, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Merge
Should this be merged with the Canadian postal abbreviations? They all do use the same format, like the North American Number Plan. 129.100.195.189 (talk) 01:54, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

GPO and Connecticut?
The article now states "Except for CT, the second letter of the postal abbreviation is found in the GPO abbreviation for the state."

According to the GPO web site, the GPO abbreviation for Connecticut is CT, same as the USPS abbreviation. In fact, all GPO state abbreviations are the same as the USPS ones.

So what does this sentence mean? --Misterantithesis (talk) 18:34, 21 April 2009 (UTC)


 * In this article, 'GPO' refers to the pre-1987 GPO recommendations. The history section (which you nicely gathered created, thanks!) says:
 * Prior to 1987, when the U.S. Secretary of Commerce approved the two-letter codes for use in government documents,  the United States Government Printing Office (GPO) suggested their own set of abbreviations, with some states being left unabbreviated. Today, the GPO supports United States Postal Service standard.
 * That being said, the sentence could be cleared up a bit -- and maybe the header in the table also. YBG (talk) 07:27, 22 April 2009 (UTC) YBG (talk) 07:44, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
 * There I've fixed it now. It might be a good idea to check 'what links here' as I believe there are several links directly to the Traditional Abbreviations section which has now been renamed. YBG (talk) 07:56, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Methodology
This section has been marked as containing unsourced information. This is probably accurate; it appears that these lists first appeared at http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_U._S._postal_abbreviations&diff=23301814&oldid=20974000 and were later revised and edited. I'm not sure if this information is actually encyclopedic or not; mainly it is just mildly interesting observations. It would be really interesting if there were a citation describing how the USPO actually came up with these abbreviations. The closest source on history I've come up with is http://www.usps.com/postalhistory/_pdf/StateAbbrev.pdf. YBG (talk) 06:33, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

Washington
Washington was also abbreviated as "Wn." No source, just original research. (50-year-old address cards.) Katr67 07:05, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
 * "NB" is a former abbreviation (used by the USPS) for Nebraska (I have this in a 1965 ZIP Code directory put out by the Post Office Department). I'm assuming they changed it to avoid confusion with New Brunswick, but I don't know.  All I know is what's in the ZIP Code directory. Squad51 (talk) 20:49, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Rename Page
Rename "List of U.S. state abbreviations" to "States and territories of the United States"

See also:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/States_and_territories

Thangalin (talk) 00:07, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Vessel numbers -- state abbreviations required by Coast Guard
If anyone would like to create a page listing the somewhat unusual state abbreviations required by the Coast Guard to be used on vessels (i.e., as prefixes to vessel numbers), here is the data. Or, perhaps an additional column could be added to this page. Some differ from the 2-letter postal abbreviations.

Source: 33 C.F.R. Pt. 173, App. A

Alabama--AL

Alaska--AK

American Samoa--AS

Arizona--AZ

Arkansas--AR

California--CF

Colorado--CL

Connecticut--CT

Delaware--DL

District of Columbia--DC

Florida--FL

Georgia--GA

Guam-GU

Hawaii--HA

Idaho--ID

Illinois--IL

Indiana--IN

Iowa--IA

Kansas--KA

Kentucky--KY

Louisiana--LA

Maine--ME

Maryland--MD

Massachusetts--MS

Michigan--MC

Minnesota--MN

Mississippi--MI

Missouri--MO

Montana--MT

Nebraska--NB

Nevada--NV

New Hampshire--NH

New Jersey--NJ

New Mexico--NM

New York--NY

North Carolina--NC

North Dakota--ND

Northern Mariana Islands-CM

Ohio--OH

Oklahoma--OK

Oregon--OR

Pennsylvania--PA

Puerto Rico--PR

Rhode Island--RI

South Carolina--SC

South Dakota--SD

Tennessee--TN

Texas--TX

Utah--UT

Vermont--VT

Virginia--VA

Virgin Islands--VI

Washington--WN

West Virginia--WV

Wisconsin--WS

Wyoming--WY —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tawagoto (talk • contribs) 02:57, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I'd be happy to incorporate that into a merged article. Most are the same as the postal code so only the others would need to be mentioned.   Reywas92 Talk  00:08, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

It seems to me that there are enough differences between the postal and vessel abbreviations to justify having another column for the vessel ones. When were they instituted?--Piledhigheranddeeper (talk) 18:38, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

RyckZ (talk) 15:32, 25 September 2012 (UTC) I've found the following URL that could be added to the reference list (#11), however the ref list is protected and I do not know how to add it: 33 C.F.R. Pt. 173, App. A http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=a6ca10fa7afc0e4d79c10ec3663a1655&rgn=div5&view=text&node=33:2.0.1.8.39&idno=33#33:2.0.1.8.39.4.209.9.16
 * The reason you can't edit it is because the ref list is generated automatically from the tags included in the article. First of all, figure out where in the article this reference should be added.  Then have a look at the existing references and try to emulate them.  If you need more help, check out Footnotes.  If you still need help, leave another note here and I'll try to walk you through it.  YBG (talk) 22:10, 25 September 2012 (UTC)

State vs. Commonwealth
Is this a differentiation worth noting in the "status" column? ~E$ (talk) 21:15, 9 October 2012 (UTC)

CNMI vs. NMI for Northern Mariana Islands
Is there any reason to have "Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana Islands" for the old style and "Northern Mariana Islands" for the new style? It seems confusing -- they're not alongside each other if sorted by name -- and that one of them may be incorrect. (The former is formal but, since the others don't mention Commonwealth vs. State status, irregular.) Czrisher (talk) 23:52, 5 November 2012 (UTC)
 * No need to have a separate line for this obsolete code, any more than there is to include one for NB, the obsolete code for Nebraska. The other three obsolete codes should stay as they were not replaced but deleted.  YBG (talk) 05:55, 6 November 2012 (UTC)

California
There is no citation for the abbreviation of "Cali" for California. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ammobox (talk • contribs) 19:16, 14 December 2012 (UTC) MEOW — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cupcakeawesome188 (talk • contribs) 22:22, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

USA
3 Cheers FOR THE USA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Æ

GO USA11111111111111111111 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cupcakeawesome188 (talk • contribs) 22:21, 10 April 2013


 * Be careful. We don't have to be perfect to succeed at anything:  We only have to be better than the alternatives.  And to be the biggest, we don't have to be the best now in any category or method of evaluation:  We only have to have (a) been better than the alternatives during the periods of highest growth AND (b) avoided the worst excesses of extreme stupidity otherwise.
 * I'm a US citizen with time in the US military, but I'm keenly aware of many criminal things the US has done. For example, we provided Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction (chemical and biological warfare technology), which he used during the Iran-Iraq War and apparently more recently.  This history is almost certainly well-known in Iran but virtually unknown in the US.
 * Yes, we are #1. But #1 what?  DavidMCEddy (talk) 19:01, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

When did the abbreviation system actually start ?
I'm a genealogist for my hobby and I often look at USA Census records. For example - In the 1850 census for Indiana you will note a lot of people being born in 'IA'. Initially I always took it for granted that IA was 'Iowa' - but then I drew out some of the travel routes of people on the census pages using subsequent census records and the traveller's journeys often didn't make much sense with people starting in Ohio, 10 years later being in IA (Iowa) then 10 years later being in Indiana, then 10 years after that being back in Iowa (IA).

I actually suspect that the local States used their own codes to start with for use by the census enumerators - and if you were in Indiana in early years then IA meant Indiana NOT Iowa.

I'd be interested in anyone else's views on this - or some factual information would be even better.

JimFlack 09:44, 11 April 2007 (UTC)


 * I can confirm that IA was being used as an abbreviation of Indiana as late as 1856. I saw this in several places on a 1856 county map of Monroe County Indiana at the Monroe County Public Library. -- Suso 22:49, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
 * This is NOT reflected in the current table, but there is place for it in the last "Other" column, along with a footnote saying what you just said. It would be useful if someone could make this addition.  DavidMCEddy (talk) 19:06, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

Colorado is missing from the main table.
As of 1:25 pm Central time on 3/25/14 Colorado is missing from the main table. 68.188.68.66 (talk) 18:28, 25 March 2014 (UTC)
 * And as of 19:30 UTC+1 it has been restored. An IP replaced it with a duplicate Oklahoma. SiBr4 (talk) 18:32, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

California
Edit request

There is no citation for the abbreviation of "Cali" for California in the "Other" section. Cali needs to be removed or citation added. Ammobox (talk) 15:57, 9 April 2014 (UTC)

North Dakota extra space
It appears that North Dakota has an extra space before it in the table, leading to sorting issues when exporting data. I am not sure how to fix this. 166.66.39.90 (talk) 16:22, 6 July 2016 (UTC)

State Code "EE"
Just curious. I see the State code "EE" a lot. Which State is that for?Presidentbalut (talk) 17:01, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Can you give an example? I've not seen it. YBG (talk) 03:34, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Estonia? – Bever (talk) 13:34, 2 May 2018 (UTC)