Talk:List of best-selling music artists/Archive 20

New Kids On The Block
Worldwide sales are at 80 million..

http://www.hondacenter.com/EventDetails.aspx?EventID=585 http://www.bokcenter.com/default.asp?bok=227&objId=600 http://www.pressplus1.com/music/press-release-new-kids-new-tour-new-album.html http://steelcitymusic.ca/events/copps-coliseum/new-kids-block-backstreet-boys/08-06-2011 http://www.nbc12.com/story/14248960/nkotbsb-is-coming-this-summer-with-brand-new-album-showcasing-fan-picked-classic-tracks-from-new-kids-on-the-block-backstreet-boys-the-premiere?clienttype=printable — Preceding unsigned comment added by R&BEditzs (talk • contribs) 19:21, 4 June 2011 (UTC)


 * The sources above are not reliable with an exception of NBC which states 80 million albums, which should be records (albums, singles, videos). Therefore, we cannot use it. But if another highly reliable source is located claiming 80 million records, we can update their estimated sales as NKONB seem to have gathered enough certified sales (some 28.3 million excluding Canadian certified sales). The 28 million covers good 35% of the 80 million, and that is all they need to meet the requirement of this list as they've first charted in '86, see the requirement percentages above.--Harout72 (talk) 19:54, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

stop inflating sales
firstly the only thing that can be inflated is money! so why are people inflating lady gaga's sales. 55 million come one that is albums and singles. if this is the case that you are counting ablums and singles then change all the amounts so they are all correct, an example: britney spears' sales are at 150million+ including singles. if you are just counting albums then get rid of gaga she doesn't deserve a place yet with 12million albums sales. sort it out cos it is incorrect and i though this website was ment to be accurate! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mikala19 (talk • contribs) 19:49, 29 May 2011 (UTC)
 * ? I don't get your point. These figures represent all records - one single + one EP + one album makes 3 records in these statistics. If you count together the certified sales of The Fame, The Fame Monster, The Remix, Hitmixes, Cherrytree Sessions, Telephone, Just Dance, Bad Romance, Poker Face, Born This Way (single) and currently Born This Way (album) (BTW album's and single's sales are acc. to Billboard), you get approximately 55 million.
 * By the way, could you please give sources to Britney's 150 million. :) -- Frous (talk) 18:45, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

my point is gaga's sales are at 55million. some artists the sales are for albums only, (like britney's) you wither need to decide on albums only or albums and singles and if you can't find all the sorces for singles for every artist you need to indicate some are counted by albums and singles yet some are counted through just their album sales. it is an unfair and unreliable source otherwise.

its imopssible for gaga to have sold as much as some claim especially when there is illegal downloading, i would have believed some figures if this was 10 years ago but not now.

britney's overall sales are at just under 125 million but that was before her new singles and album. femme fatale has sold 1,033,000 worldwide to date. this is from its opening week just add them all up through to this weeks sales and you will find just over the million mark. so that is 126million total sales worldwide. then there is till the world ends and hold it against me have been released as downloads only and they have sold including the remixes just over 1 million worldwide and till the world ends has sold 1.4 millon and then as a featured artist on rihanna's s&m has sold 196475 so from the sorces her total sales are at 128,629,000 if my calcualtions are correct. so you round it up to 129million Mikala19 (talk) 16:52, 5 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Mikala19, Britney's total estimated sales of 100 million is for albums, singles and videos. Therefore, the source currently supporting Spears' stay on the list states Records not Albums. However, if a highly reliable source is located such as CNN, Fox News, BBC etc. claiming 120 million records, we can update Britney's estimated sales and the source, since she has begun charting in '98 and she has enough available certified sales (64.7 million) to support 120 million records. But again, the source must be highly reliable.--Harout72 (talk) 18:01, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

And might we also mention that THIS IS NOT A FORUM, so you can take your dismay with Gaga elsewhere. Unless a reliable source is given, Britney sales cannot be updated. Records mean everything including singles. Gaga may be selling more singles but she's only released two albums (one of them two weeks ago) and an EP which sell at a much faster rate than Britney's so it's natural that you might see Gaga's sales increase faster since she relies mostly on digital media.--HusseinIED (talk) 08:02, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

ACDC ARE BRITISH
No Denying it! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.154.14.218 (talk) 00:50, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Bluekahuna, 7 June 2011
The Beach Boys have sold at least 100 million records across the globe, this list is very incomplete!

Bluekahuna (talk) 19:25, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made.- Happysailor  (Talk) 21:09, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Lady Gaga SALES
So recently on the UK television show Graham Norton, he told her about some "statistics." Those statistics were album and single sales and he says: "69 million singles sold and 23 million albums sold"

If this is being televised to millions of people, I think they're going to believe that and that I'm guessing those are the OFFICIAL NUMBERS.

69 + 23 = 92 MILLION total sales!

Consider the change.

The video is here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-oMF3ttjnA4 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.149.142.11 (talk) 06:17, 14 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Sales figures must come from prestigious news services or highly reliable music-industry related organizations such as Billboard or MTV. Besides we go with the figures that are supported with enough certified sales (see the brackets of required certified sales above), and the current 55 million is supported by 68% certified sales (37,890,000) which is what an artist who's begun charting in 2008 would need. For some 92 million in sales, Gaga would need some 62.5 million in certified sales which I doubt will happen soon, at least not within the next year.--Harout72 (talk) 16:15, 14 May 2011 (UTC)

65 MILLION: I put the sales of The Fame, The Fame Monster, The Remix, The Singles and The Cherrytree Sessions (all those with reliable(?) sources on her discography) and of the singles "Poker Face", "Just Dance", "Bad Romance", "Telephone" and "Born This Way" (all those with reliable(?) sources on the article on of the best-selling singles worldwide) together and it makes a total of 65,691,122. So. Since they are verified by news agencies considered reliable, should that 65 million be the figure? -- Frous (talk) 14:02, 27 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Oooops. Those are 53,691,122 put together...a "minor" miscalcutation on my side. :D -- Frous (talk) 19:04, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

The source dates from mid 2010, since then she has released a remix album, a new studio album and new singles. Through research on certifications from reliable sources (the sources listed on the Wikipedia articles for each single and album) the amount of album sales are of:
 * The Fame: 9'355,000
 * The Fame Monster: 5'489,000
 * The Remix: 519,000
 * Born This Way: 2'451,000

Which is: 17'993,000 albums sold worldwide.

Her single sales are of: 49'471,500 and, once added the album sales gives a total of: 66'944,500 total sales, should the number be changed?--StephenG (talk) 01:43, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

The Four Seasons
The Four Seasons have definitely sold over 100 million records why aren't they on the list? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jih1234 (talk • contribs) 16:40, 13 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Because they don't have enough certified sales. You might also want to refer to this archived discussion.--Harout72 (talk) 20:43, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

Eminem
Eminem sold 86.5 million — Preceding unsigned comment added by ArshakMessi (talk • contribs) 04:37, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

German and Austrian Artists
Some German Artists are missing on the list. (Platten = Records)

Modern Talking sold over 120 million records

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/panorama/dsds-neues-modern-talking-mit-medlock-und-bohlen-1.854734

Udo Jürgens sold over 100 million records.

http://www.eventim.de/udo-juergens-biografie.html?affiliate=EVE&doc=artistPages/biography&fun=artist&action=biography&kuid=695

http://www.kultmuenchen.de/konzerte/schlager-volksmusik/event/Udo_J%C3%BCrgens_muenchen_9531.html

Roland Kaiser sold over 90 million records.

http://www.sonymusic.de/Roland-Kaiser/Biographie

James Last sold over 80 million records. is ranked with 50 million records

http://www.universal-music.de/company/corporate-communications/presse-archiv/presse-archiv-detail/article/76509/james-last-erhaelt-universal-music-lifetime-award-und-einen-vertrag-auf-lebenszeit/

Falco sold over 60 million records.

http://www.seite3.ch/Falco+Der+Groessterreicher+/426817/detail.html

Heino sold over 50 million records.

http://www.laut.de/Heino

Peter Alexander solver over 50 million records.

http://www.kleinezeitung.at/nachrichten/kultur/2673560/peter-alexander-verkaufte-mehr-50-mio-platten.story

Enigma sold over 50 million records.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/virginemi-to-release-enigma-the-platinum-collection-boxed-set-on-february-9-79339722.html

Ich901 (talk) 19:14, 18 June 2011 (UTC)Ich901


 * This list requires all claimed figures to be supported by certain percentage of certified sales, see the requirements above. Modern Talking was removed from the list for not having enough certified sales supporting their claimed figure, see this archived discussion for MT. Out of all the German bands/projects, Boney M. and Scorpions are the only ones that have enough certified sales backing up their claimed figures. As for James Last, he has enough certified sales to support up to 70 million, 6 million in certified sales from Germany, 3.3 million from the UK, 200,000 from Canada (CRIA certifcation-database is offline at the moment), 1.2 million from the Netherlands (NVPI certification-database is not functioning at the moment). --Harout72 (talk) 19:54, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

Sources and references
--Ich901 (talk) 19:38, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

Garth Brooks
Can a new reliable source be located for Garth? The current source claims 128 million albums in the U.S. which doesn't represent a worldwide sales claim. In certified sales, Brooks is listed as having 159.8 million, so the 128 million claim is very low. I'm pretty sure he has a few million in certifications from the CRIA but their website is still down. Any thoughts? — Gabe 19  ( talk contribs) 23:07, 14 June 2011 (UTC)


 * I tried to locate another source for Brooks, but nothing other than couple of sources claiming 128 million maximum came up. The 128 million doesn't even cover his US actual sales, his US certified sales (see it here) alone are 159.2 million. This guy has sold some 170 million records in US easily. Actually, the Eagles are in a similar situation, 110.8 million in US certified sales (see the detailed certified sales here, and their claimed figure is only 120 million, which, in fact, should be some 150 million easily, but again I can't locate anything higher for them either. As for CRIA's certified sales, while it's still down, I contact CRIA every now and then to get their certified sales for the artists that we still don't have Canadian certifications for. I got David Bowie's today, already uploaded on MediaFire and posted along with others.--Harout72 (talk) 00:00, 15 June 2011 (UTC)


 * who cares about garth brooks? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.26.19.86 (talk) 00:51, 26 June 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Lmazis1964, 22 June 2011
Bon Jovi has been active since 1983, not 1933.

Lmazis1964 (talk) 06:06, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

✅. Scieberking (talk) 10:07, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

Julio Iglesias
his US sales certificates are above 29.5 million. and in Brazil he is the best selling artist with 8.1 million as well as his sales in France and other countries he has sold more than 40 million records certificated and because he is from 1968 so his 300 million records claim can be true!!!!!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.99.158.159 (talk) 11:45, 24 June 2011 (UTC)


 * I see only some 13.2 million in US certified sales, and 1.4 million in Brazilian certified sales, but Brazil's certification database covers only releases that have been certified after 1990. See the detailed certified sales for Iglesias here. All in all, the 300 million and even the 200 million that we see in some sources are clearly inflated figures for promotional purposes that Iglesias' record company has used possibly to market his then releases.--Harout72 (talk) 15:40, 24 June 2011 (UTC)

OK i didnt know that some of his US sales are in latin type. but anyway i say that he has sold almost 27 million according to that file and if thats right with 15% needed sales we can say that his claimed sales should be around 180 million!!!!!!!!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Farid1374 (talk • contribs) 19:21, 24 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, there is some 26.4 million in certified sales, and that could support up to 175 million in actual sales (15%). If there is that figure coming from a reliable source we could update Iglesias' estimated sales as well as the source.--Harout72 (talk) 23:49, 24 June 2011 (UTC)

OK is this 100 million claimed anywhere and is 200 million? so if these are claimed so you can add him with 175 and 200 million like for micheal jackson and some others!!!!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Farid1374 (talk • contribs) 09:56, 27 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Let's bear in mind that the lowest figure-for those artists that have begun before 1975-must be supported by 15% certified sales. And for Iglesias, as I pointed out above, 175 million is the most, and if we do locate that source, we can also keep the current source stating 100 million. All other artists on the list with certified sales that have begun before 1975, have enough certified sales supporting their claimed figures with 15% certified sales including Michael Jackson whose 750 million claimed figure is supported by 20% certified sales (153.7 million).--Harout72 (talk) 15:14, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

Eminem
Hey i just wanted to say why do you only have 80 million for Eminem when he has 86 million in Album sales only and you haven't counted any of singles When Love the way you lie has 9 million digital sales world wide and Not afraid has 4 million world wide not to mention all 32 of Eminems singles (excluding Lie and not afraid) surely have to add AT LEAST up to 10 million (My guess is added together its much higher) which would be 23 million singles sales which would put Eminems sales at 109 million just letting you know. I didn't put my sources but if you reply ill be glad to. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.42.217.172 (talk) 05:13, 26 June 2011 (UTC)


 * I replied. Place your sources.-- CallMe Nathan  &bull;  Talk2Me   14:13, 26 June 2011 (UTC)

Certifications
hi i just want to know that is certifications from some countries like Russia, Denmark, India and Ireland reliabe or not and if they are not why?

and some corrections:

1: Usher has sold 65 or 80?! i see two for Usher.

2: Enrique iglesias is not from United States at all he is from Spain only i think. --Farid1374 (talk) 15:42, 28 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Denmark's certifications can be found here and here. Denmark's certifications are also posted on their charts, here, they are all reliable. Unfortunately, they date back to 2001 only. Russia's certifications for international artists can be found here, and they are also reliable. The site for Indian music industry is this, but they don't seem to post certifications, at least not that I can find. 1) Usher's source states 65 million records, I removed the one with 80 million, it was the same source as the one listed for 65 million. Thanks for bringing it up. 2) As for Enrique Iglesias, we go with Origin Country not Nationality. In other words, we list whatever the country artists begin in, and in the case of Iglesias, it's the U.S..--Harout72 (talk) 23:21, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

Genesis
Genesis are no longer an active group. Phil Collins retired in early 2011, thus ending the band the same year. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.146.113.133 (talk) 16:48, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

✅.--Harout72 (talk) 23:37, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Tom Jones
I made a previous edit to add Tom Jones but the source i provided was considered not good enough which is fair. I did find this: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/south_east/8557064.stm

Which states "Sir Tom, who has sold more than 100m records worldwide, left school with no qualifications and married his sweetheart Linda at the age of 16." Does this seem like a credible source now?

(Paddytheceltic (talk) 01:21, 29 June 2011 (UTC))

Also found: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/7620450.stm http://www.tomjones.com/news/listen-to-tom-jones-on-bbc-radio-4s-desert-island-discs/

(Paddytheceltic (talk) 01:24, 29 June 2011 (UTC))


 * Allow some time for me to go over Jones' certified sales. If his available certified sales are 15 million+, then we can put him up on the list using one of BBC sources. All artists begun charting before 1975 are required to have their claimed figures supported by 15% certified sales. See the requirements above on the top of this discussion page.--Harout72 (talk) 01:57, 29 June 2011 (UTC)

Tom Jones' available certified sales are only 12.5 million which is not enough for Jones to be on the list with 100 million. All artists begun charting before 1975 are to have their claimed figures supported by 15% certified sales which Jones lacks. However, Jones could get on the list with a source that claims maximum of 80 million as he has enough certified sales for that, but higher figures than that will not work.--Harout72 (talk) 15:44, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

Black Sabbath sales
Black Sabbath has sold 100 million albums, not 50 million. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.56.231.57 (talk) 16:44, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

Pink!
This is with regards to the editor Dynailjarrell who insists on inserting Pink! into the list with this source which claims that Pink! has sold 40 million albums and 65 million singles. Please note that Pink! should only be listed on the list with a maximum of 55 million in sales as her available certified sales are only 28.1 million. Pink! has begun charting in 2000; therefore, according to the requirements of this page which are posted at the of this discussion page, she would need her claimed figure supported by 50% certified sales. By the way, sources by record labels should not be used to support sales fugues as they often tend to inflate sales figures for promotional reasons, that information is also posted at the top of the main page of this article.--Harout72 (talk) 15:39, 7 July 2011 (UTC)

Boney M removed from the list
I have removed Boney M from the list, their sales figure (100 million) was supported by this source. Boney M have begun charting in 1975, therefore, per the requirements of this article which can be found a the top larger yellow box of this discussion page, they need to have their claimed figure supported by 15% certified sales, that is 15 million for 100 million sales. That is not the case with Boney M as their available certified sales come up to just 13.2 million. Note that Boney M can be re-inserted with another reliable source if it claims maximum of 85-88 million in sales.--Harout72 (talk) 18:08, 10 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your tireless contributions, Harout72. Here:


 * Boney M Singer Bobby Farrell Dead.
 * Boney M star Bobby Farrell dies
 * Boney M: Did Bobby Farrell have the best job in the world?

Regards, Scieberking (talk) 23:13, 10 July 2011 (UTC)

✅. Thank you for the sources, I re-inserted Boney M into the section of 75 million to 99 million records.--Harout72 (talk) 00:13, 11 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Heck, I ain't a fan btw... :) Regards, Scieberking (talk) 01:43, 11 July 2011 (UTC)

Mistakes
Shania Twain has sold 80 million albums worldwide. Garth Brooks has sold over 200 million worldwide, and he is not even on the list.

Backstreet Boys Mexican sales 1475000 not 1.4 and brazilian 1625000 not 1.6 — Preceding unsigned comment added by DxMakebbh (talk • contribs) 16:51, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

And your source being? Regards, Scieberking (talk) 17:17, 12 July 2011 (UTC)

My source being the very source used in the page for the BSB sale — Preceding unsigned comment added by DxMakebbh (talk • contribs) 10:46, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Those are not sales figures, they are certified sales figures, and we post only figures of the hundreds of thousands. For example, 1,450,000->1.4 million, or 1,925,000->1.9 million.--Harout72 (talk) 16:21, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

Slade
Slade sales are apparently estimated at 50 million. Unfortunately, certifications are limited to BPI overall. Not a reliable source but the band had a photo with their Slade Certified Discs back in the 70s here.

Sources:
 * 
 * BBC Documentary 1999 It's Slade

Certifications estimate 520,000 albums and 1.8 million singles in UK alone based on BPI certifications. .

In 2010 VH1 listed Slade as #25 on best selling UK singles artists with single sales of 6,720,000.Ajsmith141 (talk) 20:56, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, the source above is not a reliable source. In UK Slade seem to have 780,000 certified albums and 2,500,000 certified singles (see the details of that here), they also have 50,000 certified in Canada and 20,000 certified in Finland. Unfortunately, they need to have their claimed figure (which is supposedly 50 million) supported by 15% (7.5 million) certified sales, which is not the case here. By the way, when going over UK's certified sales, refer to their previous certification-levels. Slade don't have certified sales anywhere else.--Harout72 (talk) 21:45, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

Lady Gaga sales
The number of records sold by Lady Gaga have, undoubtedly, increased since August, 2010. It has been almost a year from then and she has released since then an album of Remixes, a Studio Album and 4 singles, all of them passing the million copies mark and one of them (Born This Way) selling over 3 million copies. According to this article, released in May, 2011 by the Chicago Tribune, Gaga has sold over 91 million records. The amount of certified sales for Lady Gaga stand as:

Album Sales


 * U.S. Album Certifications: The Fame has been certified as 3 times platinum by the RIAA, The Fame Monster has been certified as Platinum by the RIAA and Born This Way has sold over 1.5 million copies according to Billboard. That counts as a total of 5.5 million copies sold in the U.S. alone.


 * U.K. Album Certifications: The Fame is certified as 4 times platinum:


 * IFPI Europe: The Fame and The Fame Monster are certified as 2 times platinum and 3 times platinum respectively, and Born This Way is certified as a platinum record. This adds up to a total of 6 million copies certified.

So: 5.5 + 1.2 + 6 = 12.7 million albums certified.

Singles Sales


 * U.S. Singles Certifications: Both Just Dance and Poker Face have been certified as 5 times platinum by the RIAA, Bad Romance has been certified as 4 times platinum, Paparazzi as 3 times platinum and LoveGame as 2 times platinum: ref1. Born This Way, as of July, 2011, has sold 3 million copies in the U.S. This totals an amount of 22 million singles sold in the U.S.


 * U.K. Singles Certifications: Just Dance and Poker Face are certified platinum, while Bad Romance, Paparazzi and Born This Way are certified gold. Which add up to 1.6 million singles sold.


 * According to Wikipedia's own List of best-selling singles, Lady Gaga has 4 singles that have sold over 7 million copies, with two of them (Poker Face and Bad Romance) selling almost 10 million of copies:
 * Bad Romance with 9.7 million of copies sold.
 * Just Dance with 7.7 million copies sold.
 * Poker Face with 9.8 million copies sold.
 * Telephone with 7.4 million copies sold
 * Other songs by Lady Gaga not included in this list are:


 * Paparazzi with over 3 million copies sold.
 * LoveGame with 2.5 million copies sold
 * Alejandro with over 2 million copies sold
 * The Edge of Glory with 1.5 million copies sold.
 * Judas with 970,000 copies sold.

If all this sales are added (9.7 + 9.8 + 7.7 + 7.4 + 3 + 1.5 + 2.5 + 1 + 2 + 12.7 = 61) and this results are not complete, since the only sales taken into account are those from Europe and the U.S. --StephenG (talk) 02:40, 23 July 2011 (UTC)


 * See the required percentages for certified sales above at the top of this page. Lady Gaga has begun charting in 2008 that puts her in the last bracket which requires Lady Gaga's actual sales to be supported by 68% certified sales. Her current available 39,250,000 in certified sales can support 57.7 million claim. We should, however, see more certifications for Lady Gaga in the near future. As soon as her available certified sales reach 44.2 million, we can use the next available claimed figure for her, which is 65 million. That said, the 91 million claim about her actual sales cannot be used unless her certified sales reach 61.8 million. For now 55 million is all we can go with. By the way, her available certified sales cover sales of US and Europe as well as sales of Brazil, Mexico, Canada, Australia and Japan. And those territories combined cover good 85-90% of all the global sales.--Harout72 (talk) 05:19, 23 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry but that's WP:OR. You might specify a certain percentage to be included on thi article, but you cannot use that to overwrite "reliable/reputable" external sources. Meaning you may decide not to list Lady Gaga at all, but if you list her, you cannot limit her uncertified figure to 57.7 but you rather have to go with the figures external sources provide even if they are higher. Otherwise you would overwrite reliable external sources by your personal guestimate/research/opinion which is in violation whith basuc policies.--Kmhkmh (talk) 13:50, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

We are going with what external sources state. Analyzing claimed figures with certified sales to see if those claims are reliable for use is not violation of basic policies. Wikipedia: Reliable Sources clearly states: ''The reliability of a source depends on context. Each source must be carefully weighed to judge whether it is reliable for the statement being made and is the best such source for that context. In general, the more people engaged in checking facts, analyzing legal issues, and scrutinizing the writing, the more reliable the publication''.--Harout72 (talk) 15:19, 26 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Lady Gaga's current certified sales available stand at over 55 million, these include all of her latest certified material, as well as some information from Nielsen SoundScan (for the amount of sales in the U.S., since these are not certified yet). This means we can support up to a 72.6 million claim. Also, if you take out all uncertified sales (from Nielsen SoundScan) the results equal 41 million, which we can use to support a claim of 61 million. --StephenG (talk) 22:54, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

The detailed certified sales (total of 39,250,000 for all significant markets combined) that I have prepared on Words and uploaded on Mediafire.com, have been taken from certifying bodies, RIAA, RIAJ, Bundesverband Musikindustrie, BPI, SNEP, Music Canada, ARIA, ABPD, IFPI Switzerland, IFPI Austria, PROMUSICAE, IFPI Sweden, Ultratop. As I mentioned above, 39.2 million in certified sales can support up to 57 million claim. I can't see your point as you have two vague figures indicated on your uploaded file of Excel, one for albums (41,666,500), and one for singles (13,600,628). You don't have any details whatsoever as to which markets or which albums/singles they are for. That is not how we operate here. I have a feeling that you have not even gone over the file that I have uploaded. Once you convert all the Gold and Platinum awards found in the databases of certifying bodies, you should have exactly what I have on the Words file uploaded. Be sure to use correct certification-levels when converting awards into figures, the levels can be found in the sources provided at the footnotes.--Harout72 (talk) 01:07, 24 July 2011 (UTC)


 * The list you uploaded is incomplete, there are other countries that have certified sales from either singles or albums sold, like Indonesia, Russia, Austria, New Zealand, Greece, Finland, Thailand and many others. Also, why include the IFPI certification if you are not taking it into account? --StephenG (talk) 01:42, 24 July 2011 (UTC)


 * He answered that already. The list he provided gives roughly 85-90% of the worldwide sales of an individual artist. Those countries you listed hold an extremely low percentage in the worldwide sales make-up. As an example, Platinum in Russia is 50,000, in Greece 6,000, in Finland 10,000, in New Zealand 15,000. In the United States 1,000,000, in the United Kingdom 300,000, in Japan 250,000, in Germany 200,000. As you can see, Germany alone is superior to all those countries you listed. Capish?-- CallMe Nathan  &bull;  Talk2Me   02:25, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

StephenG, just to prove you how insignificant the sales of those countries are that you are mentioning above, I added the certified sales of Austria, Finland and Russia. All three markets combined added only 274,599 on the top of what we had before, I re-uploaded again, still only 39,524,599. You might want to refer to List of music recording certifications and also Global music industry market share data, those two lists alone should tell you how small and insignificant 50% of the markets are.--Harout72 (talk) 04:02, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

There should be a wiki page for albums sales worldwide....Not including singles sales, etc like this one.. Just throwing this out there since I have seen multiple websites quoting/referring this wiki article in terms of artists who have sold the most albums worldwide (whereas this wiki page is the combined sales of albums, singles, downloads, etc). MatsOvechkin (talk) 02:56, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

Shakira
Shakira's number of 70 Million is for ALBUMS sold, not for records, she has sold more than 90 million singles so her total is over 160M records. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.85.4.86 (talk) 00:16, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Lol. Not even in her wildest dreams my dear.-- CallMe Nathan  &bull;  Talk2Me   06:59, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

Lady Gaga 55 million albums sold?
I think some are confusing singles sales with record sales..

There is no way in hell Lady Gaga has sold 55 million albums in less than 3 years. That's ridiculous (especially considering album sales worldwide have been on a decline due to piracy and all that). The link that supposedly backs up the 55 million claims only shows Gaga's worldwide sales being at 15 million.. According to Rolling Stone Magazine she has sold about a total 7.2 million records in America (all three of her albums combined). I highly doubt she has sold 47 million albums in other parts of the world.

This definitely needs a fix. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.71.129.197 (talk) 00:59, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

They count both her albums and singles sales. And they shouldn't since they are only counting albums sales with some artists. And an album is more difficult to sell than a single, more expensive, so singles sales shouldn't have the same weight as albums sales. Lady Gaga has sold a lot of singles in the past 3 years, not albums (compared to 10 years ago). If we only count her albums sales, she has sold less than 20 million copies worldwide. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.129.168.170 (talk) 07:39, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

certified sales are higher than claimed sales
first, I don't need your permission to change the article, it's not your possession. just to make it clear. second, if you would have checked my edit carefully you would have seen that the certified sales of Garth brooks and the Eagles are higher than the claimed sales from the cited sources. So the higher number counts...

Ich901 (talk) 19:15, 3 August 2011 (UTC)Ich901


 * Kindly locate reliable sources first. You can feel free to make your additions after that. Scieberking (talk) 19:48, 3 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Ich901, there is a difference between Certified Sales and Estimated Sales; therefore, we have two separate columns for them. While the certified sales of some artists are higher than their estimated sales, it doesn't mean you should have removed reliable sources as you have done. You should have simply discussed it. Ich901, just to remind you, you have already violated WP:3RR, the next one will get you reported which will possibly result in loss of editing privileges. Engaging yourself in edit-warring is not how we operate here.--Harout72 (talk) 22:17, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

the certified sales are SOURCED, which means the sources from the claimed sales are outdated and not reliable. Is this to complicated for you? It's not my duty to comment on logic edits. Your editing priviliges should be taken from you, because you revert correct edits!!!

Ich901 (talk) 13:19, 4 August 2011 (UTC)Ich901


 * I'm going to explain to you one more time. Because the certified sales are higher than the claimed figures, it doesn't mean you should remove the source(s) of the latter. Often times certified sales of an album could be much higher than the actual sales of the same album. For example, Backstreet Boys' album Black & Blue has been certified 8x Platinum for shipment of 8 million in US, but has sold some 5 million units only. In any case, instead of removing reliable source(s) of the claimed figures, you should invest your time in locating source(s) that are higher than the certified sales and replace them with the current ones. Right now you are not demonstrating logic, it is edit-warring.--Harout72 (talk) 15:23, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Certified sales are the most reliable source you can have, or do you have more examples like that back street boys album (ps what if it sold 8 million and the page that claims it sold 5 million is wrong, they can't really prove it...)


 * Yes, certified sales are normally very reliable, but so are all figures coming from Nelsen Soundscan (which is the case with the figures on here. If you want to help out, then you can try and locate sources for Garth Brooks and Eagles, claiming figures higher than what the current sources for them claim. But until then, we should stick to the sources that we've got.--Harout72 (talk) 23:00, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Lady Gaga, 91 Million Records
According to this source, which is used for both Lady Gaga's biographical article and her discography page, Lady Gaga has sold 69 million singles and 22 million albums, for a total of 91 million records. Using the most up-to-date Neilsen Soundscan figures for the US and certifications for the rest of the world, with sales published by reliable resources like the UK's Official Charts Company, the albums number totals to approximately 17,275,872 units. The singles sales numbers total to approximately 45,040,175 units. This totals to approximately 62,316,047 records sold or shipped, which is higher than the necessary 50% certifications figures at 68.5%. Some may note that the sales/shipments figure is only 43,089,000 when counting certifications alone, but this discounts several million units from Neilsen Soundscan data that would push the total above the 50% mark. It also would disount several million records from other countries that have been proven to be sold by official companies. For example, about 500,000 copies of the single "Poker Face" sold in the UK would not be counted, as the song is 100,000 copies away from its next certification of 1,200,000. -- MusicMonster96 (talk) 16:21, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Here we work on certifications alone. Also, where are the sources for those sales? SoundScan only tracks US sales.-- CallMe Nathan  &bull;  Talk2Me   19:48, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

Lady Gaga's has begun charting in 2008, meaning her certified should cover 68% of her claimed figures. Gaga's available certified sales at the moment are 41.3 million. That is still 2.2 million short to be able to support the next available published claimed figure, 64 million. However, we could already consider updating her claimed figure from 55 million to 64 million as she'll soon be collecting a lot more certifications in major markets including the US, Germany, UK and Japan. If there are no objections from anyone including Petergriffin (Nathan), we could implement the 64 million in Singles and Albums sales combined.--Harout72 (talk) 20:34, 5 August 2011 (UTC)


 * If you would like for 64 million, that's fine, but 91 is just absurd.-- CallMe Nathan  &bull;  Talk2Me   20:45, 5 August 2011 (UTC)


 * The source claiming 91 million cannot be used unless she's got 61.9 million in certified sales. And that is a long way to go. Ok then, I'll go ahead and update it from 55 mil to 64 mil.--Harout72 (talk) 20:49, 5 August 2011 (UTC)


 * I suppose I'll wait for more certifications, but here's what I've observed: If one was to go through the articles of all her songs and albums, they would find quite a few things. Born This Way has sold copies in both the United States and UK that have not yet been certified. "Judas" has sales in four countries (Canada, France, UK, & US) where it has yet to be certified, including 720,000 downloads in the United States. "Born This Way" has sold as-yet-uncertified copies in the US and UK, totaling to over 3 million copies. "Telephone", "Alejandro", "The Edge of Glory," and "Startstruck" have all sold enough copies in the US to be certified, but have not. They have sold, according to Soundscan, 2,801,000 copies, 2,101,000 copies, 1,336,000 copies, and 679,000 copies respectively. "Poker Face" has been certified only 5x Platinum, but has sold 6,140,000 copies in the US. It has also sold 1,100,000 copies in the UK, but has only been certified 1x Platinum for 600,000 copies because it is not yet at a 2x Platinum level. The songs "Dance in the Dark", "Monster", "Speechless", "Marry the Night", and "You and I" have sold copies in the US totaling to 690,000 copies. As far as albums go, the source for Finnish certifications lists 14 copies of The Fame, 358 copies of The Fame Monster, and 9,854 copies of Born This Way above the level required for the certification each album has received. 1.4 million copies of The Fame are not accounted for in the US, as it has received a 3x Platinum certification but has been reported by Soundscan to have sold 4.4 million copies in the US. The Fame Monster has sold 1.349 million copies in the US according to Soundscan and is certified 1x Platinum for shipments and/or digital downloads of 1,000,000. In all, the difference between all sourced & verifiable sales or shipments and the actual certifications given to date is approximately 19,227,047. The difference in albums certified and albums sold (according to sales numbers used by sources within the articles themselves) is about 4,539,372, and the difference in singles is about 14,687,675. Sales provided by trusted sources, including Soundscan and many certification bodies, support the total of 91 million albums by 68.5%. In any case, I'll wait until these sales are actually certified if need be, as many of these issues should be taken care of quite soon. (Born This Way's US certification is currently pending, so a few more of her US certifications will probably be updated soon as well.) -- MusicMonster96 (talk) 21:03, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

Salvatore Adamo sold over 100million and he is not in the list
Why is he not in the list? he should be in the list! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.21.183.95 (talk) 13:35, 9 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Because he doesn't have 15 million in certified sales.--Harout72 (talk) 15:04, 9 August 2011 (UTC)

Ok what are certified sales? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.21.183.95 (talk) 15:59, 9 August 2011 (UTC)


 * The certified sales are when an album gets certified first Gold and then Platinum for selling certain amount. In France, for example, an album that sold over 100,000 units between 1973-2005 was certified Gold, an album that sold over 400,000 (between 1980-1988) or 300,000 (between 1988-2005) was certified Platinum. For France, see the certification levels here. This list requires that all artists that have begun charting before 1975 have their claimed figures supported by 15% certified sales. See the requirements above. Furthermore, Adamo's French certified sales since 1973 up to now are only 400,000 for albums. I see no available certifications for him in any other market.--Harout72 (talk) 23:24, 9 August 2011 (UTC)

Why are you deleting my comment? are you stupid or what the fuck is going on with you???

Pink Floyd
pls update SNEP (France) sales, on 'Total certified sales' still is 6 mill France sales..., but according to http://www.infodisc.fr/CD_Vente_Artiste.php today sales is more than 11 million (probably this includes sales for singles, CDs digital and albums etc.)  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Avator5 (talk • contribs) 15:00, 12 August 2011 (UTC)


 * What we have posted for SNEP are certified sales not actual sales. The certified album sales for SNEP are here, for singles here. And they all have been taken into account including video certifications posted on here, see the details here. By the way, Pink Floyd's more updated actual sales for France is 12,539,275. --Harout72 (talk) 15:12, 12 August 2011 (UTC)

What's up with Pink?
Why is Pink not on this list? She sold over 100 million records, and she is not even on THE LIST. --Iggy Ax (talk) 13:39, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Pink has begun charting in 2000 which requires that her claimed figures be supported by 50% certified sales, the requirements for certified sales above. Pink currently has available certified sales of only 28.1 million and that can support a claim figure of some 56 million (albums, singles, videos combined). Also, we don't accept sources coming from Labels such as Jive, because they quite often inflate sales figures for promotional purposes.--Harout72 (talk) 15:24, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

This List Should Include Only Album Sales...Or...Should be Corrected...
This List Should Include Only Album Sales Its not the same to sell an album than a song.

This "record" thing is just for having Lady Gaga on the list, but then, the other artists should have a bigger number as well.

Shakira for example, over 150 million records worldwide. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.85.4.86 (talk) 23:46, 12 August 2011 (UTC)

Four Seasons
I'm pretty sure the Four Seasons, or Frankie Valli and the Four Seasons, or their various other names, sold around 175 million records (thats what Wikipedia itself says!) but they're not on here as far as I can tell!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.148.106.74 (talk) 20:32, 15 August 2011 (UTC)


 * It's because they don't have enough certified sales. You wanna refer to this archived discussion.--Harout72 (talk) 00:29, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

FYI - interesting list of best-selling music artists (found on Last.fm)
Herewith another list with an overview of the best-selling music artists ever. It seems to be a more logical list, with no inflative figures. A lot of thse sale figures seems to be correct. The sales for U2, Prince and some others seems to be incorrect (to high), but overall a very interesting list that I want to share with you.Christo jones (talk) 13:04, 20 August 2011 (UTC)

Best-selling music artists worldwide / Artistas musicales más vendidos en todo el…

26 May 2011, 02:13


 * BEST-SELLING MUSIC ARTISTS WORLDWIDE at 2011 March (Albums+Singles+Videos) (Physical and Digital formats)


 * 1) THE BEATLES 569,100,000
 * 2) ELVIS PRESLEY 444,200,000
 * 3) MICHAEL JACKSON 405,100,000
 * 4) MADONNA 352,200,000
 * 5) ELTON JOHN 288,900,000
 * 6) THE ROLLING STONES 270,200,000
 * 7) QUEEN 252,400,000
 * 8) CÉLINE DION 234,900,000
 * 9) FRANK SINATRA 226,100,000
 * 10) PINK FLOYD 220,900,000
 * 11) MARIAH CAREY 216,500,000
 * 12) ROD STEWART 212,300,000
 * 13) BEE GEES 210,000,000
 * 14) U2 208,100,000
 * 15) WHITNEY HOUSTON 197,600,000
 * 16) GARTH BROOKS 194,900,000
 * 17) LED ZEPPELIN 186,400,000
 * 18) BARBRA STREISAND 185,600,000
 * 19) ABBA 181,500,000
 * 20) EAGLES 173,600,000
 * 21) AC/DC 170,400,000
 * 22) PAUL MCCARTNEY 166,400,000
 * 23) ERIC CLAPTON 165,500,000
 * 24) BILLY JOEL 162,500,000
 * 25) BRUCE SPRINGSTEEN 161,300,000
 * 26) PHIL COLLINS 159,500,000
 * 27) BON JOVI 158,500,000
 * 28) AEROSMITH 157,300,000
 * 29) FLEETWOOD MAC 154,100,000
 * 30) NEIL DIAMOND 153,000,000
 * 31) PRINCE 146,500,000
 * 32) BOB DYLAN 145,300,000
 * 33) SANTANA 144,000,000
 * 34) METALLICA 142,700,000
 * 35) SIMON & GARFUNKEL 139,800,000
 * 36) EMINEM 139,700,000
 * 37) DAVID BOWIE 138,000,000
 * 38) VAN HALEN 136,500,000
 * 39) CLIFF RICHARD 135,900,000
 * 40) BRITNEY SPEARS 129,200,000
 * 41) JANET JACKSON 127,100,000
 * 42) GUNS N' ROSES 128,500,000
 * 43) BACKSTREET BOYS 124,400,000
 * 44) STEVIE WONDER 124,100,000
 * 45) GENESIS 118,100,000
 * 46) THE DOORS 117,000,000
 * 47) DIRE STRAITS 115,300,000
 * 48) DIANA ROSS 113,300,000
 * 49) SHANIA TWAIN 110,500,000
 * 50) KENNY ROGERS 106,400,000


 * According to official reports of certifications of IFPI, RIAA and official sources in www.ukmix.org in main markets (USA, Japan, UK, Germany, France, Canada, Australia, Italy, Russia, Spain, The Netherlands, South Korea, Brazil, Mexico, Austria, Belgium, South Africa, Switzerland, Sweden, India, China, Norway, Denmark, Turkey, Ireland, Taiwan, Thailand, Finland, Portugal, New Zealand, Poland, Greece, Indonesia, Argentina, Hong Kong, Colombia, Singapore, Israel, Czech Republic, Chile and Ukraine) that represents 98% of worldwide music sales.


 * Not estimations from labels or fans (they talk insane numbers like 1 billion for Beatles, or Elvis, 750 millions for Michael Jackson, or 350 millions for ABBA).Madonna The Beatles Elvis Presley Michael Jackson ABBA Eminem Britney Spears Lady Gaga pop rock worldwide Mariah Carey


 * 

Christo jones (talk) 13:04, 20 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Last.fm is not a reliable source. This list is of no importance, but IMHO, user-generated opinionated garbage. Scieberking (talk) 14:33, 20 August 2011 (UTC)

Table suggestion
There is a lot of white space atm, with certified sales in a long column while the other data is only one or two lines. So I've made a possible table we can implement which has certified sales spilt into two columns. It means the removal of Country of Origin as people with low monitor resolutions like 1024x768 make it look very squashed and not easily readable, but since artists do not represent their country I think it is a compromise worth doing. Mattg82 (talk) 14:53, 20 August 2011 (UTC)

Table removed


 * Why would anybody set their computer on resolution 1024x768? :) I really think that we should keep the Country of Origin. The proposed table seems to have a lot of unused white space after the second column of the certified sales. Also, the columns of Artist and Claimed sales are too wide, they take up unnecessary space. Overall, your suggestion for splitting the certified sales into two columns is logical, but the width of the aforementioned columns could be downsized. In fact, the columns of the Year active and Year of first charted record could be downsized as well. Thoughts from others perhaps?--Harout72 (talk) 17:17, 20 August 2011 (UTC)


 * "Why would anybody set their computer on resolution 1024x768? :)" Me atm :(


 * OK I've made some changes to it which you have suggested, what do you reckon to it now? But it means the removal of the [Notes] tag from every country's total cert figure and just having one tag at the end of total figure at the bottom. Having the [Notes] tag left on means references started cropping to the next line at low resolutions, which doesn't look good. This sounds like a really anal level of attention to detail on my part, so I guess I could put them back. Mattg82 (talk) 02:21, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

Not my business, but isn't everything viewed better with higher resolution settings? :) Well, notes should stay as they need to be there for some, and don't have to be there for others, it all depends on when an artist has begun charting and when a particular market has begun certifying records. I still see a lot of unused white space after the second column of the certified sales. All columns can be narrowed down as they all take up space that is not being used, with an exception of the Genre column. I think we should change the width of the column of Certified sales only. See this. In my opinion, having the markets in a single column is clearer though.--Harout72 (talk) 02:54, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

Deep Purple
I have removed Deep Purple from the list due to lack of certifications. Deep Purple have begun charting in 1968, therefore, per our requirements, they would need their 100 million claim supported by 15% certified sales. Their available certified sales are only 11.8 million which can support a claim figure of up to 80 million. We could re-insert Deep Purple into the list if such claimed figure is located.--Harout72 (talk) 18:15, 6 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Hi! I've read that info. We don't know how reliable could be, as I found the same numbers in many blogger sites. Anyway, can you insert them, as I see you are the one who knows the most about this page?? Thanks!!Milikguay (talk) 04:17, 19 August 2011 (UTC)


 * I mean, in the 80 million section, til we find better sources!! Greets to you!! Milikguay (talk) 04:18, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

I'm sorry, insert what? The certified sales? We'd first need to locate a reliable source that claims 80 million, because that's as high as Deep Purple's available certified sales can support. By the way, the certifications come from the sites of certifying bodies, I'm not sure if you were referring to those by saying that you've read that info and not sure if they are reliable.--Harout72 (talk) 05:12, 19 August 2011 (UTC)


 * I've tried my best to locate a source claiming 80 million, but it seems there's isn't any. All you can get are the ones with 100 million sales figure. Regards, Scieberking (talk) 07:00, 19 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, Deep Purple don't have 15 million in certified sales to be inserted to the list with 100 million claim. They're good 3 million short. For now we should keep them off the list, if anything changes in their certified sales in the future, we'll be sure to re-insert them. Thanks.--Harout72 (talk) 15:55, 19 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Actually (and considering old databases) they have 2M sales in Germany, 1.2M sales in France, almost 1.1M in Italy and Spain and 1.2M in Russia. I've been picking those numbers from years ago. Sad thing is that there are no updates. Everything is from their seventies sales (excluding Russia and France, which are from the 90's). About US sales, many sources claim certified sales of around 10.4M (most from Machine Head, Made in Japan, Burn and in Rock). So, if I can re-collect this data, that would make the 15M number. Later! Milikguay (talk) 17:24, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

Milikguay, my certified sales (11.8 million) uploaded on MediaFire (Word file) are taken directly from the certification-databases of certifying bodies. Those figures that you claim for US do not match with RIAA's certifications for Deep Purple. Deep Purple's certified sales that can be verified are as follows:


 * US certified sales: 7,500,000 albums, 1,000,000 singles, 50,000 videos (Total: 8,550,000)
 * US certified sales for: Machine Head=2,000,000 (2x Platinum), Made in Japan=1,000,000 (Platinum), Burn=500,000 (Gold), Deep Purple in Rock=500,000 (Gold)
 * UK certified sales: 1,040,000 albums (Total: 1,040,000)
 * French certified sales:900,000 albums, 20,000 videos (Total: 920,000)
 * German certified sales: 1,100,000 albums (Total: 1,100,000)
 * Canadian certified sales: 150,000 (Total: 150,000) (Note that the same certifications in Canada's database are duplicated, do not double count them)
 * Australian certified sales: 35,000 albums, 22,500 videos (Total: 57,500)
 * Dutch certified sales: 100,000 albums (Total: 100,000)
 * Austrian certified sales: 75,000 albums (Total: 75,000)
 * Swiss certified sales: 25,000 albums (Total: 25,000)
 * Argentinean certified sales: 30,000 albums, 24,000 videos (Total: 54,000)

Note that there are no certified sales for Deep Purple in numerous markets including Sweden, Brazil, Finland, Mexico, Norway. Overall, Deep Purple don't have enough certified sales to suggest that they have sold 100 million in actual sales, perhaps some 50 million maximum. That said, the 100 million seen in sources is just a promotional figure tossed about by their record company.--Harout72 (talk) 02:18, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

Enrique Iglesias
Hi

I noticed that there is a gap between this article and Enrique Iglesias discography. On this list he is noted for 55m, but on the discography he is noted for 60m albums and 40m singles (=100m). Could someone figure out which one is true and correct the other. --Maitch (talk) 08:58, 24 August 2011 (UTC)


 * The 55 million records (albums, singles, videos) is somewhat closer to his actual sales, even that is inflated by good 10-15 million per Iglesias' available certified sales (note that all certifications are taken from the databases of the certifying bodies). There is absolutely no way that Iglesias' actual sales is at 100 million, that figure immediately disagrees with his certified sales. If the 100 million in sales was true, we should see at least 50-55 million in certified sales, such is not the case; however. His current combined certified sales coming from larger sized, medium sized and smaller sized music markets are 21.8 million. Iglesias' true sales have been discussed here numerous times, see this archived discussion for example.--Harout72 (talk) 15:44, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

General Methodological Issues
There does not seem to be any methodology of data collection in this article. Rather it seems as though the author has conducted tireless work to compile a near meaningless list. We can be reasonably sure that the Beatles, Elvis, and Jackson are tops, but a bit further down the list there is little sense to be made. Such a list should contain a methodology and procedures of data collection. You don't go hunting for numbers and sources to validate a list. Just because The Daily Planet says so doesn't make it so in reality. Sense there are not likely to be any conclusive institutions that collect this data longitudinally, you have to develop a well-informed methodology based on expert subject knowledge and theoretical expertise to collect this data and measure artist sells. It needs to be applied to all artists equally. Naturally, there will be missing data. Oh well, that is how is goes. There are ways to deal with incomplete data (e.g. triangulation methods, etc.), but again, you need a unique methodology to do so. And again, it needs to be applied equally to all artists. These are some of the basics of data collection to ensure validity and reliability; without which the data and list are dubious at best.

Anyone who has followed a variety of music to some degree for a couple of decades or more would clearly see many problems with this list. One problem concerns the interaction between longevity, technology, and common sense. There is simply no way that a recent artist, of say a three or four year career, could out-sell a 2-3 decade mainstream artist. Two extreme example would be to compare Madonna and Lady Gaga and Rihanna and Def Leppard. The two pairs are incommensurable. If this is not obvious consider that during the seventies and eighties individuals purchased albums. By the eighties hardly anyone was buying 45s and cassette singles and were soon supplanted by CDs. On the other hand, sells in the last decade are more strategic due to technology and internet. And individual no longer has to be ripped off paying $12-15 for a CD that only has one or two decent songs. I realize this list is not just albums sells, but keep in mind that paraphernalia e.g. was much bigger in the eighties than it is in recent years. Dispelling37 (talk) 10:49, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
 * To begin with, your logic is invalid and flawed. It is pretty clear that you've NOT read the requirements and the whole thing about this list before making otiose comments. Scieberking (talk) 18:03, 24 August 2011 (UTC)


 * To defend the list (I don't work on it). There is a methodology to it. See the top of the talk page.
 * To defend Lady Gaga. Her singles sell really well. If you look at the List of best-selling singles worldwide, she easily beats Madonna and is already on par with The Beatles. I would argue that while it is hard to sell albums these days, it has become easier to get high single sales. --Maitch (talk) 11:30, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Britney? =
Britney has sold 100 million albums or records? A few years ago it was said she had sold 82 million albums... so she has sold just 18 million singles, videos and all those things? She's released lots of singles, 18 million seems ridiculous compared with other artists... I think the figure is not accurate, and maybe old — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.9.8.223 (talk) 08:13, 20 August 2011 (UTC)

I completely agree! They need to update it. If they are counting Lady gaga's single and album sales, they should update all other artists sales, otherwise this whole article would be deemed inaccurate. Britney has sold over 120 Million albums + Singles. If they aren't willing to add an artist's singles sales too, then remove Lady GaGa from this list... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 110.33.75.128 (talk) 03:42, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

This article counts both single sales and album sales for newer artists, but older artists such as Britney only have album sales counted to there final tally. Britney has far surpassed 150 million at this rate, considering she has had numerous worldwide hits. All sources about her only list album sales though. If someone can find a source to contribute the single sales that would be great. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.130.144.148 (talk) 20:55, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

What the hell happened to the top 3 selling artists?
Beatles, Elvis, and Jackson. Those three are regarded as the top three selling artists in music. It is only logical to exclude the three artists from the 300 million sellers, and revert it to have them in the 500 million+ section, or whatever it is.

Notably, they are top 3 selling artists. take them out of the 300 million chart and revert it to how it once was. 50.43.47.189 (talk) 06:37, 25 August 2011 (UTC)


 * LOL, Michael Jackson has NOT surpassed 500 million record sales, dude! Sony Music and his management loved to inflate his sales, like 104 million claim for Thriller. Jackson's record sales as a SOLO artist should be around 400 million copies. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 39.209.129.33 (talk) 23:05, 25 August 2011 (UTC)


 * That is correct. He hasn't sold anywhere near the amount of records as The Beatles or Presley. Just because Sony claims it, does not mean he has sold anywhere near 750 million. Nice try!-- CallMe Nathan  &bull;  Talk2Me   23:08, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Elton John
Why is Elton John's claim not higher? He has more certified sales than most of the people on the 300+ list and he also started very early meaning that he would only need 15%. Heck, he almost has as many certified sales as Michael Jackson. --Maitch (talk) 08:45, 31 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Are there reliable sources claiming higher figures than 250 million?--Harout72 (talk) 15:12, 31 August 2011 (UTC)


 * This claims 300 million records sold. --Maitch (talk) 16:00, 31 August 2011 (UTC)


 * This source is unfortunately not a reliable one. Do you have something from reputed newspapers like New York Times or LA Times or any other magazine source like Rolling Stone etc. Scieberking (talk) 16:38, 31 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, first, could you please explain why the source is unreliable. Is not a self-published source and I don't see much diffence between this source and About.com, which is currently used in the list. --Maitch (talk) 17:13, 31 August 2011 (UTC)


 * There is also this source from the British newspaper The Mirror who also claims 300m. --Maitch (talk) 17:30, 31 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Great! Daily Mirror is, of course, more reliable than relatively unknown websites like WhatCulture.com. See WP:WEB. I also agree Elton deserves a place in the 300 million section. Regards, Scieberking (talk) 16:46, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

I moved Elton John upwards on the list using the article by Daily Mirror. While Daily Mirror is reliable, news services like The New York Times, BBC, The Los Angeles Times, Washington Post would be more preferable. If such sources are located, please post them on here, so we can add them also.--Harout72 (talk) 21:19, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Garth Brooks And Carrie Underwood
Often on media, I've seen Garth Brooks claimed to be the best selling artist of all time (whether it means for country music, or music in general is beyond me). Also, can someone check about Carrie Underwood? I believe she belongs in the last category, but I am not certain. She'll be there soon if she isn't there already ;) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.156.121.218 (talk) 23:50, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

Mistake with Lady Gaga
According to the article quoted Lady Gaga has sold just 13 million albums worldwide at that date, not 65. Probably nowadays she has sold more than that anyway it is not enough to mention this singer in this list. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nikitafalgoon (talk • contribs) 04:10, 20 August 2011 (UTC)

I agree! What's happening there. Most of the 64 million is just single sales. Where as Britney Spears' sales are only counting the albums sales and so are most of the artists on the list. It's not fair to count gaga's singles + album sales and other artists only via their album sales. Get rid of her! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 110.33.75.128 (talk) 03:17, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

Britney's 100m are BOTH singles and albums, she generally performed better in the albums market but her sales have greatly declined since Blackout, which is the main reason her sales are stuck between 80-100 for a while now.--HusseinIED (talk) 21:10, 3 September 2011 (UTC)

And also as a reminder, this is NOT A FORUM. You can take your Britney/Gaga fan war elsewhere. Lady Gaga is not going anywhere except higher up the list, wether it's singles or albums. This Wikipedia, not Billboard.--HusseinIED (talk) 21:12, 3 September 2011 (UTC)

Remove ABBA's hyper inflated 370 million records?
There's no way ABBA has sold 370 million, even if we count their each sales estimation album by album. They has not outsold Madonna, Elton John, or Led Zeppelin, even Mariah Carey arguably sold more. With their 54.2 certfied sales (the lowest among on the section), their logical sales figure is not more than 200 million records. Maybe some editors will say they began their career before most certification databases exist, but as you can see how Elton John can achieve 153 million certified sales when he started earlier in the late 1960s. ABBA's total certified sales in USA (world's biggest music market) is only 12.7 million. I think removing them from 300 million section is not fair. How about removing the ridiculous 370 million claim, 300 million records is already exaggerated for them??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 182.3.162.108 (talk) 02:23, 3 September 2011 (UTC) ABBA precede the RIAA, so it's logical that their certified sales are that low. And yes, it's also logical they have outsold Madonna since they are 10 years older and were much more popular than Madonna in Europe and Australia. The US was the only market where Madonna surpassed ABBA in popularity. Unless you bring a considerable amount of reliable sources that they have NOT sold that much, take your rant on a forum, not here.--HusseinIED (talk) 21:17, 3 September 2011 (UTC)

That's not true, RIAA have begun their database in 1958, loooong before ABBA. It's not only unfair for Madonna, but also Sir Elton John and Led Zeppelin who both have started earlier than ABBA, yet their certified sales are FAR higher than ABBA's. ABBA will never sell 370 million if their sales number in world's biggest music market named USA is really LOW (357 million outside USA?? seriously?). For Madonna comparison, hahaha, NO!! ABBA's worldwide popularity will never surpassed Madonna whose single and album received Guinness World Records for topping charts in MOST countries ever. This is another example, in the United Kingdom (3rd biggest music market), Madonna ranked seventh for top album artists of all time, ABBA didn't even crack the top-ten.


 * IMHO, you probably make a valid point. The 370 million figure could be and seems quite inflated to me as well. Scieberking (talk) 05:11, 4 September 2011 (UTC)


 * There is no doubt that ABBA's actual sales fall somewhere around 100-150 million records. But unfortunately, they have enough certified sales for 370 million figure to meet our requirements posted at the top of this discussion page. By the way, ABBA is not the only act with inflated sales figures, Michael Jackson with his 750 million, and both The Beatles and Elvis Presley with their 1 billion figures, are part of that inflated-sales-figure club, many others too on the list.--Harout72 (talk) 15:56, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes, that's right. But my issue here is why ABBA should be placed above Madonna, Sir Elton John, and Led Zeppelin? Maybe Madonna has started a decade after ABBA, but Sir Elton John and Led Zeppelin who both released their debut earlier in late 1960s, yet their certifications are very much bigger than those of ABBA. That's really not fair, unless we don't rank them like artists on the last three sections. I don't have problem with the inflated figures for The Beatles, Presley and Jackson because most people believe they are indeed top 3 best-selling acts of all time. Displacing ABBA to 150 million section is too extreme to me. I just suggest to remove 370 million and let's keep ABBA on the same section. 300 million is already inflated enough for them. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 182.0.14.145 (talk) 16:29, 4 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, I also think this "370 million" figure should be removed and "300 million" should be kept, just like Jackson's "1 billion" figure, which was too backed by mutiple reliable sources, was removed a couple months earlier. Scieberking (talk) 17:04, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

On the main page, at the top it says The tables the artists in which are listed with both their estimated sales figures and certified sales ranks the artist/band with most sales/certified sales at the top. Meaning, if artist "X" with 300 million claim has 100 million in certified sales, and an artist "Y" with also 300 million claim has 120 million in certified sales, then the artist "Y" takes a higher spot in the same table. While we should keep in mind that this list is not about competition as to who has sold what, it needs to be noted that ABBA's 54.2 in certified sales cover only 14.6% of the 370 million claim. Normally, we should not make a big deal about 0.4%, but it's not exactly 15% either as it should be per our requirements. If there are no objections from anybody, and I believe there shouldn't be, we should remove the 370 million, and as you suggest list ABBA with a maximum of 300 million. 54.2 million in certified sales is 18% of 300 million, that will still keep ABBA in the highest table, but below Queen.--Harout72 (talk) 17:25, 4 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Hi Harout72. Hope you're doing great. Yeah, of course I do know about the requirements/ certified sales thing, and I think it's fair that we remove ABBA's 370 million and place them below Queen as you suggested. Regards, Scieberking (talk) 17:45, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

✅Ok, the 370 million has been removed. I'm good thanks:).--Harout72 (talk) 18:31, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

At the time, ABBA were much more popular outside the US yes, those records Madonna has broken you speak of have been achieved at least 20 years after she started her career. So Guinness world records are not notable enough unless Madonna achieved them in her first 10 years. Just wanted to clear that up. — Preceding unsigned comment added by HusseinIED (talk • contribs) 00:01, 5 September 2011 (UTC)
 * ABBA's 370 million wasn't removed on the basis of Guinness Records or anything. Please read the above discussion. Thanks. Scieberking (talk) 05:55, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

Marilyn Manson, Korn additions and Red Hot Chilli Peppers
--Handsprime (talk) 00:03, 9 September 2011 (UTC) Hi can you please add Marilyn Manson and Korn, they have sold over 50 million albums. Also can you update Red Hot Chilli Peppers since they have sold over 60 million I believe

Edit request from 91.194.225.29, 12 September 2011
ABBA sold 375 million records according to Universal Music Group. Source: http://www.abbasite.com/articles/news/abba-receives-a-special-award-to-mark-the-group%E2%80%99s-375-million-worldwide-record-sales

So the claimed sales can be changed to 375 million.

91.194.225.29 (talk) 12:32, 12 September 2011 (UTC)


 * ❌ - Please read the discussion above. Scieberking (talk) 13:22, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

Stevie Wonder
I think after seeing his total certs, 100m looks better. Reuters, CBS. Mattg82 (talk) 18:45, 16 September 2011 (UTC)


 * I added the source by Reuters, but kept also the 150 million as Stevie Wonder has enough certified sales to meet the requirements.--Harout72 (talk) 21:30, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

Tom Jones
Has sold over 100 million records and should be included on the list.

Sources:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/music/music-news/7398407/Tom-Jones-at-the-job-centre-singers-employment-record-unearthed.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/music/artists/57c6f649-6cde-48a7-8114-2a200247601a

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/44306215/ns/today-entertainment/t/tom-jones-cancels-concert-denies-heart-scare/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rangermouse (talk • contribs) 17:58, 20 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Tom Jones doesn't have enough certified sales to support 100 million records. See this archived discussion.--Harout72 (talk) 20:19, 20 September 2011 (UTC)

Genesis don't have anywhere near enough certified sales to support a claim of 150 million records sold and yet are included on the list. Seems odd. Rangermouse
 * I'm not sure what seems odd to you about Genesis when they have over 38 million in certified sales, which supports their 150 million by 25.7%. That is enough certified sales for an artist/band to meet the requirements of this list, that have begun charting in 1969. Please see the requirements of certified sales at the top of this page.--Harout72 (talk) 01:52, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

Apologies, I should have paid more attention to the requirements at the top of the page.

Still think TJ should be included simply because he's a music legend. :D

Rangermouse — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.175.137.148 (talk) 15:47, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

Lady Gaga
So she has obviously sold more records now that her new album has come out so why are the numbers still the same? On her discography page, the combined total of singles and albums is a much larger total than what is listed on this page. FIX PLEASE! You have two main pages stating two different quantities of info. Doesn't look too good. Lady Gaga doesn't sold 64.000.000, it is fake! She has sold 13 - 15.000.000, was the Lady Gaga's fãs that did it! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.218.50.220 (talk) 03:18, 23 September 2011 (UTC)

The Jackson 5
I have removed The Jackson 5 from the list as their available certified sales are only 12.5 million. We need at least 15 million in certified sales for their 100 million claimed figure.--Harout72 (talk) 18:03, 23 September 2011 (UTC)

People not on the list
Most of the people/bands, who definately should be on the list, fails because the claim is too high (maybe 100m is too high, but 80m is ok). Could we possibly make a short list where we can see what kind of claim we are looking for? That way we could go out and search for reliable sources. --Maitch (talk) 21:32, 23 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Record companies may claim high sales figures for lot of their artists, but lot of those claimed figures are simply not true; therefore, they don't necessarily need to be on the list. Back to your point, yes lower claimed figures may work for only some artists who have certified sales but not enough for the claimed figures which they were on the list with. This discussion page has the availability to retrieve previous discussions (at the top). You could enter the name of any artist and see related archived discussions. Once an artist is removed from the list, the available certified sales for that particular artist is posted at the discussion page. And if there is no mention about what claim figure that certified sales could go with, all one needs to do is follow the brackets of the required certified sales, posted above. For example, The Jackson 5 were removed because their 100 million claimed figure was supported by only 12.5 million in certified sales (that is 12.5%), but since they have begun charting in 1969, it requires their claimed figure be supported by 15% certified sales . To find out what claimed figure the 12.5 million in certified sales could be 15% for, I use the following crisscross-multiplication-form:


 * 12,500,000 (available certified sales) - 15% (required percentage)


 * X (missing claimed figure) - 100% (highest claimed figure)


 * Simply multiply the available certified sales (12.5 million) with highest claimed figure (100%) and divide it by required percentage (15%), and the highest figure can be 83.3 million. In other words, 15% of 83.3 million is 12.5 million, which is the available certified sales.--Harout72 (talk) 22:27, 23 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes, but could you make a short list of artist that would be on the list if only they had a smaller claim. I'm willing to do some research, but I don't want to read through 20 archives just to figures out which ones I need to focus on. Recently, it has been Jackson 5, Deep Purple, and Tom Jones. --Maitch (talk) 23:08, 23 September 2011 (UTC)

EDIT REQUEST: need SOURCE for Rihanna having more sales(80mill) than Beyonce(75mill)
Rihanna is listed here with sales of 80mill, but the source given is german(mtv.de). How do we know what the webpage says? Is 80mill her sales of whole entire full album sales or is it total sales (whole cds, plus singles). Ri has been out since 2005,for 6yrs. Her best selling cd was 2007's GGGB. Ri sells alot of singles but not albums. So please give a source for her having 80mill sales. I don't believe Ri has sold more than Beyonce. Beyonce's solo car began in 2003, so 8yrs now. She clearly sells whole albums consistently, not just singles. Bey's sales are listed as 75mill. Thanks. 173.79.72.180 (talk) 11:34, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
 * First of all, this is not a competition list. Secondly, it is a list of record sales (album+single+video). I don't know their exact certified sales (User:Harout72 will help), but looking at their worldwide chart performance, it is clear that Rihanna are more succesful worldwide than Beyonce. A quick example, Rihanna has "Umbrella" or "Love the Way You Lie" which topped many countries, while Beyonce has never had the same feat with her singles. And, it's not only who begins first, but who releases more. Rihanna has five studio albums compared to Beyonce's four studio albums. Bluesatellite (talk) 12:40, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

As pointed above correctly by Bluesatellite, this is not a competition list, and editors should stop comparing artists' sales. Every artist experiences a different success in each music market. Based on Rihanna's available certified albums, singles and videos sales (55 million), her 80 million claim is reasonable. And based on Beyonce's certified albums, singles and videos sales (45 million) her 75 million claim is somewhat reasonable also, it seems a bit inflated but close. As for Rihanna's source in German, it states Ihre ersten vier Alben verkauften sich weltweit über 20 Millionen Mal; die dazugehörigen Single-Auskopplungen bisher über 60 Millionen Mal (translation: her first four albums have sold 20 million worldwide; whereas the singles from the same album-releases have sold a little over 60 million). Frankly that is a bit inflated also considering that the source speaks of only the first four albums and the corresponding singles, but again it's close.--Harout72 (talk) 18:01, 25 September 2011 (UTC)