Talk:List of best-selling video games/Archive 7

Tamagotchi sold 70 million
Missing entry for Tamagotchi

Diablo II?
Any newer numbers for Diablo II? 2001 is kind of old... Numbers for the series as a whole, including boxed sets, are OK too. SharkD  Talk  04:23, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Table format (again)
I think it would be more useful to present more data than simply the game's name and the number of copies sold. For instance, presenting the data in a table would help:

It would make it a lot easier to copy the data into a spreadsheet for instance, as well as provide a better context within which to interpret the numbers. SharkD  Talk  20:36, 14 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Looks promising. The only issue I see with it is that editors would have to manually update the column numbers, and many people would either not bother or not realise it was required, so needing someone to come in and fix it. If there is a way to do it automatically that'd be much better, and it would mean we could clean up the horrible List of best-selling video game franchises article (it's 166 items long, and if you add something high up in the list, you have to manually change every following entry). Alphathon ™ (talk ) 21:00, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
 * I'll look into finding a script to determine the correct ordering based on the sales figures alone, as this should be possible like it is for dates. SharkD   Talk  02:38, 15 September 2010 (UTC)
 * The table should now sort properly by the "Copies" column without needing an "Order" column. SharkD   Talk  21:16, 15 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Is there a way to put numbers in as well? Also, I think "Million" would be better than simply "M" (you may have just used shorthand for the talk-page version, I don't know).


 * P.S. I have commented out the refs - they do not belong in the talk page.


 * Alphathon ™ (talk ) 21:34, 15 September 2010 (UTC)


 * What? SharkD   Talk  06:08, 16 September 2010 (UTC)
 * What about what? If you mean the numbers, I mean like in an ordered list, where the highest seller is no. 1 etc. For this page it doesn't really matter that much, but I was thinking more of the List of best-selling video game franchises as I mentioned before.


 * If you meant the refs thing, well if you have a ref without there being a references section to display it, they add a big red error tag at the bottom. If you add a refs section, that disrupts adding sections with the "+" button at the top (it auto-adds them below the refs section, which is awkward at best).


 * Alphathon ™ (talk ) 14:31, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I was referring to the numbers, sorry. The table was set up this way when I originally posted it. I thought you indicated in your previous post that you didn't like this feature/aspect. There's also the incidental issue of WP:OR when assigning numbers. Saying that a game is #1 or #2 or #3 is original research (or synthesis rather) unless a source can also be found which corroborates this. SharkD  Talk  16:17, 16 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Hmmm, that's a fair point about OR, which I had considered before, but not given much thought. Would you say then that the franchise list should also be un-numbered? (It would solve the auto-generating problem as well, so it may be a winner). I don't think I said anything about the numbers being bad, only that they were bad in their current form (i.e. manually generated). Alphathon ™ (talk ) 16:32, 16 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I noticed that in the franchise article, and it was the first thing that occurred to me. Plus, the auto-numbering scheme wouldn't be possible unless a) you implemented a complex template chain that might end up being even more cumbersome than the manual numbering was to begin with, or b) you were to modify the JavaScript files that come as a part of MediaWiki, which would require one to submit the scripts to Bugzilla, ask and wait for approval, and then wait for Wikipedia to actually copy the scripts over to start using them. Which, while not necessarily a bad idea, in my experience has been a big hassle due mainly to the developers at Bugzilla, as they tend to be very conservative when it comes to changes, even when they have to do little or no actual work of their own to create the changes. (See User:SharkD/Bugzilla for an example of the amount of flaming I've received from developers.) SharkD   Talk  16:39, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Anyone else want to make a comment? SharkD  Talk  01:56, 18 September 2010 (UTC)


 * I don't think the "Notes" column is necessary. Most of the information in the example fields above looks trivia-esque in a standalone list like this and is better off in the articles. For cases where it would make sense (like the individual sales numbers in Pitfall!), a footnote could be used instead. Prime Blue (talk) 14:07, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Fair point about the notes section. I don't think footnotes would work though - there are far too many games that have similar sales breakdowns, so I think having a dedicated column (called sales breakdown or something similar) in place of the notes column would be a better solution (although it'd probably be better next to the overall sales). Alphathon ™ (talk ) 14:51, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
 * That sounds good. Something else: It should be "Copies sold" rather than "Copies Sold". Prime Blue (talk) 15:11, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
 * I think the Notes section is a good repository for ad hoc notes regarding a game, especially since said notes might have bearing on the popularity of the game. For instance, in the example above, there's a note indicating that Missile Command is a port of another game for a different platform. This should indicate that more copies have/had been sold overall than just what is listed in the table. SharkD   Talk  04:21, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
 * If multi-platform games are an issue, there is nothing preventing you from having an "other platforms" column or whatever. Notes is just a little too vague, and likely to cause problems. It also seems like it would be prone to getting cluttered and confusing. If used for listing other platforms and multiple sales figures alone, that would make entries like Modern Warfare 2 rather cumbersome. Is there anything else that you think needs to be listed that would currently be in the "notes" column? <font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 12:35, 20 September 2010 (UTC)


 * BTW, WP:Trivia states that trivia sections should be avoided if possible, which while not directly applicable to this, is strongly related. Anything that is important and can be subdivided should be. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 12:45, 20 September 2010 (UTC)


 * I don't think there's enough space to replace the "Notes" column with two columns ("sales breakdown" and "other platforms"), as the table is pretty cramped already. SharkD   Talk  03:21, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Seems fine to me; what size screen are you using (resolution, not physical size)?


 * Also, the discussion above (about SSB Brawl) has got me thinking; there is actually an awful lot of OR on this page.


 * All the consoles that have their own page list the "top 10" games from that list; this is unjustified in all cases as far as I can tell (there may be one or two that actually have official top 10 lists which could be used, or in the case of some of the older consoles may have numbers from their entire catalogue published). They should probably be replaced with something along the lines of "games that have sold over X", where X varies from console to console. For example the PS2 list could be replaced by a list of games having sold over 4 million or over 5 million, as these both give approx. the current list.
 * The 20 best-selling console games, By genre, Top PC sellers by genre and Franchises also have no justification and should probably be removed. In the case of "Franchises", it should probably be linked in a see also section rather than having its own heading.


 * <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 15:07, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Here is my proposed version of the table (based on comments so far).

I have included two versions of the "sales breakdown"; one as its own column and one as a collapsible list part of the "Total copies sold" column. If the collapsible list version were used, the column would obviously be made narrower than it is now. In the "Other platforms" list, each platform would be a link to that platform's part of the page, assuming it exists and includes the relevant game (for example, the other platforms section for the 360 listing for MW2 would link to the PS3 section, but the 360 listing for Gears of War would not link to the PC section, as it is not on the PC list). Alternatively, it could link to a full-blown page of titles for that platform (e.g. List of best-selling Xbox 360 video games), the platform itself (e.g. Atari 5200) or the port for that system if it is applicable (Pac-Man for example has an Atari 2600 page as well as the Arcade page). This should probably be kept consistent so that people know where they are going to end up when they click on a link.

<font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 15:23, 27 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Edited by <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 15:51, 27 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Edited again by <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 22:38, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Looks good to me. SharkD   Talk  03:54, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
 * So shall we go ahead then? With which version? Also, I think the title should probably come before the sales number, since it is the subject of the entry (the figure is the data relating to it). I have changed the second table (the one I favour) to reflect this. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 22:38, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Would be good except hiding stuff like the other consoles violates WP:ACCESS and since that info ins't repeated elsewhere on this list it is an issue. 陣 内 Jinnai 05:28, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Fair enough. Seems it'll have to be version 1 then (non-hidden sales-breakdown) but with the Other consoles removed - it's actually not all that relevant to the list anyway and is only really included for kinda "further reading" purposes and so it can easily be seen when it is available for multiple platforms. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 05:36, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

VGChartz
With ELPSA completely screwing up it's rehash into UKIE, the number of reliable, up-to-date resources for sales info has drastically reduced for games older than 6 months. Firstly, we need a list of approved reference sources on the page. IN BIG SHINY LETTERS. Secondly, while VGChartz may not be seen as reliable, it is fair (the data is skewed for all games) - Although how unreliable they are is questionable - Lionhead stated in March that Fable II had sold 3.5M copies and has seen a small surge in sales in the lead up to the release of Fable III, making 3.8M a plausible figure. Also, most importantly it's regularly updated with current info (again reffing Fable II - it was the only site with info less than 6 months old - a quick check on a few other 'old' games showed the same trend. I suggest that this be used as a tertiary source for keeping old game data up to date (the previous Fable II source was dated 4 weeks after the EU release) with the primary source being the developer / publisher and secondary being any accredited awards sites (such as ELSPA / UKIE). If this is used for all games then it levels the playing field and establishes credibility. Angry Mustelid (talk) 18:02, 21 October 2010 (UTC)
 * This has been discussed before and will likely be discussed again. The points have been made and, to put it simply, the lack of other, better, sources does not mean we can or should use VGChartz as a source. Wikipedia is not a void that needs to be filled regardless of whether or not there is a reliable source, it is a collection of (supposedly) reliable information; as such unreliable sources such as VGChartz should not and cannot be used, regardless of what else is out there. Sure, their figures are plausible, but that does not make them suitable for an encyclopædia. You seem to be under the impression that "newer & probably false, but within reason" is better than "facts which are demonstrably true for a specific date".


 * If people want to see "plausible" listings then they are free to go to VGChartz, but that is not the purpose of Wikipedia. If it were, any old person could come along and add figures unchallenged, as long as they were within the realm of reason. For example lets say the figure for Halo 3 is changed to 12 million. We know that it sold 8.1 million by Jan 2008, so it seems fair that they might have sold another 4 million since. Is this a plausible figure? I would say so based on what I know of Halo 3. Is this encyclopædic content? No, because it does not come from a reliable source and is essentially a guess, which is what VGChartz essentially have (check their methodology page - some of the methods are questionable at best, and every figure is only guaranteed to be based on one of them if memory serves… it may be two, I can't remember).


 * <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 18:39, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Accepted sources section
While this is an important note to editors, putting it within the article is inappropriate (the article is not about editing standards). If it is decided that such a section should be included it should be added to the edit notice. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 17:10, 22 October 2010 (UTC)
 * As long as there is some notification of (un&)acceptable sites. (It'll save you a lot of work, and give editors a reference for sources). It's hard to know, sometimes, what is acceptable and what is not and even more difficult to find the most up-to date ref. Angry Mustelid (talk) 17:21, 22 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Well it already says that VGChartz is unreliable and cannot be used. Other unreliable sources can be added if consensus is found. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 18:25, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Needs cleaning up and updating
This article is horribly formatted and contains out of date and possibly inaccurate information. In looking at some of the PS3 sales data, some of the numbers were from 2009. More recent best selling games, such as Red Dead Redemption, are no where to be found. I'm not really for sure of the usefulness of such an article if it is so massive and out of date. Maybe, as it was mentioned in a few of the sections, some of the newer consoles should get their own dedicated page, while the older consoles stay in the larger article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.16.22.139 (talk)


 * There's not really much we can do about out-of-date figures. Figures are added as and when they are found by anyone who cares, but publishers often do not release figures unless the sales are really strong, and even then those are usually multi-platform (so unusable). If you can find more up-to-date figures for the PS3 games you mentioned from a reliable source (VGChartz and many other, similar, sites are not considered reliable due to their methods) then feel free to chip in.


 * As for the formatting, this has been discussed already (further up in the talk section). I am currently working through the page to convert it to the format in the discussion on my user space and will update this page when I'm finished.


 * As for consoles having their own pages, many of them already do. This is essentially an overview article, so needs to give a brief summary of the main page linked, which is why the top-10 360 games (for example) are listed here despite there being a much longer list on the main page.


 * <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 15:58, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

Nintendo fanboy vandalism...
There is NO WAY nintendo dominates sales of non-bundled games!!! Some fanboy has done vandalism, because 18 of the top 20 of all time are listed as Nintendo games. Someone, please fix this, because the PS2 is the one who is not being adequetly represented, because some fanboy won't stop vandalizing this page.--76.206.21.106 (talk) 02:51, 1 December 2010 (UTC)


 * No, and for two reasons. First is that in order to put a game on the list, you need a citation that says how many it sold (and that number must be higher than those already there). Normally I'd say if you could provide said citation you should go ahead, but in this case it is still no because it is pointless. The list itself is going to be removed soon anyway along with a reformat of the page - see above for more info on why. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 03:12, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
 * YOU must be a fanboy, by saying it's from a source- IT'S FROM NINTENDO, that's NOT reliable, as they can make up numbers on their own!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.206.21.106 (talk) 05:43, 1 December 2010 (UTC)


 * You seem to be implying that Nintendo has made up the figures to make themselves look better. If this is the case then Nintendo have broken the law by artificially increasing stock prices etc. Unless you have some proof of that, such an assertion is unfounded.


 * On a side note my gaming platform of choice is, and always has been, PC, but I do not consider myself a fanboy of anything, since I am not irrationally biassed towards it or against anything (as far as I am aware). The only Nintendo console I've ever owned is a GameCube which I bought of eBay for £12 (≈US$18). In terms of favourites, Nintendo is fairly close to the bottom.


 * So, unless you have some evidence that Nintendo lied, please take it elsewhere. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 12:36, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

MGS4 - top selling PS3 exclusive
Metal Gear Solid 4 should be listed as the top selling PS3 exclusive game. As of August 2009 it has sold 5 milliong copies. The source is taken from the MGS4 Wikipedia page:  http://www.konami.co.jp/en/ir/ir-data/meeting/2010/0204.pdf?ref=ir-e_top

Please update. 204.17.31.126 (talk) 18:41, 16 November 2010 (UTC)


 * That does not say that MGS4 has sold 5 million copies, it says that the Metal Gear Series sold 5.15 million. This includes other titles like Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops as well as MGS4. It is the MGS4 page that is wrong (and has now been corrected), not this one. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 18:57, 16 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Are you insane. The entire Metal Gear Series has sold 20 million plus. Metal Gear Solid 4 has sold 5.02 million worldwide.


 * http://gamrreview.vgchartz.com/sales/6970/metal-gear-solid-4-guns-of-the-patriots/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.151.159.110 (talk) 13:16, 15 December 2010 (UTC)


 * First, VG Chartz isn't considered a reliable source (for example, they claim the PS2 has sold 138.75 million (link), while we know for a fact that it passed 140 million in September 2009 (link) and has since risen to 147.6 million (link)). Second, I did not say that the total franchise sales are 5 million, but that the total franchise sales for that financial period (1st April → 31st December 2009) are 5 million - there is a big difference.


 * Since VG Chartz cannot be relied upon for accurate figures, and we have no data from anyone else to indicate it, we cannot assume it has sold 5 million. The only reliable source we have that is specific to MGS4 (rather than the Metal Gear franchise) states that MGS4 shipped 3 million in FY2009 Q1 (link).


 * As such, we can only reliably say that MGS4 has shipped 3 million as of July 2009 (the Japanese financial year starts in April, so Q1 is April→July), and the Metal Gear franchise sold 5 million from April-December 2009. It is unfortunate that the figure isn't more specific or up-to-date, but unless there is proof of a different figure, that's all we have.


 * If you know of any updated info (perhaps Konami financial reports from after Dec '09 or a press release from Konami on the total sold), then by all means bring it here so we can update the number.


 * <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 13:57, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Splitting
Maybe it's easier to split the article into multiple articles, and sort the best sold games per generation of consoles, or per manufacturer. Maybe the lists could also be replaced by tables, that's easier to read. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.30.142.185 (talk) 21:51, 15 December 2010 (UTC)


 * It is already going to be split up into tables (see Talk:List of best-selling video games/Archive 7). It is a fairly long process to do it but it's coming. I don't know about splitting it into multiple articles though - most of the consoles have their own list page already, and splitting into manufacturer or generation would loose some of the overview quality that this article has (you can easily compare, for example, the figures for the best-selling SNES and Xbox 360 games, giving an overview on the evolution of the industry). <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 02:38, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

What about non-PC computer games?
I see that this is a list of best-selling CONSOLE games - with a small "PC" section at the end.

Is there a list anywhere on Wikipedia which includes best-selling computer games - not just for the PC? For example the Amiga, Atari ST, Commodore 64, ZX Spectrum... etc. 78.105.6.33 (talk) 15:30, 3 December 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm also missing these, surely there must be a lot of these games sold as well, and they would be historically very interesting to see 85.113.160.175 (talk) 21:49, 28 December 2010 (UTC)


 * I think those should technically be included on that list - they are Personal Computers after all. If Mac games are counted I don't see why those wouldn't be as well. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 21:53, 28 December 2010 (UTC)

Update of Final Fantasy XIII's Sales
I can't seem to edit but this is the website with an update on Final Fantasy XIII's sales: http://attackofthefanboy.com/news/final-fantasy-xiii-failed-japan-346/ It sold 6 million copies worldwide, with 4.5 million copies on the PlayStation 3 and evidently 1.5 million copies on the Xbox 360. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.96.15.125 (talk) 07:26, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

GtaIV?
In the Wikipedia article on GTAIV, it is stated that "As of 9 June 2010, the game had sold over 17 million copies" (source: ). Why has it not been entered in the top 20 list?Ma Zhenguo (talk) 15:05, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

what about duck hunt?
I was reading the part where SMB got 40.2~ million units sold, are these including the release with Smb/DuckHunt (and the latter release with a third game)? if that's the case then Duck Hunt deserves to be there. Or at least an explanation of what's included in the totasl units. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.129.121.36 (talk) 01:18, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

Ape Escape
Can someone add these sales to the page, and pages? They come straight from the twitter of the official site of the series. They are also present on Ape Club website (members area), and on the official franchise's development page (available to people who are part of the production team in Japan. Everyone else get's re-directed). Thank You. --Apeaboutsims (talk) 04:22, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Will get on to it.--Morgan3136 (talk) 05:04, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Added it to the appropriate pages, as well as the "Ape Escape" pages. I do not know however, how to class Ape Escape because, the PlayStation list doesn't seem to include PSN downloads (it's a PSone game but not for PSone), so I don't know how to class that one, unless someone can tell me. The same goes for adding it tho the "Top 20" overall chart, just because of the same reason. Sony seem to list it as sales for the one game, however I do not know if the same applies here. If you can help with this, please respond! --Morgan3136 (talk) 07:42, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Removed Ape Escape games because those figures can be proven as inaccurate. The Million Monkeys game was only released in Japan, yet sold 27 million copies? As if that weren't fishy enough, wikipedia uses a source that list the PS2 as having sold about 21 million units in Japan, so it's impossible that Million Monkeys could have sold 5 million more than the system it's available on . Besides that Pokemon Red and Blue have long been confirmed to be Japan's best selling game of all time, with like 10 million copies sold. So again, this contradicts with that fact. And lastly, twitter is not reliable wikipedia source as far as I know. Roller Co-star (talk) 08:14, 22 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry, feel I should interrupt here, as I noticed a few problems. Your first point, it was sold in Asia, not just Japan. Second, most PS3 consoles at the time could play PS3 games, so that becomes irrelevant. Your third point, is now irrelevant. Finally, twiiter IS a reliable source, if the person tweeting is FROM a reliable source. We use twitter in many major articles, (eg. Britney Spears). ApeClub use a flash site as their main site, but you cannot post a text document on a flash site, so they must use Yola, as a host. If it comes from the official twitter, it's official. --Jackex56 (talk) 08:27, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

What about Minecraft?
Minecraft just broke 1 million according to minecraft.net? How should this be categorized?

Perhaps an "Indie developer" section? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.186.253.75 (talk) 23:09, 13 January 2011 (UTC)


 * It's already on the PC list (List of best-selling PC video games). There are loads of games that are over 1 million, which is why each platform has its own page. I don't think there's much reason to add an arbitrary "indie" section when everything else is categorised by platform. <font face="century gothic"><font color="#500">Alphathon ™ (<font color="#500">talk ) 23:21, 13 January 2011 (UTC)


 * If you had an Indie category, where would it stop... think Worms and the retro sales that got.Angry Mustelid (talk) 02:42, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Hexic HD
Every Xbox 360 sold with a HD also included a copy of Hexic HD... I know that Xbox Live Arcade statistics aren't represented here, but shouldn't those Hexic HD copies be included in the "Pack-Ins" section near the bottom? I can't find a good reference on the number of sales, but this page includes a comment placing it at about 20 million copies.

Blakeyrat (talk) 19:19, 26 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Seems like a valid addition to me, but we'd need a decent source for it (which that link isn't). If you can find a reliable source I'd say go right ahead. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.ðɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 19:36, 26 February 2011 (UTC)

Who deleted the top 20 list???
Why did someone unilaterally delete the top 20 console games list and the top games by genre list? I see no discussion occurring on the discussion page, just Bam! it's gone. What is that about? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.91.70.120 (talk) 14:51, 2 February 2011 (UTC)


 * That was me, and they were deleted because they were unambiguously synthesis; that is, the fact that the positions given were not backed up by a ref but instead derived from what info we have (which is incomplete and out of date at best). As such, to draw the conclusion that a game is the #1 seller of all time for example (generally or by genre, platform etc) is unfounded. It would only be allowed if we had perfect, up-to-date info on every game ever released (and we could demonstrate that it was the case). This actually has been discussed already, but nothing was ever done about it (it should be in the archive somewhere, as part of a discussion about a format change… I think it was called "Table format (again)"). The lists were originally going to be removed along with the change in format, but since it was taking so long to get the re-format done, I thought it best to just go ahead and do it.


 * Even if we had a source which placed them in order, it would have to have a disclaimer saying when the list was accurate (something like "the top 20 as of X/X/X"). EDIT: …and would be complicated by the fact that if something were to overtake something on the list, we would know the list to be out of date but wouldn't be able to correct it.


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.ðɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:47, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
 *  Edited by <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.ðɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:54, 2 February 2011 (UTC) 


 * Well, I didn't really see any discussion about deleting that, but since it seems like you're the only one doing any editing on this page, I can't really say anything about it. It's just somewhat lame, since that seems to have been the entire point of the article in the first place. 198.91.70.120 (talk) 23:23, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I suppose the same thing should be done to the franchise and console articles, right? 198.91.70.120 (talk) 23:26, 3 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Yeah, it'd be cool if there were some way to include it within the guidelines, but I don't really see how (unless Eurogamer* or someone similar does a story about the top X games, and as I said that would still have issues). As for me being "the only one doing any editing", yeah, I'm more active than most, but plenty of others contribute. The thing is I don't think most people do unless they have an agenda (i.e. they want people to know that their favourite game has sold loads, so add it to the list). That is not to say that most do it in bad faith or anything; perhaps agenda is the wrong word (motivation perhaps?).


 * *I only chose them as the example because they seem to be a lot more "fact and figure" based than most other sites, and from what they have said on their podcast, they have access to the required data, just don't publish it.


 * "[It] seems to have been the entire point of the article in the first place." Now you mention it, I'm not quite sure the article as it is serves much purpose other than to hold the smaller consoles' lists and link to the other ones. Perhaps a re-think beyond a table format is in order, like a complete overhaul (possibly involving other pages as well).


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.ðɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 23:43, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

What happened to the By Genre section???
???? LordXVMon (talk) 08:40, 6 February 2011 (UTC)


 * ↑↑ See section above ↑↑ <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.ðɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:07, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

Black ops is number 1
This list is very inaccurate, black ops has sold more then any other game, although it doesn't appear on the wii or the pc list

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/gaming/news/a308600/black-ops-named-all-time-bestseller.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.217.7.156 (talk) 07:54, 13 March 2011 (UTC)


 * That's because we don't have Wii or PC figures; if you can provide some we'll be sure to add them though. Also, the fact that it is the best selling game of all time across all platforms does not mean it has beaten any other games in a single platform (it is for example possible that it didn't sell any units on Wii, although it is unlikely). I have no doubt that it has sold at least 1 million on PC, but unless it can be confirmed it cannot be added. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.ðɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:47, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Exactly that article only provides the sales in North America but doesn't provide a source. Those numbers are also no where close to the 40 million of Super Mario Bros. let alone the 75 million of Wii Sports. IRMacGuyver (talk) 00:18, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

Table format (follow-up)
This is a follow up to Talk:List of best-selling video games/Archive 7. Since that discussion concluded I have slowly been working on converting this page to the table format. However, it takes so long to do that I never got very far. Today I had an idea though: why not convert the individual lists to the new format first then update this page based on them? I tried it out today, and have just finished converting List of best-selling Xbox 360 video games, which I will be submitting shortly. It didn't take very long (since on smaller lists like that it was far easier to automate) and was pretty trouble-free. My main reason for posting this is to ask - should we update the page as we go along or once all the other pages are converted? Also, it's another chance for anyone to voice objections/concerns. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.ðɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 18:44, 16 February 2011 (UTC)


 * UPDATE


 * Here is a list of pages completed so far, which I'll update as I progress (if anyone else wants to do any, feel free to add them as well, just remember to sign any you do). <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 20:13, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

List

 * List of best-selling Xbox 360 video games <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 20:13, 26 April 2011 (UTC)
 * List of best-selling PlayStation 2 video games <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 20:13, 26 April 2011 (UTC)
 * List of best-selling Nintendo 3DS video games <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 20:13, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

World of Warcraft
SUBSCRIBERS should be changed to SUBSCRIPTIONS. We know how many subscriptions there, not how many subscribers, because many subscriptions are owned by the same persons. --Nounobject (talk) 14:13, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
 * We don't know how many subscriptions there are - the source (a Blizzard press release) states "the subscriber base for World of Warcraft… now exceeds 12 million players worldwide" - this suggests to me that they are actually talking about the number of users (if two accounts are under the same name etc, Blizzard would know about it), not active subscriptions. It may well be true that they are actually referring to the number of subscriptions, but that isn't what is said, so to change it would technically be original research/speculation. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.ðɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 14:45, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

how much has uncharted 2 sold?
the list says 3.8 million and the uncharted 2 article says 4.3 million, im confused —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.217.7.156 (talk) 18:37, 25 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Follow the source links and see - that's why they're there. I've had a look myself and it looks like someone changed the figure on the Uncharted 2 page without providing a source, so 3.8 million is all we have a reliable source for (both pages use the same source, which says 3.8 million). <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 19:01, 25 April 2011 (UTC)
 * BTW, I've changed the UC2 article to say 3.8 million again, since that's all we can say with any certainty. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 19:03, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

Battlefield Bad Company 2
Battlefield Bad Company 2 has 2.26 million sales?

http://gamrreview.vgchartz.com/sales/31438/battlefield-bad-company-2/

ie. should it be in the ps3 list?


 * VG Chartz is not considered to be a reliable source, so no. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 23:16, 1 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Fair enough. Here's a different source. It should be added to the list.


 * "According to EA's internal figures, however, that hasn't been a problem; they're reporting over 2.3 million copies of Bad Company 2 sold in the roughly two weeks since the game launched." http://www.1up.com/news/battlefield-bad-company-2-sales — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.238.120.23 (talk) 13:03, 8 June 2011 (UTC)


 * That doesn't say that it is referring to PS3 only, so we have to assume those are cross platform figures (PS3, 360 + PC). As such, again, that isn't really suitable for the PS3 list. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 21:32, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

"Downloads" is not sales
Since this article is about games that have "sold or shipped at least…", free downloads which constitute the majority of the Angry Birds numbers should not be considered. The last figure we got for paid downloads was 12 million.

http://www.macstories.net/news/angry-birds-12-million-copies-sold-most-on-ios/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.209.237.86 (talk) 19:43, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I think this is a quite valid point. Having a list of top-selling downloads for mobile platforms and the like makes perfect sense because that is a valid metric, but we should not equate them with sales through association. Indrian (talk) 19:46, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
 * So are sales through Steam and other download services not valid for PC numbers? 92.24.105.168 (talk) 01:57, 19 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Sales most certainly are; the point that is being made is that "download" ≠ "sale". If a source says, for example, "3 million people have downloaded game X", we cannot necessarily tell whether or not 3 million people have bought it - some of those downloads may have been from free promotions or similar - it depends on the context.


 * On the idea of a "games downloaded" list, it seems like a good idea, although there are some potential problems, such as potential redundancy with the sales list. Nothing insurmountable though as far as I can tell.


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 02:11, 19 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Anonymous user here, agreeing with this point. Angry Birds is available for free in many cases and thus does not constitute a sale. I, for one, have downloaded it for free, but am not so invested in it that I would pay even a single dollar for it. "Sold" vs. "downloaded for free" are two very different ideas. --69.172.158.189 (talk) 02:05, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

'''I have edited the mobile section to reflect the latest SALES figures for both angry birds and fruit ninja. The article is list of Best-Selling, not most downloaded, therefore any free versions should not be added to the total.''' Sphonix (talk) 13:25, 1 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I have reinstated the download figures, since we currently don't have anywhere else to put them. They may or may not correspond to sales (especially in the case of Angry Birds, where the actual headline of the source is Angry Birds' sequel announced after selling 250m, while it says in the article Angry Birds has been downloaded 250 million times worldwide, it has been revealed) and the sales figures are almost certainly not up to date. Also, listing both (at least until there's a downloaded article) is much more likely to prevent well meaning editors from "updating" the sales figures based on an announced number of downloads. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon ' /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:21, 1 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I agree this is probably a good compromise for now. 14.202.96.139 (talk) 15:46, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Pauley123, 17 June 2011
Angry Birds has now been downloaded 250 million times. The article says 140 million, substantially out of date.

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/gaming/news/a325295/angry-birds-sequel-announced-after-selling-250m.html

Pauley123 (talk) 21:17, 17 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes check.svg Y Done <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 03:29, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from 117.198.76.229, 2 July 2011
Please change "Half-Life 2 (6.5 million,[21][22] may include Xbox version but does not include Steam sales)" to Half-Life 2 (12 million,[21][22] may include Xbox version but does not include Steam sales) because 6.5 million is outdated information.

According to Forbes, Half Life 2 sold more than 12 million copies as of February 9,2011. Please note this and make changes accordingly. thank you..

117.198.76.229 (talk) 14:47, 2 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Link? -- Eraserhead1 &lt;talk&gt; 15:03, 2 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I believe they are talking about this: http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2011/0228/technology-gabe-newell-videogames-valve-online-mayhem.html


 * I'm really not sure. We certainly can't say "Half-Life 2 (12 million, may include Xbox version but does not include Steam sales)", since a) we don't know whether it includes steam sales - the source doesn't say and b) at that point (February 2011) it was available on various other platforms as well as PC and Xbox (PS3, Xbox 360 and Mac OSX). It is currently already listed on List of best-selling PC video games as "Half-Life 2 (12 million; may include sales on other platforms)", which would be a much better way of putting it, but I'm really not sure it should be listed (on either page) with such a high probability that it includes Xbox, Xbox 360, PS3 and Mac OSX sales, and the fact that it probably includes PC Orange Box sales (which were largely bought to get HL2 Ep2, Portal and TF2, rather then HL2 and HL2 Ep1).


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:26, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

List by money made/how fast they sold?
Could somone add a list showing the actually money made from it, not the units? Perhaps a list of the fastest sellings ones too? Jabberwock xeno (talk) 18:56, 4 July 2011 (UTC)
 * If you can find sufficient data on this then go right ahead, but unless someone is the fastest selling, they don't usually release such data. Also, what determines "fastest" (fastest to 1 million units, fastest to 5 million, most sold in the 1st week, fastest to $X etc)? Total revenue wouldn't be quite as hard, but would still be fairly difficult to source (especially since it isn't always obvious whether data is referring to net or gross). <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 19:13, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

Nintendo Selects/Player's Choice
It seems that Games re-released with this Label (expect GameCube) sold all over a million. I am not quite sure how to verify that Information, or how to give a reference for the games. (Pictures wont work I guess?) Nebelmond (talk) 09:35, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

That's because the qualifier for being Player's Choice involved selling in excess of a million. 71.170.69.189 (talk)C-Train71.170.69.189 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 22:22, 1 September 2011 (UTC).

Pokemon Gold/Silver sales need updating
As it turns out, Pokemon Gold and Silver sold 23 million units worldwide (the proper citation can be found on the games' page on Wikipedia). The list should be updated to reflect that. From what I understand, this makes Pokemon Gold and Silver the highest selling Gameboy games barring Tetris. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.173.2.136 (talk) 15:08, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Y Done <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:56, 6 August 2011 (UTC)

Free Games?
How can you tell which "free" game is most popular. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.159.2.59 (talk) 12:05, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
 * From this, you cannot, but it seems it is rather a vague question. How do you define popular? Total number of users at it's peak? Total number users throughout the game's history? Total hours played? Even once you have a definition, how do you track it? I don't think anyone can really make such a comparison because what constitutes a free game is so broad. If you narrowed the field to, say, free smartphone games, you could use number of downloads as a basic indicator, although that would tend to over-report due to people re-downloading them or doing so on multiple devices. When talking about games in general though, there really is no way to compare, say, flash games, with free-to-play MMOs for example. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æl.f'æ.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 14:22, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

Call of Duty: Black Ops on Playstation 3
The list over xbox 360 games got Black Ops, but why isn't that game on the PS3 list? Its the be the best selling game of all times to this generation of consoles so I'm pretty sure its supposed to be there. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Haavve (talk • contribs) 02:36, 17 September 2011 (UTC)
 * Look again, it's 6th from the top. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 04:49, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

Wii Sports shouldnt be in the wii category
This line

Wii Sports (76.76 million)[70]

shouldn't be in the Wii category because it's already in the Bundled games:

Wii Sports (Wii – 76.76 million,[70] packaged with system in all regions except Japan)


 * It still meets the criteria for the list of games being either shipped or sold. By that logic any games with a bundle pack would have to be removed and or marked to indicate such. Also, it would be very hard because a lot of companies have used bundle packs to increase sales. Look at Super Mario Bros. 173.35.94.75 (talk) 15:18, 7 November 2011 (UTC)

Edit request for XBOX360 games all time best sellers, 2 October 2011
Call of Duty Black Ops, under the best sellers for XBOX360, it has 12 million listed as sold. However, the estimated total sell for the game for all consoles is 13 million, and the XBOX360 is supposed to make up 65%-70% of this total. That value should be appropriately changed to 8 million, as 12 is by far an over estimate (even an estimate in the link used as a source for that number). This new link shows the most recent total sell for black ops on all consoles: http://www.shacknews.com/article/67788/february-npd-black-ops-marvel This link supports it: http://www.mw3-forum.com/call-of-duty-modern-warfare-3/modern-warfare-3-could-break-black-ops-sales-records In the second link, a man from wedbush securities estimates that over 20 million copies have sold. However, the money that he sees that adds to that total (giving him the 20 million copies estimate) is all from the downloadable content, which has earned enough to appear as another several million copies of the game. Please review this and make any appropriate changes.

Kfactor1119 (talk) 17:03, 2 October 2011 (UTC)


 * The links you posted refer only to US sales, not global sales. Quote: "…at 13.7 million units in the U.S. alone…" and "Officially Black Ops has sold 13.7 million copies in the United States…". This list is not US-specific, but rather a list of worldwide sales. Also, even if it weren't US-specific, to use your figure would constitute original research (or more specifically, synthesis) as you are deriving the figure from other figures, rather than it being quoted directly in the source.


 * [[Image:X mark.svg|18px|link=|alt=]] N Not done <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 17:21, 2 October 2011 (UTC)

Minecraft to be listed in pc games?
Minecraft sold over 4 million copies and most probably will pass the 5 million mark easily. This should be added to the list at least... Source for sales: http://www.minecraft.net/stats — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.191.136.194 (talk) 12:04, 8 November 2011 (UTC)


 * It's already listed on List of best-selling PC video games, and hasn't sold enough copies to make its way onto this list. If we added Minecraft we'd also have to add Riven, The Sims 3, StarCraft II: Wings of Liberty, Battlefield 1942, Counter-Strike, Cossacks: European Wars, Diablo II, Populous, Where in the World Is Carmen Sandiego?, RollerCoaster Tycoon and Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of War; as they have all sod more than 4 million as well. The reason why its 5 million+ is simply to keepo the list short, as it is a cut down version of the List of best-selling PC video games list. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 14:32, 8 November 2011 (UTC)

Add Skyrim to PC, November 16 2011
Elder Scroll 4: Skyrim has currently sold over 7 million copies, placing it within the bounds of the PC list. — Preceding unsigned comment added by AndrasKrigare (talk • contribs) 21:50, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Can you provide a source? I assume you are referring to this, in which case: no - that covers all copies sold on PC, PS3 and 360, not just on PC. (P.S. It is  The Elder Scroll s V (i.e. 5)) <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 22:38, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

All platform list
There should be an all time list where the numbers across all platforms are in one list, instead of just individual platforms. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cruiseshipfan (talk • contribs) 09:53, 18 November 2011 (UTC)


 * I've been thinking the same thing for a while now. I can't see any reason not to do it, and it would certainly alleviate the issue of people adding multi-plat. numbers to specific lists (say 360 or PS3) somewhat. It would also mean we could do comparative breakdowns a lot more easily. I only really have one issue; the list would be massive. Of course we don't have to use 1 million as the base number (perhaps 5 or 10 million would be more appropriate), which would make the list significantly shorter.


 * If a game is listed then the breakdown column can contain the PS3/360/Windows/whatever figures, allowing users to quickly compare how it performed on various systems, as well as allowing combined figures to be found easily when they aren't published in that form. In this instance perhaps it may need to be split between regional breakdown and platform breakdown to avoid crossover. This assumes of course that the table format would be used - see Talk:List of best-selling video games/Archive 7 and Talk:List of best-selling video games/Archive 7 for more info, and List of best-selling Xbox 360 video games for an example of how it's currently used.


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 18:08, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Sonic the hedgehog
The game sold 4.3 millions not 15, according to gamrReview.com. AndreaFox (talk) 19:34, 26 November 2011 (UTC)


 * gamrReview is part of VG Chartz, which is not a reliable source. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 21:57, 26 November 2011 (UTC)


 * I remind you that the only source provided for the "15 millions" statement is from youtube and is therefore unreliable. I don't get why you say this isn't a reliable source. It is a professional site. However I invite you to check on the web: there is no source for "sonic the hedgehog" (1) and "15 millions". Yet there are for the "4 millions/4.3 millons": for example here, http://www.associatedcontent .com/article/649099/top_nine_highest_selling_sega_genesis_pg2.html?cat=19 and here. I invite you to correct this error. This seems to be a common error on en.wiki as it is reported even here yet the source which is cited there doesn't support the "15 millions" statement (so it is a vandalism). I cleary remember reading on en.wiki on this very page till few months ago the "4 millions" statement (look here), so I suppose the "15 millions" is simply vandalism. Indeed it is common knowledge that Sonic 2 was the best-selling game in the series and of megadrive (and it sold 6 millions: if youtube count as a source see here. See this too: http://www.ehow .com/list_6223749_list-sega-genesis-games.html. And these too:, http://www.associatedcontent  .com/article/649099/top_nine_highest_selling_sega_genesis_pg2.html?cat=19). AndreaFox (talk) 13:25, 27 November 2011 (UTC)


 * VG Chartz (and by extension, gamrReview) is not considered a reliable source. Consensus has been found that their figures are little better than educated guesses, that their methods are fairly tenuous and that their figures often do not agree with those from reliable sources. It is specifically listed on the Wikiproject video games list of unreliable sources for those reasons. All the other sources you have provided (a wikia page, associatedcontent, listal, and eHow) are community based (that is, like wikipedia, they are edited by members) and we have no reason to believe that they are reliable. While it could also be said to be true of the current source, YouTube is simply the host; the actual source is GameTap, on whose channel the video was posted. The actual 15 million figure comes from Shinobu Toyoda, Sega's Executive VP. If you dispute that this is GameTap's official channel then that is another issue.


 * One thing to bear in mind is that the 15 million figure s for copies sold bundled with consoles, so it is certainly possible that the 4(.3) million figure is for un-bundled copies.


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:29, 27 November 2011 (UTC)


 * Incidentally, when I tried to save the page it threw up an error that associatecontent and eHow are actually blocked by Wikipedia's anti-spam filters, so couldn't be used anyway (and is a red flag for reliability). I assume that's why you put spaces in the links (so you could actually post them). <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:32, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
 * As has been pointed out, the 15 million figure comes from an actual Sega personality associated with the company at the time Sonic was released and therefore has great indicia of reliability. Also, if you think about it logically, the Genesis sold over 20 million units in the United States alone, where it came bundled with Sonic the Hedgehog during the period it was enjoying its best sales, so the four million figure makes no sense whatsoever. Indrian (talk) 23:40, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
 * I admit you were right. I didn't understand the first time i watched the video that the one who reported the 15 millions statement was a Sega personality. AndreaFox (talk) 20:50, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Could the 15 million number also be pretty high because it may be taking into account all the various ports and re-releases over the years as well? I thought that Sonic 2 had actually been the best-selling game at like 6+million for the Genesis...(I've been working on overhauling Sonic articles, so it would be helpful to know...) Sergecross73   msg me   14:26, 30 November 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't think so - he specifically said that they bundled 15 million copies with Mega Drive systems. As I said, to me it seems far more likely that the fact that Sonic 2 was the best selling meant it sold the most at retail (which wouldn't include bundled copies). <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:49, 30 November 2011 (UTC)


 * Of course that doesn't mean it excludes systems bundled with those 6-1 carts (like this one http://www.enochsemporium.co.uk/images/Sega-Mega-Drive-II.jpg). <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:55, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Fair enough, I hadn't checked the actual video. I suppose it makes sense then, bundled games do seem to have skyrocketed sales... Sergecross73   msg me   16:36, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

Figures not accurate or updated.
Basically. NPD does not like releasing exact software sales numbers and this article is very misleading as a result.

One example is the game: Halo:Reach. According to the article, the game sold 3.3 million units, while in fact, this is only North American sales in 2 weeks. Halo Reach has in fact sold a lot more, and according to VGChartz, it has sold 8 million. (Other figures in the article were accurate, believable source). All though we can't confirm these figures and therefore not have the ability to write them, there should be a side note visible to all readers that these figures may not be accurate or updated.

That is all for now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2401NMNM (talk • contribs) 06:58, 12 December 2011 (UTC)


 * VG Chartz isn't a reliable source, but yes, many (if not all) games listed here are not up to date. I'm not really sure whay you're proposing. All data on Wikipedia is subject to being out of date - that is why (or at least part of the reason why) the sources are dated. Any figures that are region specific should also be specified as such, although it's certainly possible that some aren't due to editors not being aware of this, or forgetting. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 08:13, 13 December 2011 (UTC)

PS3: Gran Turismo 5 7,3 Mio. as of 9/2011, Source: http://www.polyphony.co.jp/english/list.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.251.94.156 (talk) 19:06, 17 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes check.svg Y Done <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 19:13, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

Wii Sports sales report
i would just like to say that it is not correct to say that Wii Sports is the Wii's best selling game. When the System was released, Wii Sports was a bonus game that was released with every system sold. I believe that the numbers for that game are inaccurate. In conclusion, i personally do not believe that Wii Sports should be counted as a game itself. If I am mistaken, I do apologize. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.201.249.114 (talk) 07:28, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

Halo 3, misread source
I don't think this source is saying that Halo 3 sold 14.5 million copies - I think it is talking about the Halo series up to that point. This makes sense, as the Xbox versions of Halo and Halo 2 have sold 5 and 8 million copies respectively, according to this wikipedia article. That means there is only another 1.5 million to account for (from rounding, more recent numbers for the two games, or PC versions of the games). Does anybody know another source for copies of Halo 3 sold? Chris3145 (talk) 18:37, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Good catch; someone clearly misread the source. I will do what I can to fix this. Indrian (talk) 23:50, 3 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the fix. The 8.1 million is clearly low (the number is 3 years old), but it may be the best source we have. Chris3145 (talk) 18:42, 21 January 2012 (UTC)

Halo 3 is the Xbox 360 top 1 selling game
Reference: http://halo.xbox.com/en-us/games/halo3/Overview --ODST 02:22, 18 January 2012 (UTC) and it doesn't refer to the Halo series, it refers to Halo 3 itself — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pikachu896 (talk • contribs) 02:24, 18 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Common sense, grammar, and the sources all disagree with your position. Let's start by reading the source closely. For ease of reference, here is the offending sentence:


 * "Halo 3 is the concluding chapter in the Halo trilogy—an international award-winning action series that grew into a global entertainment phenomenon, selling more than 14.5 million games worldwide, logging more than 650 million hours of multiplayer action on Xbox LIVE."


 * Notice the use of a dash above. Everything after the dash is an aside that is separate from the first part of the sentence since there is not a second dash to indicate this interjection has come to an end.  That leaves us with the following complete thought:


 * "an international award-winning action series that grew into a global entertainment phenomenon, selling more than 14.5 million games worldwide, logging more than 650 million hours of multiplayer action on Xbox LIVE."


 * So the clause "selling 14.5 million games worldwide" is further developing the preceding clause, "an international award-winning action series that grew into a global entertainment phenomenon." That's just how the English language works.


 * Also, check out http://on-screen.blogspot.com/2007_02_01_archive.html, a blog post from February 2007, which has the exact same language. The language on the Halo 3 web page is clearly from a press release issued sometime before Halo 3 was even released, perhaps even from the original press release announcing the game.  Indrian (talk) 06:30, 19 January 2012 (UTC)

Sonic
The source for Sonic's 15 million says that it was included as a pack in for 15 million consoles and that there were sales approaching 1 million before the pack in. One would expect that some people who bought the console before the pack-in got sonic, and that others bought it after the pack in stopped. Furthermore, I have seen sources that say Sonic sold 4 million stand-alones. So shouldn't the number be 19 million?LedRush (talk) 01:41, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Sure, if we have a source that specifically states Sonic sold 4 million as a non-bundled or standalone product that would make sense, as the video specifically refers to bundled copies. Indrian (talk) 03:48, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

Section title
Secion 2 of the article is titles "PC". Really, this shoudl be "Computer", since technically a Mac is not a PC. Also, renaming it Computer would allow for subsections (with manufacturers), like for consoles. Spectrum, Amige, etc, could then be added, and PC/Mac/Linux cold be the subsection for what we have now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.211.125.130 (talk) 21:13, 30 January 2012 (UTC)
 * In theory, what you are saying makes sense. In practice, unfortunately it just does not work.  This is because there are a lack of reliable sources that break down computer games sales by platform.  Since most games were ported to 3-5 systems in earlier times before the PC dominated everything, this makes it impossible to parse sales between platforms accurately.  For example, we know Populous sold 4 million, but we do not know how many of those were on Amiga and how many on PC (not to mention it probably includes SNES and Genesis sales, which is a problem we just ignore).  We also do not have figures for the split of Myst sales between Macintosh and PC.  This problem repeats across virtually all games, with few exceptions. Indrian (talk) 21:23, 30 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Well, this means that we have a great many games that have sold five million copies+, which are completely ignored by this list. As such, this does not represent a worldwide view (ie it's heavily US-biased).
 * As for data, we do have a lot of it. Two major retrogaming magazines are published by top-tier publishers in the UK every month, and they have numbers, interviews, etc.
 * Maybe we don't even need to have the data of the platform split to start with. After all, we have a Mobile phone section (Tetris, Angry Birds, etc), and yet these are grouped together, rather than being categorised as Symbian, iPhone, Android, etc. How about we just have a section 8-bit computers and 16-bit computers?
 * This list has a threshold of one million copies for inclusion. There were no Spectrum or Amstrad or BBC Micro or British-made C64 games selling five million plus units in Great Britain in the 1980s; those games were selling in the hundreds of thousands with just a very few exceptions like The Hobbit and Last Ninja that moved a million or two copies.  Worms sold five million plus in the 1990s, but that was on multiple platforms and includes console adaptations.  Other Amiga games like Populous and Lemmings are in the same boat, though we do have Populous listed here anyway.  The PC section covers all computer platforms, as the term Personal Computer used to be a generic one before IBM clones took over the market, but there are just very few games before 1993 that meet this sales threshold, and by then the IBM PC had driven off all competitors.  List of best-selling PC video games has a section for older computers with a lower threshold for inclusion (100,000 instead of 1 million), so feel free to add some games there, as the list is currently very incomplete. Finally, I have read every single issue of Retrogamer and while the magazine often gives sales figures, they are rarely broken down by platform, so I am not sure what point you are trying to make there.  The issue is simply that both the US and British computer game markets in the 1980s were too small for games to amass sufficient sales for inclusion on this list. Indrian (talk) 04:22, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Halo 3 Edit Request
http:// halo.xbox.com/en-us/games/ halo3/Overview This clearly shows Halo 3 to have sold 14.5 million copies over 4 and 1/2 years, more than Call of Duty: Black Ops, which is at 12 million.

Will someone update this? halo.xbox.com is also known as Halo Waypoint, which is home to the developers of the Halo franchise as of now, 343i, so therefore, it is trustworthy. 7301604abc (talk) 07:32, 16 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Oh God, this is never going to go away. It will be my curse as long as I remain an editor on wikipedia to post the same darn thing over and over again.  Oh well, anyway, down to business.  This site of yours is getting its information from the same place as everyone else, which is a statement released by Microsoft that does not actually give Halo 3 sales like some people think it does: rather, it is giving the sales numbers for the entire series at the time the statement was released, which is several years ago now.  Let's start by reading this statement closely.  For ease of reference, here is the offending sentence:


 * "Halo 3 is the concluding chapter in the Halo trilogy—an international award-winning action series that grew into a global entertainment phenomenon, selling more than 14.5 million games worldwide, logging more than 650 million hours of multiplayer action on Xbox LIVE."


 * Notice the use of a dash above. Everything after the dash is an aside that is separate from the first part of the sentence since there is not a second dash to indicate this interjection has come to an end.  That leaves us with the following complete thought:


 * "an international award-winning action series that grew into a global entertainment phenomenon, selling more than 14.5 million games worldwide, logging more than 650 million hours of multiplayer action on Xbox LIVE."


 * So the clause "selling 14.5 million games worldwide" is further developing the preceding clause, "an international award-winning action series that grew into a global entertainment phenomenon." That's just how the English language works.


 * Also, check out http://on-screen.blogspot.com/2007_02_01_archive.html, a blog post from February 2007, which has the exact same language. The language on the Halo 3 web page is clearly from a press release issued sometime before Halo 3 was even released, perhaps even from the original press release announcing the game. So no, your source does not clearly show that Halo 3 has sold 14.5 million copies and this page will not be updated. Indrian (talk) 11:20, 16 April 2012 (UTC)

Sonic CD speculation
With 6 million Sega CDs sold and Sonic CD being the main attraction, it's possible that Sonic CD was a million seller at a time when Sonic was mega popular. No concrete evidence though. Pure speculation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.79.32.121 (talk) 22:57, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Doesn't VGchartz list Sonic CD at 1.5 million? You know, not that it's a reliable source or anything...but I've been thinking lately, that for games that don't have any other sales sources, shouldn't VGchartz be fair??? The reason they aren't considered reliable is because of the way they gather and interpret data. Making other sources of information more reliable. But doesn't that still leave them in fair game if no other reliable source exists??? This could possibly be brought up at the VG sources discussion page for re-evaluation. Old games have just about no other way to get sales information.--<font color="#00BFFF ">Sexy <font color="#347235">Kick 23:43, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
 * You seem to have missed the point of reliable sources somewhat. We don't use sources because they are comparatively reliable, but because they are objectively reliable. The lack of a reliable source does not lower the standard by which data may be included. An unreliable source, like VG Chartz, cannot be used because we have no idea how accurate, if at all, its figures are and in this case they have proven inaccurate in the past. To put it another way, it is better to have no info than false info. Since we have no way of judging the veracity of VG Chartz's claims, and in fact have reason to suspect that they may be false, we must assume that they are false until demonstrated otherwise. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 18:51, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Reliable sources need to be reliable for the subject matter at hand. I would argue (and I think policy agrees) that if a subject matter is more obscure, lesser standards apply.  That seems to be the case here.
 * However, I also never understood why VGChartz is not a RS at all. They have proven to be more accurate than what we consider to be reliable sources on multiple occasions.  But I am overwhelmingly shouted down in this opinion.LedRush (talk) 19:08, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Can I assume that this is not a RS? LedRush (talk) 19:21, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
 * No, that is not a reliable source because it is just a copy of this very page as it existed back in 2006. As for VGChartz, the site is clearly not reliable for current game sales because its collection methodology is faulty. The question is, where does it get its figures for older games?  Clearly VGChartz was not tracking sales data for NES, Genesis, Sega CD, etc. since the site did not exist, so it is entirely possible some of those figures are accurate.  Without knowing how it collects this information though, it cannot really be considered reliable. Indrian (talk) 19:48, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Also, assuming their older figures are accurate, it is also quite likely that we could cite their source instead VG Chartz themselves, i.e. if we were to discover that they are well sourced to a particular, reliable place, why cite the middle man? If it were a news site or something that was citing them then it would make sense according to Wikipedia's verifiability policy (for mainstream publication use etc. rather than primary sources) but if it's just an aggregator like VG Chartz would be in this case I don't see what the advantage would be. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 20:11, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

I have always thought that those who call VGChartz unreliable based on their methodology to not understand market analysis, but whatever. The community, rightly or wrongly, has voted. I haven't been able to see how VG Chartz collected their old data, but will look again.LedRush (talk) 20:16, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't know if it is still the case, but there was a time when they claimed that their figures were derived from at least one of their methods, some of which were tenuous at best. Probably the most obvious example was (or maybe still is) polling users to find out what they are playing and/or purchasing. If a figure is based solely on that criterion, then it cannot be trusted due to the bias inherent in users of gaming sites (they tend to be more "hardcore" type gamers, thus skewing figures towards "core" games such as shooters, and away from "casual" titles, such as puzzle games); see self-selection bias and participation bias. If memory serves, some of their other methods were better (such as polling retailers) but since we have no guarantee that any figure includes any data from these methods, we cannot give their figures any credence. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 20:41, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
 * I see nothing in their methodology which indicates that any one method is relied on exclusively for any of their data, though it does mention that all data is confirmed with reference to publicly available tracking information. But this is probably not the place to re-argue long settled disputes.LedRush (talk) 20:56, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
 * I didn't say that, I said that at one time (not necessarily still the case) they guaranteed that any given figure was arrived at using at least one of the methods they had listed (so some may have only used a single one of them). This policy may well have changed, but they currently don't state the minimum number of methods used, so we still don't know if any figures are arrived at via just a single method.


 * Quote: "… it does mention that all data is confirmed with reference to publicly available tracking information"


 * No it doesn't. It says it is checked, which isn't at all the same thing as confirmed. What that implies to me is that if data is available they check their data to ensure it corresponds to the official/professional data. They have been shown in the past to even go so far as to change old press releases to correspond to newly available data, which seems to me more of a way of hiding their inadequacies than providing accurate data (if they were doing it to be accurate, they would have issued corrections rather than "covering it up" so to speak). Besides, we can use data that is publicly available too - anything that hasn't been checked is subject to the same limitations, and anything that has been checked against such public info should correspond to this public info, which negates the reason for using VG Chartz (i.e. the lack of publicly available info to cite). Incidentally, we have no idea how frequently these checks take place, only that it is "regular".


 * Also, to me it seems rather suspect that they give their figures to an exact number of copies; for example they currently state (correct at time of writing) that SSX for the 360 has sold 224,966 units. Given that these are estimates/extrapolated data, they cannot possibly be both that accurate and that precise. They seem to completely ignore the concept of a significant figure, which to me implies that they are not professional statisticians. This seems to be backed up by the founder's bio on the site, which states that he "read" engineering at Cambridge University (quite what is meant by "read" I don't know, and it doesn't even mention what kind of engineering he "read"; was it software, chemical, structural… ) and makes no mention of a background in statistics or market analysis.


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 16:59, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * You did say that, and hence the reason I repeated it. If you think there is a difference in meaning, I fail to see what it could be.  My statement remains true, and your objection to the material remains unfounded (with regard to the one point about using at least one method).
 * Your semantics regarding checked/confirmed are interesting, yet irrelevant. As is your follow-up reasoning.  There are many ways to conduct market reasearch, and there is nothing in their methodology to suggest that theirs is not valid.
 * Other than this, you are merely inventing possible scenarios and backgrounds to support your assumed premise. It is not helpful.  Oh well, congrats on totally sidetracking the conversation.LedRush (talk) 17:45, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

In an attempt to get back on topic, it would seem to me that as the criteria for what makes a reliable source fluctuates with the subject matter, that it would be perfectly reasonable for VGChartz not to be a reliable source for "modern" games, but be one for classic ones. Of course, this argument would probably best be brought up on the appropriate board, where the editors are as hostile to anyone making such arguments as Alphathon is above.LedRush (talk) 17:45, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * I am going to address individual points here, so it'll be quite long. To get the gist of what I am saying, read the final two paragraphs.


 * What you paraphrased isn't the same as what I said; I didn't claim that it is the case that they only used one method for any of their figures, merely that we don't know that it isn't the case. I am certainly not saying that any of their figures are based on only one method, I am saying that the fact we don't know either way calls their reliability into question.


 * Similarly, how is my "follow-up reasoning" irrelevant? I feel we have good reason to believe that their figures are not arrived at by professional statistical analysis, which again calls into question their figures' validity and reliability. Anyone can say that another person's points are irrelevant, but that doesn't make it true; if my points are irrelevant, please explain why.


 * I also don't feel I am sidetracking anything. Your premise seems to be that VGC should be considered a reliable source for old games and/or consoles, and I am saying I don't think it's reliable full stop (and why).


 * Regardless, the default position for a source is "not shown to be reliable", not "assumed reliable unless shown otherwise". I am not assuming any premise - I can't even think of a reason why I would be in this case - if VGC were a reliable source it'd be better for everyone. All things being equal, I am not against using any source, and am not assuming that it is unreliable. However, it needs to be shown to be reliable first, not assumed so. If you have a good reason to believe that VGC is a reliable source (for any figure, be it old or new, specific or general) then please let us know so that we evaluate it. If not then on what basis are you suggesting it be considered a reliable source? This is quite apart for the fact that we have reason to believe it is actively unreliable, but if there is no good reason to think it reliable in the first place then we have no reason to uses it regardless.


 * This is not the same as "unreliable"; that needs to be proven too, not that it really matters from a usage standpoint, since only "reliable" sources should be used.


 * When you say "and there is nothing in their methodology to suggest that theirs is not valid", to me, you seem to be making an argument from ignorance (i.e. it seems fine to me, therefore it is fine). Clearly I do not agree (and have explained why), so such an argument is a waste of time. If you disagree with my reasoning, please explain why; simply stating the fact is what is unhelpful here.


 * Also, as far as I am aware "the criteria for what makes a reliable source fluctuates with the subject matter" is true, but a bit of a simplification. Different kinds of statements/claims need to be backed up in different ways, so sources vary according the claim/statement (e.g. professional news organisations are far more suitable for current events citations than they are for, say, scientific consensus or historical events). Additionally, the mundanity and specificity of a claim affect how reliable (not what makes it reliable) a source has to be to be useful. I'd say that sales figures are low-average on the mundanity scale but fairly specific, so probably need an averagely reliable source. It still needs a reliable source though, and the fact that the criteria for what is and isn't reliable change based on context does not imply that those criteria will ever be null. If it did, there would be no purpose for the citation at all.


 * Anyway, to summarise, the default position regarding a source is "not proven reliable", and I believe VGC falls into the "unreliable" category. However, for a source to be used, it must be shown to be reliable. As far as I can tell, you have not provided any arguments in favour of VGC's reliability, other than something equivalent to "I see nothing wrong with it" (a fallacious argument from ignorance) and a statement that reliability standards vary depending on the topic (which doesn't seem to address the point). Yes, not all claims need equally rigorous citations, and sales figures for old games and consoles aren't particularly "important" in this regard, but their source must at least be tentatively reliable. At the moment I see no reason to consider VGC even that, but am open to arguments if you have any. Additionally, stating that an argument that someone has made is irrelevant without saying why helps no-one, as it will not convince the person who presented the argument and is unlikely to sway third-parties (you might as well say "I'm right and you're wrong" for all the good it will do). It would be far easier for everybody if VGC were reliable, as they have many figures for which we have none, and as such I don't see why you would think I am arguing to "support my (non-existent) assumption" (why would I assume it is unreliable?).


 * If you feel this would be better discussed at WP:VG or something then by all means bring it up there. If I am wrong about something then I want to be corrected so that my views and thought processes are as close to reality as possible, so I welcome the involvement of more editors.


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 21:58, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * We are talking past each other, with you using enough words to ensure that the base conversation cannot occur. Oh well...LedRush (talk) 22:02, 9 March 2012 (UTC)


 * Yes, I'm aware I tend to be rather verbose; that is exactly why I said "To get the gist of what I am saying, read the final two paragraphs." I assume however that by "talking past each other" you mean my post was tl;dr (since you replied no more than 4 minutes after I posted).


 * How about this? We draw a line under this, start again, and you make your case for why VG Chartz should be considered a reliable source for older games and systems? Then, we try to make only one point per post so as to keep responses as short as possible (most of the reason my post is so long is that you made quite a few short statements that required long responses to rebut).


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 22:12, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Excellent. Before we start, what do you see as the relevant reliable source guideline/policy/principle?LedRush (talk) 22:21, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * (BTW: I don't know that having this conversation here makes any sense as local consensus will not outweigh community consensus, which I understand has already said that VGChartz is bad).LedRush (talk) 22:22, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * (BBTW, I read your post, started to compose a point by point rebuttal, and then realized it's a ridiculous waste of time. Thank you, though, for changing your tone to be far more civil than in your earlier reply).LedRush (talk) 22:29, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm honestly not sure about the policy (beyond the general citation guidelines); I'll get back to you on that. For the location, WP:VG seems as good a place as any. Tone wise, I apologise if my tone came off as aggressive or uncivil or whatever. I don't know if it's the language I use or my matter-of-fact manner (that's one flaw I'm painfully aware of) or the verbosity or what, but I get that a lot; rest assured it isn't/wasn't intentional. As I said above, I'd much prefer it if VGC were reliable (it'd make everyone's life here much easier), but I just don't think it is, and I certainly am not trying to attack you or shout you down or anything - I'm just not very good at conveying tone in text form. Anyway, you won't hear from me again today, and probably won't tomorrow; just thought I'd give you a heads up. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 22:43, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

Arcade Section: Joust ?
"Given the different control scheme, Williams was concerned that the game would be unsuccessful. Though arcades were hesitant to purchase the game for the same reason, Joust sold well. Williams eventually shipped 26,000 units." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joust_%28video_game%29 — Preceding unsigned comment added by MistySpock (talk • contribs) 15:43, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

The Magic Box; a reliable source?
The Magic Box is used here and throughout the more console-specific best-selling lists (at least 36 for US sales and 21 times for Japanese sales on this page alone). However, I really don't know if it should be considered a reliable source. The site certainly doesn't seem to be professionally designed and doesn't carry any copyright info (which usually suggests it doesn't belong to anyone who cares about copyright, including big corps, government bodies etc), and they give no indication (as far as I can tell) of their sources or (if applicable) their methods of estimation. Even VG Chartz does that, however dubious their methods are. I also can't find any big-name sites using them as a source. Basically, to me, there seems to be no good reason to take them seriously, and certainly no good reason to view them as a reliable source. Does anyone else have any thoughts or insights on this? <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 18:06, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
 * I believe that Magic Box took all of its Japanese figures from Dengeki, which would make these figures reliable. If you look at older versions of the site in the Internet Archive, it used to track Dengeki sales figures on a weekly basis.  Dengeki has since stopped reporting figures, and Magic Box's million-seller figures have not been updated since Dengeki stopped providing this info, so that all seems to gel.  I have no idea where its U.S. figures come from. Indrian (talk) 19:35, 8 March 2012 (UTC)


 * Well if that's the case then fair enough. I assume there's no easy way to directly cite Dengeki (would probably require citing every weeks sales if I understand correctly). Good thinking on the Internet Archive thing; it never even occurred to me to check previous versions of the site for their sources. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 20:05, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

World of WarCraft
Doesn't WoW qualify as a best selling PC game if it hit like 12 million subscribers? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.254.226.51 (talk) 04:53, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * WoW is certainly a best-selling game, but the problem is that subscriptions do not equal sales. While this is the way it works in Western markets, the Asian market uses a different system that does not involve retail copies. Indrian (talk) 15:39, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Except we still know sales numbers, at the very least for the first month. Blizzard's own press release gives numbers at 4.7 million. http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/press/pressreleases.html?id=2847887  Not to mention the World of Warcraft page references the Best Selling PC section of this article, but it's since been removed.  Either the WoW article should remove the reference to this article, or this article should include the sales numbers that we have readily available.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.194.40.98 (talk) 16:54, 2 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia cannot be a reference for itself. Feel free to add any sales figures you want that are backed up by a source; just make sure they are sales numbers and not subscription numbers. Indrian (talk) 18:07, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Trials HD and digital distribution section?
Trials HD has been downloaded at least 2 million times from Xbox Live Marketplace. Should it be on Xbox 360 section or should there an individual digital distribution section? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Izmou (talk • contribs) 20:01, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Diablo 3
Diablo 3 has sold over 6.3 million units as of now, thus qualifying for a position in the PC list. Here's the official source: http://investor.activision.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=676112

Also I have to ask... "Lemmings"? 15 million? And I checked the 'source', and it's just a conjecture by the game's won creator! And it's not even PC, it's multiple consoles! You might wanna remove.. "Lemmings" from the list... Darthnixa (talk) 14:22, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Update Guild Wars sales
Someone might want to update the sales of Guild Wars to at least 6.5 millions as in the other article (that also has a source). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.13.175.86 (talk) 13:01, 6 June 2012 (UTC)

LEGO Island
The article on this site says LEGO Island sold 7 million copies, which would put it right above Minecraft; however I cannot find the source for this data, and wouldn't know how to cite even if I did. --Lair of Rockwhales (talk) 05:02, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Okay, I can't find a single reference. Anyone else find anything? --Lair of Rockwhales (talk) 22:55, 19 July 2012 (UTC)

No PlayStation Vita best-sellers?
Ditto. 213.22.62.218 (talk) 01:09, 14 July 2012 (UTC)


 * If there are any million+ sellers (which there probably are at this point) feel free to start a list for them (assuming there's a reliable source of course). <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 17:25, 14 July 2012 (UTC)

Add skyrim to ps3 section
sales 3.95 million on ps3 platform

Link: www.vgchartz.com/game/49113/the-elder-scrolls-v-skyrim/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.140.238.62 (talk) 16:24, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
 * VG Chartz is not a reliable source. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 17:15, 1 August 2012 (UTC)

Final Fantasy XIII Sales
Final Fantasy XIII has sold 4.85 million copies on the PS3. Check vgchartz. Final Fantasy XIII-2 has sold 2.04 copies on the PS3. The current generation's lists need to be updated! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.209.195.94 (talk) 15:52, 4 August 2012 (UTC)
 * VG Chartz is not a reliable source, thus numbers from there cannot be used. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 21:10, 4 August 2012 (UTC)

Halo 3
Halo 3 has sold 11.56 million copies. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.209.195.94 (talk) 15:57, 4 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I assume this number is again from VG Chartz. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 21:10, 4 August 2012 (UTC)

Minecraft sales
Ehem, Minecraft has 5.9 million sales, not 5.5 as stated in the PC section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.113.229.209 (talk) 21:30, 19 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Y Done <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  <span title="Representation in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)" class="IPA">/'æɫfə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 10:57, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Needs to be updated to 6.2 million. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.113.233.252 (talk) 02:03, 12 June 2012 (UTC)


 * 6.4 million currently — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.113.238.219 (talk) 20:58, 2 July 2012 (UTC)

7 million — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ijdlsfl;kcjsa oip3uc983u4o (talk • contribs) 10:42, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

Modern Warfare 3
Just wondering where this game is now. It was predicted to outsell Black Ops but I havent seen any solid figures for the game. I was sure to see something on this page. So if anyone could explain why it isnt listed yet. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.8.247.150 (talk) 14:36, 12 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Because we have as little information about it as you do. The fact that you haven't seen any solid figures is probably because they haven't been released to the public (AFAIK), which includes us. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 20:58, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

Diablo 3
I don't think 10 million players mean 10 million sales for Diablo 3. They included beta/started account for sure. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dantranv (talk • contribs) 19:53, 22 August 2012 (UTC)


 * What makes you say that? At least 6.3 million (including 1.2 million from WoW annual passes) had a full copy a week after launch, is it so far fetched that it could have reached 10 million two and a half months later? <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 10:01, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * That said, it should really be 8.8mil, not 10mil, since 1.2mil got it through WoW. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 10:03, 23 August 2012 (UTC)


 * All I wanna say is the article is not a valid source. Players =/= Sales. What stop Blizzard from inluding all starter edition players. 5 million sales first week (mostly from pre order) are believable. But 4 mils after that are not when a game has such low reputation from players.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dantranv (talk • contribs)  —Preceding undated comment added 15:54, 23 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Fair enough. While I find it completely plausible (or even likely) that they mean 10 million full copies, you're right that we don't know. The wording of the original source, one of Blizzard's investor docs, seems to more clearly suggest that it is sales they're referring to (they mention that it's based on internal estimates and NPD/Chart-Trak/GfK numbers) but it's still ambiguous. I guess it should get put back down to 6.3/5.1 then. Incidentally, if those aren't just sales, I find it unlikely that beta users are counted; starter edition users however are more likely. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 18:52, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

Why???
Why is this list separated by console? Aren't most people interested in overall rankings? I know that's what I came to look for. Dancindazed (talk) 07:43, 28 August 2012 (UTC)


 * I got to agree with Dencindazed here, people come here looking for a chart rather than an intrusive console list. Anyone could throw together a stat page it'd be better. (217.18.21.194 (talk) 10:43, 6 September 2012 (UTC))

Skyrim Sales
Skyrim made 10 million total sales.

http://www.statisticbrain.com/skyrim-the-elder-scrolls-v-statistics/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kokothegorilla3 (talk • contribs) 20:33, 9 September 2012 (UTC)

Further systems need to be accomodated
What about earlier systems like Commodore 64s or Apple IIe or Macs? What about their games? Their total sales may not be anything like modern games, but it is still significant to know which games were most popular for each system. - 202.76.163.105 (talk) 09:08, 16 September 2012 (UTC)
 * While they aren't listed here, they are at List of best-selling PC video games. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 05:16, 20 September 2012 (UTC)

Minecraft for Xbox 360
Minecraft now has 4 million copies sold. https://twitter.com/Kappische/status/252474113027887105 Grr02 (talk) 21:05, 30 September 2012 (UTC)

Resident evil 6
Resident evil 6 Has Sold 4.5 Million now. ;) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.236.34.33 (talk) 20:20, 7 October 2012 (UTC)


 * On what platform and according to what source? <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 20:25, 7 October 2012 (UTC)

Contradictory
Article name implies this is a list of best-selling video games, yet in some cases it goes by units shipped. Either use sales data exclusively or move it to a name like "List of best-selling and most shipped video games." There was discussion to this effect back in 2007, but nothing came of it apparently. --Jtalledo (talk) 16:26, 12 October 2012 (UTC)
 * And of course there's bundled games, which arguably shouldn't count since people are buying the system, not just the game. And downloads of free games, which technically aren't "sales" either. --Jtalledo (talk) 16:36, 12 October 2012 (UTC)

Uncharted 3/Gran Turismo 5 sales
Uncharted 3 - 4,657,760 Gran Turismo 5 - 7,942,015

Both for PS3 - http://www.vgchartz.com/weekly/41189/Global/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aazesyne (talk • contribs) 20:51, 15 October 2012 (UTC)

Wii Sports as a sold game?
Whats the official consensus of Wii Sports being a 'sold' game as opposed to just being a permanently bundled game? I know you can buy it separately if you need or want to, but it seems to skew the results a bit including the vast number that were bundled with the wii. I don't think it deserves a change though, just speculating about it Eeveeman (talk) 21:36, 24 October 2012 (UTC)
 * No, it doesn't make sense. But as I posted above, some of these numbers aren't even about numbers sold, but shipped. So, yeah, that's definitely an issue. --Jtalledo (talk) 23:07, 24 October 2012 (UTC)

GTA IV
The sales of GTA IV on this article are contradictory to the wiki article on GTA IV. It should be 25 million. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.45.110.115 (talk) 06:57, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

World of Warcraft
This MMORPG has 10 millions subscribers in October 2012, which imply 10 millions persons bought the game and the four extensions. Why is this game not in the list? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 156.25.4.2 (talk • contribs) 11:49, 18 January 2013 (UTC)


 * Because it does not imply that. In Europe and North America, that is how the game works (you need to buy a copy before you can subscribe). However, that is not how it works in much of Asia. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon    (<font color="#900">talk ) 13:50, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Hello I am new (sorry I couldn't find right place to write this)but I would love to improve the accuracy of this article. The number of purchases of Minecraft is off by >300,000 - it's over 9.4 million, having surpassed Half Life. Thought I'd clarify - my source is Thanks (& sorry this is here, Idk why page is locked, please delete all this after you fix it :)  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.113.231.230 (talk) 18:33, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

Why?? (Repost)
I've posted the below question before and was browsing some of my past contributions to find that it was unjustifiably deleted...
 * Why is this list separated by console? Aren't most people interested in overall rankings? I know that's what I came to look for. Dancindazed (talk) 04:53, 27 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Quote: "I got to agree with Dencindazed here, people come here looking for a chart rather than an intrusive console list. Anyone could throw together a stat page it'd be better. " (217.18.21.194 (talk) 10:43, 6 September 2012 (UTC))

Dancindazed (talk) 04:53, 27 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, this is a legitimate question. I'm not too sure where they're going with this somewhat confusing list either. --Jtalledo (talk) 13:03, 27 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Likewise, I see no legitimate reason for that to have been deleted. I agree with the sentiment to a point. I see no good reason why there shouldn't be an overall list of games that have sold, say, 5 million copies (1 million across all platforms would be far to many to be practically maintained or browsed). There are good reasons to split up the list by platform: so that like is being compared with like, i.e. things like exclusives are put in context and we can see how sales are broken down by platform. That said, it needn't be one or the other; we can have both. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æɫ.fə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 14:09, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games#Statistic Brain
You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æɫ.fə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 16:19, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Where are the rest of the platforms?
PC is included, so the list is obviously not only for consoles, so where are the games for the Commodore 64? The Amiga? Lastunusedusername (talk) 16:35, 19 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Waiting for someone with proper sources to put them on the list? If you have the ones that have sold over 1 million for these systems, then, please add them to the article. Rodze (talk) 19:07, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

Plague Inc.
Please remove the quotation marks from "Plague Inc." in the mobile section to keep the text all the same. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tomh2092 (talk • contribs) 12:39, 5 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Y Done. I suspect whoever added it mistook the Wiki italics markup for quotation marks when adding it in. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æɫ.fə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:28, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Tables
The tables for some consoles are obnoxious. They break the flow of the article, making it harder to read actually. Since these systems have separate pages, I think they should be kept only there, and on this article only the simple list format. Rodze (talk) 19:09, 23 March 2013 (UTC)


 * At some point all the sections should be "tabelised", but it takes a long time to do so has to be done in stages. Those with their own articles are generally being done first though since they are also being converted for transclusion at the same time. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æɫ.fə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 15:28, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Minecraft Xbox 360 Edition
Minecraft Xbox 360 Edition is now sold 6.1 million copies, please someone edit it.

--MarioErmando (talk) 09:45, 9 April 2013 (UTC)


 * ✅  10:45, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

Kid Icarus Uprising
I think that should be included on the 3DS list now, it's sold 1.16 million units worldwide release — Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.194.162.93 (talk • contribs) 14:51, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

About Mobile Phone
Shouldn't we spread mobile phone into this:

Mobile Phone The games that are mostly downloaded

iOS The games that are mostly downloaded

Android The games that are mostly downloaded


 * Because this article is about games that shipped at least 1 million units to stores for retail sales. TySoltaur (talk) 20:51, 2 June 2013 (UTC)

Minecraft as a popular video game.
It has come to my attention that Minecraft is not updated. In the section in this article about Popular PC games, It lists Minecraft as 10.1 million sales for PC, whereas it actually now has Roughly 15.1 million. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.56.147.63 (talk) 02:33, 16 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Um, not is hasn't . (Also, it's "best-selling", not "popular".) <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æɫ.fə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 09:31, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

Vandalism - Xbox 360 section
The top game sold for the xbox 360 is listed as "Sex Adventures" with 69 million sales. There is no such game. It should be Kinect Adventures. I am not able to edit this page, but it appears to have been on the list for a while now and someone should correct it. --LeDrewxcore (talk) 17:23, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

The Oregon Trail
Which section would The Oregon Trail go? It's sold 65 million copies so it's weird that it's not on the list. The figure is for all versions so maybe there should be a multiplatform section? --Mika1h (talk) 19:17, 31 July 2013 (UTC)


 * At present there is no list that it would fit in given that we have no platform-specific figures. I would personally support the inclusion of a cross-platform list, into which it could go. However, to do so would likely take a lot of discussion to decide on the specifics.


 * Where is the cut-off point for example - any figure is arbitrary; if we used for example 1 million then every game already on the platform lists would have to be included, in addition to probably several hundred more. Then there's the problem that it would be systemically skewed towards newer games, as the games industry is much larger now than it was even a decade ago, let alone in the 1970s. Then there's the issue of ports and remakes - how different can a game be before it qualifies as a separate game. Is Age of Empires II: HD Edition for example a separate game, a port or a compilation? What about all the different versions of Tetris? Are they all the same game or separate ones, and if separate, should any of them be lumped together and why?


 * <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æɫ.fə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 08:16, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

Modern Warfare 3
It has been almost a year since it's release. Why isn't it on this list? Call of Duty Modern Warfare 3, 28,8 millions every plataforms  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.56.173.108 (talk) 17:28, 19 November 2013 (UTC)

GTA5
7 mio (PS4) + 30 mio (XBO) = 29 mio (all platforms) ? 91.49.6.19 (talk) 09:42, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

Minecraft - Pocket Edition
Minecraft - Pocket Edition has recently (April 29, 2013) reached 10 million sales; the page needs to be updated. Here's a link to source: http://mojang.com/2013/04/10-million-copies-of-minecraft-pocket-edition-sold/

Also Minecraft should be on the "All consoles" list by now. 39 million total. (13M PC, 10M Xbox360, 16M Mobile.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.106.53.11 (talk) 11:37, 16 December 2013 (UTC)

Demon's Souls
Apparently it's sales are up at almost 2,4 million copies, and since it's a PS3 only game, it should be on the list under best-selling PS3 games. http://www.joystiq.com/2013/04/12/dark-souls-claims-nearly-2-4-million-sales-worldwide/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.165.228.246 (talk) 04:24, 6 May 2013 (UTC)


 * That article is about Dark Souls, which is multi-platform, not Demon's Souls. <font face="sans-serif"><font color="#900">Alphathon  /'æɫ.fə.θɒn/ (<font color="#900">talk ) 11:41, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

This article is about Demon's Souls, and it says 1.63 million copies sold, which is above the 1 million requirement to enter the list. http://www.vgchartz.com/game/31689/demons-souls/
 * Don't you read? You do know it says below the title that vgchartz is inaccurate and unreliable. — Preceding unsigned comment added by EncycloAgainstWiki (talk • contribs) 09:15, 26 December 2013 (UTC)

Diablo II
I very, very recently learned that the Diablo Franchise had sold 17 million copies in 2006. https://web.archive.org/web/20061110101603/http://www.vivendi.com/ir/download/pdf/VIVGames_EuropeRoadshow_June2006.pdf According to Vivendi's 2008 Q1 report, Diablo II alone had sold 17 million copies -- and Lord of Destruction 17.5 million copies. That report is currently missing -- after Diablo 3's launch. 11 million players were playing Diablo II and Starcraft I in 2008. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diablo_II#cite_note-gspot_starcraft2-44

Someone must have the complete sales numbers for 2000-2012. Most likely, Diablo II and it's expansion are each at 20 million physical copies sold right now, considering the sales boost the franchise got in 2008, when Diablo 3 was announced: It was one of the best-selling PC-games of the year in 2008, and it was on NPD's top 10 PC-games for the year 2010. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diablo_II#cite_note-vg247_diablo2npd-42 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diablo_II#cite_note-ign_bestsell_2008-43 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.165.10.123 (talk) 22:33, 5 January 2014 (UTC)


 * I researched and couldn't find a reference to Diablo 2's sales to be 4 million in 2001 and the add-on to be 1 million. You need to find an independent source, it is strange no one reported on Vivendi's report in 2006.

Semi-protected edit request on 5 January 2014
on minecraft has been released for playstation 3 please edit

Sources: Mojang https://mojang.com/2013/12/minecraft-playstation-3-edition-is-now-available/

Also Minecraft has sold over 14,000,000 units now https://minecraft.net/stats

Goodman55 (talk) 11:04, 5 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Technical 13 (talk) 21:44, 6 January 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 January 2014
The Flag for GTA V should be either Scottish or British because the game was developed by Rockstar North whose HQ's are in Edinburgh, Scotland. After the game was released, in the Rockstar Games New York (IIRC it NY) HQ's there was a "huge poster" which said "Grand Theft Auto V, Made in Scotland".

LOL232XY (talk) 21:43, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
 * I changed it to Scotland, since Rockstar North is in Scotland, and they made all of the GTA games. Frmorrison (talk) 23:58, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
 * I don't know the convention, but I feel it should be the UK rather than Scotland since the UK is the country; Scotland isn't independent (currently). 131.111.184.100 (talk) 17:02, 3 February 2014 (UTC)

I will add to that, it should certainly be the British flag, if we're going to start doing constituent countries way more flags on here need switched to England. I say this as a Scot. 176.27.13.83 (talk) 19:13, 3 February 2014 (UTC)

Minecraft mobile phone sales can't be counted on all consoles best-selling videogames list!
Either all paid mobile phone games are included (100M Tetris, 30M Pacman and 20M Sonic Dash -ugh-) or nothing related to mobiles is included! (Minecraft, GTA: San Andreas, and Sonic The Hedgehog mobile sales) ...It CAN'T be both of them!

I personally think they shouldn't be included. — Preceding unsigned comment added by JFDP13 (talk • contribs) 11:55, 6 February 2014 (UTC)

Tetris' many versions
I see the first list only mentions the GB/GBC version of Tetris, but the game had a ton of ports, shouldn't they all be added up? --Stormwatch (talk) 20:34, 6 February 2014 (UTC)

Minecraft Total Sales
If you look at the sources for each Minecraft version, along with this, it would add up to 41.7 million copies. On the 'All Platforms' section, rather than getting it from citation, can't it just be added up? GameFreak667 (talk) 22:27, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

Call of Duty: MW3 seems to be missing from list
According to the CoD MW3 page, this has sold 26.5 million copies so should be on the 'All Platforms' list? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.177.40.112 (talk) 14:15, 21 February 2014 (UTC)

Tetris Sales reach 495 million
“We have 425 million total paid mobile downloads. That’s all just on mobile. We had 35 million on the original Game Boy. Boxed products, I think altogether we sold something like 70 million,” he said.

“That 425 million number doesn’t count free-to-play. We have Tetris Blitz now. Electronic Arts secured the mobile rights and decided to do a product that’s similar to their Bejeweled Blitz, a free, item-based game. That’s another level on top of the 425 million paid downloads,” he added.

http://www.vg247.com/2014/04/07/tetris-mobile-sales-hit-425-million/

Someone please add. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.205.69.204 (talk) 00:20, 11 April 2014 (UTC)

Tetris
Should we add the other systems Tetris was released for? according to the article it was released on Acorn Electron, Amiga, Amstrad CPC, Amstrad PCW, Apple II, Apple IIgs, Atari ST, Arcade, BBC Micro, CD-i, Commodore VIC-20, Commodore 64, Electronika 60, Family Computer/NES, FM-7, Macintosh, MSX, PC-8801, PC-9801, Mega Drive, MS-DOS, TRS-80 CoCo, WonderSwan Color, X68000, ZX Spectrum. Elvis (talk) 10:50, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

Any way to make the copies sold columns sort properly?
Right now it sorts completely wrong if you click on that column, can this be fixed?98.243.94.83 (talk) 22:35, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

Could an auto-confirmed Wikipedia user please update the Grand Theft Auto V sales for both the PlayStation 3 and the Xbox 360?
Here are the sources:

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/65884/grand-theft-auto-v/ (PlayStation 3)

http://www.vgchartz.com/game/65883/grand-theft-auto-v/ (Xbox 360) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.184.90.51 (talk) 04:07, 13 January 2014 (UTC)


 * Please read the templates above. VGchartz aren't considered in Wikipedia as they are inaccurate with their sales. Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by EncycloAgainstWiki (talk • contribs) 11:03, 19 February 2014 (UTC)

GTA V has now passed the 33 million mark.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2014/05/13/grand-theft-auto-5-has-sold-nearly-2-billion-at-retail/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.30.113.225 (talk) 16:52, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Freemium downloads
Mobile games that use a freemium model. This list includes freemium mobile games with at least 10 million downloads.

Is deleted.

This is a List of best-selling video games. If something is free, it's not sold. I have left a copy above if someone thinks to create a List of most downloaded freemium games.--Vaypertrail (talk) 19:14, 25 May 2014 (UTC)

Tetris 530m copies sold
GamesBeat: What are the numbers again, as far as how wide it’s been downloaded?

Rogers: For mobile we’ve had more than 425 million downloads, which doesn’t include freemium. For Game Boy, we sold more than 35 million units. The console games combined have been something like 70 million to date. Obviously it’s all over the world. We’ve been on more than 50 platforms.

http://venturebeat.com/2014/06/20/after-three-decades-tetris-becomes-a-multigenerational-game/2/

Add please

Another artilce confirm 425m paid mobile downloads

“We have 425 million total paid mobile downloads,” Rogers told VentureBeat during Philly Tech Week, which featured a record-breaking game of Tetris played on the side of a building. “That’s all just on mobile. We had 35 million on the original Game Boy. Boxed products, I think altogether we sold something like 70 million.”

"“That 425 million number doesn’t count free-to-play... That’s another level on top of the 425 million paid downloads."

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/04/08/tetris-has-reached-425-million-paid-mobile-downloads
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. — &#123;&#123;U&#124;Technical 13&#125;&#125; (e • t • c) 14:51, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

Flags?
Why are there flags with each of the games in the first section? The national origin of each game and system has no relevancy to the context of the article (especially when sales are worldwide). -AnonWikiEditor (talk) 20:26, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

PS4 and XBox One?
Come on guys, those systems have been out for nearly half a year and still haven't been included on this list even though both have had games that have sold about a million copies. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.65.34.146 (talk) 02:33, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

Bejeweled not listed
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bejeweled says Bejeweled sold more than 75 million copies, yet it isn't listed here. Are there additional criteria? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2620:0:1000:1601:BE30:5BFF:FED2:F3EB (talk) 00:46, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 July 2014
The Grand Theft Auto titles are created in Scotland, therefore the United Kingdom flags do not accurately portray the country of origin for these tiles. I request the flags be edited to better represent the origin of the titles.

QyuBurt (talk) 14:16, 22 July 2014 (UTC)

Not done for now: - Scotland is still part of the United Kingdom - wait until after the referendum. Until then please see Terminology of the British Isles and Nationality of people from the United Kingdom - Arjayay (talk) 14:37, 22 July 2014 (UTC)

Grand Theft Auto 5
Grand Theft Auto 5 was reported by IGN as having reached 34 million copies sold as of August 6, 2014. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.180.20.188 (talk) 12:52, 7 August 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 August 2014
Diablo 3 has sold now over 20 million copies, contrary to the 15 million listed on this page. source: http://files.shareholder.com/downloads/ACTI/2943524616x0x773936/367e59a1-e228-468c-bd15-6f5f7a04aa6c/Q2_2014_ATVI_Earnings_Press_Release.pdf

however this is expected to raise dramatically again on august 19th. to change it now or wait 'til the new information is revealed after 08/19/2014 is up to you, I guess.

2602:306:33DB:8AB0:0:0:0:49 (talk) 23:54, 5 August 2014 (UTC)
 * ✅ Stickee (talk)  10:44, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
 * That is for combined sales for Diablo 3 and Reaper of Souls. --Mika1h (talk) 18:20, 21 August 2014 (UTC)

The Tetris mobile numbers are not correct.
The numbers for Tetris are based on the loose wordings in this article as well as this article from EA. Claiming that 10% of all games currently sold on mobile are Tetris, a fairly absurd statement.

If you check the official all time Apple sale numbers, Tetris is not even in the top 10, while games that have sold far less than 10 million copies are. On the current official site for the game for EA, they have since then amended the numbers and right now only claim 60 million downloads, despite four years having passed since their initial wording of "100 million paid downloads". Note that on the newer numbers it says downloads, not sale numbers as the game is free to play on for example Android.

85.229.178.5 (talk) 10:51, 22 August 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 August 2014
WhosBehindYou (talk) 23:30, 22 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. -- ferret (talk) 00:19, 23 August 2014 (UTC)

Xbox One and PlayStation 4?
Do you think it's about time PS4 And X1 get added onto this page? 'Cause they already have best-selling games on them and it would be good to include them now.125.239.231.186 (talk) 23:24, 26 August 2014 (UTC)

need to fix Minecraft's thing
minecraft is out for xbox one, and ps 4 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.139.122.186 (talk) 18:43, 14 September 2014 (UTC)

The top-selling Xbox 360 games
On the mobile applications, you don't have flappy bird: 50 million downloads, piano tiles: 75m - 120m

Reakol (talk) 20:49, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Cannolis (talk) 23:22, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

British flags?
Does anyone know why the Scottish flags, identifying Rockstar North games were switched with British ones? If no one can give a reason by next Wednesday, I might consider changing them back. Pablothepenguin (talk) 18:22, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
 * It's too late now, they will be changed Pablothepenguin (talk) 19:28, 11 November 2014 (UTC)

The top-selling Xbox 360 games
According to this page (http://www.vgchartz.com/platform/7/xbox-360/) you have to do some updates, for example editing Grand Theft Auto V and Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 into the list.

46.244.149.170 (talk) 18:38, 10 November 2014 (UTC)
 * ❌: this request is too vague: either clarify exactly what you want changed, or create and account and change the article yourself. G S Palmer (talk • contribs) 14:37, 12 November 2014 (UTC)

Grand Theft Auto V System update
It now is on Microsoft Windows, Xbox One, Playstation 4, Playstation 3, and Xbox 360.

Source: http://www.rockstargames.com/V/order  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arron Lampkin (talk • contribs) 01:13, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

Oregon Trail
Can we add The Oregon Trail to the list? According to Wikipedia's own article on the game, it has sold 65 million copies. 02:26, 15 November 2014 (UTC)
 * According to Wikipedia's The Oregon Trail (video game) article, the game have 13 different iteration (not port), an average of 5 millions by iteration. This list contain only game with at least 15 millions sale. If you find a source about the sale of a specific iteration, it would not be a problem. (I'll tell James ;)) DelBiss (talk) 02:54, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Looking more deeply to the list, if what I've said is true, there a problem with Tetris. Mobile version of Tetris should at top position with 100 millions sale amd gameboy version at number 6 with 35 millions. Since I think Oregon Trail have the merit to be on this list, I'll add it. But if someone remove it, Tetris should be split in 2 for is different iteration. DelBiss (talk) 03:09, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
 * While Oregon Trail could fit in on this list, it is really about the sales individual games and not the sales of multiple versions, so I went ahead and removed it and split up tetris, as the game boy version is definitely a distinct version from the phone game and should have been kept separate in the first place. However, I am not sure if the phone version belongs on the list at all as other best-selling mobile games are not included on the list. Likesorange (talk) 07:30, 8 December 2014 (UTC)
 * If the older Tetris entry refers specifically to the Game Boy release, should its year not be changed from 1984 to 1989? – NuclearDuckie (talk) 10:01, 9 December 2014 (UTC)
 * Uhh... yes, that's what I meant to put. (I've fixed it now) Likesorange (talk) 08:15, 16 December 2014 (UTC)

Scotland Flags
Whoever keeps changing the Scotland flags for Rockstar North, please knock it off and/or explain yourself. Edit will be reverted. Pablothepenguin (talk) 23:33, 23 November 2014 (UTC)

It should be a British flag. All of the other entries in the list have the flag of the sovereign state, rather than the regional flag.2.125.154.117 (talk) 09:07, 8 December 2014 (UTC)


 * Why didn't you discuss this before directly editing the article to your view? If you have a disagreement with something, you are to discuss it, not just dive in and ignore everyone/the viewpoints of all others. Your edits should be reverted to the original/the consensus, and if you disagree, you may discuss the matter here.


 * Furthermore, what is the shown is the "country", not specifically the "sovereign state". Should you doubt Scotland's status as a country, I advise you to read our article on it. The fact you refer to it as regional, are so new as to not indent your posts, and have no account suggest to me that you are here to troll - but, as proper, I assume good faith. Feel free to explain yourself.  82.176.92.44 (talk) 12:20, 20 December 2014 (UTC)


 * I didn't edit the article. 86.138.50.109 (talk) 09:31, 28 December 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 January 2015
Update Diablo III statistics: http://www.polygon.com/2014/8/5/5972671/diablo-3-activision-blizzard-pc-sales

62.219.163.122 (talk) 11:11, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. — &#123;&#123;U&#124;Technical 13&#125;&#125; (e • t • c) 13:14, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 8 January 2015
change grand theft auto sales from 34 million to 40.56 million in the most sold video games list.

Lolzinyourmouth (talk) 22:08, 8 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. — &#123;&#123;U&#124;Technical 13&#125;&#125; (e • t • c) 22:49, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 January 2015

 * 🇬🇧 Grand Theft Auto V
 * 2013
 * 🇯🇵 PlayStation 3, PlayStation 4, 🇺🇸 Xbox 360, Xbox One; Microsoft Windows (2015)
 * 43,57 million

"43,57" does not match the decimal separator as other entries in the table. Should be "43.57" for organization.

69.244.239.217 (talk) 17:33, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

✅ Thanks for pointing that out - Arjayay (talk) 17:43, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 January 2015
24.128.159.169 (talk) 23:10, 11 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: no request Cannolis (talk) 23:22, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

Tetris lacks the original platform
Tetris is originally written on an Elektronika 60 soviet computer and that is not in the Tetris' platform list. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.139.196.185 (talk) 14:29, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 30 January 2015
70.50.140.39 (talk) 06:24, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

All the sources I've found online site Pokemon Red/Blue/Green as havng sold 31.37 million copies. One such source is VGChartz. This source includes data from Canada, Mexico, Central and South America aswell as the rest of Europe.

http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?name=Pokemon&publisher=&platform=&genre=&minSales=0&results=200


 * VgChartz is not a reliable source. -- Joseph Prasad (talk) 06:34, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

No list for PS4/Xbox One?
Both of these systems have been out for over a year and the PS4 in particular has sold more than the Wii U, yet the Wii U gets a spot but not the system that sold twice as much? As for the XBox One, it seems it has sold around the same amount as the Wii U. Both PS4 and XBox One deserve to have spots on here. It makes no sense why they are not on here when a less popular system is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.21.156.24 (talk) 17:15, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

GTA V Sales
GTA V sold through 45 million copies: http://ir.take2games.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=86428&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=2013202

″Grand Theft Auto V is the highest-rated game to date for PlayStation 4 and Xbox One*, and has now sold-in more than 45 million units on console, including nearly 10 million units on PlayStation 4 and Xbox One. The title is planned for launch on PC on March 24, 2015.″ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.247.124.217 (talk) 19:50, 4 February 2015 (UTC)

They SOLD IN that much. no new info on sold through. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.79.133.132 (talk) 02:11, 5 February 2015 (UTC)

Question
The all-console sales figure and the specific console sales figure does not correlate. For e.g GTA4 is noted to have sold 24 million in all consoles sales, but the number is below 5 million from the specific console sales figure cumulation. It's contradictory, and inaccurate. The numbers needs to be updated. Penpaperpencil (Talk) 10:59, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

Duck Hunt
Duck Hunt is listed in the NES section with 28 million copies sold, but is not in the primary list at all. Any reason why it should be absent? 69.142.53.177 (talk) 23:45, 16 February 2015 (UTC)

Counter-Strike
Counter-Strike has sold over 9 million copies as the worlds most sold mod according to Guinness world records in 2010. According to shacknews, it had sold over 4.2million retail (not including steam) and their source is the November issue of Ganeinformer 20, but i cannot confirm this. I could not find any solid proof of sold copies of the other games in the franchise, but we should atleast start adding this as a start. Johan Bjäreholt (talk) 01:41, 22 February 2015 (UTC)

Tetris Mobile
The only listed source for Tetris Mobile's sales figures is EA themselves; This game is now free, and has been for a while. Are there any outside sources for these numbers? Dstruct2k (talk) 06:26, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 16 March 2015
Please change the numbers concerning Minecraft "Minecraft 	2009[n 2] 	Windows, OS X, Linux, Java, Xbox 360, Xbox One, PlayStation 3, PlayStation 4 	34 million["

Minecraft has now sold almost 54 million copies. As stated by this tweet from one of the developers: https://twitter.com/pgeuder/status/481812186390880257

and reported by gamespot here: http://www.gamespot.com/articles/minecraft-console-sales-pass-pc-series-nears-54-million-copies-sold/1100-6420724/

HappyThug (talk) 05:07, 16 March 2015 (UTC)


 * ❌: The current reference is from October 10, 2014, and states a total of 60 million, while the one you provided is from June 25, 2014 and only states 54 million. The reason only 34 million are stated in the table is because 30 million from the pocket edition are removed. (both the PC and Pocket have received a newer number since then, causing a total of 64 million to be stated). KnightMiner (t/c) 16:00, 16 March 2015 (UTC)

Minecraft Sales
Seems to be out of date:

PC Sales: 18 Million (Official Website)

MCPE (Mobile Version): 30 Million (Official Website)

PS3 and Xbox 360: 16 Million

That's a total of ~ 64 Million (that's without PS Vita, PS4 and Xbox One figures so is likely to be higher)

So Minecraft's sales figure needs changing from 54 Million to 64 Million under All Platforms — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.21.198.214 (talk) 22:54, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

Stop splitting up Minecraft sales for MCPE. It's the same game on all platforms with variations in the amount of available features. -- Searge — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.24.130.18 (talk) 14:09, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Per Searge above, minecraft should be third on the list with >60M sales. See; https://twitter.com/SeargeDP/status/567684437849415680 24.57.132.149 (talk) 20:42, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Please check the Duplicate Entries discussion for more on this topic. Navarr (talk) 03:13, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

Also worth mentioning that Microsoft bought Mojang in late 2014 and until then was a an Indie game. https://mojang.com/2014/09/yes-were-being-bought-by-microsoft/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.95.104.91 (talk) 15:07, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 April 2015
Demon's Souls
 * 1.7 million

80.236.115.199 (talk) 23:53, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Amortias (T)(C) 16:54, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Could an auto-confirmed Wikipedia user please add the PlayStation Vita, PlayStation 4, and Xbox One to the list?
Could an auto-confirmed Wikipedia user please add the PlayStation Vita, PlayStation 4, and Xbox One to the list? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.177.138.134 (talk) 18:20, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

Donkey Kong 64's sales are messed up.
I just saw that on the list it says Donkey Kong 64 sold 100 BILLION copies. That is absolutely wrong, no doubt about that, but sadly I don't have any source to see the actual sales, so I can't edit. - Unknown member

Has been fixed, just checked. - Gerottinho (talk) 23:02, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

Duplicate entries
May I ask why Minecraft is separated into a main version and a mobile version, yet not separated for other versions? Officially they are the same game, the article used as a source for the sales of Minecraft even describes all the versions within it. What qualifies a game as a port allowing additive sales rather than a new game, requiring separate sales? --KnightMiner (t/c) 02:45, 16 February 2015 (UTC)


 * Also, here is a tweet from a developer of Minecraft --KnightMiner (t/c) 15:06, 17 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Here is another tweet from this developer of Minecraft. Also, he seems to have written above as 85.24.130.18. | violine1101(Talk) 15:36, 17 February 2015 (UTC)


 * An edit war seems to have started, and the best advise from the most recent guy opposing this is to go along with him to prevent an edit war. I say lets discuss it instead, so, pinging the involved parties to discuss. --KnightMiner (t/c) 17:56, 18 February 2015 (UTC)
 * I am not part of any edit war. I made one edit, and through some communications, decided to leave the article alone. Weegeerunner (talk) 17:59, 18 February 2015 (UTC)


 * the person who has been keeping it this way cites Tetris as his example of keeping it separated. Minecraft PC/Consoles is basically the same game (though one could argue XBOX is fairly different with skin packs).  Minecraft PE on the other hand was built mostly from scratch, I believe, with a differing feature-set and is working on re-implementing all the features Minecraft PC has.  It also utilizes completely different player run servers (which none of the consoles support as a generic port), etc, etc.  For the purchases of Alpha users, Mojang also distinctly separates them as different games Navarr (talk) 18:01, 18 February 2015 (UTC)


 * I am mainly asking what determines separation, for example, why are the PC, Console, and Pi editions merged, but the Pocket edition separate? What are specific criteria that determine which are the same and which are separate?
 * In the case of Tetris, the two are treated as separate games within Wikipedia, including separate articles and separate companies producing them. Tetris was only split about two months ago, for the reason the game was declared separate alliterations (see here and here)
 * In the case of Minecraft, the two games share an article and have the same company producing them, (the Console Edition is produced by a different company though). Also, the lead developer of the PC edition is the lead developer of the Pocket Edition.
 * As far a features go, the original version of the Pocket Edition was vastly similar to the original version of the PC edition, and its later updates tend to contain the same features the PC Edition got, except in a few cases where the hardware could not handle the feature yet. Then we can ask about the Pi Edition, which is no where near the same as the PC Edition by features.
 * KnightMiner (t/c) 18:31, 18 February 2015 (UTC)


 * I absolutely agree regarding the Pi edition, but I don't believe it's on this list in any shape or form. Navarr (talk) 19:56, 18 February 2015 (UTC)


 * " Minecraft PE on the other hand was built mostly from scratch, I believe" - That's been directly refuted by the lead developer, via tweet (quoted above) "Minecraft versions are ports of the SAME codebase". To end this discussion: "We made it pretty clear that there is only one Minecraft." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.219.124.70 (talk • contribs) 20:28, 24 February 2015‎
 * Yes it's true. This should be changed, all Minecraft editions (exception: Pi) are the same thing! I want to make it clear to all of you: They're just a port! Don't you understand? Then, if you want to split every game per platform, them do it. These games will be affected: GTA (ALL of them), Call of Duty (ALL of them), Pokemon (ALL f them), The Elder Scrolls, Battlefield 3, Super Mario Bros., The Sims, and Diablo III. Please consider this. If the editors are going to be lying to people then no one should ever visit this thing. Update this to either both things: Split ALL games per platform or Count ALL games as the same UNLESS their developers agree or gave an announcement that they're are two separate editions. Please don't say anything about Call or Duty or anything with "THEY are different", no you're wrong, MCPC and MCPE and all other editions (except Pi) are the same thing! Cyberdg (talk) 00:59, 6 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Well, seeing as there is only one opposed user in this discussion, could the people who oppose please comment their opinion? KnightMiner (t/c) 20:14, 18 April 2015 (UTC)


 * people who opposed didn't say anything for more than 20 days after your reply, can you edit it one more time and see how it goes? Gerottinho (talk) 02:12, 10 May 2015 (UTC)

Snake?
If bundled games count, one would suppose Snake would top the list, as it was bundled with hundreds of millions of Nokia phones. --Stormwatch (talk) 04:32, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas systems
Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas is on Mobile for both Android and iOS. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stuffdude99 (talk • contribs) 18:20, 25 May 2015 (UTC)

Mobile phone numbers
iOS/Android: Blek, 1.5M Source — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.226.133.146 (talk) 07:17, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 August 2015
Diablo III - 30 million copies sold, making it the top 1 best selling PC game. Source: http://finance.yahoo.com/news/activision-blizzard-announces-better-expected-200500630.html

217.132.245.76 (talk) 10:41, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
 * ✅ -- Chamith   (talk)  06:46, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

PLZ Add XBONE and PS4 up to the section.
There is no article for Xbox One and Playstation 4. Therefore Somebody should post some information of those things soon. 04:56, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
 * ❌ It's unclear what you want added. Please phrase your request with what you specifically want added, along with references. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 16:47, 9 August 2015 (UTC)
 * He surely means: "please add the best-selling games for the new consoles." Which can be found here and here. --Stormwatch (talk) 05:02, 18 August 2015 (UTC)
 * For sure, it means: "please add more information of best-selling game of PS4 and XBOX ONE with the link to those articles." 08:40, 22 August 2015 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 223.62.163.75 (talk)


 * Wikipedia is run by volunteers. If someone wants something added to an article, they should do it themselves, provided that it's sourced. If the article is locked, they can still write up the prose they want to add, include references, and submit it here. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 16:43, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

Minecraft Stats in Single Platform
Minecraft has sold 21.22 million copies. The page currently stands stating Minecraft has 20 million copies, citing an article written in July. More up-to-date stats can be found here (minecraft.net/stats) 184.156.180.126 (talk) 14:39, 25 October 2015 (UTC)


 * --KnightMiner (t/c) 15:28, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 November 2015
I would like to expand the Xbox one videogames list.

71.120.219.225 (talk) 22:29, 4 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Cannolis (talk) 22:44, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

Cut The Rope
Cut the Rope had in 2011 6 million paid downloads. http://www.geek.com/apple/cut-the-rope-has-sold-six-million-copies-and-valentine-update-on-the-way-1311747/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:75:CF3A:BA01:51A1:7289:D8B7:4C7 (talk) 00:02, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Tetris Mobile Sales
So according to Henk Rogers, Founder of the The Tetris Company, Tetris has 425 million paid downloads on mobile.

"“We have 425 million total paid mobile downloads. That’s all just on mobile. We had 35 million on the original Game Boy. Boxed products, I think altogether we sold something like 70 million,” he said.

"That 425 million number doesn’t count free-to-play."

Source: http://venturebeat.com/2014/04/07/mr-tetris-explains-why-the-puzzle-game-is-still-popular-after-three-decades-interview/


 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: It would not be academically responsible to claim as factual, the assertions of a person who has a vested interested in making his company look good. We don't use primary sources for controversial content. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 06:07, 14 December 2015 (UTC)

I'm not sure how what you have linked has to do with anything? Most of the references in the page are from the companies own PR pieces and initiated to make their business look good too. Fares.Ketbi (talk) 14:33, 14 December 2015 (UTC)

Add Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive has 17,857,637 owners according to steamspy .CSGOWALRUSSIAN (talk) 17:12, 22 December 2015 (UTC)


 * Adding on that this only counts sales on PC (as all legitimate copies utilize Steam, whether brought from retail or online). There are also Xbox 360 and PS3 versions to consider (however, neither of these platforms has had their game updated since launch, and both games are very very different from each other after 3 years of development). arivie (talk) 18:19, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

Garry's Mod has ten million in sales.
Small correction, but pretty necessary, considering the gap between the information on the page and the actual figure. Source: http://steamspy.com/app/4000

TechnicLePanther (talk) 20:55, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 4 one external links on List of best-selling video games. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Attempted to fix sourcing for http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20090507-00000019-oric-ent
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20080705204108/http://www.japan-gamecharts.com:80/dc.php to http://www.japan-gamecharts.com/dc.php
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090831085027/http://www.japan-gamecharts.com:80/ps3.php to http://www.japan-gamecharts.com/ps3.php
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20080912003609/http://www.japan-gamecharts.com:80/psp.php to http://www.japan-gamecharts.com/psp.php

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

Cheers.—<sup style="color:green;font-family:Courier;">cyberbot II <sub style="margin-left:-14.9ex;color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS;"> Talk to my owner :Online 16:25, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

Final Fantasy sales need updating
Sales for FFX, FFX-2 and XIII should be updated.

Square Enix announced in 2013 that FFX & X-2 have sold over 14 millions copies worldwide: http://www.jp.square-enix.com/company/ja/news/2013/html/cea4547d66edba7a424ff516c8715511.html

FFXIII also sold a lot more than 2.97 on PS3. It's total console sales is 6.6 million. Asian sales are over 800,000.


 * Information about sales should come from reliable secondary sources, not from a primary source like Square Enix. We can use primary sources for uncontroversial information like a release date, but sales figures would certainly be controversial. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 23:21, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

Request to add Xbox One million sellers
http://news.xbox.com/2016/01/04/greatest-games-extends-to-2016/

Halo 5: Guardians, Rise of the Tomb Raider, Forza Motorsport 6 and Gears of War: Ultimate Edition sold over a million.
 * Done. NotJim99 (talk) 21:26, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

Nintendo vs VG Chartz
I need to point out that in the DS list, Animal Crossing: Wild World is listed at 12.11 million, a number given by VG Chartz (http://www.vgchartz.com/game/82/animal-crossing-wild-world/), however, in the source which is Nintendo themselves, it's listed as 11.74 million. This 12.11 million from VG Chartz needs to be reverted back to 11.74 from Nintendo, as the source is directly from Nintendo. Thank you.2602:304:CFD3:2EE0:A848:8E64:D715:5571 (talk) 18:24, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

Counter-Strike: Global Offensive, 20 million sels.
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive, Hits 20 million sells. Source: [] Can now be placed in the list "Games across all platforms that have sold at least 15 million copies, across multiple platforms" Can be placed in the list "PC games for Microsoft Windows, OS X, and Linux platforms that have sold or shipped at least five million copies"

---

Left 4 Dead 2: Hits 14 million sells. Source: []. Can be placed in the list "PC games for Microsoft Windows, OS X, and Linux platforms that have sold or shipped at least five million copies" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.242.231.131 (talk) 22:40, 26 March 2016 (UTC)

Request to remove Minecraft: Pocket Edition from Single Platform Best-Sellers
It has released on multiple platforms, and even in the description it states the platforms it has been on, which shows that it isn't a single platform game. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.177.219.37 (talk) 17:54, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

Dissonance between lists
I've noticed some strange dissonance between many of the lists, for "The Sims" series in particular (there may be other such odd differences between lists, this is just one I noticed). All the Sims games were sold on Windows and Macs, making them single platform games and PC games, so they fall on these two lists plus the one for all platforms. The Sims 2, in the multi-platform list, is shown to have sold more copies than the original Sims, yet on the single platform list, only the original Sims is listed, when logically The Sims 2 should be there too, higher up. More strangely, the sales numbers are completely different in the PC games article, making the Sims 2 seem like it sold less than the Sims 1 or the Sims 3, with differing numbers being presented from the single and multi-platform lists for The Sims 1 in addition to that.

I'll fix the single platform section once I'm done with typing this, but both sources for the PC list and all platforms list are apparently considered reliable sources, so we need to find which is more accurate. Moreover, people need to check for more of these differences between these lists so that they can be consistent and reliable. I put this on the talk page so we can discuss these issues, so hopefully you all can help with this. IAmACowWhoIsMad (talk) 04:10, 26 April 2016 (UTC)

The GTA V number is techinically wrong
65 million copies were shipped. Technically that's not the same thing as sold copies. Hgleobr (talk) 19:59, 19 May 2016 (UTC)

This page is a disaster
What's going on with the transcluded pages? (Not a good idea—look at the ref errors.) If we're going to include so many consoles on one page, we need to look at reducing the number of entries in each list. Also the tiny text is not okay for the main tables... czar 15:28, 30 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Yeah I have no idea why there is a big list that separates pre-SNES consoles to post-SNES consoles. It is just strange. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.108.68.122 (talk) 10:36, 31 May 2016 (UTC)

Minecraft Is At 100 Million Copies Sold
At least according to this article 79.181.241.25 (talk) 13:25, 2 June 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 June 2016
Remove TI Programmable calculators from the multi-platform Tetris listing because there are no paid downloads or official versions of the game for that platform.

73.36.10.189 (talk) 19:56, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Done. --SubSeven (talk) 20:54, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 June 2016
Change OS X in the Minecraft section to Mac OS X to clear up confusion.

71.244.147.252 (talk) 19:23, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Not done:. OS X is the official name. Note that the main article is titled OS X. --SubSeven (talk) 21:00, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Tetris is counting mobile scores
I don't care about editing wikipedia but why is Tetris at the top if it's counting mobile scores? Even as something that is an arcade game counting mobile scores just shoots it up while mobile games like Angry Birds have like 3 billion sales. If it's going to be on the list, either other mobile games should or the mobile numbers shouldn't be counted if you ask me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.67.194.98 (talk) 03:50, 9 June 2016 (UTC)
 * Mobile games aren't being excluded in any way.  --SubSeven (talk) 04:43, 9 June 2016 (UTC)

Add World of Warcraft at 14,500,000 copies
Add World of Warcraft to this article with 14,500,000 copies sold. http://www.statisticbrain.com/blizzard-entertainment-statistics/ Also you may want to include total gross sales to date in currency values.

Johncgoff (talk) 16:31, 20 June 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 June 2016
All of the article below NES has been put into the the NES table, in the 'Punch Out!' row. Someone'll want to take the article out of the table.

82.5.114.150 (talk) 20:34, 24 June 2016 (UTC)
 * Should be fixed now. — Andy W.  ( talk  · ctb) 22:55, 24 June 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 8 July 2016
Add Angry Birds to the list, which has sold 2 billion games according to https://www.vg247.com/2014/01/22/angry-birds-downloaded-2-billion-times-has-as-many-maus-as-twitter/

20:57, 8 July 2016 (UTC)20:57, 8 July 2016 (UTC)20:57, 8 July 2016 (UTC)20:57, 8 July 2016 (UTC)~
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: Angry Birds is already listed in the list. Sir Joseph <sup style="color:green;">(talk) 18:55, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

What does "Single Platform" mean?
If Minecraft Pocket Edition is found on mobile, Android, iOS, Windows Phone, Amazon Fire TV, and Raspberry Pi, what does "single platform" mean? That list contains multiple platforms from multiple hardware developers.2600:8800:7480:1500:654A:4B66:7CDE:89FC (talk) 01:15, 22 July 2016 (UTC)

Pokemon Go
n this list there isn't Pokemon Go. Dawid2009 (talk) 13:38, 31 July 2016 (UTC)

Overwatch
Overwatch shpuld be added in the All Platforms - Multi platforms list as it has sold 15 million copies across all platforms. Reference:- https://www.engadget.com/2016/08/05/overwatch-15-million-players/

151.231.206.225 (talk) 12:26, 5 August 2016 (UTC)

Overwatch has hit the 15 million mark
I believe we swhould add it in to this site since it is now on par as top 50 best selling games of all time. http://www.polygon.com/2016/8/4/12382000/overwatch-15-million-players Douggiek26 (talk) 16:54, 5 August 2016 (UTC)

Rocket League has hit 19 million players
I believe we should add this game in. https://www.vg247.com/2016/07/19/rocket-league-now-has-19-million-players/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Easportsforever (talk • contribs) 04:20, 24 August 2016 (UTC)

Call of Duty sales need updating
http://www.statista.com/statistics/321374/global-all-time-unit-sales-call-of-duty-games/


 * Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 with 30.78 million sales
 * Call of Duty: Black Ops with 30.34 million sales
 * Call of Duty: Black Ops II with 29.69 million sales
 * Call of Duty: Ghosts with 27.73 million sales
 * Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 with 25.05 million sales
 * Call of Duty: Black Ops III with 23.88 million sales
 * Call of Duty: Advanced Warfare with 21.77 million sales
 * Call of Duty: Modern Warfare with 17.16 million sales
 * Call of Duty: World at War with 14.93 million sales — Preceding unsigned comment added by Billyanderson9 (talk • contribs) 15:53, 5 September 2016 (UTC)

Terraria
As of July 2016, Terraria has sold over 18 million copies — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.117.195.189 (talk) 23:29, 9 September 2016 (UTC)

Overwatch sold 15 million copies
Blizzard made an official statement about the Overwatch copies sold on the @PlayOverwatch Twitter account.

To the table "Multi-platform" Overwatch should be addet.

Title: Overwatch Release year: 2016 System(s): Windows, Xbox One, PlayStation 4 Copies sold / Paid downloads: 15 million

Source: https://twitter.com/PlayOverwatch/status/761317633979539456

DefsIO (talk) 02:00, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Twitter is not a reliable source. -- MorbidEntree - (Talk to me! (っ◕‿◕)っ♥) (please reply using &#x7B;&#x7B;ping&#x7D;&#x7D;) 05:25, 10 August 2016 (UTC)

Here is a forbes article: http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2016/08/04/overwatch-now-has-over-15-million-players/ And a Polygon article: http://www.polygon.com/2016/8/4/12382000/overwatch-15-million-players But i don't get why an official statement made on twitter isn't a reliable source... I mean these articles took exactly this twitter post a the source for the articles. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DefsIO (talk • contribs) 13:05, 23 August 2016 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done Topher385 (talk) 16:43, 28 August 2016 (UTC)

Please do note that 15 million PLAYERS DOES NOT equal 15 million sales! This number includes resold copies of the game on consoles as well as the ability for multiple players to share the same game on the same console. It is unclear if the value also includes the 9 million free players during the beta/free weekend periods or not. Non of the sources actually claims the game was sold 15 million times. This is very important and I believe the addition of Overwatch should be reconsidered until Blizzard actually states 15 million copies SOLD, not 15 million PLAYERS. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.173.211.0 (talk) 15:12, 18 September 2016 (UTC)

Counter-Strike: Global Offensive needs to be added/updated
According to SteamSpy (http://steamspy.com/app/730), Counter-Strike: Global Offensive has sold a little bit over 23.5 million copies on Steam. It thus needs to be placed between Pokemon Gold and Silver and Mario Kart DS on the multiplatform list and on the PC games list.

67.206.114.140 (talk) 12:53, 7 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Steamspy is not a reliable source for sales figures, for numerous reasons including their own about us page. See further discussion at Talk:List of best-selling PC games. -- ferret (talk) 15:11, 7 October 2016 (UTC)

Sonic 1 Sales
I was under the impression Sonic 1 sold 4 million - http://www.ign.com/articles/2009/03/20/genesis-vs-snes-by-the-numbers

The citation on the page is linked to a youtube video, but is not available in my country. So I can't view it to see if I agree with the source. :/FightersMegamix (talk) 06:06, 10 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I can't view it either. Sonic the Hedgehog (1991 video game) uses the same source. My gut feeling is that the video meant to refer to 15 million for the entire series, not original Genesis Sonic 1 cartridges... -- ferret (talk) 11:44, 10 October 2016 (UTC)
 * No, it refers to Sonic 1 sales. Its an interview excerpt with, if memory serves, Shinobu Toyoda who states they sold 15 million Genesis systems in North America bundled with Sonic 1. Indrian (talk) 16:24, 10 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Sega Saturn Magazine gave a similar estimate of 14 million in August 1997.TheTimesAreAChanging (talk) 05:50, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

The Witcher 3 10.000.000 copies, but in all formats, not only PC
The Witcher 3 10.000.000 copies, but in all formats, not only PC

The Witcher 3 dind't reach 10 million copies in PC platform. The supossed "source" doesn't mention the platform, but obviously was used in a general, multi-platform perspective. If you simply follow the article hyperlinks, you can check how is obviously the total number in all platforms, searching a bit in internet is easy to check more accurately, 10 millions copies is the total number for all platforms (of a total of 20.000.000 in entire The Witcher series). If you search only a little could see the distribution of sales between consoles and PC too, with the 70% on consoles and 30% on pc, when the copies sold were 4 million.

Sources:

https://gamerant.com/the-witcher-3-sales-pc-consoles-125/

http://www.dsogaming.com/news/the-witcher-3-out-of-its-4-million-sold-copies-1-3-million-were-from-the-pc-version/

If the really unusual 2015 tendency in PC sales (overwhelmingly dominated by steam), in wich GOG The Witcher 3 sales owned more than 50% meanwhile Steam really less (less than a 40%?), we can make some speculations on actual numbers: Right now we have 2.200.000 TW3 owners on steam, so we could have 5.000.000 or more PC  copies of 10.000.000 total in all platforms that is the usual distribution in videogame industry.

I really think that the PC buying tendencies are not only different to consoles in regard to the chosen format (digital over physic), but in timing too: The PC users buy a lot of games months (and sometimes years) after the release, far more than in consoles. The ultra-consumerist /hype style of buying videogames exist in every format, but is less usual in PC (but we have great examples of people buying... "obscure things" only by hype in PC, ex: No Man's Sky).

For example, when Skyrim reach the 20.000.000 copies, back in 2013, we "only" had 6.000.000 steam owners (+ another digital formats + physical copies)... Right now, we have 11.572.000 owners, only on Steam.

In any case, doesn't exist a single source that expose these 10.000.000 The Witcher 3 copies number only for PC. This is the total number of copies in all formats.

--87.219.130.90 (talk) 09:20, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I suspect this was meant for Talk:List of best-selling PC games, as this list does not care if they were PC sales or not. I'm confident the game has sold more than 1 million copies on PC, so it belongs on the list. However we need a solid reliable source to back an actual number. Dsogaming is currently considered unreliable but it was last evaluated by WP:VG/RS years ago. Steamspy cannot be used for these sales figures. I'll see if I can find a better source later on that mentions PC sales specifically. -- ferret (talk) 12:40, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Ey, no Ferret I wrote specifically for this article that has a subsection and list for every format, not only "general numbers", this general numbers of all formats is only the first subsection of this article. In the final part of article, at point 3, you can see The Witcher 3 suposedly 10 million (10 not 1) copies only on PC. And both, this subsection and the article that you cite, use the same wrong source for the specific PC numbers. I don't wrote here for contribute with the exact total numbers for PC (that we don't have, yet) but simply to point that this article and the another one that you cite use "general", multi-platform sales for lists of PC sales only. This is the source used to reference the number: http://www.gamespot.com/articles/witcher-3-ships-almost-10-million-copies-report/1100-6435592/ And there we can check not only the absence of PC specific numbers but the archive of the article is under the tags "playstation 4" or "xbox" too. So if you can erase this mention on the PC tables could be fine (because we don't have PC total numbers) and if you think The Witcher 3 can be here you could add to multi-platform list.


 * Sorry for my english --87.219.130.90 (talk) 01:16, 20 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I see what you mean. Both articles need fixed. I forgot to check into it last night but I will try to dig at it this weekend. -- ferret (talk) 12:51, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

I've lowered The Witcher 3 to 1.3 million copies, based on the best source we currently have available. Note, this article transcludes the table at List of best-selling PC games. Both lists have been updated as a result. -- ferret (talk) 23:20, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

The Oregon Trail
|Polygon reports that The Oregon Trail sold 65 million copies. I will add it if there are no objections. Phediuk (talk) 00:12, 3 November 2016 (UTC)
 * I'm going to tentatively object, as it appears the article is referring to all versions of the game, including multiple complete rewrites and re-releases. I don't think we can use that figures for any individual specific version of the game. -- ferret (talk) 00:16, 3 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Okay, but we have a multiplatform list already, and it includes games like Lemmings, which have also been remade from scratch for various platforms. The Oregon Trail seems appropriate for it. Phediuk (talk) 00:21, 3 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Hmm. If there's precedence, but it seems a little sketchy to add all the copies of 10 separate games that share the same name and concept but are otherwise separate releases... -- ferret (talk) 00:24, 3 November 2016 (UTC)
 * No "sketchier" than the games that are already on the list. Need for Speed: Most Wanted even includes the GBA and DS versions, which are completely different games from the console editions. And the top Tetris entry considers the NES and iOS versions to be the same. Phediuk (talk) 00:27, 3 November 2016 (UTC)

"Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Winter Games (Vancouver 2010)" on Wii sold 5.67 millions
Hello,

"Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Winter Games (Vancouver 2010)" on Wii sold 5,67 millions. This game is among the list of best-selling Wii video games. So can you put this game on the list of best-selling Wii video games? This is one of the popular Wii video games. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.22.104.9 (talk) 21:03, 8 November 2016 (UTC)
 * It's already in the list as Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Winter Games. -- ferret (talk) 22:05, 8 November 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 7 one external links on List of best-selling video games. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20111029232528/http://www.next-gen.biz/features/30-defining-moments-gaming to http://www.next-gen.biz/features/30-defining-moments-gaming
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070421003854/http://www.the-magicbox.com/Chart-USPlatinum.shtml to http://www.the-magicbox.com/Chart-USPlatinum.shtml
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100417223849/http://www.elspa.com/?i=3942 to http://www.elspa.com/?i=3942
 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.sega-16.com/feature_page.php?id=169&title=Interview:
 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.farsightstudios.com/games/nfl_98/index.htm
 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://sega.jp/archive/album/11_ecco/interview1.html
 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.gamedaily.com/articles/news/god-of-war-psp-dev-talks-about-ending-psp-development/?biz=1

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at ).

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 16:36, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Minecraft: PlayStation Vita Edition has reached 1 million units!
I'm also no Minecraft fan but if yo go to this link: http://www.siliconera.com/2016/12/30/week-sales-pokmon-sun-moon-closes-year-top/ It will show you sales for games in Japan and it says Minecraft of Vita has sold 1.01 million units. So can somebody put that in. (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 22:41, 30 December 2016 (UTC)

Civ V sale stats
The Civ V sale stats listet in this article are from 2014, and are therefore way of the actual sale numbers. According to an article from gamespot from 2015, the sale numbers were over 7 million (Civilization sale numbers 2015). In an article from vg247 from last year, the sale numbers har reached over 8 million (Civilization sale number 2016) and when you look at the numbers from steamspy (which are updated every day) Civ V have sold over 10 million copies (http://steamspy.com/app/8930).

Now I created this user to address this so I cannot edit the article yet since it has some protection, so if someone could update the numbers that would be nice. — Preceding unsigned comment added by VimiZap (talk • contribs) 10:46, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately we can't use these sources. The Gamespot reference above is a forum, referencing Steamspy. Forums are unreliable sources (WP:USERG), and Steamspy provides estimates only, not hard sales figures (See Steamspy's own about page). I almost incorporated vg247, but I'm concerned with how they phrase it, "8 million being Civilization V plus expansions". The inclusion of expansions makes this number a little vague. -- ferret (talk) 14:59, 8 January 2017 (UTC)

RuneScape category?
Which thing does RuneScape or other online games go under? It has millions of players.--99.33.187.137 (talk) 00:31, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

Overwatch sold 25 million copies
here is the cite

https://twitter.com/PlayOverwatch/status/824757676693270529?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

update list please — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2605:E000:3511:EB00:4107:1CA:2B8C:7F99 (talk) 06:57, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

Sega Master System
Why isn't there a list for the best selling games of the Master System? Does this mean none of the system's games sold a million copies? 47.152.93.124 (talk) 02:37, 14 February 2017 (UTC)

Terraria
I don't actually have a source, but the Terraria article claims the game sold 18 million copies (presumably across all platforms). Feels like one of these two articles should be edited - not sure which. BanunterX (talk) 21:06, 14 February 2017 (UTC)

Terraria recently released official stats of copies sold across all platforms in a forum post on the official site.

In the post they list the platforms that is tracked in this statistic: PC/Mac/Linux, Xbox 360, Xbox One, PS3, PS VITA, PS4, Nintendo 3DS, Wii U, iOS, Android, Windows Phone, and Amazon mobile devices.

DrFair (talk) 01:33, 18 February 2017 (UTC)

Invalid cite ref errors
There are multiple "Cite error: Invalid tag;" errors on this page. It seems that most of them come from transcluded pages with identical refs.

One approach to fix these is simply to rename the refs on the individual transcluded pages. This would result in some identical refs being shown separately on this page, but at least without the big red errors.

Is there any other sensible solution? --David Edgar (talk) 18:00, 5 March 2017 (UTC)
 * If they are the same reference, just replace them all with the most complete cite. It shouldn't change once fixed, the main issue comes from them having been added to each list individually. If they are actually different references, then I agree, rename some of them. -- ferret (talk) 18:54, 5 March 2017 (UTC)

Pokémon Go
What about Pokémon Go? Isn´t it one of the most popular games of our times? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.122.56.97 (talk) 11:54, 8 March 2017 (UTC)
 * It's a free to play game however, and this list is in regards to units sold, which can't be calculated for a F2P game. There might be 10 million users, but only 100,000 of them ever spent any money on the game, etc, etc. There's no way to convert it to "units sold". -- ferret (talk) 12:28, 8 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Do we have any sort of "List of most played/highest grossing free-to-play video games"? If not, then we probably should. ~ Dissident93  ( talk ) 18:42, 14 April 2017 (UTC)
 * There is a list for crowdfunded games and highest budget games, but I don't think there is one for microtransaction/F2P games at this time. -- ferret (talk) 00:39, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

Tetris
Currently, the Gameboy tetris is listed separately from the tetris entry covering a lot of different consoles including the Gameboy. What should happen about that? Y0shimari0 (talk) 14:40, 5 April 2017 (UTC)


 * Its listed on both, one is for games per platform, the other is for titles across all platforms. --KnightMiner (t/c) 01:31, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

Minecraft: PS Vita Edition Sales needs to be updated to 1.14 sales!
Minecraft' sales have been updated in Media Create Sales on the Vita. I would update the list myself but I don't have a Wikipedia account to do that. Source is here for the sales update: http://gematsu.com/2017/04/media-create-sales-41017-41617 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.49.12.50 (talk) 03:38, 20 April 2017 (UTC)

Overwatch needs to be removed
I'm not exactly sure how many sales Overwatch has reached, but it surely isn't 30 million. I believe the reason why it was listed on the list was the misconception of its "30 million players" achievement. 30 million players doesn't automatically mean 30 million units sold given that Activision/Blizzard offered a couple of "free to play" weekends where users would be able to play the game for free for a limited time. Until Activsion gives actual data on how many the game sold, Overwatch should be removed from the list.2602:306:C5B4:5E09:99B7:AB8A:96CC:9E14 (talk) 00:40, 5 May 2017 (UTC)
 * This topic is somewhat under discussion at WP:VG at this time. -- ferret (talk) 12:02, 5 May 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 May 2017
Overwatch is not listed here, even though it passed the 30,000,000 copies sold mark in April of 2017. Link to the Overwatch article here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overwatch_(video_game)#Commercial_reception I would like to request that Overwatch be added to the page. SyncHeart (talk) 02:51, 21 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done for now: I guess you're referring to Kotick's quote in the original press release, of 30 million? It seems reasonable on its face to include it here, since I believe that's a directly correlation to sales, but maybe someone else has a different opinion/understanding. Izno (talk) 01:20, 26 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Read the discussion literally right above this. Andre666 (talk) 08:31, 26 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the template. Izno (talk) 13:25, 26 May 2017 (UTC)

Saturn and Dreamcast
Wow. I see this whole page was redone. How come Saturn and Dreamcast were completely removed? Genesis/MD gets its own page, but not those two?69.108.67.125 (talk) 21:35, 14 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Saturn and Dreamcast only had a few games in their lists, which did not constitute being made into their own articles. If we are able to find a top 20 or so, with proper sources, then we could create these in the future. Andre666 (talk) 10:08, 15 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Well, they if we are only going by million sellers, there wont be much, given the systems themselves only sold 9 million. I could do a Top 20 Saturn, but it would be limited to Japan, and only one of them would be a millionaire. I guess they are too niche for their own pages, but I do feel a lot of my research has been wiped out as I did spend a lot of time researching Saturn sales.69.108.67.125 (talk) 22:15, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

Roblox isn't own the list
It has 38 million downloads and free sales IMCERTAINLYNOTFAMOUS (talk) 16:06, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * This is the list of best-selling video games, not the list of most downloaded. -- ferret (talk) 16:07, 16 June 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 August 2017
https://steamspy.com/ According to SteamSpy Counter-Strike:Global Offensive has 31,162,531 copies but it is not on the list. I would insert CS:GO into the table. 94.173.132.111 (talk) 09:28, 1 August 2017 (UTC)


 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: SteamSpy is not a reliable source for sales figures. It is an sampled estimate of copies owned only. -- ferret (talk) 11:55, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Tetris
I have taken the liberty of changing Tetris to 170 million, for a number of reasons. Firstly, the main Tetris article itself mentions 170 million, with the 425 million mobile figure nowhere to be found there. Secondly, the 425 million figure comes exclusively from a single primary source, Henk Rogers, and has never been backed by any independent sources other than Rogers, or by any official press releases from EA or Blue Planet Software. Thirdly, Tetris had sold 100 million mobile downloads through to 2010, according to official confirmation from EA and Blue Planet Software. And yet, in 2014, Rogers claims that it sold 425 million, which would mean it would've quadrupled in sales, selling an additional 325 million in four years between 2010 and 2014, which is highly implausible. If it really did sell that many, then there should've been some kind of press release from EA or Blue Planet Software to confirm it, or independent mobile app trackers backing that number up, yet all we have is just a single claim from Rogers in an interview on the VentureBeat website. The 425 million mobile number looks highly dubious, so I've changed it to the earlier 100 million mobile number (170 million overall), which is the last officially confirmed mobile number, in line with the Tetris article. Maestro2016 (talk) 13:01, 23 August 2017 (UTC)
 * Makes sense to me, I was always very taken aback by the 425 million number, so it makes sense that it would be potentially inflated (or his definition is much wider). I am just going to clear up the source, but thank you for clarifying this. Andre666 (talk) 13:45, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

What about Overwatch?
I believe that Overwatch should be included in this list because the number of players has already exceeded 30 million, consequently already having that amount of copies sold, as well as some other games also like Rocket League for example. https://www.pcgamesn.com/overwatch/overwatch-sales-numbers — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2804:7F0:A090:A4A4:A9F3:779A:546C:2B7F (talk) 16:06, 25 August 2017 (UTC)
 * The problem is that the sources all say things like "registered accounts" or "players", not sales. This makes it difficult to add to an article that requires direct verification of "sales". -- ferret (talk) 16:09, 25 August 2017 (UTC)

Hexic
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexic

"A variation of the game called Hexic HD was later developed by Microsoft Game Studios (since renamed Microsoft Studios) and Carbonated Games for the Xbox 360, and comes preinstalled on all Xbox 360 hard drives as part of the Xbox Live Arcade service;"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360_sales

Worldwide 	84 million as of August 23, 2016 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 171.4.4.147 (talk) 07:34, 26 August 2017 (UTC)
 * This is basically WP:OR to claim 84 million sales. It would also be a different version from the original that essentially was never sold, and was only provided as a free offering with XLA. -- ferret (talk) 13:45, 26 August 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 30 August 2017
Include Overwatch in the list as it has over 30 million copies sold - therefore placing it at 11th place. ArekZajac (talk) 15:09, 30 August 2017 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. — nihlus kryik   ( talk ) 15:30, 30 August 2017 (UTC)
 * Please see the discussion just above you on this talk page, where this has already been rejected. Andre666 (talk) 15:40, 30 August 2017 (UTC)

Black Ops III
I think Call of Duty: Black Ops III can make this list because in vgchartz.com says that the game has 15 million copies for the PS4 version only — Preceding unsigned comment added by Costas theodorou7 (talk • contribs) 16:43, 16 September 2017 (UTC)
 * VGCharts and Steamspy are unreliable sources for hard sales figures. -- ferret (talk) 16:44, 16 September 2017 (UTC)

New Super Mario Bros (DS)
The game was included with the console as part of a special promotion. I know for a fact that Walmart and Sam's Club carried the bundle because I bought it at Sam's. 71.68.48.232 (talk) 22:03, 29 October 2017 (UTC) whatami

Semi-protected edit request on 30 October 2017
Nintendo's IR Information has been updated which include updated sales figures for 3DS and Wii games. The updates sales figures can be found here: https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/finance/software/index.html.

The games that require an update are:
 * Wii Sports
 * Mario Kart Wii
 * Wii Sports Resort
 * New Super Mario Bros. Wii
 * Wii Fit Plus
 * Pokémon X and Y
 * Mario Kart 7
 * Pokémon Sun and Moon Stefvanschie (talk) 10:09, 30 October 2017 (UTC)
 * ✅. Prefall  10:32, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

Tetris
Why does Tetris count its cell phone sales? Those 100 million sales should not be on this list. Brankestein (talk) 15:53, 27 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Why not? This is best-selling video games, not best-selling non-mobile video games. I'd go so far as to say that pointing out "mobile downloads" is unnecessary. They are still sales. -- ferret (talk) 16:00, 27 November 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 November 2017
Add Rainbow Six Siege. It sold more than 25 Milion copies and isnt even on this list "https://venturebeat.com/2017/11/07/rainbow-six-siege-quietly-captures-25-million-players/" and its also featured in its wikipedia article "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Clancy%27s_Rainbow_Six_Siege" Major.Blackbird (talk) 15:13, 24 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: Unfortunately, Ubisoft is announcing registered players, not copies sold. This coupled with multiple free "try it out" weekends means that "25 million players" does not equate to "25 million units sold". The main article also carefully denotes this as "registered players" and not sales. -- ferret (talk) 16:08, 27 November 2017 (UTC)

Correction
Grand Theft Auto: Vice City has sold over 20 million copies take a look (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Theft_Auto:_Vice_City) And Grand Theft Auto III has sold over 17 million copies take a look (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Theft_Auto_III) But you wrote that Grand Theft Auto: Vice City has sold 17 million and Grand Theft Auto III sales are not exicted in the list? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.219.70.34 (talk) 06:44, 2 December 2017 (UTC)
 * As far as I can tell, the figures in the lead sections of those articles were incorrect. I've changed them to what the latest citations in their articles state, which is 17.5m for Vice City and 14.5m for III. Prefall  06:56, 2 December 2017 (UTC)

Need for Speed: Underground
Need for Speed: Underground ultimately sold 15 million copies worldwide (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Need_for_Speed:_Underground) and that was not in your list? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.219.70.34 (talk) 07:28, 2 December 2017 (UTC)

Overwatch
I was looking forward to see the position of the games here and i didn't see overwacth, overwatch has sold 35 milion copies and i would like to see it added just like destiny 2 that has 18 milion copies and it surpasses soem of the games on the list — Preceding unsigned comment added by MininoMan (talk • contribs) 08:33, 19 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Please provide a reliable source for the sales figures. One of the issues we often have is that the company does not report sales, but instead "registered players", which is not the same thing. -- ferret (talk) 12:34, 19 December 2017 (UTC)

Overwatch
According to the most recent figures Overwatch has at least 35 million active players, and by extension copies sold. It should be on the list. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overwatch_(video_game)

"A week from its launch, Blizzard reported over 7 million Overwatch players with a total accumulated playtime of 119 million hours; Blizzard reported more than 10 million players by mid-June, and has reported continued increases in the player base, with 35 million players as of October 2017." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:306:32CD:5AE0:190A:3CB6:D9E0:2B89 (talk) 07:41, 23 December 2017 (UTC)
 * See my response to the section on Overwatch directly above this one... -- ferret (talk) 14:15, 23 December 2017 (UTC)

Call of Duty
https://www.statista.com/statistics/321374/global-all-time-unit-sales-call-of-duty-games/ All time unit sales of selected games in Call of Duty franchise worldwide as of January 2018 (in millions) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Costas theodorou7 (talk • contribs) 10:20, 10 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Statista is not reliable. They pull stats from other sites and simply rehost them in graph form. In this case (and others) they pulled the data from VGChartz, which is unreliable for sales figures and has been known to have incorrect and inflated values. -- ferret (talk) 14:11, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 13 February 2018
Sonic the hedgehog is Multi-platform game. Is avaible on Steam too. 86.49.14.254 (talk) 00:47, 13 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate.  JTP (talk • contribs) 01:31, 13 February 2018 (UTC)
 * In emulated format, which doesn't count. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 06:25, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

Playerunknown's Battlegrounds on Xbox One
PUBG is available on the Xbox One yet the listing for it just states that it is available for Microsoft Windows. -- https://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/playerunknowns-battlegrounds — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:100C:B22E:2478:2494:AD45:D0BA:52F1 (talk) 18:24, 8 January 2018 (UTC)
 * I fixed it, and combined both sales numbers. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 06:26, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds Bundle Request
Please change PlayerUnknown's BattleGrounds to being packaged with a console in it's lifetime, as is it now sold as a bundle with the Xbox One, and therefore should be edited to reflect this. Source: https://www.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/consoles/xbox-one-s/playerunknowns-battlegrounds-1tb InoriAizawa (talk) 16:55, 2 March 2018 (UTC)
 * ✅ ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 08:24, 3 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Might be worthwhile to add a note that this happened after it had already sold 34 million. -- ferret (talk) 14:31, 3 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Sure, but the key says "during its lifetime", so it's not technically misleading either. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 23:59, 3 March 2018 (UTC)

Minecraft
Another citation of the 144 million figure courtesy of Games Industry - Accessed 16th March 2018: https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2018-03-15-microsoft-were-growing-our-gaming-business-beyond-the-console

Hope this helps *<:@) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 51.7.246.209 (talk) 15:23, 16 March 2018 (UTC)


 * ✅ – Nixinova ⟨ T | E ⟩ 19:58, 16 March 2018 (UTC)

SteamSpy
The sales listed for PubG is according to SteamSpy. But SteamSpy doesn't show accurate sales number. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:List_of_best-selling_PC_games#SteamSpy for better understanding. Instead, the sales should be 24 million by http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/42320076/pubg-creator-says-games-need-better-protection-from-copycat-titles which has official confirmation. So, the total sales should be 29 million instead of 35 million.--Skylord wars (talk) 05:03, 1 April 2018 (UTC)
 * The rules regarding SteamSpy-sourced numbers are inconsistent. They are allowed in the game's respective articles, but apparently not in these lists. Either we allow them (via way of reliable sources reporting on them) or not at all. Also, while SteamSpy may not show exact numbers, there is no way they are off by 5 million. Could somebody ask Greene on Twitter for an updated sales count? ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 20:08, 1 April 2018 (UTC)

Sonic the hedgehog 15 million including mobile
Sonic the hedgehog sold 4 million on the genesis (http://www.listal.com/list/bestselling-genesis-mega-drive) and (http://www.vgchartz.com/platform/16/sega-genesis/) the 15 million includes mobile sells. I point this out years ago. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:3C5:8200:B79:2923:6D0F:A3EA:7FF8 (talk) 17:46, 24 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Nether of these are reliable sources. Did you read the note at the top of the page? ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 19:20, 24 March 2018 (UTC)
 * I've done research and most sources prior to 2011 seem to show that it sold 4.34 million on the genesis, he is probably right that the 15 million probably includes other formats.

EDIT: I think some research needs to be done. I found a Mobile news source that says it sold eight million on mobile (https://www.mobilemarketer.com/ex/mobilemarketer/cms/news/gaming/1080.html)--Fruitloop11 (talk) 01:20, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

--Fruitloop11 (talk) 01:00, 25 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Not listed at WP:VG/RS either. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 05:08, 25 March 2018 (UTC)
 * What does that have to do with what I said? I said more research needs to be done. I didn't say my source is reliable and should be included in the article. Also FYI the source is reliable read WP:SOURCE--Fruitloop11 (talk) 05:11, 25 March 2018 (UTC)
 * How does linking to potentially unreliable sources help? If no source on WP:VG/RS reports on the same numbers, then it shouldn't be added. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 21:10, 29 March 2018 (UTC)
 * The fifteen million figure comes from an interview with Sega employee Shinobu Toyoda on Gametap as part of a Sonic retrospective, in which he says that Sega of America sold fifteen million Genesis systems bundled with Sonic. Obviously the game sold more than 4 million copies considering it was bundled with a console that sold well north of 4 million units. Indrian (talk) 21:42, 29 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks, but that still doesn't say anything about the eight million on mobile. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 22:13, 29 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Right, I have no opinion on how that is handled. Toyoda may also not be correct on Sonic sales, though they are certainly higher than 4 million.  Its possible that 4 million is unbundled sales, but I have never seen what I would consider a reliable source for an unbundled figure.  I just wanted to point out that no one got to 15 million by adding console and mobile sales. Indrian (talk) 02:33, 30 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Just to expand a bit on what Indrian said, while Sonic was bundled with the Genesis for a long time and is an extremely common game, the 15 million figure is conveniently round and not necessarily something we should accept as gospel truth unless/until Sega ever releases its official sales data. If all of those 15 million were bundled, that would imply that more than half of the 27 million Genesis units sold by Sega outside Japan were bundled with Sonic 1. Does that sound roughly in the right ballpark? Maybe—but we do have to bear in mind that the original "Model 1" or "Model III" Genesis (not to be confused with Majesco's "Model 3") sold a bare minimum of 500,000 units bundled with Altered Beast in the U.S. before Sonic became the pack-in, and that the "Model 2" Genesis—released in late 1993—was bundled with Sonic 2 rather than the first game. (Of course, I'm not suggesting that literally all of the 15 million would have been bundled.) On the other hand, Toyoda's recollection is largely corroborated by Sega Saturn Magazine, August 1997, p. 68, which states: "The original Megadrive game sold over 14 million copies." (While it's hard to say for sure where SSM got that number from, in its Sonic Jam review, the magazine published—on other occasions, at least—what appear to have been official sales data provided to it by Sega.) Therefore, an estimated 14–15 million units sold is reliably sourced on its face, but more information is needed to verify it. A 2011 recollection by a former high-ranking Sega of America employee and a 1997 blurb in a magazine licensed by Sega are not equivalent to the exact sales figures that Nintendo routinely publicizes.TheTimesAreAChanging (talk) 03:25, 30 March 2018 (UTC)
 * The BBC source doesn’t even say if the 15 million is only genesis sales or sales on all Platforms including mobile.--Fruitloop11 (talk) 10:00, 6 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Again, forget this BBC source. Gametap is the original source, which is what the Sonic article itself cites.  And that is console only.  You really think a game that was bundled with a console that sold tens of millions of units sold only 4 million units? Indrian (talk) 12:40, 6 April 2018 (UTC)
 * If that was the case the sales of sonic 2 would be over 10 million it was packaged as well.and even if that is true why aren’t mobile sale included to the 15 million?--2601:3C5:8200:B79:19BE:FC39:D6C5:23F1 (talk) 09:43, 7 April 2018 (UTC)

Siege
So, another "players registered" entry. It's important to note off the bat the source even calls this out: "or how many of those registered players come from free weekend promotions" -- ferret (talk) 10:32, 29 March 2018 (UTC)
 * I still think we at least need a new, separate list for this sort of thing (download numbers, account numbers, subscriptions). Perhaps even merge the two in the future if consensus goes with that. Would you or anybody else be willing to help with that? ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 21:08, 29 March 2018 (UTC)
 * I'd be interested in contributing Masterfireheart (talk) 16:38, 30 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Thinking of starting a sandbox version of it soon. Guess I'll ask WT:VG before I start incase there is a large consensus opposing it. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 00:47, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

Ubisoft Rainbow Six Siege has reached 29,000,000 sales — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jefars715 (talk • contribs) 13:01, 17 April 2018 (UTC)
 * No, it hasn't. It's reach 29,000,000 registered players, as noted already here this is an issue that still needs a solution. -- ferret (talk) 13:49, 17 April 2018 (UTC)

Review of the entire page
This page seems to have multiple discrepancies, missing entries, inconsistencies and incorrect statistics.

Examples: 'Tetris' entry has included every single variant of Tetris on every platform, including as best I can tell, remakes and alternative versions. Source websites are news articles that do not cite their own sources.

Counterstrike and Counterstrike Global Offensive are missing from the list, both with 25m+ sales each as of 2016. ( according to steamspy ).

World of Warcraft is missing from the list. ( As per Diablo III's entries which combines base game and expansion sales figures, that puts WoW total sales at 56.5 million copies sold as per blizzard entertainment statistics. )

That's just what I've found in 10 minutes of cursory Google searching. I'm currently not able to make the edits myself because of it's semi-protected status, but the entire list more or less needs to be wiped clean and started again from scratch, and the sources need to be heavily filtered before being accepted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Saltyspecula (talk • contribs) 02:01, 18 April 2018 (UTC) They're reliable enough to be used for other entries in the list apparently, making your sarcastic "point" moot. Get to it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Saltyspecula (talk • contribs) 05:48, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Funny how say sources need to be heavily filtered, then suggest using two unreliable sources (Steamspy and statisticbrain) ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 04:57, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Actually they've both regularly been removed everytime they've been added.... Neither is reliable, as Statisticbrain never has original stats and primarily just rehosts data from VGChartz (Definitely unreliable), and Steamspy is becoming defunct anyways (No actual sales data, just estimates from public profiles).-- ferret (talk) 10:22, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
 * I did rewrite the list from scratch, conducting in-depth research and looking at all other lists on Wikipedia to cross-reference sources. If there are reliable sources given for any other games, we will add them. Andre666 (talk) 10:32, 18 April 2018 (UTC)

World of Warcraft: Over 100 million accounts. ( You must buy a copy of the base game at least to have an account, meaning 100m+ sales of the base game alone ), straight from the World of Warcraft website as an official Blizzard publication. So could we get WoW added to that list please? Should slot in at #3 on that list. However, that publication is nearly 3 expansions old so many millions more have been sold since then. But that's what we've got to work with.

Statista first day of release WoW expansion pack sales If we also include expac sales like Diablo III does on the list already, we can also use these to at least add in the 'first day sales' that Blizzard has publicly released totaling 17.8 million. So in total, we're looking at the still completely wrong, but at least statistically and publicly confirmed amount of 117.8 million. The real number, while not publicly announced, will be much. MUCH higher than that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Saltyspecula (talk • contribs) 12:06, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Sales are defined as physical or digital purchases of a game. When Blizzard says "100 million players", there is no way of confirming whether that means that 100 million copies of the game were literally sold. What about hackers and people who torrent the game? There are no doubt millions of people with illegitimately created accounts, so until they say "we have sold X million copies", we can't include it. Even then, you'd need a reliable third party source. See WP:RS. Also, you cannot simply add up expansions of a game and make a conclusion as to sales. See WP:OR. Sorry! Andre666 (talk) 12:50, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
 * WoW has long supported starter accounts that don't require purchase, and those are typically included in "registered player" counts. We shouldn't be conflating sales of Xpac together such as "WoW Classic + TBC + Wrath + etc = Some Grand Total", as it includes duplicate sales where a player has bought all items. Blizzard doesn't release sales data much anymore, and WoW doesn't have firm enough numbers that would place it in the top 50. Diablo III's listing is a weak one and should probably be reconsidered. -- ferret (talk) 13:06, 18 April 2018 (UTC)

You can't just "torrent" a subscription based MMO's files and somehow... Magically end up with an account. Hacking Blizzard's own databases to create an account for yourself? That's a massive accusation of fraud and theft of which is extremely questionable at best. Please provide irrefutable evidence to back up your claim. Considering Blizzard's financial team would very quickly notice that account numbers weren't matching revenue, I'm going to say that claim is outright wrong. Any company it did happen to would be onto that kind of activity immediately.

That's also not conflating sales numbers, those numbers are purely of each expansion by itself as one item in it's first 24 hours of retail release. If they bought the battle chest or some sort of bundle with the base game, then it's another sale of the game. However, again this site is only tracking a single retail statistic: "Did a sale involve this expansion pack during it's first day? Yes? Add it to the chart."

While I'm trying to be reasonable about this, I'm frankly baffled at the nature of the incredulous excuses being offered as to why World of Warcraft should be kept off this list, and despite multiple admissions that the existing sourcing and numbers are flawed of many of the other entries on this list, no attempt is being made to change them. It's starting to become pretty clear that there are a lot of questionable people here who intend to enforce a factually wrong status quo for some reason. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Saltyspecula (talk • contribs) 14:03, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Well, I guess remain baffled and incredulous. You've already been informed that the unreliable sources you offered are in fact NOT being used on this list, and had an editor (myself) agree that the Diablo III listing is questionable. What more do you want? -- ferret (talk) 14:09, 18 April 2018 (UTC)

You just can't read, can you? No -YOUR- nutbag conspiracy theory claim that people just willy-nilly hack into Blizzard's databases and create viable, active World of Warcraft accounts for themselves which Blizzard doesn't notice is what's incredulous. You still have to prove your own absurd claim there.

Your cited sources are of the exact same quality and in many cases, even less quality than the ones I offer. Most of your sources are just journalists making claims that have no reference material and no corroborating evidence ( Random example from the list, PUBG. No proof of the 24m figure ). You literally have no valid position to stand on. Wipe the list clean and do it again from scratch. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Saltyspecula (talk • contribs) 14:18, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
 * I didn't make any such claim or theory. You might want to re-read the messages, multiple people have replied to you. As for PUBG and other entries, you'll want to read WP:RS, the policy on reliable sources. There are many sources we consider to be reliable (BBC is definitely one as far as that goes). Statista, Statisticbrain and Steamspy are not. Personally, I would get rid of this list entirely if I thought that would fly, but it likely won't. We will never have solid concrete figures for many games that are otherwise assuredly have more than 50 million sales. -- ferret (talk) 14:23, 18 April 2018 (UTC)

"What about hackers and people who torrent the game? There are no doubt millions of people with illegitimately created accounts" as said by Andre666, which you seem to agree with since you called me incredulous in response to questioning it. So, still waiting on your proof. And it doesn't matter who wrote the article, BBC or not. They're not above having to cite their sources and if they fail to do so, they're even worse journalists than the ones you don't outwardly trust. Again, with no other supporting evidence it's not an acceptable source of information.

Either way, this entire thing is a waste of time. The list is completely inaccurate and in many cases just flat out wrong, most of the cited sources can't prove what they claim and don't cite their own sources or are just outright wrong or irrelevant. And the excuses from editors and others to leave the list as it is are hypocritical, irrelevant, petty, uneducated, wrong or are just batshit conspiracy theories. The list has no purpose existing when it's so wrong and neither do the people who insist on perpetuating the list's misinformation to enforce the status quo or saying "I guess it is wrong"... And then leaving the list as is, no changes.

Later chumps. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Saltyspecula (talk • contribs) 14:35, 18 April 2018 (UTC)
 * I just wanna point out how hilarious it is that this editor asked me to "provide irrefutable evidence to back up your claim" about hackers and torrenters... when trying to provide random, seriously dubious websites as sources for game sales. Dude, relax. The list may not be 100% accurate, but very few lists on Wikipedia are. The information is based on reliable sources, and it really is that simple. If they are wrong, there's not much we can do about that but try to find another, better source. It is as accurate a list as we can build on the platform. Getting all up in arms about how you want it to look helps no one. Please provide valid criticism and contributions, or respectfully move along. Andre666 (talk) 21:13, 18 April 2018 (UTC)


 * World of Warcraft a hundred million people have created an account, but that number includes free previews according to Polygon . The Wikipedia article for World of Warcraft says they had "a peak of 12 million subscriptions in October 2010".  Perhaps use that number, with a note that its impossible to get more accurate numbers.  I would think shareholders had access to that information or someone would know.   D r e a m Focus  00:11, 2 May 2018 (UTC)
 * I'd also like to point out it'd be ridiculous to include sales of Expansion Packs, now referred to as DLC. Many games make you pay extra for some item that gives you a massive advantage over those who don't have it, so everyone does.  Or they just keep you addicted by constantly selling you new things.  No way to accurate count that, nor any reason why it should effect the count of the base game itself.   D r e a m Focus  00:11, 2 May 2018 (UTC)

Fortnite
It is a top and famous game already its been a month so it must be on top best selling PC game Personale (talk) 09:01, 9 May 2018 (UTC)
 * It's free to play though, so it won't have too many actual sales. Andre666 (talk) 10:36, 9 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Only the Battle Royale version is. The actual Fortnite (also called Save the World) is a paid product (for now, it's supposed to go F2P once it exits early access), thus it would belong here if sales can reliably cited. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 16:37, 9 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Sure, that makes sense. If a source is provided, then of course it can be added! Same goes for anything :) Andre666 (talk) 18:48, 9 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Wasn't Tetris free? Personale (talk) 07:08, 11 May 2018 (UTC)
 * No? The vast majority of Tetris releases (before the mobile F2P era) were retail releases that had price tags, so I'm not sure why you think Tetris was ever free. On a related note, It's always bothered me how we make an exception for Tetris and consider every special version of it to be considered as a single release. Not sure if we can do anything about that if this all stems from how sources group them, but it still isn't ideal. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 19:53, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 May 2018
Overwatch has been struck out. According to developer update released today, it has 40,000,000 copies sold. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rge4Wo508U as citation art3mis 22:14, 15 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Wasn't this proven to include free weekend accounts? ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 22:28, 15 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Like usual, the actual phrase is "40,000,000 players", not "40,000,000" copies. This is compounded by a free weekend on going this week. -- ferret (talk) 22:29, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

Overwatch
Jeff Kaplan just announced on twitter that they have sold 40 million copies of the game. (Watch Developer Update Overwatch Anniversary 2018 on YouTube) Pretty sure this should be added, but I don't want to ruin the page, that's why I am using the talk page. Karstvgl (talk) 13:42, 16 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Jeff Kaplan announced 40 million registered players, not 40 million copies sold. -- ferret (talk) 21:54, 16 May 2018 (UTC)

Pokémon
Would it be a good idea to merge the pokémon games together, just like I imagine has happend with Tetris (Since there were different tetris games over time, like the original gameboy, to the DS and all sorts of locations). The Pokémon Company has merged their units on their website and show a total of 300 million units sold worldwide. This would also clean up the page a little bit, with all the pokémon titles scattered across the chart. Maybe we could even make something that shows how many sales for what specific versions of the game. I do not know if this is a good idea. But I thought I'd bring it to light. Karstvgl (talk) 13:48, 16 May 2018 (UTC)
 * The Pokémon games listed are all totally different games, with different storylines, settings and characters. They are also created in different engines and for different platforms, with more features each time. The Tetris number is difficult to pin down in definition and scope, but the Pokémon games are all very clearly different. Merging them would not make sense. The 300 million figure is covered in List of best-selling video game franchises. Andre666 (talk) 13:54, 16 May 2018 (UTC)
 * No, and I pointed out this exact thing above just a few days ago. Why merge them if we have specific numbers for each game? ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 02:12, 17 May 2018 (UTC)

Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
With 25 million sold, is CS:GO the bestselling game on PC? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 116.39.24.217 (talk) 23:21, 21 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Different day same issue. Figures from SteamSpy, which is unreliable for sales figures. -- ferret (talk) 23:23, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six Siege
news.ubisoft.com - RAINBOW SIX SIEGE SURGES TO 20-MILLION-PLAYER MILESTONE
 * Please see above for discussion on this same point. Andre666 (talk) 08:07, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 7 June 2018
Overwatch has sold over 40 million copies but it is not on this list Lucci 754 (talk) 01:38, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: There's already a section about this stating why not. -- ferret (talk) 01:42, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I really need to get this draft set up... ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 01:47, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 3 May 2018
https://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2016/07/08/here-are-the-five-best-selling-video-games-of-all-time/#71db27fb5926 Forbes says tetris has almost 500 million sales. The current sales is much lower. DaBeastBlasta (talk) 20:25, 3 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done for now: The Forbes reference actually tracks back to Venture Beat, which makes the claim that Tetris has "...more than 425 million paid downloads..." on mobile platforms, not 425 million total sales. This was also over four years ago. Total sales are likely much higher, but there is not a good source for a total figure than can be substituted for the current number.  Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 03:31, 9 May 2018 (UTC)

Aren't paid mobile downloads technically sales? I mean I'm sure the minecraft figure include mobile sales too. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.99.63.193 (talk) 07:05, 14 June 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 18 June 2018
Overwatch has currently over 40.000.000 sales but is not represendet in the list. 2003:CA:9F34:4A00:7C90:C101:C78D:8741 (talk) 16:30, 18 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: Overwatch has 40 million registered players, not 40 million confirmed sales. -- ferret (talk) 17:28, 18 June 2018 (UTC)

PLAYERUNKNOWN'S BATTLEGROUNDS
With Xbox and PC sales combined, PUBG has now sold over 50 million units worldwide.

116.39.24.217 (talk) 02:59, 20 June 2018 (UTC)
 * It was already updated, did you check the list? ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 10:04, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 29 June 2018
Fortnite now has 125 million downloads according to this source - https://www.pcgamesn.com/fortnite/fortnite-battle-royale-player-numbers Libertarian123 (talk) 03:09, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Which are not sales. No offense, but you people should really read the talk page before making another of the same request. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 04:48, 29 June 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 29 June 2018
Please add the Witcher 3 at at least 25 million copies sold - https://www.cdprojekt.com/en/media/news/cd-projekt-posts-strong-results-2016/ Libertarian123 (talk) 03:16, 29 June 2018 (UTC)
 * It clearly says that the entire series sold 25m combined, not Witcher 3 alone. Also, this is outdated, as it is now over 33m as of March 2018. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 04:50, 29 June 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 July 2018
This list is seriously incomplete due to some missing games, probably becuase there was no source that could prove the total amount of copies sold, especially for games sold on the Steam platform.

The websites Steam DB (https://steamdb.info/) and Steam Spy (https://steamspy.com/), however, provide useful informations on this topic reporting a fairly accurate statistic of copies sold for every game of the platform. Altough all data found on these website is accurate only until the 11th of April 2018 (when the Steam privacy policy drasticly changed), it could be used to create a more reliable list of the "Best-selling video games of all time".

Example: Counter Strike: Global Offensive doesn't figure out in this list, altough his Steam DB page (https://steamdb.info/app/730/graphs/) states it sold about 41 milions! (he should have placed 6th). Ama1899 (talk) 19:37, 11 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: SteamDB and SteamSpy are constantly used in edit requests at this list, but are not reliable sources for sales figures. They are estimates only for the number of players who have a game in their library. -- ferret (talk) 19:42, 11 July 2018 (UTC)

Potential new section to solve issues with this page?
I've seen a fair amount of people complaining about the incomplete nature of this list. Despite many games not having exact sales numbers, there are certain games that have been very successful and definitely do deserve representation here (Overwatch, CS:GO, etc.). This page could potentially have a "notes" or "additional titles" section that lists all of these titles and their projected sales (or users for FtP games like League of Legends and Fortnite) but clarifies why they're not on the main list.
 * But some of those are not sales (new player accounts on a free weekend bloating up the numbers, or just the game being free in general), so they shouldn't be on a best-selling list. The best suggestion I had was to just create a new, separate list that includes things that differ from sales like player accounts and subscription numbers. I just haven't gotten around to it yet. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 18:50, 31 July 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 10 August 2018
Number 23 on the List should be The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim with 23,270,000 units sold TheChillingGhost (talk) 23:53, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. -- ferret (talk) 00:46, 11 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Only source I could (quickly) find is this, which does not look reliable nor states where the 23m claim comes from. ~ <b style="color: #660000;">Dissident93</b> (<b style="color: #D18719;">talk</b>) 17:21, 11 August 2018 (UTC)