Talk:List of characters in Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas/Archive 1

This article was formed from the Characters section of the article Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas. I request that the character descriptions be expanded and images added for as many characters as possible. Other things to be done on this page include changing each character entry to a seperate heading (for TOC purposes) and adding a short introduction. Raijinryu 17:03, July 22, 2005 (UTC)

An alternate pic
I didn't notice there was another when I uploaded this one -



But I did, so which one do you think is better? Jim Bonzo O'hara

And now this one -



Which I believe to be worse than the other one.

For crying out loud, why didn't you just add your pics if you had them?? Jim Bonzo O'hara


 * On your Dwaine and Jethro image, it has potential, but it's too blurry and too small to make up some of the characters' facial features. If you could save the image in a better quality jpeg file and print-screen the shot in a higher game resolution, it has a chance to replace mine. I do have an almost exact image here, but it looks to be too wide for the article. Even if my image were to be splited into two images for each of the two characters, it may be a little too much as they are simply minor characters.


 * On the Cesar image, given some of the characters were explained so briefly, placing all uploaded screenshots at once into the article would had saturated the page with too many images; believe me, I've tried. For now, I'm opting to place images one by one as more info is written into the article, rather than just a few short sentences on common knowledge. It would help if others would like to provide more additions. ╫ 25 ring-a-ding  21:23, 1 October 2005 (UTC) ╫

Su Xi Mu
Su Xi Mu isn't mentioned. remember? he is woozie's assistant. he should at least get a mention in the minor characters section. --TBH 11:57, 14 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Feel free to put him in. I couldn't write anything about him because I missed most of the cutscenes featuring him and wasn't able to confirm his entry posted in the external link. ╫ 25 ring-a-ding  18:19, 14 October 2005 (UTC) ╫

Mixed breed CJ
Someone replaced all of the information about CJ and just said his mother was half-Mexican and his father was half-Indian...or something. I went back to the edit history, copied the old CORRECT info, and put it back. CJ's info is excellent and must be kept as is...although I do not think he co-founded the GSF. Rockstar mentioned GSF was the original gang in Los Santos, and the Ballas were founded in the 70's, meaning the GSF outdates the Ballas and is much older than Carl or Sweet. Fishman

Tenpenny
I noticed on the san andreas loading screen that Officer Tenpenny appears to have a U.S Marine Corp tatoo on his right arm.I was wondering has anyone else seen the article and should this info be added to the main page.

Sweet and CJ are not proven GSF co-founders
Something I think should be changed is the sections on CJ and Sweet. I'm not sure about this, but they probably weren't "co-founders" of the GSF. Correct me if I'm wrong. &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 203.12.164.23 (talk &bull; contribs).


 * Sweet and CJ have not been proven to be co-founders of the Grove Street Families, as there has not been anything in the game's dialog or other San Andreas media to prove as such. Repeated attempts to reenter such unverifiable information without any explanation or discussions will be taken as vandalism and will be reverted. ╫ ２５ ◀RingADing▶  15:53, 30 January 2006 (UTC) ╫

...their birthdays are not proven either
There is no official source on their birthday. Also, given the nature of the recent edits flip-flopping between dates, I can conclude that the edits are fan-fic, which I will undoubtfully revert. ╫ ２５ ◀RingADing▶  01:37, 21 February 2006 (UTC) ╫

The Only Right Birth Date iz Zero's Birth Date 1962 Next Fiday 17:20, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

CJ and Sweet are proven co-founders of the GSF
CJ and Sweet are co-founders of the Grove Street Families. 2 reasons: 1.) They're brothers, and 2.) How can one brother be the leader of a gang and the other brother be a member of that same gang? It don't make no kind of sense whatsoever. So, there is my evidence. CJ and Sweet are co-founders of the GSF. —Preceding unsigned comment added by King Gemini (talk • contribs)
 * A rather weak argument, and OR even. Regardless of family ties, relatives still agree or disagree, and in this case, there is also the possibility of CJ, Sweet, Brian or Beverly at odds in affairs, including forming and running a gang. I want official confirmation from the game or R* to be convinced that they are co-founders. ╫ ２５ ◀RingADing▶  14:46, 7 July 2006 (UTC) ╫


 * That is a stupid argument. Why does the gang have to be started whilst thy are alive. It could've been started by anyone on the street, or indeed the area before they were even born. So you have provided no evidence. Either this is rectified or I am removing the text which says otherwise in the article Dankru 07:21, 9 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Just asking, is this message directed to me? ╫ ２５ ◀RingADing▶  10:13, 9 July 2006 (UTC) ╫


 * The question was directed to King Gemini. Apologies, as it isn't crystal clear, although it is more of a rhetorical question. Dankru 00:24, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Paul and Maccer
In my opinion, Maccer should be in the major characters list if Kent Paul is there. Maybe even the other way around with Paul in the minor characters list. Both of them have the same significance to the storyline, introducing CJ to Ken Rosenberg. Ctaduran 17:54, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Emmet
There is no mention of Emmet in this article. I'm going to go ahead and add one, if nobody cares. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.130.138.12 (talk • contribs)

Jizzy B = Jazzy B?
"Jizzy's name may also be a spoof to Bhangra artist Jazzy B."

I think it's silly that a San Andreas pimp (an icon of American culture) could be construed as any kind of reference to an Indian DJ. There are other parts of this section that read like "Jizzy B is a pimp. X is another reference to pimp culture contemporary to the time the game was created.  Therefore Jizzy B refers to X." This seems like wishful speculation.

I think there is some New Jack City influence in GTA:SA, but Nino Brown was a gangster, not a pimp. Rick James was a disco singer, so the fact that Rick James is playing in the club when CJ meets Jizzy is perfectly reasonable. Dave Chappelle portrayed Rick James, spoofing the same era that the GTA team is spoofing. It doesn't necessarily mean that they're paying homage to Chappelle. 140.247.29.121 11:56, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Guppy?
Was Guppy Ran Fa Li's assistant or the guy riding the helicopter when they did a fly-by of the Da Nang Boys' ship? The info here seems to indicate that he is both, but the guy from the helicopter mission acts and sounds more like the second Triad guy from the Casino Heist (the other was Suzie, right). --HannuMakinen 16:42, 2 August 2006 (UTC)


 * You may be right. Guppy may be a separate and very minor character from Farlie's assistant. While I couldn't catch a glimpse of the pilot during the takeoff cut scene and flight to the freighter, inspection of the crashed helicopter revealed that he looks to be only a standard Triad member, while Farlie's assistant had a more unique appearance (glasses, slim stature and ponytail). The voice may be hard to judge though.
 * If this is true, Guppy would be too minor of mention, but also leaves the question of the assistant's name. ╫ ２５ ◀RingADing▶  11:48, 3 August 2006 (UTC) ╫


 * I have decided to hide Guppy's entry due to the lack of evidence up to now pointing to who is who, and the lack of input from other parties for the past months. Hell, having this entry in display without proof is also more likely to mislead readers. Feel free to include any objections and arguments here. ╫ ２５ ◀RingADing▶  12:42, 4 November 2006 (UTC) ╫

Ryder
hey, anyone else think there may be a connected between Ryder (some of whose missions are based around vans) & Ryder, a British vehicle hire company? a sort of in joke parhaps? Shas&#39;o sodit 20:05, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Wu Zi Mu ("Woozie")
another thing that should be added, Woozie may have his sight, as he can be clearly seen picking up his playing card and looking at its number underneath. This implies that Woozie can see, but he may be very short sighted. (if SA gets a stories game, i can see this being further explained Shas&#39;o sodit 10:52, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
 * That doesn't mean he can see the card, remember, he had 47.200.112.160.47 02:45, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

Smoke & Ryder's betrayal
In the "Green Sabre" mission when CJ saw Big Smoke and Ryder with CRASH and the Ballas, I was wondering why CJ was only talking about Smoke, saying "It's Smoke. And he in deep with Tenpenny and some Ballas. He sold us out." Ryder was in on it too.

I wondered that too myself. Also in the mission where Carl and Ceasar take pictures of the Loco Syndicate members Carl seemed a little surprised to see Ryder. I guess Carl was so shocked at seeing Smoke he could have just ignored Ryder(possibly because the two might have had a better and longer friendship). Leegar84 22:16, 11 February 2007 (UTC)


 * First off, this isn't a forum; don't simply "chat" about the article subject. Unless you're thinking of doing something for the betterment of the article, discuss subjects more relevant to the state of the article. And to answer your question, I wouldn't even pay too much attention to that, for the only reason why CJ reacted in such a way is probably because he didn't expect Smoke to do something so frivilous. ♣ Klptyzm  Chat wit' me  §   Contributions ♣ 01:36, 12 February 2007 (UTC)


 * In terms of the issue, it seems possible, if not plausible, that the authors of the story had intended to keep Ryder's betrayal from the player until "Photo Opportunity" but changed their minds because it would be confusing to players to lose contact with Ryder in between the Los Santos missions and "Photo Opportunity". In terms of the article, I don't think there's much we could say about the matter because of WP:NOR unless a reliable source discusses it in these terms.  Croctotheface 01:42, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

non-neutral phrasing
When I get a chance (or if someone else wants to do it), I'm going to go through and change phrases such as "Such-and-such is an obvious spoof of..." to more neutral phrasing that merely points out a similarity. In cases where the similarity is dubious, I'll either delete it or add/leave a citation tag. Croctotheface 06:58, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

pendleberry assanation
when did this "training day" like scene occur, I don't seem to remember it and i've completed it 100% twice —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mickiscoole (talk • contribs)
 * This has been depicted in The Introduction (a seperate prequel film of the game) during the second last scene. Hernendez has been asked by Tenpenny to kill a beaten-up police officer, or be killed with the police officer. He reluctantly complies. ╫ ２５ ◀RingADing▶  13:36, 19 October 2006 (UTC) ╫

Thanks, its really weird that I haven't heard about that video. - Mickiscoole 05:30, 20 October 2006 (UTC)


 * You can watch it on youtube, just search for it. It's split into two parts. - User:Johnnyfog 11:59, November 2006 (UTC)

Vandalism
I don't know how I can report it to the Wiki moderators, but this site has clearly and extensively been vandalized.


 * Note: The vandalism all originate from a single anon user. ╫ ２５ ◀RingADing▶  09:28, 30 October 2006 (UTC) ╫

Maccer's real name is Claudius?
I don't think that's true, his first name isn't mentioned neither in the game nor on his "website". LITIS 16:11, 7 December 2006 (UTC)


 * It's vandalism. The anon user(s) who made these changes (217.230.90.145 and 217.230.123.189) have a record of adding similar nonsense in Lemming, as well as defacing Saw III and adding soapbox comments in Christian Coalition. ╫ ２５ ◀RingADing▶  17:02, 7 December 2006 (UTC) ╫

Torino
Judging by his actions in the game, we are not sure that Torino is a government agent, he could have his own agenda, be a cultist.

LITIS 16:11, 7 December 2006 (UTC)


 * No, he states it, at an early point in his entrance into the story. There is nothing in the game that could support him being a "cultist" or that he could have his own agenda, outside being a corrupt government agent. ♣ Klptyzm  Chat wit me  §   Contributions ♣ 06:28, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Rosie is not in Liberty City Stories
I'm reverting it until you provide proof. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.94.122.64 (talk • contribs).

2 minor characters
There are 2 minor characters, who are not yet listed. There are 2 guys wearing blue clothes, who are showing up on various mission szenes. For example: in Woozie´s house in San Fierro, in the mission, when Madd dog tries to kill himself and in the room when Cj is planning the Casino robbery( that is when he says something like:" but please fuck off!"


 * I'm pretty sure their names aren't disclosed, so they are rather insignificant. ♣ Klptyzm</b>  Chat wit me  §   Contributions ♣ 06:29, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Madd Dogg
U can actually get the Mad Dogg Albums, can u???? There are just posters right? I wanna know if he is real or just a character, hes palyed by Ice-T are there any songs from the game w/ Ice-T where he palys Mad Dogg? RealG187 17:31, 25 January 2007 (UTC)


 * No. Who told you that? ♣ <b style="color:blue;">Klptyzm</b>  Chat wit me  §   Contributions ♣ 23:25, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Ryder--does he even smoke marijuana?
I'm not convinced that he's lacing blunts with PCP and not just cigars. Admittedly, I'm not an expert on the subject of drugs, but I don't think there are any in game references to him smoking weed. Is it just implied that if he's doing PCP, it's with marijuana? Croctotheface 05:52, 28 January 2007 (UTC)


 * In the "drug community," its common to lace marijuana with PCP. Not too many people lace plain cigars with PCP; it would be, in a sense, considered "smarter," if not more common, to smoke it on its own, in its crystalline form. ♣ <b style="color:blue;">Klptyzm</b>  Chat wit me  §   Contributions ♣ 06:26, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

registered users only?
With the amount of crazy vandalism and turf wars going on around this article, maybe it should just be registered users only for awhile. The Superman article got locked down for less. ==>Johnnyfog

Denise Robinson in LCS?
It say's here that the Denise who calls the Electron Zone in LCS is Denise Robinson, but she only gets refered to by her first name. I can find no evidence that it is actually her. Does anyone know different? If not, it should be removed. Dbam 18:43, 19 March 2007 (UTC)


 * That's interesting that you brought that up; due to my limited knowledge of LCS, I thought that her full name was given and that her voice was very similar to Robinson's in SA. Someone needs to verify this, because I'm assuming good faith that someone did this with some sort of support. ♣ <b style="color:blue;">Klptyzm</b>  Chat wit' me  §   Contributions ♣ 19:40, 19 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Me too. It should probably be removed in the meantime and restored only if we get a source. Croctotheface 21:54, 19 March 2007 (UTC)


 * OK, i've removed it. Dbam 19:54, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Old Big Bear?
As you know, the characters used to have older outfits(Smoke's white and green basketball jersey, Sweet's skullcap clothes, Ryder's pure orange(in the game art)), but I think so did Big Bear. In one of the earliest screenshots wear members of the Grove are doing a driveby in their old clothes, there's somebody in the back wearing almost all black who looks a lot like Big Bear. If anybody can find this screenshot(it's on the back of the Triple Pack), you might be able to see the resemblance.


 * Uhhh, are you getting at something, because if you're not, then I'll please ask you to not treat this page as a forum, that is, don't create idle banter. ♣ <b style="color:blue;">Klptyzm</b>  Chat wit' me  §   Contributions ♣ 19:20, 29 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm not using it as a forum, I'm just asking whether or not this could be an addition to the article.


 * Aaah ok. Sorry, man. A lot of crap has been happening, putting me on edge. I don't know if it could or should, but if others find it necessary, then I'll support it. Otherwise, I don't feel it should. ♣ <b style="color:blue;">Klptyzm</b>  Chat wit' me  §   Contributions ♣ 22:53, 30 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I think this must be the screenshot in question. It certainly does bear (no pun intended!) a resemblance to Big Bear.  But I think unless there is something somewhere that says it actually is him, I don't see how it can go in the article without looking like original research or speculation. Dbam 23:50, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Birth Date's
Is Dis Shit true about the birth dates dat someone put on CJ and them Next Fiday 17:15, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

OR Tag?
I'm not sure I'm no board with having the OR tag at this article. It's certainly the case that articles like these will depend a bit more on primary sources than we'd like, but there's a pretty strong precedent for having these kinds of articles despite spotty sourcing. I'm not sure that the article would be improved by having a note at the end of every other sentence pointing readers to the game's script. Croctotheface 09:25, 17 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I agree. I hate when people do that. If anything, an unreferenced tag should be used. ♣ <b style="color:blue;">Klptyzm</b>  Chat wit' me  §   Contributions ♣ 15:18, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Name of Madd Dogg's manager?
Do we know this for sure? I don't think it's Todd Crawford. Croctotheface 16:10, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I've never heard of a name for Madd Dogg's manager and I removed references to it earlier. If his name is Todd Crawford, then it should be referenced. A-Dust 21:14, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Spoiler Tag
I added the spoiler tag earlier on today because I scrolled down the list to see what Tenpenny's first name was and accidentally read when he's killed in the game! >.< Why does this article not require a spoiler tag? Sean 02:15, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
 * There was a discussion at WP:SPOILER, and the consensus established was that readers should expect articles or sections on fictional characters to reveal major plot elements and therefore that the tag is redundant. Croctotheface 07:09, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Manchester native
I don't know offhand what the game says, but it's certainly possible for a person to be a native of Town X despite originally hailing from Town Y. It would involve moving. Croctotheface 21:19, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

Officer Jimmy Hernandez
Why did Hernandez have to be killed in the first place when he was a good guy? {GaryUser 19:53, 23 June 2007 (UTC)}


 * Wikipedia is NOT a forum! - .:Alex:. 20:04, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Salvatore leone?
Shouldn't he be under Minor characters or whatever. he only in like what 1 or 2 missions?


 * Yes but Salvatore appeared as the boss of two missions and was featured as a main character in the game. Salvatore was also featured as a main character in GTA III, which may come into account here. A-Dust 20:13, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Speedy Deletion
Erm, why are the images in this article candidates for speedy deletion? I'd think it falls under fair use.. Th 2005 08:59, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Listing characters as major or minor
I think that this page makes something of an odd classification of major and minor characters. I have a hard time seeing, Maccer, for example, as a more important character than Jimmy Hernandez. These ideas aren't fully formed in my mind yet, but I think that we should change our conception of major characters here. I could see a few methods:
 * 1) Restrict "major character" status to CJ, Sweet, Smoke, Cesar, and Tenpenny.  These are characters who have a presence, although not always physical, throughout all stages of the game, and act on their own volition.  Their roles are largely essential: the protagonist, main antagonists, and the hero's close friends and confidants.  This would exclude Pulaski and Ryder because they are more like henchmen, and it would exclude Woozie because he has more of a secondary role as an employer/partner.
 * 2) Include Ryder, Pulaski, and Woozie.  Their roles are significant, even if they are not essential.
 * 3) Include Toreno, Leone, Rosenberg, Madd Dogg, Catalina, and Kendl.  I think this gets a little bit more difficult, I suppose this would involve saying that a constant presence in the game (Kendl) or a significant impact on certain stages of the game (the rest) is enough to qualify for major.  Personally, I would want to draw the line before including these.
 * 4) Include everything we already do.  This is really Maccer territory, and he has no impact on the plot whatsoever.

I think that I would want to go with either option 1 or 2. I have a hard time really seeing Toreno or Leone as major characters: they are major players in certain subplots, but the game is huge and the storyline is quite long. The main plot is about CJ being challenged by forces beyond his control and then coming into his own as a person by overcoming and defeating them. Thoughts? Croctotheface 07:44, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Also, and I admit that this is not a great option, but it could be a viable one, we may want to create a hierarchy of minor characters. In my mind, Toreno is sort of major-minor, while Millie Perkins is so minor that she's barely significant. Three tiers is less elegant, but it would be more accurate. Croctotheface 07:50, 12 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I think you've got a point about being more selective and the three-tier thing would be a good way to go. I'd go with option 2 for the Major characters, but would perhaps include Toreno and The Truth as well.  The second tier would be basically anyone else who has any significant role at any point during the main story.  The third tier really should only be used for those who truly have very little impact on the story, such as Denise, Maria and Claude (and, of course, Tony the Parrot).
 * I think what might be useful as well, to try to avoid disagreements, is some sort of criteria for classification based on aspects of each characters involvement in the game, similar to those used for the list of gangs article. Something reasonably straight-forward, based on things like number of missions involved in, whether they are the boss of any missions—stuff like that.  Also, I think any changes we do make should be across the board, for the sake of uniformity of the various "List of characters in..." articles.  Dbam  Talk/Contributions 18:21, 12 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm not opposed to making similar changes in similar articles, but I'm not going to hold back on making changes here if people resist elsewhere. It's been a few days and we seem to be on the same page.  Do you have ideas as far as names for the three tiers?  Croctotheface 08:16, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


 * If there are no objections here then I can't imagine problems elsewhere—keeping similarly-themed articles inline style-wise seems a logical step to me. As for tier names...got to admit, that's a tricky one.  My initial thoughts were along the lines of Major–Minor–Other or Major–Supporting–Minor.  To be honest, if you'd rather just stick with two tiers and re-jig the characters a bit then that's fine by me, but if that is the case, then personally, I think i'd rather promote Hernandez and T-Bone Mendez to Major status as they are the two that really stand out for me in the Minor section, whereas the lower end of the Major section is a bit more hazy.  I think three tiers would give a better opportunity for a more drastic overhaul of the kind you suggest.  Dbam  Talk/Contributions 19:56, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Introduction questions
I haven't seen anything in the introduction about Hernandez shooting Pendlebury, or Pulaski calling Tenpenny "pal" or T-Bone beating up an accused snitch. Is this part of a special version or something, because I'm apparently missing something. Please help! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.255.40.33 (talk) 05:37, 9 September 2007 (UTC)


 * "The Introduction" is a film that was included with the soundtrack. It was designed to preview the storyline, and it actually gives quite a few details away.  It's probably on Youtube, though I don't know for sure. Croctotheface 06:04, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

Oh. I guess I missed that. I was real friggin' confused because I was racking my brain trying to remember where I've heard that stuff in the game, even though I never have! Thank you for saving me from much frustration and confusion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.255.40.33 (talk) 21:31, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

C.R.A.S.H.
Does anyone what does it mean? Also, is it part of a gang name? Professional Gamer 20:49, 9 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Community Resources Against Street Hoodlums --Croctotheface 20:51, 9 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks. Professional Gamer 17:47, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Woozie
Even Woozie may be blind, I noticed that he has very good hearings and he can respond to sound whenever he hears gunshots. Professional Gamer 16:27, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:GTASA Ryder.jpg
Image:GTASA Ryder.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 02:18, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Tommy Vercetti?
I don't think Tommy Vercetti should be listed here. He makes no appearance at all, and is only mentioned in 'The Introduction'. He doesn't really have influence on the story. Larrylarp (talk) 23:41, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
 * You're absolutely right, I've removed it.  Dbam  Talk/Contributions 15:40, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Heffy
i hope you guys know that madd doggs managers name is Heffy it was revealed in the mission you kill him —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mcanmoocanu (talk • contribs) 03:43, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Actually, the name of Madd Doggs manager is Scipio. No one mentions 'Heffy' in the cutscene "Management Business" nor in any point of the mission. Larrylarp (talk) 12:07, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Old Reece?
Do you really think that Old Reece should be in this article? He is actually only a shopkeeper, just like the bartenders, store clerks etc., and doesn't have any influence in the story. In my opinion, he should be removed from this article.