Talk:List of countries by population in 1500

Note About Source
For each entry there should be a source. Note that, when dealing with countries pre-1800, there is usually very scant information drawn from censuses and actual counting. Instead, scholars use things like the count of marriages, births, deaths in their calculations. Or, they see available food supplies, estimated birth rates, etc. Any solid estimate will do, as long as it is a reliable source. Jlr3001 (talk) 12:18, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Ming Dynasty Seal
The Ming Imperial Seal is used for the Ming. I believe that any symbol representing the state or authority can be used, whether or not it is a flag. This is also true for the Mughal Empire, or the Roman (on other pages). As for the veracity of the symbol itself, there is a discussion on the Ming dynasty talk page (to which I contributed), but no sources beyond paintings have been verified. Thought?



Note: This discussion is also ongoing on the talk page for List of countries by population in 1500. Jlr3001 (talk) 19:11, 18 June 2018 (UTC)
 * The file description of the image makes it clear this is a pattern sewn into the Wanli Emperor's robe, and the file name is erroneous. This is not an imperial seal of the Ming dynasty and does not represent the state. _dk (talk) 19:25, 18 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Don't know how I missed that. Great catch, and thanks for update.Jlr3001 (talk) 14:51, 20 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Added the other imperial seal RedStorm1368 (talk) 06:48, 21 August 2022 (UTC)

Information Needed
The following states existed in 1500. If you have statistics for them (and a source!) please add them to the list and remove them from this one: • Kingdom of Morocco

• Ethiopian Empire

• Kingdom of Lan Xang

• Trucial Sheikhs

• Ayutthaya Kingdom

• Tondaiman

• Đại Việt

• Kingdom of Kongo

• Arakan

• Venad

• Duchy of Prussia

• Zapotec civilization

• Principality of Zeta

• Ryukyu Kingdom

• Sindh

• Principality of Moldavia

• Jysan

• Tír Eoghain

• Duchy of Parma

• Duchy of Savoy

• Republic of Genoa

• Rinpungpa

• Phagmodrupa Dynasty

• Republic of Lucca

• Manchu

• Kingdom of Kozhikode

• Duchy of Mirandola

• Duchy of Modena and Reggio

• Adil Shahi dynasty

• Qutb Shahi dynasty

• Garhwal Kingdom

• Pandyan dynasty

• Kingdom of Middag

• Most Serene Republic of San Marino

• Ag Qoyunlu

• Shirvan

• Marashis

• Paduspanids

• Mihrabanids

• Afrasiyab dynasty

• Kingdom of Kartli

• Kingdom of Imereti

• Samtskhe-Saatabago

• Kingdom of Kakheti

• Aceh Sultanate

• Samudera Pasai Sultanate

• Adal Sultanate

• Ahmadnagar Sultanate

• Bahmani Sultanate

• Ahom kingdom

• Yemen

• Avar Khanate

• Alodia

• Kingdom of Arakan

• Bonoman

• Denkyira

• Astrakhan Khanate

• Golden Horde

• Joseon

• Sultanate of Bali

• Delhi Sultanate

• Benin Empire

• Duchy of Brittany

• Bruneian Empire

• Maynila

• Sultanate of Sulu

• Tondo

• Malacca Sultanate

• Kingdom of Kotte

• Jaffna kingdom

• Moghulistan

• Four Oirat

• Champa

• Cherokee

• Republic of Cospaia

• Kingdom of Ava

• Gujarat Sultanate

• Malwa Sultanate

• Garha-Mandla

• Chanda-Sirpur

• Deogarh-Nagpur

• Sheikdom of al-Hassa

• Hausa Kingdoms

• Hejaz

• Wyandot people

• Grand Duchy of Muscovy

• Pskov Republic - ?

• Qasim Khanate - ?

• Iroquois

• Bornu Empire

• Kashmir

• Kazakh Khanate

• Knights Hospitaller

• Cambodia

• Khandesh Sultanate

• Khanate of Kazan

• Leinster

• Lan Na

• Sultanate of Makassar

• Sultanate of Maldives

• Mamluk Sultanate

• Sharifate of Mecca

• Mali Empire

• Maya

• Manipur

• Kingdom of Mutapa

• Thomond

• Kingdom of Ormond

• Kingdom of Desmond

• Kingdom of Mrauk U

• Northern Yuan dynasty

• Kara Del

• Monaco

• Nogai Horde

• Nepal

• Fartak

• Union of Viscounty of Béarn and Kingdom of Navarre

• Timurid Empire

• Songhai Empire

• Hafsid dynasty

• Ormus

• Kingdom of Tlemcen

• Oman

• Gajapati Kingdom

• Oyo Empire

• Hanthawaddy Kingdom

• Ulster

• Terra Mariana

• Republic of Siena

• Khanate of Sibir

• Shawnee

• Shan States

• Swahili people

• Sukhothai Kingdom

Should the population of the Ashikaga shogunate be updated?
The population listed now uses the McEvedy and Jones study from 1978, but looking at the Demographic History of Japan article, it looks like there have been three more recent studies that all put the number much lower, anywhere from 12 million to 8 million rather than 17 million. The highest estimate among these three newer studies has the population only reaching 17 million in 1600. This article should probably be updated to reflect these newer studies. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ungeheuerlich (talk • contribs) 05:28, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Good call and thanks for the update. Jlr3001 (talk) 19:05, 21 February 2018 (UTC)

Kingdom of Mali Population
With a population of 20,000,000 Mali would have a population density comparable to Ming China and HRE, which seems absurd. Surely there exists a more reasonable estimate? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:8108:8F80:351C:7DE6:4035:2CA7:DFA7 (talk) 19:57, 14 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Past estimates, like Diane's 40-50 million, have been even higher for the Malian population. The figure of 20 million is both a compromise figure and a traditionally accepted population estimate from what I've read. But yes you are right, 20 million is still a large population for a sub-saharan state, especially considering the Mali empire lost significant chunks of territory since the mid-15th century. Hence why I implied the empire had "less than" 20 million inhabitants. If you manage to get your hands on a better source, please let us know, thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by RedStorm1368 (talk • contribs) 23:31, 14 November 2021 (UTC)
 * According to, the population of Mali, Mauritania, Niger, Burkina Faso, Senegal, and Gambia combined was around 15 million in 1950, and that number would have been far lower in 1900. Are you saying that the population of the Mali Empire in 1500 was higher than the western Sahel in 1950? 73.73.127.102 (talk) 00:33, 26 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Seems like a rather illogical argument to make considering populations grow and shrink throughout history Ireland is a

Prominent example of this as is Central Asia you can’t just claim something is absurd as well if it doesn’t match a preconceived notion about a region WILLIAMSRD33 (talk) 07:22, 22 October 2022 (UTC)
 * I would rather compare West Africa to Southeast Asia, both areas where the population remained low until the 20th century due to a hostile enviroment. According to Thai historians Chris Baker and Pasuk Phongpaichit, Southeast Asia's density was a fifth of that of India and China's until the modern period. Ayutthaya had a population of 1-2.5 million in it's heyday in the 1700s. Taungoo and Konbaung Burma had a similar population number. Vietnam and the Philippines, two countries with similar growth rates to African countries (Egypt, Nigeria, Ethiopia) each had a population of around 10 million in 1900. Ilffie, whose book "Africans: The History of a Continent" is an r/askhistorians recommended book, argues that most historians don't know the exact population of pre-modern West Africa. I would probably agree with removing Mali from here. Yourlocallordandsavior (talk) 06:32, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

Where is Iran ???
2601:483:300:6300:A9AC:2E6C:961F:2EA7 (talk) 22:29, 14 June 2022 (UTC)


 * Added as Aq Qoyunlu Iran RedStorm1368 (talk) 06:47, 21 August 2022 (UTC)