Talk:List of non-Gaelic games played in Croke Park

2009/2010 Magners League Final
Why is the 2009/2010 Magners League Final listed as a future event to be played at Croke Park? The venue is still TBA and depends on the participants. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Myfearlessfriend (talk • contribs) 01:20, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Final was played at RDS. (Mobile mundo (talk) 14:47, 23 April 2017 (UTC))

Ali at Croker
Can someone add who he fought and when (Gnevin 01:54, 23 February 2007 (UTC))


 * Al "Blue" Lewis on 19 July, 1972 (www.boxing-memorabilia.com/biolewis.htm), if anyone wants to add it. Apparently one of Ali's great-gradfathers was Irish (from Ennis), but he was a bit evasive on the issue when it came up! Nick Cooper 17:13, 12 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Was this really a one-fight card? That would be most unusual.   If we are making a list of all the "ganes" (should we rephrase that? No-one talks about a boxing "game") then we should presumably list all the fights on the card that evening.  Kevin McE (talk) 16:47, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
 * it's Gaelic games not non-Gaelic, games played in Croke Park, the games part only refers to the collective name of the  GAA sports Gnevin (talk) 16:57, 8 May 2008 (UTC)


 * That makes sense to me. However, that makes "Gaelic games" the only subject (apart from Croker) in the fragment. Akin to: "List of non-X played in Y". There's a noun missing. Compare: "List of non-soccer played in Wembley". "Non-soccer" in this case is an adjective. "non-soccer what?". "non-soccer matches" presumably. Maybe the title should be changed therefore
 * from: "List of non-Gaelic games played in Croke Park"
 * to: "List of non-Gaelic games events in Croke Park".
 * Although that would leave it open to concert/etc, so possibly the following is better:
 * "List of non-Gaelic games sporting events in Croke Park".
 * Or a bigger change:
 * "List of Croke Park sporting events other than Gaelic games".
 * Or maybe it really doesn't matter that much :) Guliolopez (talk) 17:52, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

Croke Park / Jones' Road
Regardless of who owned it at the time, Croke Park is a continuation of the old Jones' Road, the only difference being a name change (for example, on All-Ireland Senior Football Championship, Jones' Road is actually redirected to Croke Park). Thus a soccer match played at the ground in 1901, I feel, is perfectly resonably placed in the list. I'll add a note afterwards just to specify the exact name, which should suffice. Schcambo (talk) 18:56, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes but these games are only notable as the GAA banned them Gnevin (talk) 16:32, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * This is a full list of non-Gaelic Games at Croke Park, not a selective one where you can pick and choose which games you'd like to appear on it. The then owners of the stadium are irrelevant; for example Wembley Stadium was owned at first by a limited company who rented it to the FA, it didn't then suddenly become a new stadium when the FA purchased it. Schcambo (talk) 17:15, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Of course the owner of the stadium is relevant if the owner is barring "foreign games" from being played, The only reason this list is notable is because of rule 42 a rule which didn't apply when the GAA didn't own the place Gnevin (talk) 17:39, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I dunno Gnevin. I think it might be appropriate here. Not least because it's notable as a highlight that Croke Park (like many other sports grounds around the country) had other uses and "owners" prior to be labelled for use by one sport or another. Irrespective of rule 42 or anything else. I'd say leave it in. The article title is "List of non-Gaelic Games played in Croke Park", and the article itself doesn't assert the purpose that you infer about "foreign games" and "rule 42". Ostensibly it's just a list. (Although - obviously - it should definitively be highlighted that this game was played before the ground was purposed for GAA games and under a different name). Guliolopez (talk) 18:07, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * A WP:NN game played freely at a private stadium should not be in this listGnevin (talk) 18:24, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I haven't changed the purpose of the page I've clarified the purpose of the page. Gnevin (talk) 18:47, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Also Rule 42 is still enforce just relaxed for Croke Park by the GAA, hence the notability of them , not a game played in a field which happened to become Croke ParkGnevin (talk) 18:52, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

(deindent) A jeez. So your solution to the argument "the list isn't ostensibly only for games played after rule 42 was instrumented" is to repurpose the list? So that it is only for games played under those terms? And here I thought you were a responsible editor who understood the concepts of good faith and consensus. Anyway - I frankly don't care WHAT the purpose of this list is. (And before your change I wasn't particularly bothered about the game one way or the other either). My original point though was simply that the Jones's road game was notable in that it was an identifiable individual instance that showed the history of the ground (like other grounds) included a period where it was an "open" community field. That was used by all types of people and sports - before sport became some kind of sectarian stick to beat each other with. I still think this is worth noting somewhere on the project. So maybe I'll just form a simple oneliner in the history section of the Croke Park article. (And before anyone accuses me of WP:POINT or otherwise, I'll do so "delicately".) Le meas. Guliolopez (talk) 19:19, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * What are you talking about ? Sectarian stick? I've no problem listing it on the Croker article as it of some note but note, I don't know why your questioning my good faith and consensus, I've discussed this here as the issue goes on and was simply being bold and WP:BRD in clarifying the list to what i believed would sort this problem.
 * My original point though was simply that the Jones's road game was notable in that it was an identifiable individual instance that showed the history of the ground' and my point is this is about Croke Park and games played their when Rule 42 was enforce in what ever kind.Gnevin (talk) 11:35, 22 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Not sure why I'm wasting my energy with this, but: Until you changed the text of the article to match the purpose you had unilaterally decided for this list, it wasn't "about games played in Croker when Rule 42 was in force". It was a list of "non-Gaelic games played at the ground". That's what it was - just a list. There was no criteria for notability of inclusion in the list, and there was nothing about "rule 42" anywhere. (It was just a non discriminartory list). That is, until you decided that the purpose SHOULD BE Rule 42 related, and re-purposed it. Beyond that, your note on WP:BOLD and WP:BRD would be valid except that there was already a discussion ongoing to find a compromise on the issue. So, being BOLD to kickstart a discussion (per WP:BRD) isn't appropriate. And WP:BOLD isn't really intended for cases where there is an unresolved consensus issue. And I expect you know that.
 * Anyway, as above, this is not worth the energy. I'm going back to working on Irish Conservation Box and Natural resources of Ireland. Would appreciate some help with either if you have some time. Cheers. Guliolopez (talk) 12:39, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I've asked WP:IWNB for input are we are going in circles Gnevin (talk) 12:50, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
 * If you want a reason why the game is notable, here's one: it is the first and only major soccer game to have been played at Croke Park/Jones' Road before the 'relaxing' of rule 42 in 2007. Quote from the RTÉ reference:
 * "One of the first major finals played in the south at the turn of the century was played at Jones's Road. That was the IFA Cup final of 1901. Freebooters, who were based in Sandymount, met Cliftonville in the decider but were beaten 1-0"
 * I think that's notable enough? Oh and I'm restore the Steelers/Bears crests, they serve no purpose, completely agreed, but then neither do the international flags, and neither do the Navy/Notre Dame crests, which you've never had a problem with; they just look nice! Schcambo (talk) 10:22, 23 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Use of the images is in violation of fair use imageGnevin (talk) 13:42, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

It's clear from the foregoing that the game is notable. It's not one of a hundred such games and therefore its inclusion adds to, rather than distracts from, the article. It can be justified by simply editing the opening sentence to something like, "The following is a list of non-Gaelic Games played and scheduled to be played at Croke Park (formerly Jones's Road)." There should also be an explanation of Rule 42, including the date of its introduction, to show the uninitiated why the article exists at all (btw the rule is not even explained satisfactorily in the GAA article). We would then have a comprehensive list of games played before, during and after (the unrelaxed) Rule 42. Scolaire (talk) 09:26, 24 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Excellent, a good encyclopedic conclusion. SeoR (talk) 12:35, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Rule 42
Is rule 42 notable enough for an article of it's own i current have it listed at Rule 42 ?Gnevin (talk) 18:30, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

As I said in the section above, I would like to see Gaelic Athletic Association considerably expanded to clarify the actual substance of the rule, the wording of the rule, the date of its adoption and the background to its adoption. If the section then became sufficiently large it would be worth forking it off into its own article, but first things first. In the meantime, that section would be a better link than the terminology list. Scolaire (talk) 19:16, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

International Rules.
Given that it's not stricly speaking a Gaelic game, shouldn't this list include the International Rules football games that have thus far been played? Van Dieman (talk) 02:06, 7 July 2012 (UTC)
 * This was the first thing I thought of also Screech1616 (talk) 14:18, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

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