Talk:Little Hagia Sophia

turbe / baptistery
In one section (history, paragraph before UNESCO paragraph) we have the building to the north called a turbe, in another (description, final paragraph) it is called a baptistery. Could someone who knows clarify whether these are the same building (only one is visible on site as of yesterday afternoon). It is a little confusing otherwise. --5telios 10:41, 20 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Sorry, It has been a bad error of mine. When I was in Istanbul and visited the building, I mistook the turbe for a Baptistery...Shame on myself! The small building is actually the Turbe of the founder of the mosque. Thanks and Ciao, Alex2006 11:47, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Justin or Anastasius?
The present text, which appears to be sourced to a travel guide, states that Justinian's life was threatened by his uncle Justin. Norwich says the emperor was Anastasius. Norwich (1988), p. 195, n. 1. On that authority I propose to change the text, with citation to Norwich. Kablammo (talk) 12:34, 20 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Hallo Kablammo, I will check it during the weekend! Anyway, if I remember well, was his uncle, Justinus, who threatened the young Justinian. Bye, Alex2006 (talk) 12:50, 20 April 2012 (UTC)
 * I will check also about it. Anyway, i don't consider Norwich a reliable source for this kind of articles. He is a generalist, and we all (also he) are all dwarfs on the shoulder of giants. In these case the giants are Janin, Müller-Wiener, Mamboury and few others. About the history of the churches, the supreme authority is Raymond Janin. Bye Alex2006 (talk) 12:58, 20 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I agree about Norwich, but I think the present statement appears to be sourced to a tourist guide, which we probably should replace as a reference in any event.  I look forward to your findings.  Regards, Kablammo (talk) 13:19, 20 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Are you writing about the (in-)famous Freely cookbook? :-) Alex2006 (talk) 13:28, 20 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, but I've never had the pleasure of sampling whatever he is serving. Kablammo (talk) 16:00, 20 April 2012 (UTC)

I've found sources online, which indicate the following. The church was founded by Justinian as a shrine to Sergius and Bacchus. Procopius, De Aedificiis, 1.43-7. According to an old story, Justinian’s devotion to the two was in gratitude for the martyrs’ intervention with Anastasius; they appeared to the emperor in a dream to forestall the execution of Justin and Justinian, who had been charged with treason. This legend has been discredited. Fowden, Elizabeth Key (1999). The Barbarian Plain: Saint Sergius between Rome and Iran. Berkeley: University of California Press. page 132. ISBN 0520216857; Bryce, James (1887), "Life of Justinian by Theophilus", English Historical Review, vol. 2, pp. 657–86, republished online here. Other online sources mentioning the legend also indicate the emperor to whom the martyrs appeared was Anastasius. Kablammo (talk) 19:33, 21 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Hallo Kablammo,
 * this is exactly what I found. Neither Janin nor Müller-Wiener cite this story (about Janin this is highly suspicious, since he knows the sources as none other), and Mazal ("Justinian I. und seine Zeit : Geschichte und Kultur des byzantinischen Reiches im 6. Jahrhundert" Köln : Böhlau, 2001) writes clearly that this is a later legend without fundament. I propose to remove it from the article. And I am sorry for Freely, whose guide has a lot of information about the City, but all too often is unreliable (or plain wrong, as in this case). This evening I will read the interesting article that you found, thanks a lot! Bye Alex2006 (talk) 12:21, 22 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Good! You may be able to access the most relevant page of the Fowden book by this search on Google books.  Regards, Kablammo (talk) 13:53, 22 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Great article! I propose to remove the legend with what Bardill says. Alex2006 (talk) 06:50, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, I agree. I may add a little on the architecture from Mango as well.  Kablammo (talk) 13:26, 24 April 2012 (UTC)

This would be great! I was there the last time in November last year, and I showed the building to two friends from Rome. It was after sunset, with a crystal clear deep blue sky and full moon. They both were amazed... Alex2006 (talk) 13:36, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * I envy you! I wonder how much of of the original decoration is still there underneath the plaster.  Maybe someday we will find out.  Kablammo (talk) 13:42, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately nothing. :-( I know that the church was among those suspected to have still covered mosaics, but random samples did not reveal anything. The problem is that St. Sergius was converted into a Mosque under Bayezid II. He was not like his father, but rather a strict believer, so I suspect that he let everything destroyed. I think that here they could still find something... Alex2006 (talk) 14:05, 24 April 2012 (UTC)

English variant
this article has used American English since its inception, and there is no particularly valid reason to change that now. Please revert your spelling changes. Elizium23 (talk) 05:39, 16 March 2020 (UTC)
 * What you have said is false. At its inception, this page used a unidiomatic, Italian-inflected English. Only on 06:55, 11 December 2006 did a differentiation between English and American occur, deciding for "neighbourhood" not American's "neighborhood". No American should have been used on this page thereafter and will be removed. GPinkerton (talk) 05:58, 16 March 2020 (UTC)
 * , uh, did you READ the diff you provided? Elizium23 (talk) 06:00, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Little_Hagia_Sophia&oldid=93537550
 * Yes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by GPinkerton (talk • contribs) 06:07, 16 March 2020 (UTC)