Talk:Livilla

Untitled
This redirect is confusing. Livilla is usually meant to be Livia Julia (~13 B.C. - 31 A.D.), granddaughter of Livia (Livia Drusilla or Livia Augusta), wife of Gaius Caesar (the son of Agrippa). No pages link to this one, but it is a problem when searching directly for Livilla. Could this page be removed, please. CharlesS 09:19, 14 Mar 2004 (UTC) Sorry, there are quite a few pages linking to Livilla, I'll have to check what is going on.CharlesS 09:21, 14 Mar 2004 (UTC)


 * If you'd like it deleted, you should list it on Redirects for deletion. Presuming nobody objects, the redirect eventually will be deleted after a week or so. -- Hadal 09:24, 14 Mar 2004 (UTC)

If there are multiple Livillas, this is the page that should disambiguate and send readers to the right one. Stan 14:10, 15 Mar 2004 (UTC)
 * There are no multiple Livillas, or at least all the references to Livilla in the Wikipedia point to the same person which is not Livia. I have now changed this redirect to become a separate article about Livilla.CharlesS 01:08, 19 Mar 2004 (UTC)
 * I have in mind a Roman naming convention proposal that will hopefully clear up some of the confusion, gotta write it down soon. Stan 05:09, 19 Mar 2004 (UTC)


 * I looked at the history of the Livilla page (I should have done so to start!): Before the Livilla page was turned into a redirect it was a stub which, short as it was, had all the correct information. Except that the link to Livilla's second husband, commonly referred to as just Drusus, went straight to Nero Claudius Drusus (brother of Tiberius) instead of Drusus (Drusus Junior or Julius Ceasar Drusus, son of Tiberius) and for whom I think there is no page.  So the real confusion is perhaps caused by the use of the name Drusus for the page on Nero Claudius Drusus.CharlesS 09:50, 19 Mar 2004 (UTC)


 * This is now fixed :) Adam Bishop 05:07, 22 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Chronology of AD 31
Chronology of AD 31 Crucial evidence for the chronology of the massacre of Sejanus' family is provided by the Fasti Ostienses (V.Ehrenberg & A.H.M.Jones, Documents Illustrating the Reigns of Augustus and Tiberius [2nd ed.Oxford 1955):

"XV k.Nov.Seianus s[trang.] VIIII k.Nov. Strabo [Seiani] f. strang. VII k.No[v. Apicata] Seiani se occidi[t......] Dec. Capito Aelia[nus et] Iunilla Seiani [in Gem.] iacuerunt"

I.e Sejanus was strangled on 18 October, Strabo was strangled on the 24th, and Apicata killed herself on the 26th. The two younger ones seem to have died between 14 November and 13 December ("Dec."). Livilla's death seems to have predated theirs, since when Tacitus' narrative resumes in Book VI, she is already dead while Capito and Iunilla are still alive.

Dio is mistaken in saying that all the children were already dead when Apicata committed suicide. ('His wife ... on learning that her children were dead, and after seeing their bodies on the Stairway, ... withdrew and composed a statement about the death of Drusus, directed against Livilla, his wife, who had been the cause of a quarrel between herself and her husband, resulting in their separation; then, after sending this document to Tiberius, she committed suicide.')

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Tiberius"

Livilla's agenda AD 19-31
Livilla’s agenda: to maximise the survival chances of her sons (i.e. after 23 of Tiberius Gemellus). She must have believed – in the event correctly – that Gemellus’ survival, and that of Agrippina’s male offspring were incompatible. Crucially, her husband Drusus deferred to Germanicus, although the latter was only slightly older. Drusus and Germanicus remained the best of friends (“singularly united...wholly unaffected by the rivalries of their kinsfolk”, Tac.Ann.2.43), and after Germanicus’ death fostered and seemingly promoted Germanicus’ children with genuine affection (Ann.4.4.: “kindly disposed or at least not unfriendly towards the lads.”). If Livilla did indeed conspire to murder Drusus, this is as excellent a motive as any. To quote Seager (Tiberius, 182): The only possible explanation for her conduct is that she was acting in the interest of her sons, Tiberius Gemellus and Germanicus. If Drusus followed Tiberius, it was probable that he would respect his father’s wishes and hand over power to one or the other of the sons of Germanicus....”

See especially R.Seager, Tiberius, London (Eyre Methuen) 1972

81 190 70 164

Livilla cameo
"A cameo portrait of Livilla, with the silhouettes of two infants, can be seen at http://home.earthlink.net/~jburns31780/gasvips.htm. (Figure 10)."

The image in question is extremely striking, and brings out Livilla's character. Is there any way it can be used in the Livilla article? Can permission be obtained?

81.190.70.164.

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.190.70.164 (talk • contribs) 18:57, 27 March 2006‎ (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: moved per request. Favonian (talk) 21:04, 4 April 2013 (UTC)

Livilla (sister of Claudius) → Livilla – She is already the primary meaning of "Livilla", which redirects here, the only other person who might possibly be known by this name is Julia Livilla, who was normally known as "Julia", but who should remain a hatnote. PatGallacher (talk) 17:16, 28 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Makes sense to me. P Aculeius (talk) 01:36, 30 March 2013 (UTC)
 * ✅ --Codrin.B (talk) 10:54, 30 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. Surprised it was ever given a disambiguating phrase while remaining a primary topic. Cynwolfe (talk) 13:52, 30 March 2013 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Strange idiom
I have checked Dictionary.com reference guide, done Google search and I can't find an explanation of the expression "blossom years". What does this mean and can you rephrase so more people will know what is being talked about? 69.125.134.86 (talk) 22:51, 9 July 2013 (UTC)