Talk:Llantwit Major/GA1

GA Review
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Reviewer: Grapple X (talk · contribs) 22:34, 16 February 2012 (UTC)

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria Ah Wales. Thanks for Alex James, Shirley Bassey, Richard Burton and Christian Bale. I guess that makes us even for Tom Jones, Charlotte Church and the accent.


 * 1) Is it reasonably well written?
 * A. Prose quality:
 * B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists:
 * I'm not sure a full etymological breakdown of the name is needed right up front. Stick it in a note ( to create the note and to cite it). Keep a translation up top, though, and append the note to that. I'd suggest splitting the opening paragraph of the lead into two, breaking it at "Llantwit Major's name is taken from the Welsh name "Llanilltud Fawr"", as that starts a train of thought on its history, changing from the previous information on its location. "Llantwit Major's name is taken from the Welsh name "Llanilltud Fawr", named after Saint Illtud, who came to the area from Brittany, France and founded the monastery of Illtud and the college attached to it, Cor Tewdws, which would grow into one of the most esteemed Christian colleges of the times, attracting over 2000 students at peak including princes and numerous eminent clergymen, now revered as saints." -> Really should be more than one sentence. I'd suggest " Llantwit Major's name is taken from the Welsh name "Llanilltud Fawr", named after Saint Illtud, who came to the area from Brittany, France. He founded the monastery of Illtud and the college attached to it, Cor Tewdws, which would grow into one of the most esteemed Christian colleges of the times. At its peak, it attracted over 2000 students, including princes and numerous eminent clergymen, now revered as saints."
 * I'm not sure a full etymological breakdown of the name is needed right up front. Stick it in a note ( to create the note and to cite it). Keep a translation up top, though, and append the note to that. I'd suggest splitting the opening paragraph of the lead into two, breaking it at "Llantwit Major's name is taken from the Welsh name "Llanilltud Fawr"", as that starts a train of thought on its history, changing from the previous information on its location. "Llantwit Major's name is taken from the Welsh name "Llanilltud Fawr", named after Saint Illtud, who came to the area from Brittany, France and founded the monastery of Illtud and the college attached to it, Cor Tewdws, which would grow into one of the most esteemed Christian colleges of the times, attracting over 2000 students at peak including princes and numerous eminent clergymen, now revered as saints." -> Really should be more than one sentence. I'd suggest " Llantwit Major's name is taken from the Welsh name "Llanilltud Fawr", named after Saint Illtud, who came to the area from Brittany, France. He founded the monastery of Illtud and the college attached to it, Cor Tewdws, which would grow into one of the most esteemed Christian colleges of the times. At its peak, it attracted over 2000 students, including princes and numerous eminent clergymen, now revered as saints."


 * I've made into a separate paragrpah and reworded as you said but can you sort out the note of the translation into a footnote, cheers, I can't think how to do it!♦ Dr. Blofeld  13:57, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * "14 mile long coastline" -> Might be worth sticking Convert in here.
 * Converted all of the distances.♦ Dr. Blofeld  13:57, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * "The town's name in Welsh, Llanilltud Fawr, is named after him" -> Surely it's the town, and not the town's name, that is named after him? Perhaps "The town's name in Welsh, Llanilltud Fawr, is derived from his name"
 * Fixed.♦ Dr. Blofeld  14:12, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * "Hywel ap Rhys, king Glywysing (d. 886) was buried at the monastery." -> I don't know if this is one or two people. Is Glywysing the regnal name of Hywel ap Rhys; should it being "Hywel ap Rhys, king of Glywysing"; or are these two different people? Or have I missed something? "Tythe" should be "tithe", unless the Y is a common Welsh spelling (for the record though, Irish use of the word is always with an I, so I'm not sure it would be).
 * Fixed both.♦ Dr. Blofeld  14:12, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * "In the 20th century, Llantwit developed into a dormitory town and grew about 15 times in size to accommodate the RAF at St Athan." -> Since this is the first mention of the RAF in the article body, it'd be better to use "Royal Air Force".
 * Fixed.♦ Dr. Blofeld  14:12, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * There's a few more measurements under the "Geography" heading that could do with Convert - "100 yards" and several uses of miles.
 * Fixed.♦ Dr. Blofeld  14:12, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * "the The Tudor Tavern" -> drop the lower-case "the" here. Might also be best to move this to the front of the list so it reads "Of note are The Tudor Tavern, the Old Swan Inn, Old White Hart Inn, and West House Country Hotel Heritage Restaurant."
 * Fixed♦ Dr. Blofeld  14:12, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * "The current Mayor is Cllr Ralph Austin" -> Any word on the party Austin stands for, or the party breakdown of the council? Would be a good addition as the "local government" part of this section is a bit short.
 * Cllr means Councillor.♦ Dr. Blofeld  14:24, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * Not a problem, but a suggestion—there's plenty of listed buildings here, apparently. Might be worth firing up a list article of them, based on, for example, Listed buildings in Runcorn (urban area). There seems to be plenty of information that can be migrated or copied from this article to support a solid list.


 * Didn't you see the shrinkable box with the full list? May consider a split later though as there are plenty more buildings which could be written about.♦ Dr. Blofeld  13:52, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * "organize" -> Wales uses BrE, and not Oxford English, I believe. Should be "organise". There's also "organized walks" in another heading that could be changed too.


 * I believed I've fixed that.♦ Dr. Blofeld  13:57, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * "The Thomas's built the Town Hall clock to commemorate Queen Victoria’s Jubilee." - I fixed the erroneous apostrophe, but which Jubilee? QE2 just had a third one and she's reigned for less than Vickie did.


 * The geograph caption says it could be either Golden in 1887 or Diamond in 1897. Unsure, so I've removed the jubillee part.♦ Dr. Blofeld  14:22, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * 1) Is it factually accurate and verifiable?
 * A. References to sources:
 * B. Citation of reliable sources where necessary:
 * C. No original research:
 * "There is a plaque on the gatehouse, telling of its history. Historians have recently suggested that this plaque may have been erected after a grain-related incident involving local peasant Benjamin Kirkham that later resulted in his expulsion from the town." - Definitely needs cited.
 * C. No original research:
 * "There is a plaque on the gatehouse, telling of its history. Historians have recently suggested that this plaque may have been erected after a grain-related incident involving local peasant Benjamin Kirkham that later resulted in his expulsion from the town." - Definitely needs cited.


 * Removed.♦ Dr. Blofeld  13:44, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

I'd also like to see the three uncited entries under "Notable people" given citations, I would imagine these are already available on the relevant articles. If not then I could let them go as they're not hugely controversial.


 * Sourced.♦ Dr. Blofeld  13:44, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * 1) Is it broad in its coverage?
 * A. Major aspects:
 * B. Focused:
 * Seems okay. Big focus on landmarks but that's not distracting or detrimental.
 * Seems okay. Big focus on landmarks but that's not distracting or detrimental.


 * I think its a pretty comprehensive article, its only a small town and most of the detailed info is on the Illytd monastery and church. The historic buildings and early history and surfing/beach is really all that's notable about Llantwit. I've mentioned the fair, the artisan's shops and some of the other things but I feel the buildings which are covered are important to it.♦ Dr. Blofeld  14:27, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Oh I didn't mean that as a negative. GRAPPLE   X  22:28, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Is it neutral?
 * Fair representation without bias:
 * Seems neutral to me.
 * 1) Is it stable?
 * No edit wars, etc:
 * Stable and uncontroversial.
 * 1) Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?
 * A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:
 * B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:
 * Lose the two maps under the geography heading. They squash the text inwards too much, and the panorama is a much better image to keep here. There's also an image without a caption, should be given one. All the images are free which is nice.
 * Removed.♦ Dr. Blofeld  13:57, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Removed.♦ Dr. Blofeld  13:57, 17 February 2012 (UTC)


 * 1) Overall:
 * Pass or Fail:
 * I've pointed out a few heft of minor issues but this should really only take a brief period to see to. Sticking this on hold for the time being to address these. Your range of interests never ceases to confuse me, Doctor. GRAPPLE   X
 * Looks good to me. I think you misunderstood me about the local government (I was wondering which political parties were represented in the council, especially which one the mayor belonged to), but I went and had a look for that and added it. Going to pass this one now. Well done! GRAPPLE   X  22:28, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

Thanks, I appreciate it.♦ Dr. Blofeld  22:35, 17 February 2012 (UTC)