Talk:Lorenzo Da Ponte

Removed "Further reading"
How do we know that the reference to a book about da Ponte removed today (5 December 2006) was just a commercial tie-in? Goochelaar 17:14, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
 * We don't, but we can look at the accounts other edits and come to a reasonable conclusion. Mak (talk)  17:29, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
 * OK, now I see that all the contributions by that user are about books from the same publisher. Goochelaar 21:42, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Problem
There's a problem here that I don't know how to fix. The page on bishops of Vittorio Veneto has a reference to Lorenzo Da Ponte, which redirects here, which is wrong, because it's about this Da Ponte's namesake, the bishop, and not about the librettist. 131.215.242.164 22:51, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Fixed, the bishop now does not link here, but to an article not yet written on Lorenzo da Ponte (bishop). Wish they were all that easy! Eebahgum (talk) 17:15, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Image of da Ponte
The portrait attached to this article has been found, by User:Wetwassermann and with the support of User:ChristianBier, not to be of da Ponte at all, but of Beaumarchais. See also here Hence it has today been deleted from the da Ponte article. Eebahgum (talk) 22:22, 16 April 2008 (UTC)


 * The now attached portrait is ok. --Wetwassermann (talk) 13:43, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

About Tham153's edits
I restored my entry on Da Ponte in science ficiton, mainly because I like SF and resent all those who sort of snub it. Besides which, this isn't a commercial promotion, but a factual mention of the man's appearing in a novel. I didn't list the author, publisher, or price. I think Goochelaar just resents SF.Tham153 (talk) 23:54, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * A novel which you wrote and which is as yet completely unknown. Do not use Wikipedia as a promotional tool or you will be blocked. If it becomes significant then it can be readded. -- Necrothesp (talk) 08:37, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * To Tham153: first of all, please do not make assumption about people you do not know anything about. You might have a surprise, should you care to check my editing history. But all of this is widely beside the point. You added a mention to a non-notable book by a non-notable author (whose article has been deleted twice, as you are well aware), and this is plainly against WP rules. Happy editing, Goochelaar  (talk) 11:54, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The book has been nominated for a 2008 Sidewise Award (winners are announced at the World Science Fiction Convention, August 6-10, 2009 in Montreal). "Non-notable"?  Keep your innane prejudices to yourself and out of wikipedia!  Sharon G. Rosen (Yes, I knew the author--he was a professor I took 2 courses with.  Wanna make something of it?)
 * If the book is notable, and it may well be for all I know, please start an article about it (even a stub) and then link to it. Till then, I stand my opinion. A generic mention, without even the name of the author and just an ISBN, is not particularly meaningful nor easy to evaluate. And, of course, please do not make personal attacks. Thanks, Goochelaar  (talk) 22:06, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

burial location
Green-wood cemetery appears to have a memorial marker for da Ponte and Find-a-grave claims that he's buried in that cemetery at an unknown spot, but some quick googling doesn't find any substantive documentation of this. The 1922 dissertation "Da Ponte, Poet and Adventurer" p.138 goes on at some length to say that da Ponte was buried in a Catholic cemetery at 11th st between 1st Ave and Ave. A (I think that means in lower Manhattan) but the exact location of his remains is unknown, and that a 19th century biographer (Krehbiel) had unsuccessfully search for his grave. Anyone know more about this, perhaps from more modern sources? I will add a cite request to the article for now. 67.117.145.149 (talk) 02:29, 29 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I remember an article appeared in Opera News, the magazine of the Metropolitan Opera Guild, some 40 years ago, discussing this matter. Da Ponte was buried in a cemetery in Lower Manhattan. When that cemetery was dismantled so that the plot could be sold by Church authorities, all the remains were transferred and mass-buried at what is now Calvary Cemetery in Sunnyside, Queens. The author of the article had obtained this information after having made an enquiry to the librarian of the  Catholic archdiocese of New York.

208.87.248.162 (talk) 04:13, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Should he be in American Jews cat
Should someone who converted to Roman Catholicism before coming to the US be in the American Jews cat. He was for many intents and purposes no longer a Jew by the time he became an American.John Pack Lambert (talk) 07:05, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * He was an ordained Roman Catholic priest, and was buried from Old Saint Patrick's Cathedral, which proves that, notwithstanding his irregular life, he died in the communion of the Church.

208.87.248.162 (talk) 04:17, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Grocer notability
I boldly added the category "American Grocers" and it's been quickly removed with the comment "not notable for this". I am very, very unlikely to start an actual fist fight over this but I just wanted to comment: (1) that I do find it notable, or quirky, or worth noting or knowing, or something, that Mozart's librettist ran a grocery shop in the USA. It seems so unlikely and out-of-era that I wondered if it was not perhaps worth listing him as such. And if it's not, why is the fact in the article at all? The other point is (2) I know that WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS (or whatever) is a pretty annoying argument but, actually, is he notable for all the other categories in which he is listed here? What exactly are the criteria for that notability? If we are strict on this I'd think there are very very few of them for which he's notable - they are just facts about him, perhaps interesting ones, perhaps not ... a bit like his having been a grocer! Ah, but this is where we came in ... I think I will go and make a nice cup of tea now. Best wishes DBaK (talk) 09:31, 22 February 2013 (UTC)
 * "he briefly ran a grocery store" – I think removing that category was correct, for the reason given. As for the other categories: I can't see any quite as clearly inappropriate as the grocer's except for Category:American Roman Catholic priests and Category:American opera librettists because he was not American when he wrote the librettos he's famous for, nor was he active as a priest in America; in fact, categorising him as a priest seems very close to the grocer's category: a triviality with no bearing on his life. However, if the priest-related categories remain, the Category:Italian Roman Catholics ought to be removed as an unnecessary parent category. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 13:13, 22 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I believe his priesthood is in fact relevant because it touched significantly on his early career.--Smerus (talk) 15:35, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

New York Opera Company 1st in the US?
I'm pretty sure this is not true. I know I've even read it in Burkholder's A History of Western Music but what about New Orleans? There Le Théâtre de la Rue Saint-Pierre functioning by the time of the Louisiana Purchase (1803) then Le Théâtre d'Orléans (1815), both long before the New York Opera Company and with the 2nd even being constructed after the Louisiana Purchase, making it unambiguously an American opera house. The only references I have are the other Wikipedia pages so I'm leery about changing anything unless someone with more knowledge on the subject can corroborate that New Orleans really gets slighted in write ups of American opera. Joshisanonymous (talk) 15:17, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

Assessment comment
Substituted at 22:26, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

DEFAULTSORT/listas
User:Johnsoniensis recently changed the article's DEFAULTSORT and listas on this talk page from "Da Ponte, Lorenzo" to "Ponte, Lorenzo Da" (to nit pick, listas was changed to Ponte, Lorenzo Da with a leading space). I think that's wrong. Every other Wikipedia and Commons use "Da Ponte, Lorenzo". So do dictionaries and encyclopedias. The previous sort order ought to be restored. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 01:43, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
 * PS: The same applies to Mario Del Monaco and that article's talk page. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 03:12, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
 * PPS: … and at Giuseppe Di Stefano. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 03:24, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I see now that Da Ponte should not have been changed because he became an American. Is there a specific rule somewhere that says that Italian names with prefixes "de" "d'" or "della" should not be treated the same way as names of a similar form in French, Spanish or Protuguese? I have always treated them that way so far without objection.--Johnsoniensis (talk) 10:13, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
 * IMO Da Ponte's American status has nothing to do with it – it's incidental. The place to look is a) the Italian Wikipedia; b) WP:NAMESORT, especially WP:NAMESORT; c) dictionaries and encyclopedias; d) how their names appears in publications (Da Ponte, Del Monaco, Di Stefano, not Ponte, Monaco, Stefano). -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 11:38, 29 January 2020 (UTC)

Make the dates more obvious when you write bios, pleeeeeeze!
I can't believe I had to read the whole article, carefully, in order to find out what year Da Ponte moved to USA. In a biographical article like this, EVERY sub-section which has a title like "American career" should say, in the FIRST sentence, WHEN his American career began, that is, when he moved there. I should be able to find a date like that without looking for more than FIVE SECONDS! Very grumpily yours, HandsomeMrToad (talk) 18:05, 25 October 2023 (UTC)