Talk:Louis Leakey

Louis Semour Bazett
Leakey, Louis Semour Bazett (1903-72): Louis Leakey was the British anthropologist, who, in East Africa, was to discover the fossilized remains of a number of "pre-men." For an enjoyable read, and, an insight in the work of the Leakey family; read Richard E. Leakey's book, The Making of Mankind (1981) (New York: Dutton, 1981). Born in Kabete Kenya, he grew up, played, and learned to hunt with Africans. He also learned to walk with the distinctive gait of the Kikuyu and speak their language as fluently as English. At 13, after discovering stone tools, he began to develop his lifelong passion for prehistory. He studied at Cambridge University, graduating in 1926. He discovered several human and proto-human skeletons or partial skeletons at Olduvai Gorge and Rusinga Island, firmly outlining man's early ancestral tree. Among his many extraordinary finds was the 1959 unearthing of 'Zinjanthropus', a robust hominid that hinted at the great complexity of mankind's evolutionary roots. In 1972, Leakey died in of a heart attack in London. He was 69. One of Leakey's greatest legacies stems from his role in fostering field research of primates in their natural habitats, which he understood as key to unraveling the mysteries of human evolution. Leakey touch chose three female researchers, later dubbed 'Leakey's Angels', who each went on to become giants in the field of primatology. Jane Goodall became the first of Leakey's Angels in 1957, when she began her first field study of chimpanzee culture in the Gombe Stream National Park in Tanzania. In 1967, Dian Fossey became Leakey's second Angel, beginning her extended study of mountain gorillas in the Virunga Volcanoes of Rwanda. In 1971, Biruté Galdikas became the third, when she began field studies of Orangutans in the jungles of Borneo. Louis Leakey was married to Mary Leakey, who made perhaps the most important discovery in Palaeolithic archeology, the Laetoli footprints. The footprints, which established the earliest record of truly bipedal gait, were found preserved in volcanic ash in Tanzania. He is also the father of paleoanthropologist Richard Leakey. Leakey's cousin, Rea Leakey, was a British tank commander during World War II.

I struggle to understand the purpose of the quote at the beginning of the article. Perhaps it could be removed? Aacarpio (talk) 17:06, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Rea / Nigel Leakey
I think louis' relative who was a tank commander (and a vc) was called nigel rather than Rea Leakey. mjfc
 * Nigel Leakey already has a wikipedia article. I dont know if he is a relative to Louis Leakey or not. Rea Leakey is obviously another person. Julius Sahara 21:25, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I found Rea's obituary. Rea and Nigel were brothers. Nigel died getting the VC and Rea went on to become a Major General. I don't see any VC in there but he had plenty of medals. They were the sons of Arundel Gray Leakey, a cousin of Louis Leakey. Poor old Gray was taken away by the Mau Mau and never heard from again, which was considered a great shame, because the Leakey family was pro-Kikuyu. The Leakey missionaries spoke against taking Kikuyu land whenever they could. Louis was a member of the tribe and Harry railed against the native policy to no avail. As to who should have an article the issue has already been raised. See under the Leakey disambiguation page. What do you think, folks?Dave 04:57, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

Leakey foundation by leakey user
Hello leakey, whoever you might be. Your user and discussion pages are empty! I note the changes in "early career" etc. regarding the Leakey foudation. They would not end up there, of course. Additional sections need to be added. The article has a long way to go.

But, it seems to me there is another very important concern. I recognize your phraseology as typical advertising hyp. What bothers me is that the Leakeys do not use this sort of hyp on any of their sites. They don't have to. Everyone already knows who and what they are. Moreover, the stuff is so pat that is looks as though it were copied from somewhere. So, I seriously question it. When those phrases finally do end up in the appropriate section, I will probably be deleting them, as this is not an article to sell the Leakey Foundation, which is forbidden by Wikipedia, and moreover it seems pretty much below the level of the Leakey sites. Their work brings them to public attention. They don't need the hyp.

I will be glad to consider any further argument as I write and it would be interesting to know why you chose that name, although, of course, it is not relevant. As far as I know, you can choose any name.Dave 17:56, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

Leakey on Race
I'm concerned by the "Leakey on race" section. It is merely a one sentence quote of his, with no explaining information. It makes him seem like a racist, which he very well could be, but it could easily have been taken seriously out of context. I am removing it for now and moving it here pending discussion. Indeed, I would be inclined to suggest that however great may be the physical differences between such races as the European and the Negro, the mental and psychological differences are greater still." - L.S.B. Leakey, in The Progress And Evolution Of Man In Africa (Oxford University Press), 1961  Ungovernable Force  Poll: Which religious text should I read? 05:29, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
 * It surely is out of context. Louis did not think like a settler, he thought like a Kikuyu. He even said, he spoke Kikuyu better than he did English. I saw him in the news films back in the 1950s prattling away in Kikuyu to some intent tribemen while everyone looked on in astonishment. There was no hesitation and no stuttering. He just went right on at a rapid clip. His main friends and his loyal friends were Kikuyu. I don't suppose the beatings he took in secondary school or his treatment by his former colleagues and mentors at Cambridge predisposed him to prefer the English, even though he was English. So that section is rightly removed and I would have done it had you not.Dave 04:46, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

Leakey a Presbyterian?
I can find no evidence that Leakey was a presbyterian. His parents were Anglican missionaries. He wished to follow in his father's footsteps, which can only have been as an Anglican. In case you might not have known, the presbyterian church was Scottish in origin and dates from the English revolution. The Anglican church was established by Henry VIII and was the established religion. Both were in Kenya. Do you have some evidence that Louis converted to the Presbyterians? This is Louis now, not anyone else in the family. As far as his being forced to go to church is concerned I neither have any idea nor do I see any relevance to this article. I doubt he would have had a problem with church. He used to preach to the other students until he got kicked in the head by them. At the same time he was clearly an evolutionist. I notice you have a blank user page. Have you got anything to back up the Presbyterian category? I deleted it again but if you find something we can put it back. One thing I notice is that the short Internet articles you see on Louis are full of some bad errors. I'm working mainly from books. So, we need a reference from a book, as the Internet is unreliable here, unless you are looking at a Leakey site. As far as I can tell from the books, after his concussion (which was really bad and may have contributed to some of his later behavior) he was not much of a church-goer and after he left Frida all the minsters would have been carping at him to leave Mary, including his parents, so I do not imagine he put up much of a show of church.Dave 04:21, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

rqimg
It would be nice if commons could acquire some Leakey pictures, which seem to be absent from there. Also Leakey place names appear to be absent as well, such as Kabete. I've looked high and low. Some desiderata: Kabete, Canon Leakey and his wife, Frida, Mary, the children, Heselon mukiri, Chief Koinange, any shots of Louis, the museum in Nairobi, the camp at Olduvai, Rusinga, Kanam, Kanjera, the Miocene Lady; in short, there is a deficit in the photos on this and related subjects which needs an enthusiast to fill. Bienvenue.Dave 17:04, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Ezeu and references
Mr. Ezeu! Do you think I would do an article like this without references? The main reference is Ancestral Passions and also I am using to a lesser degree "By the Evidence." Both those are listed there. Not only that but the Internet material is not just footnotes but is references as well. There a few facts from other books. Right now Ancestral Passions is about all I can handle. The problem is to keep it short for the material.

I think I know what you mean, though. I believe you want to see exact citations to chapters, possibly pages? Certainly that can be done. But what would you like to see cited? The whole thing is from the Ancestral Passions, just about. Have you read it? If you do you will see that the approach I have taken is quite moderate. I'm nearly done here except for clean-up. Why don't you state what ideas you would like to see cited and I will cite them? For the material on Kenya I am relying on Morell. If you have a problem with her perhaps you could suggest references to alternative views. I don't really have an interpretation of my own. If any views beyond basic have surfaced let me know and we can fix it. Meanwhile I will just finish up here and start putting in chapter numbers. To put in page numbers I will have to cite specific editions. But, you know, you have to let me know to what level we are going to cite (unless you do it). We can have a page number on every phrase, but it wouldn't look so good, you know?

What I am inclined to do is go with the chapter numbers. But, if you (or anyone) have not read the book, and want to question every idea, then certainly page numbers can be given. But on which ideas? There are a LOT of ideas in there. I appreciate your general comment and can respond to it generally but is that enough? What have you got in mind? Let me go on bit - I hate to leave things half done - and clean up and try to respond. At that point I think you have to get more specific in your commentary. If you or anyone else wants to pick up on it, feel free, according to Wikipedia custom. I'll play along as long as I feel we are getting somewhere on it. I still can't find any pictures. Wierd! You'd think there would be some!Dave 02:14, 25 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I am not saying the article was written without references, but that it is not obvious to the reader what references have been used and where. You do not need to reference exact pages. Use

, then simply every time you use the same reference. --Ezeu 02:42, 25 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Got it. I'm probably not as knowledgeable on the format as you so it may take a while to home in on it but I am sure you can help me out. I'm writing by successive approximation - broad strokes then refinement. By the way, great pic. Could use more if you can find any.Dave 03:19, 25 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Its difficult to find images with usage licences acceptable to Wikipedia, but I'll try. --Ezeu 03:23, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Box
I see Jane has nice box. How about one for Louis, ye box-makers? Dave 14:29, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Not a start now
I'm just about done with this except possibly for minor edits at some future time. I do apologize but I found I could not get the size down and still include adequate information for this important, free-thinking, liberal, and much-loved palaeoanthropolgist who played such an important part behind the scenes or partially so in numerous events of the modern world. Now it is someone else's turn. It could use pictures if anyone can find them. I'm not taking the templates off because I don't think that is my function. Take them off, put them on, just as you wish. If you find ways to improve it, by all means do.Dave 10:51, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

West Africa
In note 7, on the main page, it says that Louis Leakey demonstrated talking drums from the roof of a building in Cambridge. This might be true. Note that talking drums are found only in West Africa, not Louis Leakey's East Africa. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.145.11.103 (talk) 12:36, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Rattle-snakes
In the main article, under the heading "The Leakey Circus", rattlesnakes are mentioned. They seem to have been imported from America.

"White African"??
Louis Leakey spent 12 years in Kenya and 9 in England. He can not have remembered the first year or two. He seems to have spoken some Swahili and Kikuyu. It seems that he did not speak English with a White African accent. He seems not to have spoken Afrikaans. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.8.53.39 (talk) 16:58, 1 February 2008 (UTC) Potus lies (talk) 17:50, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
 * I must ask, how appropriate is that section title? "White African" ? --99.229.57.173 (talk) 23:17, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
 * It doesn't seem inappropriate to me, given that _White African_ was the title of one of his books.
 * On the first page of the Preface to his book Mau Mau and the Kikuyu Leakey explains that he speaks Kikuyu as well as, if not better than English. He spent most of his youth with the Kikuyu, and was a member of the Kikuyu age-group called the Mukanda. ixo (talk) 19:12, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

Brief revisit
I read this again a few years after I wrote it. I had forgotten that I wrote it. When I started I couldn't put it down! Then finally I remembered that I had written it! In all that time there have been few changes in content. Thank you, that means it is well-liked. I think the image of this remarkable man comes across, a man who really did say what he meant and meant what he said. He lived with a freedom most of us only dream of, and accepted the price of it. What makes him different from the many people who fly the skull and crossbones is that he never wavered in his philanthropic intent. As far as I can see, he was never out for Louis Leakey. He did what he had to do to survive, but it was always subordinate to the greater good. He didn't give a rat's tail for wealth, status and success. He threw off the yoke of slavery under which most of us concede to live, but he single-mindedly pursued what seemed to him best for society in the long run. Well I could go on at length. I don't plan to change the writing. Thanks for your contributions to the article. These items of the talking drums and the rattlesnakes, these things came from Louis Leakey not me. He was nothing if not a showman. His "lectures" I am told were standing room only and brought the house down, but none of that was in his personal interest, the way it is for Hollywood. A star without the glitz. He was no stuffed lion, no indeed. When I wrote this I was in awe of tags and didn't know too much about citing. I seem to be back on archaeology by natural interest. I'm going over these cites to see if they cannot be made more compatible with WP policy. Meanwhile, the tag was on long before I started. I never dared to remove it. It seems to me the article is adequately cited so I am going to take it off now. If you want to see a particular statement cited put an inline tag on it, but you know, once you start reading Louis, he takes over and dominates the scene. The article reflects totally what he said not what I say. What I have to say I just said. Ciao. I will start working on the cites.Dave (talk) 09:17, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

A Pretty Good Article
I was happy to read this article Dave; on reading it, it turns out that Leakey was not the man I expected him to be. I look forward to more citations though, as every time I read an opinion in a Wikipedia article which does not have one I wonder if it is really true. ixo (talk) 19:06, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

Schooling
If an article is about a person of British background, I think British terms ought to be used in its text, i.e. those that Leakey himself would have known. Just these two points about his education, for example:

1. 'In Britain the Leakey children attended elementary school...' Throughout the United Kingdom and its Commonwealth, the early years of formal education are referred to as 'primary schooling'. 'Elementary school' is a U.S. term. It's also likely that Leakey, as a child of the British middle classes, attended a private primary school, in which case it is called a 'preparatory school', i.e. preparing the pupil for entry to his 'public', (i.e. private) secondary school.

2. The word 'hazing' is also an American usage. The British term is 'bullying'. If I understand the US term, 'hazing' also has the connotation of 'initiation', whereas 'bullying' is simply persecution. Bluedawe 21:26, 30 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I agree for the following reasons.


 * First, Louis Leakey did not attend elementary school in England. Elementary schools were publicly funded schools established in England and Wales by the Elementary Education Act 1870 for the purpose of ensuring that all children between the ages of five and twelve received an elementary education. On the Leakey family's first trip home in 1905, Leakey was far too young to attend an elementary school, given that he did not turn two until 7 August 1905. On their second trip home, for a one-year-long furlough in 1911, Harry Leakey started up a preparatory school which Louis Leakey, with three other boys, attended. At the age of sixteen, Leakey attended Weymouth College. Weymouth College was an English public school in Weymouth, Dorset from 1863 to 1940. Hence, at no time did Louis Leakey ever attend an elementary school in England. (NB The term 'elementary education' disappeared from the lexicon in England and Wales with the passing of the Education Act 1944).


 * Second, according to the relevant definition in the OED, 'hazing' is

3. A species of brutal horseplay practised on freshmen at some American Colleges.
 * 124.186.216.23 (talk) 07:36, 10 October 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Louis Leakey. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070123142042/http://www.leakey.com/louis_leakey.htm to http://www.leakey.com/louis_leakey.htm

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 00:09, 7 January 2018 (UTC)

Use of cquote
Display quotes give undue weight to the quote, and therefore violate WP:NPOV they also contradict MOS:BLOCKQUOTE. s suchm a mere editorial prefernce for them cannot stand withotu good reasons why6 the policy an guideliens should not apply in nthe case. In the absence of a policy-based reason for using cquote or other forms of display quotes, I will remove them again. DES (talk)DESiegel Contribs 01:48, 21 December 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 20:30, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Louis Leakey.jpg

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 01:20, 19 April 2021 (UTC)
 * Louis Leakey.jpg

How has LSB Leakey made the evolution theory an authentic fact
How has LSB Leakey made the evolution theory an authentic fact 105.113.69.119 (talk) 13:09, 14 January 2024 (UTC)