Talk:Love & Mercy (film)

Requested move 2014

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: not moved. Armbrust The Homunculus 12:09, 2 August 2014 (UTC)

Love and Mercy (film) → Love & Mercy – The film is officially referred to as Love & Mercy on its TIFF profile and just about everywhere else. Ilovetopaint (talk) 12:03, 26 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Oppose per WP:DIFFPUNCT. If the film comes out with a "&" on the poster, like Love & Mercy (album), then maybe change it then, but it'll still need (film) because of Love and Mercy (Brian Wilson song) In ictu oculi (talk) 15:10, 26 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Oppose. I'm also concern about WP:DIFFPUNCT issues, with readers expecting to find Brian Wilson's 26-year-old song (which would have longer-term significance) when entering "&" instead of "and", not the recent film about him. Zzyzx11 (talk) 03:16, 27 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Oppose per IIO and Z11 -- 65.94.169.222 (talk) 08:51, 27 July 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

what is meaning of Future & Past?
Why use "Future" and "Past" instead of "Older" and "Younger" respectively? This is what I found in the cast listing, and I do not wish to change it without my question being answered:

John Cusack as Brian Wilson–Future Paul Dano as Brian Wilson–Past — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.47 (talk) 14:44, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Is "Older" and "Younger" how they are actually credited? Because official sources state that the roles are designated "Future" and "Past".--Ilovetopaint (talk) 19:09, 3 June 2015 (UTC)
 * After seeing the film I can report that Dano is credited "Brian Past" and Cusack "Brian Future".--Ilovetopaint (talk) 20:36, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

(Actually, there are 3 actors playing Brian Wilson. He's shown BRIEFLY as a child, so a child actor appears there.)  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.47 (talk) 15:06, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

Requested move 07 June 2015

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: not moved. Jenks24 (talk) 20:17, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

Love & Mercy (film) → Love & Mercy – See previous discussion from July 2014. Also I'm not quite sure that redirecting Love & Mercy to Love & Mercy (film) is proper formatting. Ilovetopaint (talk) 10:09, 7 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Oppose per 2014 move request. "Love & Mercy" should point to Love and Mercy. -- 70.51.202.183 (talk) 18:37, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Oppose per 2014 move request. Khestwol (talk) 19:48, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Oppose per 2014 move request. In ictu oculi (talk) 01:02, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Oppose per 2014 move request. --Seduisant (talk) 03:25, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Unless we are given to understand that the film's title is intended to be pronounced as Love Ampersand Mercy in a similar sense as I Heart Huckabees, then for disambiguation purposes, the "&" should be considered to be the same as "and". &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 17:12, 15 June 2015 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

a fictionalized-for-dramatic-effect item?
I have already seen the movie twice now, and I saw Brian's breakdown and retirement from touring (OK), but it goes IMMEDIATELY to: mention of the Beatles' "Rubber Soul" album; Brian saying to Marilyn that he's going to make the greatest album; work on the "Pets Sounds" songs.

The stuff I put after "IMMEDIATELY" is actually a year later, so we skip over "Help Me Rhonda", "California Girls", "Little Girl I Once Knew", "Barbara Ann" (all of these were singles coming out after Brian's retirement from touring and before the release of "Pet Sounds"); albums of this period were "The Beach Boys Today!", "Summer Days (and Summer Nights)", "Beach Boys Party" (the last of these was done for the Christmas market; although Brian had done some work on what we now call "Pet Sounds", there wasn't time to finish it to have it serve as the 1965 Christmas-market album). A greatest-hits album could signal that the Beach Boys were late in their career, and they had already had a Christmas album and a live-in-concert album.

Presumably Brian Wilson had the U.S. (not the U.K.) version of Rubber Soul album. "The Beach Boys: An American Family" program does have a living-room scene with a Christmas tree, with (actor playing) Brian walking into the room carrying a Rubber Soul album cover. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.47 (talk) 14:56, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

I just went to the Wikipedia page for "The Beach Boys Today!" album. Much or all of it was recorded before Brian retired from touring. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.47 (talk) 15:10, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

When Brian Wilson retired from the Beach Boys' tours, he was replaced (on the tours) briefly by Glen Campbell, and later in 1965 by Bruce Johnston. This movie does have someone in the role of Bruce Johnston, but because of the 1-year jump I wrote about, I do not see any taking into account of Glen Campbell (including that I see no one playing Glen Campbell). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.20 (talk) 17:30, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

I now see that Brian married 1st wife (Marilyn) on Dec. 7, 1964. When I go to Brian Wilson article, it says his breakdown was on a Dec. 23, 1964 flight.

I will comment on the year gap in Historical Accuracy section. (It was reverted by someone who complained about lack of sources, although Pet Sounds article here on wikipedia describes this period as well.)


 * See WP:PROVEIT and WP:CIRC.--Ilovetopaint (talk) 21:44, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

I haven't seen the film yet. But as a musician growing up in 60's, 70's LA and SDiego, I and friends were very aware of BBoys and BW's troubles.. or genuis! So i wonder if the film covers his late 70's 'run-away-from-home', being found wandering San Diego, and kept locked up for personal safety in the mental ward of the Alvarado Hospital?? No matter. We knew a fellow musician who was chilling-out there. Called us one day..'Hey, i just played some of my music for Brian Wilson of the BBoys!' Ok, no biggie, no surprize, except why's he here in san diego?? Anyways, we brought him over a little Fender? Farfisa? keyboard, give him something to do, help keep him focused? on what's important. The music.

Always felt Surf's Up and Holland their very best. (I also own Friends/Smiley Smile double albumn, Carl & the Passions/Pet Sounds double album.)

Speaking of genuis, wordsmith, songwriter, etc... Brian and Paul McCartney, yes that one.. born same year, w/in days of each other... 2602:304:CDAF:A3D0:4988:39E8:A3FA:214E (talk) 21:37, 26 June 2015 (UTC)


 * If you were "a musician [...] in 60's, 70's LA and SDiego", then how come you even remember it? ;) --80.187.113.170 (talk) 19:25, 10 July 2015 (UTC)

someone named "Graham"?
(I just wrote about "fictionalized for dramatic effect" -- see above.)

I heard the name "Graham" somewhere during the movie. I thought of Graham Nash, but there is no reason he'd be mentioned in this movie. Then I realized that an actor with the first name Graham is playing one of the Beach Boys (other than Brian Wilson himself). I am reminded that I read of an "I Love Lucy" episode where someone said "OK, Des" (no trailing "i") to Desi Arnaz, but I assume THIS should have been "OK, Ricky", because Ricky is the CHARACTER being played by Desi Arnaz. Do you understand what I am saying about use of "Graham"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.47 (talk) 15:02, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

For "I Love Lucy" bloopers (including the "OK, Des" remark I just wrote of), see:

http://ilovelucyzone.tripod.com/id21.htm

which includes:


 * 1) 44 "Ricky Loses His Voice", when Ricky is singing in the beginning of the show with Marco playing the piano, he tells Marco to call Lucy. Marco answers with, "OK, Des."... instead of Ricky.

Again, the question about "Love and Mercy" film is did I hear an actor's name used when the name used should have been that of the CHARACTER played by that actor? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.47 (talk) 15:50, 11 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Please use the talk page only to discuss improvements to the article. WP:NOTAFORUM--Ilovetopaint (talk) 19:41, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

If that "Graham" item does exist in the movie (I couldn't pick it up when I saw the movie for a 3rd time), it would be mentioned in this article. I did notice Graham Rogers in the role of Al Jardine, one of the Beach Boys. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.20 (talk) 16:05, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

Please check the part where the other Beach Boys meet Brian upon return from Japan tour. Elsewhere, that's the point where the other Beach Boys come across what Brian has done for the new album (Pet Sounds) and Mike Love has some misgivings. (Hang On To Your Ego became I Know There's An Answer on the album, but that change is not mentioned in this movie.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.47 (talk) 20:23, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

1 year discrepancy
In case it gets reverted, I am here repeating what I am saying in the "Historical Accuracy" section: Also, although this movie does include Brian resigning from the tours in December 1964, it conveys the impression that he quickly came across the "Rubber Soul" album by The Beatles. That album wasn't released until December 1965. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 167.102.56.94 (talk) 18:54, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Please see WP:VERIFY and WP:ORIGINALRESEARCH.--Ilovetopaint (talk) 10:12, 26 March 2017 (UTC)

____ it, the information can be put together from other Wikipedia articles. The Brian Wilson article has panic attack of Dec. 23, 1964 which caused him to leave touring (does someone have to prove such resignation occurred right around then?), and I get December 1965 (not 1964) release for Rubber Soul album per Wikipedia article about that album. You appear to be creating a runaround for inclusion of this one-year discrepancy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 167.102.56.186 (talk) 22:00, 10 August 2017 (UTC)


 * If one checks the links provided by Ilovetopaint one will see that Wiki articles cannot be used for cites inside wiki articles. Information, even though appearing in another wiki article, cannot be included without a cited reliable outside source supporting that information. Amongst other things this helps avoid the criticism that Wikipedia is less than trustworthy in the information it provides. Please check the WP:VERIFY link at the very least to gain a good understanding of this requirement.THX1136 (talk) 19:56, 31 December 2017 (UTC)


 * FWIW - Interesting note on the Rubber Soul issue. In the booklet that came with the 1999 release of Pet Sounds, Brian - in the foreword dated Mar. 1990 - mentions he heard Rubber Soul in December of 1966 which motivated him to start on Pet Sounds. I only mention this as I found it interesting. People say a lot of things that conflict. In Brian's case I can imagine he may not be remembering entirely correctly. In the same booklet it has many, if not all, of the recording dates as being prior to Dec. 1966. My guess is the actual date he heard the album was Dec. 65, but if the cd booklet is used as a source, Brian would have heard RS after Pet Sounds was finished and released.THX1136 (talk) 00:48, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

Interesting Note
Since it's a quote from Consequence of Sound it need not be changed. But I think they got it wrong. I am reasonably certain the "concert" portion was clearly depicting the TAMI show appearance by the group - not the concert used for the 64 live album.THX1136 (talk) 01:19, 31 December 2017 (UTC)


 * The Concert homage in the film appears only seconds before the TAMI recreation.--Ilovetopaint (talk) 08:27, 31 December 2017 (UTC)


 * Right you are. I had forgotten about the other two "concert" portions in the intro of the film. Thanks for the correction ILTP!THX1136 (talk) 19:41, 31 December 2017 (UTC)

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