Talk:Main Building (University of Texas at Austin)

Added...
...a bit about the Burleson Bells today. Follow that link, there's a picture of them. I guarantee you'll recognize the structure, and go "Oh!" I had no idea what those things were even though I passed them almost every day. (I only know because I did a story about UT's building architecture when I was a student.) · Katefan0(scribble)/ mrp 19:59, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Actually, I knew they were tower bells but not the OLD MAIN bells ;-) I forgot to add them to the article! I know  checked out a fantastic book from the PCL that covered a lot of the Tower destruction and construction in 1934-7.  Did you know that people wrote poems in protest? LOL.  Now we write rock songs, so I suppose it's just poetry with a melody. Anyway, I'm hoping we can check it out again and get more information.  Any chance that you wrote any of those articles on the Tower?  &mdash; Scm83x talk [[Image:Hookem_hand.gif|18px]] 20:08, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I'll never tell! &middot; Katefan0(scribble)/ mrp 20:22, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

libraries
Does anybody know if that little science library is still in the main building, also? It was when I was a student a few years ago. I remember going up into this teeny room with horrendously narrow stack aisles (and the referenced dumbwaiter) to do research for a term paper on fetal alcohol syndrome. · Katefan0(scribble)/ mrp 20:04, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Again, I think goes there to study a lot.  I've never been inside the library there but he mentioned it being the "Life sciences" library.  No doubt, it's still there. &mdash; Scm83x talk [[Image:Hookem_hand.gif|18px]] 20:08, 20 January 2006 (UTC)


 * But before you get into the teeny stacks, there is the is the main reading room with its beautifully stenciled beams. UT still has it mentioned on their website at this link. Johntex\talk 20:08, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I should clarify that link has more than a mention - they have some nice photos there. The stencilling includes the wording from the constitution about the establishment of a university of the first class...Johntex\talk 20:10, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Anyone think it'd be relevant to have a picture of the Life Science library on the page? I don't have anymore classes today, so I could go snap one. &mdash; Scm83x talk [[Image:Hookem_hand.gif|18px]] 20:16, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, that's it. Life sciences library.  I knew it was some science or another.  I never had a reason to go there until I did that paper on FAS, I remember how shocked I was to learn that "MAI" on UTCAT meant main building :/ &middot; Katefan0(scribble)/ mrp 20:18, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I think it'd be fun to have a shot of the dumbwaiter (which they were still using as of a couple years ago. I was completely befuddled by it.) &middot; Katefan0(scribble)/ mrp 20:18, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Egad - I'm surrounded by Liberal Arts majors!!! :-)  I spent *a lot* of time in that library.  It is very conveniently located to the greenhouses and the turtle pond.  Although I think I remember reading a while back that the turtle pond was jeopardized by some new building expansion.  Is it still there?  And yes, a photo from the Life Science Library would be awesome, please.  Johntex\talk 20:22, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Yeah, it's still there. I doubt they'd get rid of it now that they made it into also a memorial to the tower shootings.   &middot; Katefan0(scribble)/ mrp 20:27, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Scm83x and I grabbed a few shots of the Life Sciences Library earlier this afternoon. Scm83x also asked one of the librarians about the dumbwaiter; apparently, they removed it quite a while back. Now all that's left of the shaft that housed the dumbwaiter is a closet filled with wiring and servers for the computers throughout the Tower. -Rebelguys2 01:54, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

Suicides
Just for the record, how many suicides took place before the barriers were installed? (needed for the suicide sites article) - Eagleamn 04:38, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
 * 9 suicide jumpers, not included Whitman, who arguable committed suicide by cop. The tower was closed intermittently due to the suicides and the shootings, until the barrier solution was finally adopted. I put a link to this newspaper article over at "List of suicide sites" for you.  Johntex\talk 04:50, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Where the hell is it?
Does the building have an address? Is it on a street some where? Funkyj 19:59, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Great question! It's in the middle of the campus. It is basically in the center of this Google map I guess the address would be off "Inncer Circle Drive" or maybe off "West 22nd Street".  My initial attempt to find an actual street address has not been sussessful - the hits I'm finding give a mail stop, not a street address.  I'll keep looking. Johntex\talk 20:13, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Here is the street address:
 * The University of Texas at Austin
 * 2400 Inner Campus Drive
 * Austin, Texas 78712
 * I see Jareha has already added the appropriate maps and geographical coordinates to the article. Johntex\talk 22:30, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

the tower is 28-floors tall
According to, the tower is 28-floors tall, with the observation deck being on the 28th floor. elaborates:

For the first time since it was built, the observation deck will be accessible to people who would be unable to climb a series of small stairs leading from the 27th floor to the observation deck. A newly installed elevator between the 27th floor and the observation deck is among the renovations made in recent months to prepare the Tower observation deck for reopening. TerraFrost 17:29, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * According to, it's actually 29 stories tall. Maybe the tower has a basement and they're counting that? TerraFrost 17:41, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * We discussed this somewhere before but I don't remember where. (The main UT article perhaps).  We were not able to reach a definitive conclusion.  For one thing, the observation deck is not the highest point in the structure.  There is definitely a basement; should that count as a "story"? The Carillon is housed above the observation deck.  Should that count as a "story"?
 * If I recall correctly we went with "27 floors" because that is the number of "floors" of office space. Johntex\talk 18:31, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Hmmm - interesting. It doesn't seem to be in the talk pages for University of Texas, so I guess I'll have to keep my eye out for it :) TerraFrost 18:45, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * It's a hard number to pin down, and possibly merits some qualification and/or further details in the article. 27, as points out, is the true number of floors that are (potentially) usable as office/administrative space and accessible directly by means of the Tower's twin elevators (which are denoted "1 - West" and "2 - East"), or the stairwell that parallels them. This number (27) is what appears in various authoritative articles such as  and . The Main building does have basement space, but there is no basement below the Tower itself -- it's all structural there (probably lots of dead crickets, too).
 * The building's floor plans, which are not to my knowledge available anywhere to the general public, detail the basement and 32 total numbered floors. Access to the observation deck is, of course, tightly restricted, and limited to hosted tours by reservation; a metal detector was installed at the entrance of the corridor that leads to the Tower elevators coincident with the reopening of the observation deck for public tours, but it is only used to screen those going on the tours, not for employees who have an official need and authorization to access any of the lower floors on a regular basis. According to the brochure available on the University Unions' Tower Tours site, "Patrons will ride an elevator to the 27th floor of the Tower, then take three short flights of stairs to the observation deck. An auxiliary elevator is available if needed." I'm uncertain as to whether the observation deck is actually on the 28th or the 29th floor, but 28th does seem likely, and it's what appears in Main Building (University of Texas at Austin). The floors above the 29th are the guts of the carillon and Tower clock.
 * Having said all this, I'm not sure how much is worthy of the article or the best way to distill it. The introduction currently asserts 30 floors, which seems rather random and unsubstantiated (the reference cited there is not exactly apropos to the content either, methinks, but that's a separate matter). I'd vote for at least changing that number to 27, with or without some sort of "administrative space" or "office space" qualification (although either of those would be somewhat misleading as well, since many of the floors in the tower are completely vacant, others house things like botanical samples, and so forth), and adding one or more of the references noted above (and/or others that won't be hard to find) that support that number. Barring objection, I'm happy to make at least that much of an edit, and to hear other suggestions/arguments as well. Lardofdorkness (talk) 02:32, 20 April 2019 (UTC)

Requested move
I would like to move the article to Main Building (The University of Texas at Austin). The disambiguation page Main Building lists the other Main Buildings in the United States with their respective university's in parentheses. The University of Texas at Austin sites the name as Main Building and not Main Building of The University of Texas at Austin. Building Website Comments? Do you agree? NThomas76207 (talk) 06:13, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

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Introduction -- pertinence of citation to content
Near the end of my post on the thread the tower is 28-floors tall, I stated in passing that the article cited after the introductory content does not appear to be directly pertinent to any of the text that precedes it. The intro at present reads:

The Main Building (known colloquially as The Tower) is a structure at the center of the University of Texas at Austin campus in Downtown Austin, Texas, United States. The Main Building's 307-foot (94 m) tower has 30 floors and is one of the most recognizable symbols of the university and the city.

The citation that immediately follows these two sentences was added by early in 2008, and the article it references details an interview with Cheryl Botts Dickerson, who encountered Charles Whitman (the "Texas Tower Sniper") atop the UT Tower in the midst of his infamous killing spree in 1966. It is a truly chilling account, and it possibly deserves mention elsewhere in the Main Building article; but since it does not expressly bear upon any of the points presented immediately before, it should be replaced or simply removed. I believe the first paragraph at WP:WHYCITE may serve somewhat to defend this:

By citing sources for Wikipedia content, you enable users to verify that the information given is supported by reliable sources, thus improving the credibility of Wikipedia while showing that the content is not original research. You also help users find additional information on the subject; and by giving attribution you avoid plagiarising the source of your words or ideas.

Located where it is, the citation is in most direct proximity to the end of the second sentence, "The Main Building's 307-foot (94 m) tower has 30 floors and is one of the most recognizable symbols of the university and the city"; however, as the article cited does little to substantiate the physical characteristics noted in the first clause, readers may be led to infer that it stands instead to lend credence to the second clause, which asserts the Tower's status among the locale's "most recognizable symbols". This potentially serves to impart an initial bias to the Wikipedia article by the single association offered in its introductory passage. While the Whitman story is inarguably a well-known and notable part of UT's past, it does not merit promotion as the reason the Tower is so recognizable a local landmark (and even if it did, a link to the Whitman or Tower shooting article might be preferable to/more elucidating than a reference to a single eye-witness account). As it stands, I believe this second clause requires either: (To be clear, the declaration that the Tower is recognizable is not in dispute.) It should be noted that the citation in question was initially placed within the sentence, immediately after the number of floors, which was changed from 32 to 28 in the same edit; and to be fair, the referenced story's epilogue does begin, "Twenty-eight floors below...". That doesn't really serve to confirm the information referencing it in the Wikipedia article, though, as it is simply a phrase within a journalistic narrative, not an authoritative or verifiable source of information about the building's architecture. Although this citation has stood now for over 11 years, it seems dubious as to whether it was ever an appropriate or helpful reference, either as originally inserted or in its current location (I have not yet searched the history for when it was moved to the end). To remedy these specific points, I would like to update the number of floors from 30 to 27 per my arguments in the thread noted above, adding references to any of the sources I mentioned and/or others. The height spec deserves citation too, I'd imagine, likely pointing to some of the same sources. '''UPDATE: I have made these changes. Lardofdorkness (talk) 21:08, 21 April 2019 (UTC)''' Most importantly, in the interest of rectifying my primary concern here (WP:WEIGHT seems to get at it), I would like to remove the Dickerson interview citation, possibly replacing it with references to one or more other sources that support the "most recognizable" claim more broadly. I'm not certain as to what will fill the bill here and would invite suggestions (or others to add what feels appropriate themselves), but I am inclined at the very least to delete the reference now, and tag the end of the paragraph as requiring citation (assuming any is indeed needed). Please chime in with any dissenting or supporting views, applicable standards and guidelines and such, as well as ideas for good sources to cite and other guidance apropos of the concerns that I've raised. Thanks! Lardofdorkness (talk) 16:36, 21 April 2019 (UTC)
 * more and better references that further illuminate what makes the Tower recognizable; or,
 * perhaps none at all, as the rest of the article already speaks to the history (including the 1966 massacre), tradition, and other notable points for which the Tower is known.