Talk:Man versus Horse Marathon

Untitled
The story of Guto and the horse is discredited in his own article.

Unfortunately, it's not true that bicycles are prohibited from bridleways. --Auximines 13:36, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I find article claims about bike participation doubtful, unless the course terrain is crazy (rocks, logs, etc) a bicycle would beat a runner (and by article's reasoning, any horse) by a huge margin: on most roads/packed dirt trails a good mountain biker could have ~15-20mph sustained speed.

(and the best result mentioned in the article has an overall speed of less than 11mph).

Similarly, the claim:

"In 1989, British cyclist Tim Gould beat the first horse by three minutes - the first time that a horse was beaten by a human in the race."

is doubtful. Pro bicyclists can maintain road speeds in excess of 25mph for several hours. I was under impression that this is quite a bit faster than what a horse can do.

Shouldn't there be a column for whether the race was won by a horse, a cyclist or a runner?

From someone who was there
I rode in this race in 1984 and 1985. I was actually in 2nd place in 85 when a collision with a razor/barbed wire fence ripped up arm and I ended up 9th cyclist. I still have the scars. Comparisons with what a road cyclist does are essentially meaningless. If you want a sensible comparison, look at cyclocross racing instead. Tim Gould was indeed the first cyclist to beat a horse on this course. Its possible that had mountain biking drawn the attention of some professional cyclists back in the mid-80's, this event would have happened sooner. But this was, as the UK's "Bicycling" magazine put it years later, the "pre-history" of UK mountain bike racing. Even when top US riders like Joe Murray came to try this event, they could not beat the horse. I raced Tim Gould on a couple of other occasions, and although he probably wasn't much a of pro road racer, he was an amazingly talented mountain bike racer, especially in the muddy, nasty conditions that the UK (and this race in particular) were known for. And yes, by comparison with US mountain bike racing of that time, this course's terrain was crazy. Sufficiently so that only someone with a lot of experience of this kind of terrain would ever beat a horse or even a runner. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.59.25.70 (talk) 02:59, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Urban legend it must be
I sounds mega-bullshit that a human runner on foot could defeat a horseman over 40-something kilometers. Either those horses were centennials or there is some skullduggery going on here. They definitely did not use the noble arabian horses, which regularly run a 1000 kilometers over terrible desert terrain without much water or stopping. 82.131.210.162 07:30, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
 * But what speed do those Arabian horses make? Probably not very fast. Vultur (talk) 23:39, 27 August 2008 (UTC)


 * You're vastly underestimating the speed of a well-trained athlete. The competitors in this race are not even elite distance runners, and they can average ~11mph over 22 miles. The world record for the marathon (26.2 miles) averages over 12.5 miles per hour.  The article on horse gait claims that, at a trot (horses cannot gallop for more than a mile or two, even Arabian horses), horses only average around 8mph--137.22.112.142 (talk) 02:00, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * There is hardly any evidence in the article on endurance riding that there are 1000 kilometer events. (However, that article seems mainly to reflect the sport from a U.S.A. perspective.)  It does mention "multi-day" events, but doesn't give details.  So, the 1000 KM events could be some of these.  That article suggests a horse in a 100 mile event can average about 8.3 to 10 MPH. 206.53.197.24 (talk) 02:40, 12 October 2008 (UTC)


 * While it is my own experience and so not really permissible, I regularly run along side a "noble arabian horse" ridden by my mother, and also regularly beat it over 5 miles. This is not far fetched at all. However it probably should be added that I'm quite into my fitness training and neither my mother or her horse is. Humans are well designed for long distance running compared to most animals.80.41.175.7 (talk) 09:31, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

More info?
The article is entirely lacking in route description. Is it primarily ross country? Roads/lanes? River crossings? Any steeples? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gatematemakeshaketohatehats (talk • contribs) 20:59, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

Wouldn't the article be more informative if it mentioned how many runners, horses, and bicyclists participate? How many runners go in hoping to beat a horse? How many runners beat the slowest horse, and how many horses beat the slowest runners? Also, I recently heard from a marathoner in my neighborhood that this is just one of several man vs. horse events. Shouldn't the others be mentioned in this article? 206.53.197.24 (talk) 02:09, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

I noticed that, in the table of results from 2000 to 2008, a runner and horse-and-rider always make up first and second (in either order). Has it never been the case that human runners placed first and second, or horses placed first and second? 206.53.197.24 (talk) 02:47, 12 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The table has been modified to show the fastest horse, and the fastest human. It no longer implies 2nd place overall. SlowJog (talk) 01:29, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

Human/horse comparison/background data
This would be more interesting with some background information, particularly on the physical performance characteristics of both humans and horses. Naively, one would expect a horse to win easily, since their top speed is much greater than a humans, but clearly the whole premise is that isn't necessarily the case. How long can a horse gallop without stopping? How long must they be rested? Are they rested, or do they just run at a slower pace for longer distances? What is different about human and horse physiology that gives them different endurances? Also, How does the terrain factor in, does that aid human or horse? 207.58.192.150 (talk) 17:27, 15 September 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree. Part of the answer, at least with regard to humans, can be found in the article on Persistence hunting.  Humans are better able to dissipate heat due to light hair and a lot of seat glands. SlowJog (talk) 04:14, 26 September 2009 (UTC)

15 minutes head start
This should be renamed "Man with 15 minutes head start versus horse marathon". Even in the text it's not clear that this is a handicap race where the humans are given a big advantage. The text makes a short mention of it like we were supposed to know of this advantage but it's not described anywhere. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.184.78.70 (talk) 16:32, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Yes, this race is stupid if the humans are given a head start. I realize that it is a timed race, so the head start doesn't really matter, but why not have the horses and humans start at the same time, if you are timing both? I doubt a well-trained horse would be spooked by a few humans running alongside. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.103.249.246 (talk) 23:42, 3 September 2014 (UTC)


 * The 15 minutes is accounted for at the finish line - the times of the humans and horses are compared. The first human across the line has to wait 15 minutes to find out if they've beaten the horse or not :-)
 * As for starting at once - there's not a lot of room at the start line and someone would almost certainly be trampled. "A few" runners and a couple of horses would probably be OK. A few hundred runners and ~50 horses is another matter entirely. 137.44.4.110 (talk) 14:46, 22 September 2014 (UTC)
 * You really shouldn't use the word "stupid" if you don't understand why the humans and horses don't run together. -- 184.189.217.210 (talk) 05:49, 20 November 2017 (UTC)

Rules are lacking
The terms for humans and horses for the race seem to be different, but they are not explained in the article. How is the start organised? A mass start with 40 horses, 500 humans and bicycles sounds difficult. Is the race course the same? Do they compete on the same lane? Are there dangerous situations if man, horses and bicycles overtake each other? How is the turf (grassland, forrest, road, rocky) - is it the same for bikes, horses and humans? difference in altitude? Regards Minoo (talk) 10:27, 28 August 2016 (UTC)

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Why does this Man versus Horse Marathon get the article?
The lede admits there are several Man vs. Horse Marathons. That being the case, why is it this one has a WP article? Is this one somehow more prominent or notable than the others? If not, what should be done? Can this article be turned into an article about man vs. horse marathons in general, perhaps with a table or paragraphs about specific such events? SlowJog (talk) 00:35, 31 July 2023 (UTC)


 * This one seems to be the original and from the looks of the dead links, the only one still extant.
 * And given the coverage, this seems to be the only one meeting notability and verifiability.
 * If anything I'm tempted to remove the others as irrelevant. If you think there's enough for a more general article, then it should probably be at something like Competition between humans and horses and then wiki linked between the two. OwainDavies (about)(talk) edited at 07:41, 31 July 2023 (UTC)