Talk:Mandaeanism

I think that the "rasta" word, meaning the clothing has nothing to do to what it links, namely, the Rastafari religion (since this "rasta" comes from "Ras Tafari ", the last Emperor of Ethiopia). I have thus made it link to "Rasta_(garment)" Nihil -- alphacat 14:47, 20 Oct 2005  re: the suggestion that this page be merged with the Mandaean page - while the concept of Johannitism is embraced within the Mandaean religion, it (the religion) is not the sole arbiter of this concept; there is also a current debate as to whether or not the Knights Templar were influenced by this idea. If anything perhaps it should be a subset of Gnosticism.

re: references to the pre-Christian origins mentioned by Bacchiad - further on in the article we find "... There is some confusion that the Mandaeans came after John the Baptist, while in fact they existed before him; according to Mandaean dogma, Mandaeanism was the original religion of Adam. In the Mandaean library of scriptures there is a book of John called Sidra d Yahia, which includes a dialogue between John and Jesus."

- mind you, I'm not in any way saying that they definitely ARE of pre-Christian origin, chronologically; just citing what was in the original article.

--

I'm puzzled by the pre-Christian thing. According to the article, Mandaeans have been around since the 1st century AD, which at best gives them a couple decade lead on Christainity. Furthermore, the only historical sources cited are Christian and Islamic. And St. John is a central figure. Is there anything whatsoever to support the pre-Christian thing? Might not "originated at the same period as early Christianity" or something similar be more accurate? Bacchiad

Question:

Mandaeaism (the religion) is different than  Mandaeans (the people). Which data you want on this page? Both?

If you prefer, you can make a separate article for Mandaean or Mandaeans. I'd certainly like to read one! - Mustafaa 07:00, 23 Jun 2004 (UTC) --

Perhaps I did not make myself clear in the question.

Was this entry titled Mandaeanism intended to cover both the religion and the culture of the Mandaean people. Mandaeanism is more the theology, sacred literature, comparative analysis and rituals. Whereas the word Mandaean indicates the culture that would include for example demographics, history, or language. A Mandaean practices the religion of Mandaeainsm not vice versa If I know what is intended, I can offer more details.

usamandaean (mandaeanworld.com) -

This is an obscure area, regarding which we have little expertise. Any help from you is appreciated. If there is to be one article, it should focus on both the people and religion, I presume. If there are to be two articles (which means a bit more work of course ;) than one could be for the people, and the other for the religion. In that case Mandaeanism would be for the religion, and Mandaean or Mandaeans would be for the people (I assume, other opinions are welcome). Of course we would love a dozen other related pages, but only if someone writes them. We can't ask more from you than you will give, this being volunteer work, a charity for the public good. You will do what you will do, and we will be grateful (hopefully ;). My preferences are both for quantity and quality, but I understand that all human endeavors tend toward finite results. One thing that would be nice is that if you find more to be done than suits your time or interest, you might refer other knowledgeable persons. The more the better of course! I know almost nothing of this subject, and am here rather to read and to learn :) Thanks again, Sam [Spade] 18:18, 23 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Sloppy
There are sections of this article that include dialogue between wikipedians. (!?) I hardly think that this sort of think ought to be included in an encyclopedic reference...just imagine if a user saw it and thought it applied to her! ("This encyclopedia is so bad it's directly questioning me!" or "I'll ask the questions here!")

I studied near-eastern late antiquity for four years in undergraduate work; I also spent a year studying it in divinity school. I'd like to do some work on this article, and it will probably be bold. If you think there are particular POVs or sources you'd like me to include, please let me know; I would like to beef up the history and current practice of the Mandaean religion.

I'd also like to settle the question of whether or not wikipedia will consider the Mandaeans an ethnic or separate cultural group, as, for example, the Druze of Israel and Libnan. Perhaps the best approach would be to include perspectives on the ethnicity of Mandaeans from within and without the community, and perceptions of the Mandaeans along with some difficulties with persecution and intolerance.

Sandbody 19:00, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)


 * Good remarks, and we are eagerly waiting for your edits! Nixdorf 06:48, 2005 Mar 29 (UTC)


 * Being bold on obviously suffering articles is a very good thing. Go for it. - Mustafaa 23:49, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Wilco, all. Obviously, work takes precedence, along with finishing up my other article, but I should have some references by the end of the week. Incidentally, we really should have some pictures...this community baptizes everything. I think it would be a unique addition to WP! Sandbody 16:16, 30 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Johannite merger?
This merger proposal does not make sense to me, because the Mandaean religion rejects Jesus as a false prophet, whereas the Johannites are identified on that page as Christians. Michael Hardy 00:17, 24 October 2005 (UTC)
 * "The Johannites are a sect of Gnostic Christians who reject Jesus Christ, and instead posit that the true savior of the world (sent to fulfill Old Testament prophecy) was in fact John the Baptist", Straight from the Johannite article --ThrashedParanoid 02:54, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

...The fundamental issue to grasp here is that the identities of Jesus and Christ are two separate discussions in this context; first, whether or not Jesus was 'The' Christ (a title, not a last name) and second the different perspective offered by Johannitism as to who this Christ - the Me'Shach or Annointed One - actually was. There are strains and suggested implications of this "heresy" in discussion of things as disparate as Mandaeanism, the Knights Templar, the Essenes, and more... User:Alphacat 17:47, 28 Oct 2005