Talk:Manganese/Archive 1

Potassium Permanganate
This is also known as an indicator for acid/base reactions.


 * This belongs on the potassium permanganate page, not here, as it is not a major use. Also, I am not familiar with this use, I didn't think it changed colour with pH, other than to start decomposing at high pH values.  Do you have a reference for this application? Walkerma 15:11, 26 September 2005 (UTC)

In the 17th century it was founded by the chemist named kith glauber

Talk
- 56Mn needs to be added, its pretty common. Its half life is 2.6 hours

Could anyone explain tome how Quantum numbers effect the shape, size and orientation of Mn?

Does anyone know how to remediate soil with high manganese content?

Any evidence that Manganese ingested "strengthens bones and connective tissue"? My Pineapple Juice bottle says it does. --Murftown 19:07, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Mimic of Parkinson's Disease
This article suggests a link between the ingestion of small amounts of manganese and neurological disorders resembling Parkinson's. Among these is 'Welder's Disease", now undergoing much the same scandal as was once associated with those dieases associated with asbestos -- I read that there are some 6,000 lawsuits connected to the matter.

Now I read in the article that organic manganese compounds are being introduced into gasoline for purposes similiar to those previously met by tetraethyl lead. What is the possibility that we are ONCE AGAIN being poisonsed by short-sighted solutions to industrial problems ??

My wife has an unexplained Parkinson's-like neurological disorder which is slowly taking her life -- so I am naturally very concerned. . —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.214.135.125 (talk) 20:39, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

New External link

 * Potters Manganese Toxicity by Elke Blodgett

I removed the link from the page and added it here. Is this a apropriat link? --Stone (talk) 22:39, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Shouldn't Manganese also be in Category:Biology and pharmacology of chemical elements ?
Shouldn't Manganese also be in Category:Biology and pharmacology of chemical elements ? Eldin raigmore (talk) 18:51, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

native manganese
http://ammin.geoscienceworld.org/cgi/reprint/88/5-6/931 describes the findings of native manganese.--Stone (talk) 14:24, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

Infobox image
Wouldn't that make a better infobox image for Mn, it's a FP and shows both the clean metal and oxidized states? — raeky  t  09:16, 27 December 2010 (UTC)


 * We had a similar discussion with the Nickel image and the problem is the blue colour, which is due to salts from the electrolysis. This is hard to explain and some people might think that this is the natural colour it should have.--Stone (talk) 09:26, 27 December 2010 (UTC)


 * You will never seen only shiny Mn pieces. Mn is and will be always oxidized on air because they arn't air stable. What is important: to view Mn how it is or Mn how it is fresh cleaned (acid etched)? The blue color isn't a Mn salt, it is a thin iridescent oxide layer similar to the bismuth. But I'd like to take a Mn photo only with shiny pieces too, sometime ... .--Alchemist-hp (talk) 10:55, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Manganese oxidation is very slow, and we normally should not see much of oxide on fresh samples. In the picture above, the blue color is very local, and I do not believe it is iridescence (surface too rough). Materialscientist (talk) 11:12, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
 * This Mn was clear if I bought it. It is only oxidized on air. I don't know blue Mn oxides. MnO is green, Mn2O3 is brown, Mn3O4 is brown-black and MnO2 is black and Mn2O7 isn't stable. What is the "blue" for a Mn compound? --Alchemist-hp (talk) 12:12, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

Crystal structure
Does anyone know more about the crystal structure of manganese? See this for an example. Seems like it is not BCC. --HappyCamper 07:16, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

Cubic apparently. See http://www.webelements.com/manganese/crystal_structure.html and ref therein Plantsurfer (talk) 11:02, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

Nutrition?
I was reading a nutrition guide that stated that one should find a calcium supplement "containing vitamin D, manganese, and boron so your body can best utilize the calcium ingested." I assumed this was a typo and it meant magnesium, as this is a common additive to calcium supplements. However, I was lead to believe that magnesium primarily had the function of reducing constipation and wind resulting from calcium supplements, particularly in the form of calcium carbonate. Any thoughts? Livingston 13:29, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Manganese supplements are commonly found in most health food stores. It has been suggested by some that manganese supplementation can help with Mennieres(sp?) disease symptoms (dizziness and tinnitus) however, other data has shown supplement to accelerate Alzheimers development, once initiated. 99.251.114.120 (talk) 03:47, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

Format of intro section
This section leads rather abruptly into bio subject matter without warning. It takes a few reads to figure out where the topic matter headed. A samll heading or more key words in the first sentence to introduce the organic side of the article may help. 99.251.114.120 (talk) 03:50, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Done. Although this IS the function of a paragraph-change, still it can be shocking if you don't expect it, and good writing should still provide at least a bit of segue. The last paragraph of element article ledes is normally reserved for a discussion of the element's relationship to life (utility or at least toxicity), and so your comment probably serves as well for the other element articles. I'll have a look and see if the others could use a "In biology,..." warning two-word intro of the last paragraph. BTW, we might also be aware that this is a special problem that occurs generally in lede sections of all types, where paragraphs must summarize whole article sections, but without any helping headers. It's a nasty job, and one of the reasons why good lede writing is some of the most difficult on WP. S  B Harris 19:54, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

File:Manganese electrolytic and 1cm3 cube.jpg to appear as POTD soon
Hello! This is a note to let the editors of this article know that File:Manganese electrolytic and 1cm3 cube.jpg will be appearing as picture of the day on September 11, 2012. You can view and edit the POTD blurb at Template:POTD/2012-09-11. If this article needs any attention or maintenance, it would be preferable if that could be done before its appearance on the Main Page so Wikipedia doesn't look bad. :) Thanks! — howcheng  {chat} 16:47, 10 September 2012 (UTC)

Lyme Disease Spirochete Needs High Manganese Level
Lyme Disease Spirochete Needs High Manganese Level

A study was released today by Johns Hopkins -- the Lyme spirochete is manganese-based, not iron-based!!!

Scientists reveal quirky feature of Lyme disease bacteria

http://phys.org/news/2013-03-scientists-reveal-quirky-feature-lyme.html

"To cause disease, Borrelia burgdorferi requires unusually high levels of manganese, scientists at Johns Hopkins University (JHU), Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution (WHOI), and the University of Texas reported. Their study, published March 22, 2013, in the Journal of Biological Chemistry, may explain some mysteries about why Lyme Disease is slow-growing and hard to detect and treat. The findings also open the door to search for new therapies to thwart the bacterium by targeting manganese.. ......" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.224.145.215 (talk) 01:47, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

So mining of ferro-manganese is not considered Manganese mining?
Many American Iron-ore deposits (e.g. Animikie Group) were formed when highly insoluble Iron (III) Hydroxide precipitated from the oceans after Precambrian atmospheric Oxygen levels rose. Oxidation of soluble Manganese (II) to Mn3O4 et al coprecipitated. US Iron Alloys allows Mn to be included as Iron content up to 1% Mn. Looking at the raw numbers, that .9% Manganese in the huge Iron mined numbers should at least merit an honorable mention. (See Hydrothermal vent associated with undersea spreading centers. Shjacks45 (talk) 04:11, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

Why it has that properties
Mn can be named as "less metallic true metal". Mn has very low electrical and thermal conductivity in comparison to other metals. Black phosphorus is better conductor of heat than Mn (Mn 7.81 W·m−1·K−1, black P 12.1 W·m−1·K−1). It has lower melting and boiling points than neighbouring elements. HMnO4 has very high acidity, Mn2O7 is liquid at room temperature (despite being composed only of atom of metal and oxygen). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.49.75.235 (talk) 20:27, 19 October 2013 (UTC)

Lead Picture
The image by Alchemist HP with the cube should be the lead picture, not the current one. It is a far better picture for showing what manganese looks like. The current picture has too shallow a depth of field and is too dark. Please change this.
 * It is a nice picture, but it is very heavily oxidized... Double sharp (talk) 21:03, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

Magnetic Properties
This entry contained quite a bit of erroneous information on the magnetic properties of manganese. Although manganese is well-known to be paramagnetic, it was listed in the entry as "nonmagnetic", so I corrected this in the entry. The only reason I found out about this is because one of my coworkers, relying on Wikipedia (as he should be able to), included manganese in an experiment that was incompatible with the presence of any paramagnetic material. Let this serve as an example of the fact that publishing erroneous information can have real world consequences. Biochemnick 23:29, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for fixing that! We do have to be vigilant.  Walkerma 05:24, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

"Manganese metal and its common ions are paramagnetic." I think that this is wrong. Manganese is paramagnetic but Manganese Oxide is a well-known antiferromagnetic material, and I am sure that many others are too (the reference says it's paramagnetic probably meaning it is at room temperature but for example http://what-when-how.com/electronic-properties-of-materials/quantum-mechanical-considerations-magnetic-properties-of-materials/. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.50.195.173 (talk) 09:19, 27 December 2015 (UTC)

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Assessment comment
Substituted at 22:58, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

History
The first paragraph in the 'History' section cites only one reference, which does not provide sufficient basis for the paragraph. The first sentence ('The origin of the name manganese is complex. In ancient times, two black minerals from Magnesia (located within modern Greece) were both called magnes from their place of origin, but were thought to differ in gender.') sounds like a misunderstanding of the difference between grammatical gender and actual gender, and in any case makes no sense without an indication of which 'ancient times' are meant and which language is being referred to. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 145.64.134.242 (talk) 12:03, 11 May 2017 (UTC)


 * Agreed, the naming history leaves much to desire. My CRC (1997), indicates something similar, but indicating that the magnes is Latin and involves the magnetic properties of pyrolusite (MnO2), which is not magnetic(?) and Italian manganese which is a corrupt form of magnesia.  Not exactly helpful.  If anyone else has a better source, it has to be better than the current description.JSR (talk) 13:09, 11 May 2017 (UTC)
 * What we have in the article is a misunderstanding of what actually happened, although a close enough one to reconstruct the truth from. In ancient Greek both lodestone and pyrolusite were referred to as η Μαγνεσια λιθος "the stone from Magnesia" (I'm on my phone and it'd be quite a bother to pull up the polytonic diacritics), which was borrowed into medieval Latin as magnesia; there was as yet no distinction of gender, so in medieval times there was an attempt to create the separate words magnes (m.) for lodestone and magnesia (f.) for pyrolusite. A different white powder (MgCO3) was in the 18th century called magnesia alba and Davy isolated magnesium from it (though he proposed the name magnium instead, to get away from the overloaded word magnesia). Meanwhile over the centuries the name magnesia had changed to manganese, whence the name of element 25. Double sharp (talk) 05:45, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

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Process mixup?
"A more progressive extraction process involves directly reducing manganese ore in a heap leach. This is done by percolating natural gas through the bottom of the heap; the natural gas provides the heat (needs to be at least 850 °C) and the reducing agent (carbon monoxide). This reduces all of the manganese ore to manganese oxide (MnO), which is a leachable form. The ore then travels through a grinding circuit to reduce the particle size of the ore to between 150–250 μm, increasing the surface area to aid leaching. The ore is then added to a leach tank of sulfuric acid and ferrous iron (Fe2+) in a 1.6:1 ratio. The iron reacts with the manganese dioxide to form iron hydroxide and elemental manganese. This process yields approximately 92% recovery of the manganese. For further purification, the manganese can then be sent to an electrowinning facility.[35]"

Manganese in soluble salts is typically in a 2+ oxidation state while the manganese ore are typically 4+ or 3+, thus the ores need to be reduced before or during the leach process. This can be done in a variety of ways. Something is wrong with the section above. Either it describes two different processes, one using gas to reduce the ore to MnO for leaching as described and the other using ferrous iron to reduce manganese dioxide i.e. ore that has not previously been reduced, but is it really possible to reduce the manganese to elemental form using Fe2+ or is it used to reduce it to Mn2+ for leaching?

In case Fe2+ really can reduce Mn2+ to elemental manganese and the process really is a two step process with reduction by gas followed by reduction with ferrous iron the error in the text would be smaller: the second reduction by Fe2+ would not be of manganese dioxide but Mn2+ (MnO) (or possibly Mn3+) would be reduced by the ferrous iron.150.227.15.253 (talk) 16:46, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Heavy metals
"The tobacco plant readily absorbs and accumulates heavy metals such as manganese from the surrounding soil into its leaves. " --> Manganese is not a heavy metal.Eudialytos (talk) 20:16, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

´Biological role in humans´: deficiency effects possibly Osteoporosis, Alzheimer's or (sorry) Parkinson
To ´Biological role in humans´: it appears to be a new discovery, that a deficiency may lead to Osteoporosis, Alzheimer's. Just to mention, please. Thanks. In the german article Mangan at ´Biologische Bedeutung´ (biological meaning) is a (little) list with mangan-rich food: black tea, wheat germ, hazelnuts, oat flakes, soybeans, flaxseed, blueberries, aronia berries, rye full grain bread. --Visionhelp (talk) 19:04, 10 August 2021 (UTC)

Mineralogy errors
As a rule for Wikipedia, there is a number of mineralogical errors also here.

(1) "spatial relation to the iron ores, such as sphalerite" --> completely wrong. Sphalerite is a ZINC ore!

(2) "psilomelane" - this name is disused for many years and is a DISCREDITED name; the correct name of this mineral is romanèchite.

Refs. (to mention few):

(1) https://www.ima-mineralogy.org/

(2) https://www.mindat.org/min-3441.html

(3) https://www.mindat.org/min-3727.html Eudialytos (talk) 21:27, 23 September 2021 (UTC)


 * Meant as support, if it helps: the links to the Wikipedia-articles.
 * Sphalerite, Romanèchite.
 * --Visionhelp (talk) 08:58, 24 September 2021 (UTC)

Article changed note
Article changed over to new WikiProject Elements format by Dwmyers 22:00 Feb 24, 2003 (UTC) and Mkweise. Elementbox converted 14:44, 2 July 2005 by Femto (previous revision was that of 12:16, 27 May 2005). 27 May 2005

Oxidation States
This was written poorly.

The most common oxidation states of manganese are +2, +3, +4, +6 and +7, though oxidation states from +1 to +7 are observed.

The only oxidation states missing are +1 and +5, so why not -

The most common oxidation states of manganese are +2, +3, +4, +6 and +7, but oxidation states of +1 and +5 are also observed.

Re-rate?
I think this is getting to be close to A class. I'd like to see it as a Featured Article. S B Harris