Talk:Mauricio Macri/Archive 1

Politician?
"Mauricio Macri is an Argentine politician". I would rather say "Mauricio Macri is an entrepreneur become politician". He owns Correo Argentino, Metrovías, etc, and has for some time.


 * Politicians own the country. your comment is either misguided or worse retarded. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.127.101.227 (talk) 08:21, 14 March 2008 (UTC)


 * You really should not be using that kind of language against me. In a Democracy, politicians do not own the country, they merely administer it on behalf of the people. Now, we could argue how close or how far we are from a true democracy, or whether Macri is corrupt or not, etc. But that would be original research unless properly sourced.


 * What I was actually referring to with my comment, is that I think it should be stated in the article that Macri has been in the money-making business years before pursuing a political carrer; and how owning Metrovías, for example, could create a conflict of interests, him being the Jefe de gobierno and all. Would you care helping me in expressing these points in the article, which are, in my opinion, completely ignored? (this article seems pretty pro-Macri biased to me) --W2bh (talk) 19:00, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

I'll use whatever language I please. For instance

"Macri's political position can be described as fascist and he also has ties to the left-leaning and populist Peronist party. "


 * You are being disruptive. Stop. You cannot do what you wish. Please read the link provided. If you keep adding that statement whithout complying with Wikipedia policies: WP:NPOV, WP:V, WP:BLP, WP:OR, it'll just keep being reverted, the article protected, and every IP you hide behind will be subsequently blocked.


 * Why don't you try to be constructive instead: look for sources for the statement, and reword it to something like "Macri's political position HAS BEEN described as fascist [source] . IT IS SAID THAT he has ties to the left-leaning and populist Peronist party [source] ." Wikipedia is not a soapbox. --W2bh (talk) 18:13, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Page protected
I've currently protected this page for three hours, due to an edit war; several editors have expressed concern that a particular passage being added may not conform to WP:NPOV and/or WP:V. It may be best if interested parties can discuss on this talk page, to develop consensus as to the most appropriate wording (if any). Anyone not familiar with Wikipedia norms may wish to review the dispute resolution process. Thank you all for your time. – Luna Santin  (talk) 03:24, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Your 'charges' are ridiculous. I suggest you give up your misguided censorship. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.212.49.145 (talk)
 * What charges have I made? Please elaborate. – Luna Santin  (talk) 04:19, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

I wasn't specifically addressing 'you' but the rest of the gang on the ip based talk page.
 * Ah, I see. In any case, I'd encourage other editors to provide their comments, here, in the meantime. – Luna Santin  (talk) 05:01, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Personally, I agree with the statement, but I understand that that is my personal opinion, and that's why I kept reverting it. The article also seems pro-Macri biased. I don't have, however, the time to fix it. --W2bh (talk) 18:49, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay. Do you realize that you just claim to be 'objective', but you really are not ? For people who know what fascism is and what Macri does it should be clear that my statement is just fact. That he has ties to the peronist party, wich is left leaning is even more obvious if you bother to look around. Do people use wikipedia to get information ? I am providing it.201.212.90.185 (talk) 19:07, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * You are not a verifiable source. Is that so hard to understand? --W2bh (talk) 19:16, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Can't you see how ridiculous this is ? Do you need a 'source' stating that 2+2=4 ? - Get a copy of 1984 - you need it —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.212.90.185 (talk) 19:35, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I have read it, thank you. You write: "For people who know what fascism is and what Macri does it should be clear that my statement is just fact". Have you considered that there may be people who don't know what Macri does? Or that they may not even know who Macri is? We We (you and me) know that Macri considers that the cartoneros "steal" the garbage, or that he pressured TBA to get rid of the train that transported them in and out of Capital Federal. But we we, you and me, who live in Capital Federal, know it. That is why everything we put here has to be sourced. By the way, please always remember to sign your comments with four tildes. --W2bh (talk) 19:48, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Dear 201-212-90-185.cab.prima.net.ar, yes, you need sources for stating that 2+2=4 (see Addition there are several references). Besides, you should explain that you are performing addition in base 5 or greater. If you were using base 3, then 2+2=11. Now, writing about Macri, for people who know what fascism is and what Macri does it may not be clear that your statement is factual'; if you endorse your statement with some reliable source then it will be easier to discuss about it. Furthermore, for each statement "A is FOO" there is another statement "A is not FOO" that should be considered too.

Regards Rjgodoy (talk) 14:24, 20 March 2008 (UTC).


 * Wikipedia is non-objective and politically biased. And citing more politically biased 'sources' just makes matters worse and is clearly circular reasoning (a fallacy). Commies are great : source : pravda. 15:15, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Macri and algae?
This is about the paragraph: In 2006, Mauricio Macri was appointed as a Goodwill Ambassador [2] of the Intergovernmental Institution for the use of Micro-algae Spirulina Against Malnutrition, IIMSAM, that works to promote the use of micro-algae Spirulina (Spirulina platensis) to counter malnutrition and its severe negative impacts especially in the Developing and the Least Developed Countries (LDC). I have no doubt that this might be true, now I think this information is completely irrelevant for a person who is a rich entrepreneur and currently is the head of a city with more than 2 million inhabitants. I'm pretty sure that in his political career he was given many other "honorary" degrees and medals, however that is not relevant to his administration. What do you think? Alchaemist (talk) 16:10, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

Kidnapping
Macri was kidnapped in 1991, and liberated for a ransom of US$ 6m. Can anybody provide further details about this? dariopy (talk) 12:10, 12 February 2009 (UTC)


 * I added a reference in the biography stating what I could easily find on internet. I saw no reference to the money actually paid. Regards! Alchaemist (talk) 14:21, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Section for current administration
This article seriously needs an updated section for Macri's current administration of the city. If you can contribute references and the hot topics that should be covered, please go ahead and post them HERE so a suitable NEUTRAL, NON BIASED, section can be added later. Alchaemist (talk) 17:42, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

Union conflicts
I intend to add this paragraph, any opinions are welcomed.

"One of the first administrative decisions taken by his government was to fire 2400 city employees under contract, whose contracts were not renewed, claiming that they all were 'ñoquis' (employees who receive a salary but never show up to work). This action caused conflicts with the city unions which were followed up by strikes of the SUTECBA-CGT and ATE-CTA unions. In response to the strike, Macri administratively intervened the medical security organization of the city workers which depends on the unions."

Alchaemist (talk) 19:28, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Education conflicts
A lot has happened in 2008 in this front, and it seems that a lot is hapening now in 2009, so this is a conflictive subject for his administration. Even recurring to dirty strategy adds on TV. My best guess would be to write a paragraph but to wait till the current events come to an end to publish it. Anyone willing to help? Alchaemist (talk) 14:09, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

City infrastructure, public services and traffic
Macri's administration has made some important changes (for bad or for good, sometimes against popular wishes) in public infrastructure and traffic.
 * He has been accused of an extreme under-execution of the education budget so he could finance his public projects which were not in the budget for 2008.
 * He has been repeatedly directly contracting companies without licitation.
 * Things are done without consultation to the affected neighbors, and when the press and public pressure strive, he backs.
 * There is little or no control on the works (like repaving a road in a perfect state, and that costs millions).

Now, while all this seems to be true, we need references and a way to present this in a nonbiased way. Any help? Alchaemist (talk) 14:03, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Metropolitan police
I intend to put this paragraph if nobody complains...

The main police force which acts in the city is the Argentine Federal Police. The city, being a capital district until 1994 when a new National Constitution was sanctioned, did not elect the mayor who by then was appointed by the president. When in 1996 the new City Constitution was created, a national law was passed, known as "Cafiero Law", which kept the Federal Police control for the Ministry of Interior of the National Government. Since then this lack of control for any police force from the mayor, has been a persistent problem between the city and the federal government. After several months of negotiations with the National Government, they did not arrive to any agreement, and on March 2008, Macri announced he would create a new Metropolitan Police force under his control. The 28th of October 2008, the law was sanctioned by the Legislature of Buenos Aires. Initially it would have approximately 1000 effectives and it should start working by the end of 2009. The situations were this police force would be allowed to act, is yet to be determined by an agreement with the National Government, but in principle it would be allowed to act in evictions and traffic blocking protests. Alchaemist (talk) 19:53, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Public image
Recently there was a journal (I think it was Pagina 12), that after a lengthy investigation demonstrated that he spent almost half of the week, playing arround outside Buenos Aires, sometimes in Uruguay, instead of being working. While I personally find this a lousy attitude, I see that there is pattern with what happened when he was a Deputy, and he was absent most of the time. Perhaps something like that should be mentioned in this area. Also, his public image has been affected with the taxes rise, and the back and forth of the parking meters. Alchaemist (talk) 14:29, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Non English noun / mistranslation
Under the metropolitan police section, "effectives" should be replaced by "policemen" or "members". Formal words and expressions rarely translate from one language to another. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.179.216.48 (talk) 06:47, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

more facts
Here's another one for you. Macri is supposedly a sort of 'neoliberal' but he's doubled property taxes, instead of reducing the size of the government.201.212.90.185 (talk) 22:09, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * OK, I'll make you a deal. We are both interested in including facts and points of view which are currently not represented in the article. I propose we work together on it. Today it's my birthday so I'm busy, and tomorrow I have to work on some audio tracks. I guess that late in the afternon, around 19:00, I'll be free.


 * You can start by looking for reliable sources, like notable newspapers (i.e., Página/12) regarding Macri's actions, and pasting them here. It is very recommended that you create an account for you, if you are serious about working on this. Then, once we know what we have to back up the statements, we can start working on the text here before putting it in the article. I'll pospone something that I'm doing in order to work with you on this. We (well, me at least) have the whole easter to do it. What do you think? --W2bh (talk) 23:41, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I would never consider pagina12 or any other newspaper for that matter a reliable source. You see, that's the problem. Regarding political articles, wikipedia is not concerned with truth, merely with poltical correctness. So, I'm done with it - sorry.201.212.90.185 (talk) 14:48, 20 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Wikipedia concerned with political correctness? I'm sorry, but you have certainly misinterpreted WP:V, WP:OR and WP:NPOV if you think it has anything to do with political correctness. Wikipedia is an Encyclopedia; that is, a conpendium of information. Wikipedia is not the place for political campaigning.


 * I told you: let's include the information, to better reflect the true nature of the guy, but we have to play by Wikipedia's rules. And you blew me off. Suit yourself.


 * BTW, when I mentioned Página/12 (which belongs to Grupo Clarín. You see, it all stays whithin the family) I was mentioning an example of a source that wouldn't get deleted. We cannot just start putting things we read on blogs. It may be "truer", but, if you think about it and try to reason beyond the crimethink conspiracy theories, you'll understand why it has to be like this. --W2bh (talk) 19:54, 20 March 2008 (UTC)


 * There were many facts posted here about incidents related to Mauricio Macri, from people who live in Buenos Aires capital city, are witness to them, and have continuously been erased from his profile. That leads us to believe the admins of this page are linked politically or receiving monetary compensation to supress true facts about this individual. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.22.52.68 (talk) 11:15, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 3 November 2015
In Biography, Second Paragraph

the Socma Group, where we worked for 3 years as Junior Analyst

change the "we" to "he".

Self-explanatory

192.167.90.134 (talk) 14:54, 3 November 2015 (UTC)


 * ✅, thanks! &#8209;&#8209; El Hef  ( Meep? ) 15:42, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Presidency section
So far, it seems that the sole reason for the existence of this to promote some Anglo-centric worldview. The sovereignty issue did not even come up in either of the presidential debates and I have not heard it mentioned once in any of the many interviews Macri (or even Scioli) has done these past months because it is simply the last thing anyone in the country is thinking about. It really has undue weight and should be removed, or in the very least balanced out with 9x more content on foreign policy which has actually been discussed in the electoral :cycle to put it into perspective. SegataSanshiro1 (talk) 16:37, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
 * I agree that this section needs to be expanded, but I do not think that removing verifiable and referenced information is what Wikipedia is about. The information about the relationship with the UK should be a small part of a much larger 'Foreign Policy' section, which I am sure, in time, will come. I do not agree, however, that we should remove the existing information because other information is currently lacking. WatermillockCommon (talk) 18:35, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
 * I added a statement to clarify what little importance the issue bares outside conservative UK newspapers. And yes, the section needs to be expanded, though it probably would have been best to hold off writing it until after he is sworn into office. SegataSanshiro1 (talk) 20:51, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

what more until we can nominate this for Good article status? or A-class?
I read that an article can attain A-class without it having been reviewed as a Good article. I'm asking more experienced editors, what else would we need to add to be able to nominate it as Good article? Perhaps the Biography section? Themidget17 (talk) 03:52, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Well I think for sure when it comes to people or things that are from non-english speaking countries, as with this article, I think it's important to look at the article in the wikipedia for the language of the place that they are from, in this case the Spanish Wikipedia. It's very extensive, similar to this one, but I think we could always look and see things we may have missed. On a personal note, i'm also very interested in helping any way I can in nominating it to GA status, and I will help do so, but if you need any specific other help just let me know. - SantiLak  (talk) 11:31, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
 * I think that we should wait, for the stability criteria. Macri is a president elect, and there is a lot of new info appearing in the media every day. And also, a lot of speculation. I propose to wait until he takes office and there is enough solid information to fill the standard subsections of a "Presidency" section. Cambalachero (talk) 12:32, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Cambalachero makes a reasonable point regarding stability, although I agree that we should wait for stability in certain sections, I don't think that necessarily means we should delay expanding the article where information maybe regarding his past hasn't been filled. - SantiLak  (talk) 12:41, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
 * I agree with the points both of you have made. The only observation I do make is that, although the Spanish article is a bit more extensive, it has banners showing it's not adequately sourced. This isn't the case with the English article, so I guess in that sense the English article is closer to being a GA than the Spanish article, which is one of the reasons I thought we might be approaching GA quality.themidget17 &#124; babble 15:59, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Agree with Cambalachero on the article's evaluation. Especially at this point, what his presidency may be like is a matter of dispute and speculation and the section will most likely continue to be unstable for a considerable amount of time. SegataSanshiro1 (talk) 23:04, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
 * I agree that it will be unstable per se in the sense that it will be changing as he takes office and does different things, then the section will need to be expanded, that doesn't necessarily mean that when he takes office and the section can be less speculative, that we can't work to promote it to GA. - SantiLak  (talk) 23:30, 26 November 2015 (UTC)

New mayor
Although Macri was supposed to be the mayor of Buenos Aires until December 10, his term has been shortened for one day, and Rodríguez Larreta will take office today. As you know, Macri will be taking office as president tomorrow, and can't take part in two ceremonies at the first time. Cambalachero (talk) 16:21, 9 December 2015 (UTC)

Pictures
There's CC-BY-SA pictures up on the presidency website of the inauguration here. I don't have time to upload them all right now, but it might be nice to upload and replace the main image with an inauguration one as is done with other presidents. SegataSanshiro1 (talk) 20:54, 10 December 2015 (UTC)


 * This is the official portait of the new president: Official Portait of Mauricio Macri seated at the Seat of Rivadavia --Turkmenistan1 (talk) 05:32, 11 December 2015 (UTC)


 * Hi. I just changed the main image and put up the official portrait that linked above. However, I had to do it several times because  kept changing it back to the old photo. I don't know why they were doing that, though, since there seems to be consensus from several users on this new portrait.  themidget17 &#124; babble 08:38, 11 December 2015 (UTC)


 * The new image seems fine, but it is used twince in the article. I think we should use it just as a main image, and use some other image of his inauguration in that section. Cambalachero (talk) 12:24, 11 December 2015 (UTC)

Currency Devaluation
According to http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/17/argentina-lifts-currency-controls-floats-peso-in-bid-to-boost-economy, the currency had a devaluation of around 30% (or 40%, at most), and not 60%. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.192.116.121 (talk) 19:50, 4 January 2016 (UTC)


 * You're right and I just corrected that. Thanks for pointing it out. Just remember to sign your posts on talk pages! themidget17 &#124; babble 07:15, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

how can we attempt to bump this article from B-class to A-class ?
i think's it's good enough to be A-class, if not GA


 * I think a bit more work is needed on the Buenos Aires administration section first. I have done some on the transport section, but other parts are scarcely referenced and there are aspects which are entirely absent. Considering he was mayor for 8 years, there's probably more that could go into this section such as infrastructure projects, renewal of public spaces, conflicts with the national government and also criticisms from opponents, such as accusations that the administration focussed too much on aesthetic changes or overspent on advertising. SegataSanshiro1 (talk) 03:08, 4 January 2016 (UTC)


 * Ok I'll see if I can improve the article in that way. Sorry for forgetting to sign my previous comment. Also, Happy 2016! themidget17 &#124; babble 06:50, 5 January 2016 (UTC)


 * Have in mind that, at this moment, the only info about his time as president of Boca Juniors is just in two lines. Cambalachero (talk) 13:25, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Addition to Presidency section
I think it would be beneficial to link to the cabinet page somewhere under the Presidency section. Igiarmpr (talk) 11:09, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Done. Thanks for pointing that out, . themidget17 &#124; babble 20:34, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 April 2016
Where it says "Macri won the first ballotage in Argentina's history" it should say "Macri won the first presidential ballotage in Argentina's history".

75.78.166.8 (talk) 14:46, 6 April 2016 (UTC) Here's a reference for this: http://www.infobae.com/2015/10/25/1764927-daniel-scioli-y-mauricio-macri-competiran-el-primer-ballotage-presidencial-la-historia-argentina 75.78.166.8 (talk) 14:54, 6 April 2016 (UTC)
 * ✅, Jmmuguerza (talk) 15:10, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

Dubious
Previous presidents were elected too. I wonder what the first paragraph is trying to say. Richard75 (talk) 10:32, 15 May 2016 (UTC)


 * It was the first case when a president was elected in a ballotage. In previous cases, the system was not implemented, the victor won with the numbers required to avoid it, or the second candidate (Menem and Balbín) resigned before the ballotage was implemented. The text is clear enough as it is. Cambalachero (talk) 15:42, 15 May 2016 (UTC)


 * Thanks for clarifying, that makes much more sense now. However I don't think the sentence was all that clear, and it also made it seem like a bigger deal than it really was -- the current voting system has only been in place since 1994, which is an important qualification to the "in the whole of Argentina's history" bit. I've made it a bit clearer, and a bit less misleading. Richard75 (talk) 16:46, 22 May 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request: Colegio Cardenal Newman
The Spanish language version of this article states: "Mauricio Macri cursó sus estudios primarios y secundarios en el Colegio Cardenal Newman....." Could this be reflected in the English language version and the following category inserted, "Category: People educated at Colegio Cardenal Newman." Thank you very much in anticipation.Jam6700 (talk) 02:34, 13 June 2016 (UTC)

Mother
The article says that his mother is "Alicia Blanco Villegas, a woman of Spanish descent", and requires a source. I have checked La Nación and Perfil, both say that she's from a family from Tandil. I will remove the "Spanish descent" part, as it is trivia. Unlike Franco, she was born in Argentina. Cambalachero (talk) 17:48, 22 November 2016 (UTC)

His Excellency?
There is no proof in Argentine Law that the title of "His Excellency" is given to the Argentine President. This kind of title is only common when foreign politicians address him. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.173.202.210 (talk) 13:13, 2 December 2016 (UTC)

Milagro Sala issue not related
The Milagro Sala issue mentioned in the main article, has no relationship with the president Macri. The judicial process takes place in Jujuy, wich under a federal system, is totally independent in judiciary issues of the central or federal government. It should be removed. ¬¬¬¬ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.127.205.115 (talk) 05:21, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Numbering
Seeing as the numbering was being kept out the infoboxes of the last 5 or so Presidents of Argentina? I've deleted the numberings from the rest of the infoboxes of the Presidents of Argentina, as well as the infoboxes of all the Vice Presidents of Argentina. GoodDay (talk) 18:16, 19 May 2017 (UTC)

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Pinedo
Please remove that Pinedo succeed CFK. Macri is the president that followed CFK, it doesn't matter if he was unable to being in charge of the executive branch. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.179.141.55 (talk) 08:17, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Pinedo was President albeit for less than 24 hours, he was still technically president, which is why we include him along with CFK. - SantiLak  (talk) 09:04, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Pinedo was not president. 128.179.141.55 (talk) 11:10, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * He was legally in charge of the executive branch, essentially in the position of the presidency because there was no president. - .. SantiLak (talk) 20:17, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Yes, there was a president: Macri. You are confusing being president with being in charge of executive branch. Macri is president since December 10th 2015, 00:00 hours (you can see the reference in the Cristina Kirchner article). Then, he started being in charge of the executive branch when he took the oath of office. Then, he stopped being in charge of the executive branch every time he left the country. As you can see, being president doesn't mean that you are in charge of the executive branch. If you list Pinedo, then you would have to list all the times that Macri wasn't in charge of the executive branch because he was abroad. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 20:33, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * No i'm not confusing the two, and actually I mistook myself when I said essentially in the position, he was legally the acting president and a multitude of reliable sources tell us that. It was for 12 hours but he was still legally acting President according to a federal judge in Argentina. Also you wouldn't have to list that, because Macri would still be Argentina's president when he was abroad, but in this case he wasn't sworn in. Just to cite one RS |"An Argentine federal judge ruled Wednesday that the mandate of President-elect Mauricio Macri is to begin at midnight, though he will not officially be head of state until he takes the oath of office 12 hours later. The leader of the Senate, Federico Pinedo, will be the country's acting president between the end of incumbent Cristina Fernandez's term - at 11:59 p.m. Wednesday - and Macri's inauguration." -
 * "An Argentine federal judge ruled Wednesday that the mandate of President-elect Mauricio Macri is to begin at midnight." That's it. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 21:47, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * You seem to misunderstand the concept of reading the entire quote, especially the key part where it follows that up with "though he will not officially be head of state until he takes the oath of office 12 hours later. The leader of the Senate, Federico Pinedo, will be the country's acting president between the end of incumbent Cristina Fernandez's term - at 11:59 p.m. Wednesday - and Macri's inauguration." -
 * I don't understand what is your point. First, you said Pinedo is president. Then, that it was no president. Now what? Macri was the president all the time, but several times he wasn't in charge of the executive branch, either because he didn't took the oath or office or he was abroad. "Acting president" doesn't appear in the Argentine Constitution. Still, real acting presidents are not listed, see G. W. Bush. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 21:56, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Pinedo was the acting president, a federal judge said so, reliable sources say so, Macri was not president until he was sworn in, but until then Pinedo was legally acting president. Being abroad does not make Macri suddenly not be the President of Argentina suddenly, but before he was sworn in, he was not legally the president. It's that simple, and during those few hours there was a legal acting president and that was Pinedo. - SantiLak  (talk) 22:07, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * See, you argument has four mistakes. 1) The federal judge didn't said that Pinedo was "acting president", again, "acting president" isn't something that appears in the Argentine Constitution, is only a loose translation. 2) The federal judge said that Macri is president starting midnight, not when he was sworn in. 3) Again confusing being president with being in charge of the executive branch, because I never mentioned that being abroad makes Macri suddenly not president. It makes him not being in charge of the executive branch. I was pretty clear explaning it, yet you still misunderstand that. 4) Similar to 2), yes, Macri was the legal president before taking the oath, but not legally in charge of the executive branch. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 22:22, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * No, the judge said that his mandate began, i.e. Kirchner's ended, but still Macri wasn't president until he was sworn in and that Pinedo was acting president until Macri was sworn in. Acting president, whether appearing in the Argentine constitution or not is what Pinedo was for those hours, the judge decided so, RS says so, it's that simple. Macri wasn't legally president until he was sworn in. As to your edit warring and 3RR violations on CFK's page by the way, I would suggest that you self-revert to remedy that situation. - SantiLak  (talk) 22:39, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * How can Pinedo can be "acting president" if it's not in the Constitution? He can't. The judge referred to the relevant law, which, again, doesn't mention "acting president" at all. There is not common law in Argentina. It's that simple. And yes, the judge said that Macri term started at midnight. What mandate? Yes, the mandate of president... What else could it be? It's really that simple. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 22:46, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Just in case. Mandate. "The authority to carry out a policy, regarded as given by the electorate to a party or candidate that wins an election". . So, according to you, Macri's mandate of president began without being president. It doesn't make sense at all. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 23:01, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Yes he can be acting president, a judge said so, Pinedo said so, everyone acknowledged he was the acting president. You continue to ignore the part where it says "though he will not officially be head of state until he takes the oath of office 12 hours later. The leader of the Senate, Federico Pinedo, will be the country's acting president between the end of incumbent Cristina Fernandez's term - at 11:59 p.m. Wednesday - and Macri's inauguration." Pinedo had the power of president and held the office, albeit temporarily, for those few hours, whether the term acting president is mentioned in the Argentine constitution is irrelevant, Pinedo was the acting president. Period, that's it, you can deny it over and over and over and over and over but it won't change the fact the Federico Pinedo was the acting president of Argentina. - SantiLak  (talk) 23:06, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Can you tell me which part of the judge ruling mentions "acting president"? Then, I didn't ignore that part, that's why I said that "acting president" is only a loose translation. So, stop stating something untrue please. Then, once again, Pinedo had the power of president, but it doesn't makes him president nor acting president. The confusion continues. It strikes me how can you still not getting it.


 * POWER OF PRESIDENT ≠ PRESIDENT ≠ ACTING PRESIDENT.
 * IN CHARGE OF THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH ≠ PRESIDENT ≠ ACTING PRESIDENT.


 * You still don't provide one single argument or source that proves that "acting president" is an official title in Argentina and not a loose translation. On the other hand, my sources are the Constitution and Laws of Argentina. And Macri being president without the power of president happens all the time when he is abroad. Are we going to list all the people that had the power of president? 188.61.3.218 (talk) 23:10, 16 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Reliable sources state over and over and over and over that he was the acting president, on Wikipedia it makes sense to say acting president because he was only president temporarily until Macri was inaugurated because there was no President from midnight to noon. Whether the title exists in the constitution is irrelevant, a law, that Pinedo talks about and a judge put him in the position of president for 12 hours. Because it was only for 12 hours, it makes sense to write that he was only acting president. Your repeated argument about him going abroad is irrelevant, its a completely different situation. CFK's term ended at midnight, Pinedo became the president temporarily for 12 hours because he was the president of the senate and as such next in line because there was no vice president. When Macri was sworn in, Macri became president and Pinedo was no longer president. It's pretty simple actually. - SantiLak  (talk) 22:09, 17 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Look, you can provide a 100 sources from media stating that Pinedo is "acting president" but that doesn't prove that "acting president" is an official title. For that you go to the Constitution and the Law. Please provide which part of the Law or the judge ruling (yesterday I asked for this and still nothing...), made Pinedo (acting) president. You didn't provided it yet, because "acting president" isn't an official title. The law that you mention (which is the same law that applies when the president go abroad, so is the SAME situation and you are wrong again) says that (article 4) you have to add to Pinedo's title "in charge of the executive branch". Therefore Pinedo was "Provisional President of the Senate in charge of the executive branch", NOT (acting) president as you continue to mention inaccurately. Remember... IN CHARGE OF THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH ≠ PRESIDENT ≠ ACTING PRESIDENT. For more, and this is a right source to prove if "acting president" is a official title or not, not like your sources, see  "he wasn't president, (...) because the president starting at midnight was Macri already (...) Macri took over the presidency at the first second of today." And this is pretty clear in the Spanish Wikipedia, you are the only one that CANNOT. SEE. THIS. Your statement of "the Constitution is irrelevant" is nonsense. Even if the judge said something contrary to the Constitution which she didn't. End of story. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 22:14, 17 June 2017 (UTC)
 * You seem to be stuck on semantics, to start off he was in charge of the executive branch, we can at least agree on that. To start, as there were no people sworn in as president or vice president, he was the highest ranking person in executive power, as such he was the acting president for 12 hours. Reliable sources back it up and so does a judge, and yes having those sources does actually prove that he was acting president for the purposes of Wikipedia. It doesn't have to be a title listed specifically in the Argentine constitution to be what he was. A judge said he was, and she didn't have to use the exact words "acting president" to make that what he was. She said he was in charge of the presidency of the nation i.e. being president, quote from her ruling "y hasta tanto Mauricio Macri y Marta Gabriela Michetti juren como Presidente y Vicepresidente de la Nación respectivamente, quien estará a cargo de la Presidencia de la Nación, será el presidente Provisional del Senado." Pinedo was the president for 12 hours, you can call him the temporary president, provisional president, 12 hour president, or whatever, it doesn't change the fact that he held the presidency for 12 hours and that reliable sources called him the "acting president" and as such we definitely should use that term, not to mention the fact that its the most accurate and appropriate description for what he was. - SantiLak  (talk) 07:24, 18 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Dude, once again (I lost the count...)...
 * CORRECT: PINEDO WAS IN CHARGE OF THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH / PINEDO WAS IN CHARGE OF THE PRESIDENCY / PINEDO HAD THE POWER OF PRESIDENT.
 * INCORRECT: PINEDO WAS PRESIDENT / PINEDO WAS ACTING PRESIDENT.
 * You need to understand this for one and for all. Take your quote "She said he was in charge of the presidency of the nation i.e. being president", that is wrong. You added the "i.e. being president", so you changed what the judge said. If you have to do that is because you are wrong. Stop making untrue and unsourced statements. Bending what the judge said to your convenience.
 * You are CONFUSED. In the US, only presidents and acting presidents can exercise the power of president, is in the Constitution. In Argentina IS NOT THE SAME. Another quote "the fact that its the most accurate and appropriate description". WRONG AGAIN. The only constitutional, legal, official, accurate description is what the law says: "Provisional President of the Senate in charge of the executive branch". My sources are the Constitution, the Law, the judge ruling, the constitutional expert that you ignored, AND PINEDO HIMSELF. Your sources are just media (President Dewey says hello) and bending what my sources says. The law defines if someone is (acting) president, NOT THE MEDIA. This is nuts. 128.179.254.15 (talk) 08:06, 18 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Just because you keep on repeating the same stuff and repeating that you've said it so many times, does not make it correct, nor does it make it what we should list on the article. Your stuck on a semantic issue, he functioned as the acting president, the title of acting president doesn't have to exist in the Argentine constitution to be what he functioned as. "An acting president is a person who temporarily fills the role of an organization's or country's president when the substantive president is unavailable or when the post is vacant." That's the definition given by wikipedia for acting president and is exactly what Federico Pinedo was. He was a person who temporarily (for 12 hours) filled the role of a country's president when the post was vacant (i.e. before Macri was sworn in). Lets go through the check marks here, do reliable sources back up what i'm saying that he was the acting president whether the technical title exists or not, yes, does the definition of acting president do so, yes, did the judge say that he would be in charge of the presidency which yes does mean he was the acting president, yes. You've made a federal case because of semantics. The law says he was in charge of the presidency of the nation, the judge did too, reliable sources describe that as him being the acting president, that meets the criteria we need to list him as such on wikipedia. I don't understand why you are so stuck on semantics here, as this discussion has progressed you eventually acknowledged he had the powers of the presidency and was in charge of the presidency, and per the definition of acting president, he was one. Even outside of that, by being the highest ranking person in charge of the office of the presidency when there is no one sworn in and having all those powers makes you the president and in his case it was temporary. I'll say it again you can call him the temporary president, provisional president, 12 hour president, or whatever, it doesn't change the fact that he held the vacant office of the presidency for 12 hours and that reliable sources called him the "acting president" and as such we definitely should use that term, not to mention the fact that its the most accurate and appropriate description for what he was. - SantiLak  (talk) 05:41, 27 June 2017 (UTC)
 * You are making a federal case for something so simple... Wikipedia does not define is someone is (acting) president. Nor the media. The law does. Look, so simple. That definition of Wikipedia if you take it literally then you will have to apply it even to countries without president such as UK, North Korea... So, you just proved yourself wrong. End of story. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 18:53, 27 June 2017 (UTC)
 * The discussion isn't finished as you claim, if you even want to call it a discussion. Also contrary to what you said, that definition would only apply to countries with presidents because it specifically references presidents and not prime ministers or eternal leaders. The law defines that Pinedo held the presidency for 12 hours, the judge says so too, and RS describe that as him being the acting president along with him fitting the definition of acting president. It's clear this isn't going anywhere, i'm going to request outside assistance for dispute resolution. - SantiLak  (talk) 21:06, 28 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Oh, I guess you are the authority to say when that definition applies. Not the law. Good to know. Is clear that would only apply to countries with acting presidents... Not Chile for instance, another country with no acting presidents, according to law. Do you know that every country is different? Again, all my best to President Dewey. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 21:18, 28 June 2017 (UTC)
 * The official site of the Argentine Presidency does not list Pinedo as president. http://www.casarosada.gob.ar/nuestro-pais/galeria-de-presidentes. This is over. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 08:54, 5 July 2017 (UTC)

My opinion: Regardless of the legal background, CFK was elected president in 2011 for a full 4-year term, Macri was elected president in 2015 for a full 4-year term, and Pinedo was appointed president for a coupe of hours to fill a legal void. He did not have a cabinet, or advanced any actual policy. For all reliable sources that you can check, except those dealing with the minutiae of Macri's inauguration, Macri is the president that comes after CFK, and that's it. Cambalachero (talk) 13:27, 7 July 2017 (UTC)
 * Of course. That's a valid point. If CFK and Macri both have full 4-year terms, there is no place for Pinedo. Good one. It's so clear, I can't believe how long went this. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 17:08, 14 July 2017 (UTC)
 * Fair point, we won't list it in the infobox and I have removed it from CFK's page, but like he said, Pinedo was appointed president for a couple of hours to fill a legal void and was president for that time. As such we should continue listing that in the body of the article and other articles that you have removed that from. - SantiLak  (talk) 00:09, 20 July 2017 (UTC)
 * Two mistakes with "was appointed president". 1) He wasn't appointed. 2) He wasn't president. You have serious issues to understand this topic. For more: . Camaño, Puerta and Pinedo are not entitled to the presidential pension, didn't get the presidential sash, and didn't take the presidential oath of office because... THEY ARE NOT PRESIDENTS. Jesus. See the paradox here? Macri wasn't able to perform as president because he didn't take the presidential oath as you mentioned, but then you try to present Pinedo as president who... also didn't take the presidential oath. But the problem is just semantics according to you. Good Lord. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 15:22, 20 July 2017 (UTC)
 * Dude, if you accepted the point of Cambalachero as you did, then you can't add Pinedo as Head of State. See WP:DISRUPTPOINT. 188.61.3.218 (talk) 11:55, 21 July 2017 (UTC)


 * Thank you. I agree 100%. Just to clarify that the "you go to the Constitution and the Law" was made considering this source and later . Still, if I not mistaken, so far there are no sources presented in this discussion that "do more than merely refer to him by that title in passing". Pinedonotpresident (talk) 18:25, 22 July 2017 (UTC)

I can't remember my user login for wikipedia, but what does the information "Preceded by Nicolas Maduro" (link refers to the chap from Venezuela) mean? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.193.65.246 (talk) 13:22, 12 September 2017 (UTC)

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Columbia Business School
Columbia Business school should not be listed as his alma mater. He only went there for a short course. He did not obtain any degree. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 181.28.200.204 (talk) 14:11, 17 January 2018 (UTC)

Intro-section, add "defeated."
The intro section concludes with: "He is set to leave office on 10 December 2019 following the election of Alberto Fernández as President."

This is true, but IMO not the best wording...

It doesn't make clear that he ran for reelection and lost. A reader could get the impression that maybe he simply didn't run for reelection.

It'd be better to reword it to something like: "He is set to leave office on 10 December 2019 following his defeat by Alberto Fernández in the 2019 Argentine general election." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:CA:873E:DEF7:9507:968E:F6D8:4A83 (talk) 19:56, 8 November 2019 (UTC)

un block for editing request
or block other former president's articles from "vandalism". FrankRhymez (talk) 03:19, 7 May 2021 (UTC)

Most economic facts are way off
Not to mention this article refers to the previous administration (also inaccurately). It says that the indec was widely discredited, this comes from a media campaign that started with the removal of Bevaqcua from the organization, media said that it was an intervention. Macri the hired her again (and that wasn't an intervention?) And then fired her again three months later (and that wasn't an intervention either?). Macri did not receive "economic problems" nor depleted reserves, in fact the recession started in 2018 during his administration (also not mentioned in the article). The article mentions the loan from the IMF but doesn't mention the fact that it was used (this was recognized by the IMF itself) to finance capital flight from the country. One other "economic problem" the article mentions is the 28% inflation macri received. He left over 50% inflation rate, not mentioned in the article. The article also doesn't mention that he modified a law by decree so that his family could launder money (decree 1206/2016). It doesn't mention that during his administration poverty rose from 28% to 41% of the population, neither that unemployment rose from 6% to 10% (9 if you believe the latest indec data, which is still higher and supposedly dropped from the 10% i mentioned the same year about 10.000 companies closed, and gdp dropped 3%). The article also doesn't mention his attempt to name supreme court members by decree, his meetings with judges and intelligence agents (in fact the article paints him as an independent justice advocate, which is plainly wrong).

I don't know who writes these articles, but whoever did was either stupid and disinformed or wants to desinform deliberately. 2800:810:48A:5D5:D9D6:166C:9A90:5CAF (talk) 18:58, 28 January 2022 (UTC)