Talk:Mehdi Hasan/Archive 1

Question for the masses
Why is Mr. Hasan not described as a liberal political journalist? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:18C:8100:3680:FCF6:EAD8:7745:E54B (talk) 23:02, 22 March 2022 (UTC)

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Ethnic Origin
There is constant edit warring regarding Mehdi Hasan's ethnic origin. Please do not include his ethnic origin without a reliable link. It is also not really relevant to this article since he's a British citizen. Kasbee (talk) 17:38, 24 May 2010 (UTC)


 * Been a recent spate of adding in "British Pakistani". I'd be amazed if he isn't, but it does need a cite.  For reference, "Why do they pick on us Pakistanis?" is no good, as he's actually quoting Hoodbhoy and Not In My Name: Islam, Pakistan and the Blasphemy Laws contains no reference in the text to Hasan's ethnic origins. Bromley86 (talk) 19:57, 3 June 2013 (UTC)

Comment by "Kasbee" that the topic of his origin is "not relevant" ignores the fact that Mehdi Hasan's most frequent editorial opinion is predicated on his "Ethnic origins" as displayed in the 3 citations on this line and and

Clearly for Mehdi Hasan, his ethnic origins are important, so any biography of his has to address the topic.

Coming to the claim itself, all 3 proclamations by Mehdi Hasan to be of "Indian origin" is not credible and not likely to be true for the following reasons: (Please review the following and comment, I will add a version of the below to the main article if there are no objections. I'm targeting in 2 weeks from now)

1) All the mentioned claims have NO objective source that Mehdi Hasan's parents are of Indian origin and they are claims Mr.Hasan makes on his own

2) He does not cite what part of India are his parents from, nor is there any mention of any extended family from that region, who have claimed a family connection with him. Please note any Indian family immigrating in 1970s or before are likely from economically wealthier sections of the society and hence have deep social roots in their community, so there should be many public claims made in a potential connection with a Western celebrity. So a total lack of statements imply falsehood on part of Mehdi Hasan. Please also note that cross-national immigration from economically poorer sections of the Indian society was rare until recently.

3) In summary there is no collateral available on this topic/claim from any source that can considered "bias free".

His own statements to be "Indian" can be traced to the (recent) desire among Pakistani diaspora to claim Indian descent due to rapidly deteriorating image of Pakistani nationals in the West. As shown by many Pakistani media personalities claiming a connection to India as in Salman Rushdie, whose parents actually moved and settled in Pakistan and Wajahat Ali who in his Twitter profile mentions of a stereotype of Spelling-Bee champions even though no Pakistani as ever won one.

Another observational example is that most Pakistani restaurants in United States have the word "Indian" next to it. Stand alone Pakistani restaurants are impossible to find.

The only reliable information that can be included is that he is of South Asian origin. Wiki vj20 (talk) 03:19, 28 December 2015 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wiki vj20 (talk • contribs) 20:29, 27 December 2015 (UTC) Wiki vj20 (talk) 03:21, 28 December 2015 (UTC)


 * I think you are making too much of this issue. We can only treat Mehdi Hassan's assertion in good faith. The issue came upon on twitter again yesterday: "Btw I have nothing against Pakistan but my parents and my family are from India, a country I love and the country where I got married." To say Hasan is "South Asian" would be an editor's interpretation. Philip Cross (talk) 10:40, 28 December 2015 (UTC)


 * "Accuracy" is more important for Wikipedia then "Good faith", especially if the topic has now become more relevant in his context, considering Mehdi Hasan now brings up he is Indian pretty much every day. Maybe the assertion of him being "South Asian" can be dropped as well and a disclaimer be placed in the main article that unless there is reliable (and objective) information with establishes his ethnic origins, no claims can be made.Wiki vj20 (talk) 20:44, 28 December 2015 (UTC)


 * It is your speculation that the ethnic origin parameter for Mehdi Hasan is wrong. As you have nothing substantial to go on, you should leave it alone. Philip Cross (talk) 23:00, 28 December 2015 (UTC)


 * I disagree with your suggestion, a personal claim cannot be the basis of truth. As an example, a person verbally claiming "I'm the King of England " does not make it the basis of his Wikipedia entry to refer him as "King of England". Mehdi Hasan claiming to be of Indian origin does not make it the truth. Also, the "leave it alone" suggestion equally applies to you, specifically: "As you have nothing substantial to go on, you should leave it alone" as well.Wiki vj20 (talk) 23:54, 28 December 2015 (UTC)


 * An alternative change which is likely more acceptable is adding one word to the existing entry, specifically, "claims". This would imply changing the line "From a British Indian background," to "claims British Indian background,". Hope that is okay. I'll make the change in a day. Please comment.Wiki vj20 (talk) 17:37, 29 December 2015 (UTC)


 * I have substituted a proper reliable source, which you have already mentioned above. There is no reason in Wikipedia policy why Mehdi Hasan's assertion should be assumed to be false. Philip Cross (talk) 16:11, 30 July 2016 (UTC)

So I've added a couple of secondary sources that seem reasonably authoritative to me (The Guardian, Press Gazette) but I can't find anything online about his parents being from Hyderabad, other than sites that just mirror Wikipedia content, so I've left the 'better source needed' tag. Per$1$tenceofv1$1on (talk) 15:36, 25 June 2023 (UTC)Per$1$tenceofv1$1on

Request to edit this page - July 2013
He is not British Pakistani, he is British Indian - please make this change based on: https://twitter.com/mehdirhasan/status/362280520933064704 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.132.233.81 (talk) 11:25, 31 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes check.svg Done Normally sections are added in chronological order, but it is very desirable for other editor's to see your comment and the citation. I have removed the previous assertion identifying him as "British Pakistani". Philip Cross (talk) 11:48, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Allegations of religious extremism
The text in the wikipedia section is a transcript of the youtube video. Kasbee (talk) 17:38, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from 2yyiam, 27 May 2010
Please remove the two links at the bottom of the page to hurryupharry.org as they are unfounded allegations taken out of context and not relevant to the topic. Thanks

2yyiam (talk) 13:47, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done I agree. -- Matthew Glennon (T/C\D) 14:30, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

Spelling mistake
There's a spelling mistake in the link to the Independent newspaper at the bottom of the page, could someone correct it? The page is semi-protected so I can't... (It says IndependAnt when it should be IndependEnt)
 * Thanks. I fixed it. --TS 16:36, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Request to edit this page.
I would like to add some new information about Mehdi Hasan - namely a couple of books that he has had published with the relevant links.

Thanks
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please be more specific about what needs to be changed. A fluffernutter is a sandwich! (talk) 19:05, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

Add in Publications section
Can a 'Publications' section be added to this entry:

Mehdi Hasan has co-authored the recent unofficial biography on the current Labour Party Leader, Ed Miliband (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ed-Milibands-making-Labour-leader/dp/1849541027/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1320574958&sr=8-1)

He has also written an eBook in the Summer of Unrest series, titled 'The Debt Delusion' (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Summer-Unrest-Debt-Delusion-ebook/dp/B005E87CHC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1320574958&sr=8-2)

(194.176.105.150 (talk) 10:24, 6 November 2011 (UTC))
 * Possibly, but without the links to Amazon which could be considered promotional. – ukexpat (talk) 13:48, 8 November 2011 (UTC)

Ok well can it be added without the links? I only put the links so people could have a look, but if it's considered promotional, just post the information up.

Add in 'Publication' section 2
Following various postings here and on the help desk, I would like to add the following entry to this page. If the links are unsuitable, they can be removed and the text entered without any sources.

Mehdi Hasan has co-authored the recent unofficial biography of the current Labour Party Leader, "Ed: The Milibands and the making of a Labour leader." Peter Oborne, the Daily Telegraph Political Commentator in his review commented that it is "well written and expertly researched, this book is essential reading for anybody wanting to understand either Ed Miliband or the modern Labour Party."

He has also written an eBook in the "Summer of Unrest" series published by Random House, titled "The Debt Delusion" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.176.105.132 (talk)
 * Yes check.svg Done — Bility (talk) 19:21, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

Religious views
The new section recently added about Hasan's religious views is going over old ground once more and has been taken out of context once again. It is yet another attempt to unfairly smear Hasan. There is no mention about the context and content of the entire speech from which the quote arises from. No explanation about how the speech was an attack on Muslims and non-Muslims alike.

Can the section and relevant links be deleted once more?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 110.174.63.172 (talk) 14:41, 10 May 2012 (UTC)


 * These comments cannot by reasonably removed because they have been quoted in reliable sources and gained some publicity. This does not mean that there is no scope for Mehdi Hasan's defence, including quotes from his own responses. Philip Cross (talk) 15:08, 10 May 2012 (UTC)
 * ❌ per Philip Cross. → B  music  ian  04:16, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

The comments have been taken out of context by dubious right wing websites such as Harry's Place and then picked up by suspect journalists such as Rod Liddle and Raheem Kassam who have been quoted on multiple occasions in this entry. The quotes from Hasan's blog have also been taken out of context when quoted in the biography here.

However, if you still disagree and feel that the comments can remain, then I wish to request that the page be open to general edits as I would like to add much more information about Hasan including his general religious views (backed with sources) and more information about his journalist career (again with sources). Why does the page remain under protection - meaning only a few people with their own agendas can add/edit information about Hasan? There is much more that can be included and I wish to make this biography as factual and impartial as possible.

Removed very large section on religious views
For now at least I've removed this because it's getting terribly out of hand.


 * ''Religious Views


 * Hasan, a Muslim, (ref Mehdi Hasan and Ida Glaser "We could both be wrong about God: Introductions", The Guardian, 30 March 2010 ) has been the subject of criticism for remarks made on religion.(ref Rod Little "Mehdi Hasan: a beacon for Islam", The Spectator, 12 April 2012 )(ref Raheem Kassam "So Medhi Hasan, can I call you an extremist (or at least a cab)?", The Commentator, 11 June 2011 ) During a speech in 2009, posted on YouTube, he compared non-Muslims to "animals", saying: “We know that keeping the moral high-ground is key. Once we lose the moral high-ground we are no different from the rest of the non-Muslims; from the rest of those human beings who live their lives as animals, bending any rule to fulfil any desire.” (ref "Mehdi Hasan - Non Muslims live like animals", Indian Panorama, 27 July 2009 )


 * At a separate event in 2009, (ref Islamic Unity Society "Arbaeen Majlis 2009 (Mehdi Hassan)", Islamic Unity Society, 2009 ) quoting the Quran, Hasan told an audience atheists were akin to "cattle". (ref Rod Liddle "Mehdi Hasan: a beacon for Islam", The Spectator, 12 April 2012 ) He said: “The kaffar, the disbelievers, the atheists who remain deaf and stubborn to the teachings of Islam, the rational message of the Quran; they are described in the Quran as, quote, 'a people of no intelligence', Allah describes them as; not of no morality, not as people of no belief – people of 'no intelligence' – because they’re incapable of the intellectual effort it requires to shake off those blind prejudices, to shake off those easy assumptions about this world, about the existence of God. In this respect, the Quran describes the atheists as 'cattle', as cattle of those who grow the crops and do not stop and wonder about this world.” (Rod Little "Mehdi Hasan: a beacon for Islam", The Spectator, 12 April 2012 )


 * In response to criticism over the use of the term "cattle" to describe non-believers, Hasan wrote in his New Statesman blog: "The Quranic phrase 'people of no intelligence' simply and narrowly refers to the fact that Muslims regard their views on God as the only intellectually tenable position, just as atheists (like Richard Dawkins or Sam Harris) regard believers as fundamentally irrational and, even, mentally deficient." (Mehdi Hasan "Who are you calling an Islamist?", New Statesman, 28 July 2009 )


 * The website Islamophobia Watch claimed Hasan was the subject of a "witch-hunt", writing that allegations he was an extremist were "aimed at getting him dismissed from his job."(ref Mehdi Hasan "Harry's Place and the smearing of Mehdi Hasan", Islamophobia Watch, 25 July 2009)

The relevance of any of this material to a political magazine editor seems tangential, and to all appearances this is simply a storm being talked up by some of the guy's political opponents. A small mention may possibly be appropriate, but not this massive screed. --TS 17:34, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

The piece has been restored. I'm concerned about this due to the extreme imbalance of emphasis on the religious views of a political journalist. I'll take it to the BLP Noticeboard, which can be found at the shortcut WP:BLPN. --TS 16:44, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 22 April 2013
A quote is malformed, and differs from the text as it appears at the cited source. In particular, there is internal disagreement in the re-rendered sentence on the Wikipedia page, where it begins as a statement but ends as a question. Currently it appears as this:

Hasan argued in November 2011 that "it [would be] rational for Iran – geographically encircled, politically isolated, feeling threatened – to want its own arsenal of nukes, for defensive and deterrent purposes?"

This should be replaced with the following, which has the benefit of returning the quoted text to its original form:

Hasan argued in November 2011, "Wouldn't it be rational for Iran – geographically encircled, politically isolated, feeling threatened – to want its own arsenal of nukes, for defensive and deterrent purposes?"

MonsieurIncroyable (talk) 14:04, 22 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Quote has now been changed by Philip Cross . - Sarahj2107 (talk) 15:57, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Age
He said in a column a few days ago that he was 33, which means he was either born in 1979 or 1980

Here is the article:

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/mehdi-hasan/as-a-muslim-struggle-with-idea-of-homosexuality_b_3306168.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.41.50.192 (talk) 21:46, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

This article needs to be totally rewritten.
It shows from beginning to end signs that it has been edited (maybe by Mehdi himself) to remove any of his "more extreme" views. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.13.21.209 (talk) 10:37, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Non-Muslims Are 'Animals'
Shouldn't this and other remarks from his speeches be added to the article? Twobells (talk) 11:05, 6 October 2013 (UTC)


 * I have added the details briefly with a reference to his apology and explanation.Twobells (talk) 11:13, 6 October 2013 (UTC)


 * It is a reference to Medhi Hasan's 2009 speech and the use of the word "cattle" in it. Enough of the sermon is quoted for the context to be clear, he is citing Muslim teachings rather than expressing his own opinion. (The "speech" was delivered in a Mosque, so sermon is the correct word to use.) Philip Cross (talk) 11:57, 6 October 2013 (UTC)


 * With respect if someone apologies profusely publicly for making controversial statements whether his own or beliefs he garnered from a religious text then they need to be added to his BLP otherwise why else would he apologize? and please don't delete edits without first discussing them. In fact, on further examination they are his opinion not a religious cite; however, I have updated the edit to reflect your opinion. It is quite obvious if you read the transcript of his sermons they are his opinion in that that is how he has interpreted the Islamic teachings.Twobells (talk) 12:29, 6 October 2013 (UTC)


 * The Huffington Post piece isn't so much an apology as a clarification. Here is the paragraph in full from which you have extracted a quote which you see as an apology: "In hindsight, I accept in this particular case that my phraseology was ill-judged, ill-advised and, even, inappropriate, but it is a bit of a stretch to claim I was attacking non-Muslims when the entire 45-minute speech is primarily an attack on Muslim extremists who try and justify violence against non-Muslims on an "ends justify the means" basis. But, I suppose, the whole point of a "gotcha" quote is to that it is totally and conveniently context-free." Philip Cross (talk) 13:03, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

Daily Mail
I think it's fairly uncontroversial to highlight Mr. Hassan's hypocritical stance on the Daily Mail, one day begging it for work, the next attacking it.

Nick Cohen: http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/nick-cohen/2013/10/who-is-the-greater-hypocrite-mehdi-hasan-or-the-british-left/

What section should that come under?

Mrfixter (talk) 14:23, 4 November 2013 (UTC)


 * A one sentence mention following the Question Time reference, given Hasan's appearance on QT provoked the revelation in the Mail, would be enough. Philip Cross (talk) 14:37, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Abortion, Hasan and Odone
I have restored Odone's comment concerning responses to Hasan's comments about abortion. Another user has suggested this point, which was added by myself in this edit, is a "mischievous reversal of what she argued in her column and though she used that actual sentence it was clearly done so ironically." One can see that it can be interpreted as being so, Odone is using a feminist train of thought for an anti-feminist argument, but the quote is consistent with her preceding comments which defend Hasan against his female/feminist critics, even if Suzanne Moore is the only one identified by name. Philip Cross (talk) 13:03, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 13 March 2014
is mehdi hassan a shia muslim

Salmanappit (talk) 13:00, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

❌ because that is not a request - but the answer is he self-identifies as Shia see the sources in the "Islam and Muslims" section. Arjayay (talk) 13:25, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

VictoriaGrayson's reverts
Alright, angry user "VictoriaGrayson" insists on retaining false claims in the article. Let's see if she is ready to explain and back each and every point below:
 * 1) Hasan stated that the media should be sanctioned for "dishonest, demonising press coverage" of Islam. (When the source states "of Muslims and minorities").
 * 2) Her removal of Hasan's response: "I'm all in favour of free speech and the robust criticism of all religious beliefs. But it's the made-up stories and the smearing of individuals and whole communities that I have an issue with. Why isn't anti-Muslim bigotry as unacceptable in the press as anti-Jewish bigotry?". (Is he not allowed to have his own POV?)
 * 3) Placing the above statement under the "controversy" section, when provided source makes no indication that it was a controversy.
 * 4) Her reinstatement of the following statement "Hasan also stated that non-Muslims and atheists are like "cattle", referring to a verse in the Koran", which is (1) backed by an unreliable editorial source, and (2) the quote that follows the statement contradicts it, saying he was quoting the Qur'an rather than actually stating it.

Al-Andalusi (talk) 21:34, 25 February 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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Misspelling of name
There are several instances in the article in which Mr. Hasan's last name is spelled "Hassan". As far as I am aware, this is not a valid alternative spelling of his name.

Work for UK security establishment
I don't see any references to Mendi's work for MI5 and MI6. Shouldn't it be included? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.67.81.56 (talk) 16:22, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 12 March 2021 (2)
The wikilink in " | organisation" parameter in the infobox should be of Al Jazeera English, and not the Arabic flagship.

Also, the odd line-spacing between the set of his employers (probably based on the character of outlets' countries-of-origin) must be fixed. 203.192.236.137 (talk) 12:49, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
 * ~ Aseleste charge-paritytime 12:56, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done ~ Aseleste charge-paritytime 13:00, 12 March 2021 (UTC)