Talk:Melville Henry Massue

Claim to title
This footnote:
 * Ruvigny's right to the title he claimed is very doubtful. His grandfather Captain Lloyd Henry de Ruvynes, an Irishman of French origin, changed his name to "de Massue de Ruvignés", apparently on the strength of his descent from a daughter of Henry de Massue, 1st Marquis de Ruvigny et de Raineval, but it seems likely that the title expired with the death of the first marquis' son in 1720, cf. Ruvigny, The Nobilities of Europe (London, 1909), 116-120.

Is this assessment in the source cited? If not, this editorial is original research. Gordonofcartoon (talk) 19:19, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
 * It looks like thehe cite is there at the end of the paragraph - One of Massue's own books. NtheP (talk) 11:27, 7 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Oops - I didn't notice the book was online. Here are the pages: . There's no such analysis. (He'd hardly write in his own book that his claim to the title was doubtful). Gordonofcartoon (talk) 11:40, 7 May 2010 (UTC)
 * He'd hardly write in his own book that his claim to the title was doubtful - that's what I thought. Perhaps User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) could clarify? NtheP (talk) 12:28, 7 May 2010 (UTC)
 * I didn't add that. I may have demoted it to a footnote from the text. I will look and see what I can find, and if I can find a reference I will promote the text back into the body of the article. That is also why I am a proponent of using the quote parameter in the reference citations. Anyone can point you to a book or even a page in a book, but unless you have the exact quote you can spend hours trying to figure out if the reference actually supports the text in the article, with an exact quote you can cut and paste it into Google and find the source. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 16:38, 7 May 2010 (UTC)


 * If we determine that the title is extant, we should remove "soi-disant" from the text as well as the footnote. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 16:40, 7 May 2010 (UTC)


 * Can you guys also look at John Moutray, it was nominated in a package along with Melville, and I think it should also be kept. I think there has been some arguing between the editor and the nominator, so they have been nominating everything he wrote or edited. I created this article on Melville because he is the author for a book used as a reference for many articles on noble families. I think the nominator started an AFD because the other person made an edit to this article. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 16:45, 7 May 2010 (UTC)