Talk:Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots/Archive 4

Bit of a thought
bit of a thought, in the metal gear/ metal gear solid timeline, why is there only one rerelease game? should they all be second editions subsistence, substance or should we change the twin snakes from the history? prettier graphics aside, im feeling pedantic today.


 * Dunno,But don't Add topic to top go to bottom--72.195.190.127 00:06, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Twin snakes shouldn't be in the Timeline cause it didn't add any new plot aside from the new cut scenes Shinpah1 20:02, 31 August 2007 (UTC)


 * It's the exact same story so it's still canon, which is why it's in line with MGS. ♦TH 1 RT 3 EN talk ♦ contribs 20:36, 31 August 2007 (UTC)


 * But so are all the second and third editions of MGS2 and MGS3.....Isn't Twin Snakes really just a second edition of MGS of the GC. Shinpah1 01:56, 3 September 2007 (UTC)


 * It's an enhanced remake, rather then a compilation. Plus, it has it's own article, which Substance and Subsistence don't. ♦TH 1 RT 3 EN talk ♦ contribs 02:25, 3 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Eh..........works for me. Shinpah1 22:52, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Archive complete
Please, do NOT discuss MGS4 here. Discuss the article content, not the subject. Go to GameFAQs if you want to chat about what brand of rubber is used in Snake's new suit or whatever. Hyperspacey 12:18, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for that, nice one. Flexxx 18:11, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

... dude why you archived it. That was part of the whole topic!!!--Hitamaru 19:18, 21 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Any actual article-based discussion was several months old and the rest of the page was just chatting about the game, which frankly I could've just deleted full stop because it doesn't belong here. Hyperspacey 23:36, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

OXM 74
Official Xbox Magazine has claimed that Metal Gear Solid 4 will be released for the Xbox 360. They say it is "from a bankable source," but I am not sure about this. Can anyone confirm this before I add this to the page? 72.83.118.189 03:51, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Talk pages go in chronological order down the page, so I moved this here. An un-named "bankable source" is *not* a reliable reference unless they given the details of the source, and therefore this is not verification of the title coming to 360, it's merely more speculation. See the archive on the right labelled "endless exclusivity speculation" for about 30 people's idea of "bankable sources". Hyperspacey 13:04, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I've heard about that "Bankable" source. Kotaku was commenting on it cause OXM said it,it was in the "Rumour section" Why is that bankable source in the rumour section. kojima HIMSELF confirmed it at E3,July 11th. If you have second thoughts watch E3 sony press conference.--Hitamaru 00:59, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Kojima didn't say anything about it actually coming to the 360, if that's what you were trying to insinuate. What he said was that IF the game did not sell well on the PS3, a 360 port would be CONSIDERED.  That means that at this point, a 360 version is NOT planned, and if the PS3 version sells well, the 360 version will NOT be made. DeadByDagger 05:46, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Sony said that MGS4 was only on the PS3. Honestly it is pretty much guarnteed this game will sell millions. Not to mention more people will buy a PS3 just to play this. Besides at the trailer at that event in Tokyo Sony had it said that MGS4 would not be possible without the Cell Processer. Starwarsrulez 15:59, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah it will sell like hot cakes. So far ps3 games have reached 1 million sooo 1 million x 60 dollars=60 million dollars off a 8-10 million dollar game ^^.
 * Thats one million in Japan only... John.n-irl 14:14, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Gentlemen, take it to www.moanmoanmoanblahblah360exclusivitydiscussionblah.idontcare, this is for discussing the article content. Hyperspacey 19:41, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Don't be a dick 72.160.238.141 21:34, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
 * That policy is somewhat overruled by the general policy of "It's the god damned Wikipedia, not a games discussion forum, you utter half-wits."

Voice cast table
Does anyone have any reference to support the current voice cast listings, besides Hayter, Randolph and Eiding? I'm looking, but I'm not finding them. Hyperspacey 19:20, 22 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I can't remember which magazine it was in, possibly GameInformer. But they said that the entire cast from the original games would be returning, except for the Japanese voice actor of Ocelot, who died.  I know it doesn't help, but I do remember it being an official announcement and not just speculation. DeadByDagger 04:03, 23 July 2007 (UTC)


 * If anybody can look up the data, please fill the entire voice cast list. An edit war is already in progress RE Debi Mae West as Meryl, with Mc razza having made several edits on the matterEaglestorm 05:01, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

On xbox 360?
I don't know what to say, but r u sure that this game will come out on 360? If so, please provide some official or acceptable sources.


 * I think the best source here is the creator of the game, who has said time and time again that there are no plans to bring it to the Xbox 360. I don't think it matters if a magazine hears a rumor.  If the creator of the game who knows everything that's happening with it says it's not going to the 360, I see no reason for this topic to be debated. DeadByDagger 03:59, 23 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Good point DeadByDagger. Can somebody PLEASE STOP THE RUMOR-MONGERING! Before anybody wants to bring up the damn exclusivity bit again, see the archives first. Thank you.Eaglestorm 05:06, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Besides did anyone notice the bit where Sony said in their conference that MGS4 was ONLY on THEIR platform (PS3). Honestly I can't believe 360 fanboys are now saying that a few months after it comes out on PS3 it will come on 360. You can only post that it is coming to the 360 if Konami said so. Besides Konami said they wanted to keep MGS4 on the P;aystation brand. Starwarsrulez 15:55, 24 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Here is an article from E3 2007 on Game Informer Online:

In a recent interview with Reuters, Konami’s Kazumi Kitaue, in charge of the company’s North American and European operations, said he didn’t think Sony’s $100 PlayStation 3 price cut would make much difference in terms of sales. "I don't expect a substantial impact ... With $500, you can buy a personal computer," he said.

The system’s relatively slow start seems to be shaking Konami’s resolve to have one of its flagship titles remain a PlayStation 3 exclusive, as well. "Since Metal Gear Solid was born for the PlayStation, we would like to keep it a PlayStation game. But we might have to take some steps," Kitaue said.

We’ll be sure to keep you posted with what those “steps” may include in coming days. Stay tuned.

Source: E307: [|E307: Konami Pondering Multiplatform Metal Gear Solid 4]

According to that interview, it appears as though exclusivity for the PS3 is still being juggled.mpfterd 20:03, 28 July 2007


 * Dude stop the trolling with the X360 rumor,all it is a RUMOR!And Kojima Himself said it's PS3 Exclusive since Konami of japan is handling this game,Europe and North America Has nothing to do with exclusivity. Kojima is over Metal Gear Solid 4,he said at E3 that

it's Exclusive So thats all you need to dispel the rumour. God,dude. Go watch E3 Press conference again.You know how much money people are making with those rumours?People are getting it hyped up to be 360 game then people are going to be hurt when it doesn't.--Hitamaru 16:18, 29 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Rampant, irrational fanboyism has no place on Wikipedia. The fact is, Konami has voiced concerns over not making back the money they have invested in MGS4 through PS3 sales alone. This is why the rumour persists. --RoyalFool 20:13, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Dude,The game budget isn't that high. Plus PS3 has the Japanese market. Which i see ps3 games excelling at,i don't see where you saying i have "Fanboyism".--Hitamaru 01:15, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Which is why i still believe that MGS4 may find its way onto the 360 too. and dont be upset because they might pull the only good PS3 exclusive game off of PS3's slate XD.
 * Stop,Rethink. Stop being biased,"only good ps3 exclusive game". You're over looking tons of games. Why you are here anyways?--Hitamaru 01:15, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Fanboy,tsh tsh

Do you guys get out? In an interview with Jack Trenton after Konami said that he said that was before they had the discussions with Konami which probably resulted in an exclusive deal. Besides your the biased one with "No good exclusives". Have you heard of: Heavenly Sword, Ratchet and Clank, Unreal Tournament 3, FFXIII, FF Versus XIII. I guess your said since your broken Xbox 360 won't get MGS4. Starwarsrulez 05:19, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

It's becoming a lil personal... Let's just stop mentioning Xbox360 in the Talk Page until a reliable source comes up. As of right now, facts dictate that MGS4 will be a PS3 exclusive. That is all that matters.Parafusion 10:00, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
 * M'kay Cap',Then we wait until anything says 360!--Hitamaru 15:11, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Metal gear Solid 2 was originally a PS2 exclusive. The exclusive deal has a expiration date, after which time they can do what they like.

I have an easy solution to this Xbox 360 problem because it seems to be plaguing this article for the past years. No one put "MGS4 will be on the Xbox 360" until you get it from a reliable source where Hideo Kojima says himself it will be for the Xbox 360.Xatticus 14:39, 10 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Xatticus, it's better if we dropped that topic altogether like a hot potato, because this is threatening to be a repeat of the previous archive, where everybody and their mother show up and claim to have 'reliable sources.' To those who insist on 360 availability, don't even start with that bit about HMV-taking-preorders i saw just now. they already admitted that it was a mistake.Eaglestorm 05:09, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

also, the egm december 2006 issue mentions it, and so does IGN. I tried posting it on the main page, but it keeps getting deleted... does anyone know how to change that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Barneyandfriendz (talk • contribs) 01:55, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Vandals?
this guy "142.166.153.118" is vandlize it by replace Metal Gear Solid 4:Guns of the patriots to Buns of the patriots. He also replaced the logo with the gay flag. PLEASE HACK HIS IP!!!,anyone know his "motives"?--Hitamaru 17:39, 23 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Err, vandalism? All we can do it repair it, and ban him if he keeps doing it. I'll call an admin if he doesn't leave in a day or two. Hyperspacey 19:59, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

EVA from MGS3?
WTF,1up got this pic of MGS4's eva. shes pretty old now. shouldnt she be added somewhere in the main article http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3161466, she stills look ok not as cool as she was in MGS3 but ok. (off topic) my friend thinks shes gonna mil... Raiden yeah xD the site is down so you cant see the pic but that fanboy place has it.--Hitamaru 00:52, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Unless it comes from Kojima himself, that pic could very well be photoshopped, thus the source is unreliable.
 * it did come from Kojima,he showed the pic at 20 anviersery party. It cant be photo shopped i dont think anyone is good enough in CGI modeling to photoshop it--Hitamaru 00:52, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

It's genuine, it's all over the official site. I've added her to the character listing. Hyperspacey 20:09, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

And where exactely is this "offcial site"?

Here it is- http://www.konami.jp/kojima_pro/event2007/index-jp.html
 * Yup there goes here where it says screenshots *new*. Good job--Hitamaru 01:46, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Well it's obviously just a trick by Kojima to throw us off.


 * Yeah, I'm sure they hired a reknowned Japanese signer to do the voice acting for a larf. Hyperspacey 22:24, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

And where exactely does it say that they hired someone?


 * While I can only applaud your astounding obtuseness, it would help if you checked the references on the page to confirm the details. In this case, Hideo Kojima himself announced the voice actress for Eva during the 20th Anniversary party. In future, do your own legwork and check the existing references. If I find myself constantly reverting your own bad-faith edits I'll discuss the matter with an admin. Hyperspacey 21:23, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Don't be a dick 72.160.238.141 21:37, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Don't be dense --Sqrfrk 06:49, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Or maybe since this is the last main series game itll tie up loose ends and have a plot twist like always so we get some closure...REexpert 15:56, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Online
Whats the deal with MGS Online? Its a seperate game osnt it? Should it get a page? John.n-irl 14:19, 25 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Online is serperate i think, Cause they cant release the game in japan yet. the Closed beta is gonna start at August 7-till september i think. Unless its a extra disc in case. Jus gotta wait till kojima says so.--Hitamaru 16:58, 25 July 2007 (UTC)


 * If it's going anywhere, it's going here until we find out if it's an expansion download/ seperate disc/ standalone retail release. Hyperspacey 19:40, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Locations?
I remember the guy at the 20th anniversery party said Vamp and Raiden were fighting in South America and he said thats one of the locations for the game. And the one were seeing looks like the middle east or iran or something.

It's South America alright. Some very observative people noticed parking signs in the background which look exactly like the ones they have in South America. 84.134.192.149 14:08, 31 July 2007 (UTC) Yup now there's one more location snake going to be at.--Hitamaru 21:32, 1 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Its South America, they said so in the Kojima report

April?
The source says Early 08 not April? Starwarsrulez 21:26, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Someone jus guessed april xD!Change it if you want--Hitamaru 21:32, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
 * It was stated in The Kojima Report on August 2nd that the release date is scheduled for sometime in March of '08 Xatticus 23:18, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

wait, konami only officially said quarter 2 2008, and that ranges from April to June, so we better not put anything there yet. 71.97.144.72 (talk) 15:29, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

The unaffected Solider
This probaly counts as orginal research, but I can tell you without a doubt that the unaffected Solider with blond hair is Dave Forrest from Poicenauts. The reason why I believe this is because Meryl is a character in Policenauts, Hideo made both games, there are other references to Policenauts and Snatcher, and that the other two members of Meryl's squad have the names of the other two members from Meryl's team in Policenauts. If you don't believe me the black man is Jonathon and if you listen closely you can hear the solider say "Ed" while examining the mohawk man (granted it's difficult to hear with everything else going on BUT it is clearly there). Anyway I'm not going to put this in the article, I just thought I'd let you guys know so you guys could determine if it's relevant. --Shaoken 01:57, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

It would be neat if you were right, but for now we have no idea if it is true, this is just more speculation on the man -MtyQuinn


 * The guy with mask on is Johnny butt every johnny is every game. I mean it's not a MGS game with out him!--Hitamaru 20:48, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * it's not JOHNNY it's RAIDEN if you listen to A. The voice and if you don't believe me B. Listen Kojima productions report number 50 where they talk about it anyway Johnny(AKA Johnathan in MPO) was probably the guy with the slicked back grey hair-Change is coming and potter should have died 04:55, 12

August 2007 (UTC)


 * Umm Raiden isn't him cause Raiden is litterally living off that suit full of oxygen(to make him lighter i guess).--72.195.190.127 00:12, 17 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Again this is only speculation, theories are all over the net about whether it's Raiden before whatever happened to him, it could be a new clone... many possibilities. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)

That character is the Young Snake you see at the final of one trailer... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)


 * How do you know that? I though thay 'young snake' was just old snake in using his octocamo? John.n-irl 08:21, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

And for what reason he will use it to look young? to have a date with Meryl??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.172.84.118 (talk) 09:31, 6 September 2007 (UTC)


 * I dunno, mite be easier for him i suppose... :) Or more likely its just Kojima havin a laugh, as he's inclined to do...first mgs4 'trailer' perhaps...? John.n-irl 13:52, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

It was not the first, i think it was the third trailer —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.172.88.237 (talk) 02:23, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Some secret that only Kojima and his group know? Like EVA being the teacher of Solid Snake CQC —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.172.95.111 (talk) 09:23, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

New trailer confirms it IS Johnny. Go figure
 * it's defiently him. The site even says it he says he has 9 years of experience. That means HE SURVIVED SHADOW MOSES? wtf. how!! 2005 was in shadow moses.Will kojima explain how he got out ooooo. Johnyy you dirty rat!I hope he's a super main character or something.

^^ Johnny reappeared in MGS2... If you use the digital microphone on the stage when you're supposed to be listening to Ocelot and Solidus talking to each other (The part where you rescue Ames), you will hear Johnny going to the bathroom, and making a reference to Meryl. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.176.247.196 (talk) 22:20, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

Johnny could also be heard when you're protecting Emma as she walks across the bottom of big shell. Just use microphone as she walks around the back of the first big pillar. Her and johnny have a conversation, then he has diarrhea again —Preceding unsigned comment added by Rsaddy15072 (talk • contribs) 16:27, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Close Quarters Combat
Made small change, originally implied the new CQC brought in interogation, but that was in MGS3. Looking for the source about the Judo but you can see it in the vid John.n-irl 15:13, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * The one when he lays on the guy is Judo takedowness--Hitamaru 20:47, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * That is the only judo part I remember because that grab and twist move he did on the guy he patted down.....didn't look judo to me--Change is coming and potter should have died 05:01, 12 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Maybe im a little late,but Raikov does that same move if you press /_\ in Metal Gear Online. Little offtopic,eh xD!--Hitamaru 02:09, 1 September 2007 (UTC)


 * it's used in several different arts and forms of self defence, just using your opponents momentum to throw him. it's a great way to defeat opponents much bigger and heavier then yourself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.1.170.88 (talk) 19:49, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Time
I noticed alot of people have made the mistake of saying that MGS4 takes place 7 years after the tanker(which took place yesterday August 10 2007) but it clearly states in the MGS4 E3 07 trailer 10 years between the events--Change is coming and potter should have died 04:58, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

The E3 trailer (2006 version I assume you're refering to) declares the number of years as "X", which in the Japanese trailer is "an unspecified value". It's not the roman numeral for 10. Naomi in the 2007 E3 trailer says the events occur 9 years after MGS1, therefore seven years after MGS2. Or is it seven years after MGS1, converting to five after MGS2? I can't remember. It's not ten. Hyperspacey


 * Yeah Cause the 20th aniversey had MGS4 as "X" years and MG "X" years,it's probably 4 years...


 * @Hyperspacey, you're correct- the game indeed is seven years after the Tanker Chapter (five for the Plant Chapter). I put in the edit two months ago, IIRC. Eaglestorm 02:53, 13 August 2007 (UTC)


 * It's not 7 it's still unannounced xD! go check the Site.I wouldn't be surpised if it was 9 monthes--Hitamaru 19:59, 14 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Whats the link? Check the E3 07 vid, they say 9 years John.n-irl 14:02, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I watched the E3 07 with Raiden versus vamp... it didn't say anything about 9 years it said World Wide Release 2008...--Hitamaru 20:07, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

In the E3 trailer, Naomi says "9 years ago, at Shadow Moses...". Shadow Moses is MGS1, so MGS4 (at least part of it) will be set in 2014. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)

Shadow Moses was in 1999... MGS2 was in 2007. MGS4 is unknown. X years is not numeral cause Metal Gear was 19XX at the 20th Anniversery site. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Hitamaru (talk • contribs).
 * Wrong. It goes like this-the mission to Zanzibar took place in 1999, Shadow Moses IN 2005, MGS2 is in 2007 (Tanker) and 2009 (Plant), so Naomi makes the confession in 2014. Get it? You're confusing the release dates with the years in the game storyline.Eaglestorm 02:02, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Dude Shadow Moses is MGS1 -.- Zanzibar was in Metal Gear 2:Solid SNake and that was in 1999. MGS2 Tanker was 2005 while Plant was 2007. It's at the Anniversery site if its still up.PROOF http://www.konami.jp/gs/game/mg20th/index.html For Metal Gear Solid 4... *Drum Roll* 20XX. Roll over the banner to see the history.--Hitamaru 21:54, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Hey, spare me the drum rolls. I know how to read japanese, I know my metal gear history and you are mistaken with your facts. Perhaps you'd like to recheck the site again. I rest my case. Eaglestorm 02:09, 20 August 2007 (UTC)


 * WHAT DOES IT SAY??? 20XX CLICK THE MGS4 its says year 20XX OOHHHHH hit you in the face with a hat trick :),from now on all edits about the Year is officially Edited my source is the shiz :)!!! And its offcial ouch that burns. What it says? 20XX? no 2014?--Hitamaru 21:53, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

You're wrong Hitamaru. The Shadow Moses incident took place in 2005. Tanker incident took place in 2007 and the Big Shell took place in 2009. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.34.217.222 (talk) 01:47, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

--Hitamaru 21:53, 20 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I think an actual trailer, from the actual game, featuring actual dialogue from the actual voice actors, released mere weeks ago, overrides a reference found in a promotional site for a boxed set of different games that is about two months old, and which in any case doesn't discount the possibility that the game is indeed set in the date suggested. I would consider a verifiable, more up-to-date, reliable source that adds detail to the article far above an outdated promotional site's timeline. Hyperspacey 15:42, 21 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Hmmm,wrong? Cause this site was up after every trailer >:). No where does it say Naomi said its 9 years after shadow moses. That Site has been up since june 20. rawr cakes :)  —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Hitamaru (talk • contribs).


 * Yes. It was put up before the more up-to-date reference confirming the time period, making it outdated. That's the definition of outdated- something made irrelevant by a more recent discovery or invention. See: the 2007 E3 trailer, 1:31, Naomi dialogue, line: "Nine years ago, at Shadow Moses. I injected it into your body, Snake". 2005 + 9 = 2014. QED. Now, unless you want to prove my math wrong, or claim that it's all some grand Kojima-led conspiracy to make you look like daft, please give it up. Hyperspacey 18:52, 22 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Wow you jus kicked my ass xD! ok i shut up. Adding it to article myself.--Hitamaru 19:08, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

What moron here doesn’t grasp the MG timeline? Look at the MGS1 manual, MG SAGA DVD, you pick it! Here is the chronology, officially stated, of the cannon series:

1964 – Metal Gear Solid 3 Snake Eater 1970 – Metal Gear Solid Portable Ops 1995 – Metal Gear 1999 – Metal Gear 2 Solid Snake 2005 – Metal Gear Solid 2007 – Metal Gear Solid 2 Sons of Liberty (Tanker) 2009 – Metal Gear Solid 2 Sons of Liberty (Big Shell) 2014 – Metal Gear Solid 4 Guns of the Patriots

FACT! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.161.203.11 (talk) 21:18, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

Leipzig 2007
... ummm Any got the voice actors for the funky guys with the metal suits and bull queef? Once again characters popping out of nowhere.--Hitamaru 01:35, 23 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I could swear that Laughing Octopus (the one with the tentacles) in the trailer is voiced by Grey DeLisle... the laughing sounds very similar to Mystique's in X-Men Legends II... but that's just what I think, I could be wrong. Zidane4028 16:06, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Oooooo so Mr. Fancy Pants here got to see the Lipzig trailer. >_> —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)

yup i did at 6:00 am August 21,2007 >:) I SEEN BEFORE EVEYONE MWUHAUAHUAHAU —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions{{[[Hitamaru))

Just saw the magazine article screenshot. I ought to see how those guys move. Raging Raven's legs are so MG Ray. Crying Wolf's a robo-quad! Eaglestorm 05:15, 24 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I seen the Famitsu article too. They looking 'effin weird...-Hitamaru

Um, last time I checked birds have those inverted knees, so with her being a Raven and all... —Preceding unsigned comment added by {{{User|24.247.117.2}}}}}}|{{{IP|{{{User|24.247.117.2}}}}}} ({{{User|24.247.117.2}}}}}}|talk) {{{Time|14:33, August 24, 2007 (UTC)}}}

Boss image
Im adding a boss image(laughing ocotopus), downscaled(to 70%) from the original on the MGS4 site. Felt it would help clarify the Leipzig updates which are a little confusing at the moment when you read around the net. John.n-irl 14:52, 23 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Page looks a mess, who posted image links and no image? John.n-irl 08:04, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Can't believ one of you guys deleted the speculation bit. did you ask the guy who wrote that you were gonna delete? XenoSilvano 19:05, 05 September 2007 (GMT)

6 monthes to live?
Am i the only one who thinks thats bogus. I know he ages a bit faster but 6 monthes? Dorothy or whatever name the sheep is alive and kicking its been almost 10 years but she's very old now.--Hitamaru 21:11, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
 * It's Dolly, and she's been dead for more than four years. Also, this kind of discussion isn't what talk pages are for. - DoubleCross 16:05, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
 * ...>.< i thought she was alive still >.>.--Hitamaru 12:41, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

BD or Blu-Ray?
There doesnt seem to be a consensus on the PS3 game pages about weather format should be BD-ROM or Blu-Ray Disc. I think it should be Blu-Ray Disc since thats the most obvious(BD-Rom not clear). Ill bring it up on ps3 pages later and see if they can all be made the same(whichever one's better). John.n-irl 12:45, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

New stuff
Um Liquid Snake Actually kidnapped Noami and is now taking her hostage,something about Fox die. She is "begging" him to rescue her. a New Grey fox like character named Drebin. They found olga's baby named "sunny". Final Question: Should this be added to the plot,cause Ryan says these are the major pieces of the plot. *Walks away*--Hitamaru 20:08, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Um, Drebin is a black Arms dealer who has more in common with Denis Rodman than Grayfox, dunno what your source is. Raiden dies, Snake pilots REX while fighting Liquid in a Ray at Shadow Moses, and Johnny Susaki is the mystery member of Foxhound. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.247.148.187 (talk) 20:22, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
 * ... Got that part. But Raiden dieng and Snake piloting a rex(with no experience at all) is flubalah, Drebin in my book is the Grey Fox character >.> or maybe a signit charater ooo


 * Apart from the fact that Drebin is one of Snake's allies, he's nothing like Grey Fox. Grey Fox was a cyborg, and he was also white.(Myscrnnm 04:48, 22 September 2007 (UTC))

Don't know why you insist Drebin is a Gray Fox character, Raiden is the cyborg Ninja and Drebin is just a black guy selling guns...

Also if you don't believe the whole Snake piloting Rex or Raiden dying, check out the new trailer. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.247.148.187 (talk) 02:37, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

It was a obvious Spoiler, all the ninjas trought the game dies... Black Color, Gray Fox, Olga and finally Raiden... Kojima says "he will be cool for the fans" but he don´t mention the fact he is a Ninja, and like the other ninjas he´s gonna die... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.172.93.158 (talk) 07:54, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
 * lol i didn't know Olga dies until i played it again like in 2007... i beat it the first time when it was release but until i played again i was like... olga died? WTF! her kneck snaps by solidous totally didn't remeber or even seeing that part and i watched every cutscene. I see drebin as the grey fox character cause he jus a mystery.--68.99.151.14 00:35, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

She was shot in the face. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.247.148.187 (talk) 02:54, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Tokyo Game Show 2007
I read at the GameSpot coverage of TGS 2007 that Metal Gear Solid 4 will make use of the DualShock 3's force feedback capabilities. I've written this into the article, but I'm afraid I don't know how to cite sources. So if anyone could do that, I'd appreciate it.(Myscrnnm 02:16, 20 September 2007 (UTC))

I read it too. - Quinn —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.32.239.201 (talk) 06:16, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

I'll check the story after i return from the office...but a DUALSHOCK III? this is different from the Six-Axis, right? Eaglestorm 07:06, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
 * it's still 6 axis but with "nex gen" rumble. Rumour is it rumbles in different corners at time,hence the logo up the top corners and bottom handles rumbleing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hitamaru (talk • contribs) 23:38, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Winter, 2007 Release date
According to the official site a Winter 2007 release date is scheduled. http://www.konami.jp/tgs2007/en/index.html --155.92.30.80 14:29, 21 September 2007 (UTC) I'm sorry I forgot to log in, that was --WhereAmI 14:31, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Screenshot: http://www.ps3only.nl/nieuwsitem.php?nid=6881 in case Konami did not work in your browser.--WhereAmI 14:34, 21 September 2007 (UTC)


 * That is not the Official Site for MGS4. Konami is the publisher, Kojima Productions is the developer. The TGS blurb is from Konami and not from Kojima Productions. It is odd though that in the E3 trailer it says Worldwide Release early 2008, but the most recent trailer doesn't mention early 2008. Still this most likely is a mistake.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Strongsauce (talk • contribs) 15:36, 21 September 2007 (UTC)


 * http://kotaku.com/gaming/top/liveblogging-the-konami-pre+tgs-press-conference-301269.php mentions that Kojima himself has said, "Early 2008"

Winter 2007 is comfirmed --- It's in the Offical Tokyo Game Show Trailer that was released on 21st of Sep. 2007 TheAsianGURU 17:48, 21 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Are you talking about the one that introduced Drebin and Little Gray? That one just says, "Simultaneous Worldwide Release" with no date Strongsauce 19:40, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Are you thinking of MGO? because I know Kojima studios was thinking of releasing it earlier then MGS4, but then they pushed that back too. - Quinn —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.32.239.201 (talk) 23:45, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
 * for now the article is keeping winter - 2008 release. i could understand if it was winter 08 or something cause winter is in december and january. But you gotta think about every country's weather... so a season as its release date for a worldwide isnt accurate. whatever ~Hitamaru OK BOT DONT LOG MY IP!!!  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.99.151.14 (talk) 00:31, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Here is the TGS trailer that clearly shows Early 2008: http://www.konami.jp/gs/kojima_pro/movie/tgs2007_mgs4_e.asx It also states simultaneous worldwide release.  Strongsauce was right about what I found earlier.  I know the video is on Konami.jp but it is linked to by the official Kojima Studios site too.--WhereAmI 19:49, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

Haven Soldier
Everyone's associating the reference to "the FROGS" with the Haven troopers seen in the trailer. However, the official name for them is Haven Soldiers, as of now - and, since the "FROGS" are said to be twenty and the trailer only shows four Haven troopers, Ed might be reference to another threat. I'm not going to post my theories about what the FROGS are, but I'm going to request one thing - please don't refer to the Haven troopers as FROGS while more information is not released. It might be right, but there is still not enough evidence. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.196.104.147 (talk) 22:32, 23 September 2007 (UTC)


 * The people seen in the trailer are the FROGS, because Ed refers to them as such. The Haven Soldiers are the ones shown in the Metal Gear Solid 4 website. This much is for certain. But perhaps the FROGS are a subdivision of the Haven Troopers, like even more elite. However, it's safe to say that the people in the trailer are the FROGS.(Myscrnnm 06:49, 27 September 2007 (UTC))

i think they're owned by the Frog pmc.--Hitamaru 23:37, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Ed says, "It's the FROGS!!!" in the latest trailer.(Myscrnnm (talk) 21:22, 6 December 2007 (UTC))

Outer Haven / Outer Heaven?
At the end of the latest trailer Liquid says, "Outer Haven" so is there a difference between what he is talking about here and what is mentioned earlier as Outer Heaven? Or have they decided to change the name and call the PMC Outer Haven? Would like to know for clarification as it certainly can cause confusion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Strongsauce (talk • contribs) 23:04, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Haven.--Hitamaru 23:37, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Seems like this article on Gamespot confirms that the mother PMC company is called Outer Haven. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Strongsauce (talk • contribs) 23:56, 23 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Both can be used interchangeably, I believe - Haven has been heard (and seen - it appears on the Metal Gear RAY's side) on the most recent trailers, but Heaven too has been seen on the trailers before. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.196.44.196 (talk) 19:41, 9 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Considering that this encyclopedia has a search for "Outer Heaven" lead one to the MGS page, whereas "Outer Haven" shows that no page exists with that name, I think that it should be Outer Heaven just for consistancy. Also....I can't find an example on any other page in the MG series that has Outer Haven. Shinpah1 22:54, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
 * It is called Outer Haven here, an indirect reference to Outer Heaven I would assume. It seems pointless to point it to "Outer Heaven" since that just redirects to the original Metal Gear game which wouldn't really explain it if the user was actually curious about it. Since we don't know that much about the game and the situation there I think it wouldn't be a good idea to redirect it to Outer Heaven.Strongsauce 12:53, 10 October 2007 (UTC)


 * In the Gamespot article noted, they also refer to Outer Haven being the soldier's utopia that Big Boss envisioned, which obviously was not Outer Haven, but Outer Heaven. This would lead me to believe that the person who wrote that article from Gamespot just made a typo and meant to write Outer Heaven.Sourberville 10:43, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Split Characters
Can the characters be split to a new article? After all, there are separate articles for characters from previous Metal Gear games. Plus, I'd say there is an adequate amount of new characters to warrant a new article.(Myscrnnm 02:42, 24 September 2007 (UTC))
 * Just wait for the game to be released, before a separate 'List of characters' article can be made. Eaglestorm 03:34, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
 * We can still do it,we jus need to put a stub tag. but we don't which characters are major and which are minor. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hitamaru (talk • contribs) 19:59, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

We'll need a Characters section in the finished article anyway. Just keep it lean and efficient, we don't want complete character bios. Hyperspacey 20:08, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Keep it lean, make it gleam
While I applaud people's enthusiasm, please people, try to be efficient with the article. Check to see the best place to put new info, think about if it's really that vital, and always cite your sources. Don't just list gameplay features in the gameplay section, for instance. Hyperspacey 20:10, 24 September 2007 (UTC)


 * ... hmmm Maybe i shouldn't have listed that the ring thing without actually knowing the thing. but it's really easy to know that it was for lack of Vibration in the ps3 controller but yeah. soz--Hitamaru 21:57, 27 September 2007 (UTC)


 * TBH I'm not overly concerned if I just have to nab on now and then to shift the words around, the article's come along pretty well in my absence. Hyperspacey —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.0.206.52 (talk) 23:22, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:MG Online 07.jpg
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BetacommandBot 07:08, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Metal Gear Mk II.jpg
Image:Metal Gear Mk II.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

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Resolution??
I can't find a definitive answer on what resolution it will be running at. I'm guessing Kojima would want it to be running at 1080p, and I thought I read somewhere that it will be at that resolution. I figured someone here might have read that too somewhere and, if so, could they please add it to the side Infobox? Sits69 11:16, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Mgs4mercs.jpg
Image:Mgs4mercs.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 17:09, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Sales Data
Can I get everyone opinion on adding sales data to the Metal Gear Solid 4 page? The simExchange provides useful insight on sales data and they are considered one of the most credible sources for data projection in their industry. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gamergirl9 (talk • contribs) 06:07, 30 November 2007 (UTC)


 * So what if its 'credible'? It's worthless to post sales data when the game has not been released yet. Eaglestorm (talk) 06:21, 30 November 2007 (UTC)


 * it's projection data which has been proven to be incredibly accurate Prediction Markets. It allows people to follow the trend of the game. If it gets some good news, trailers, previews, the estimates go up. If the PS3 gets a price cut, estimates could go up as well. It is just pretty interested to see whats going with sales. Not to mention that the external link is updated 24/7 as it is a live prediction market. --Gamergirl9 (talk) 06:53, 30 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Accuracy doesn't matter. Such links may still fall under WP:CRYSTAL, so don't put the link in. Eaglestorm (talk) 07:08, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
 * As pointed out, we don't speculate, regardless of how accurate it is. As well sales data doesn't really add anything to an article unless a game has set a particular record that its notable for, or a hyped game bombed horribly.--Crossmr 14:05, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

Unless someone's going to show me, in a mathematically rigourous, third-party-verified way that this provides accurate tracking of future game success, I'm not putting it in. This is a virtual stock exchange for trading non-existent currency based on speculation regarding values of review scores and sales, and as such any data created from it, however accurate it may ultimately end up being, is inherently speculative in nature and undoubtedly falls under WP:CRYSTAL. Wikipedia is for fact, not speculation. Hyperspacey (talk) 00:30, 6 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Additional- in fact, unless I'm mistaken, any data created from this site will be based upon the speculation of its users over release sales and review scores, and as such would completely fail on a quality-of-source standpoint too. It's essentially an elaborate crystal-ball agrregator using random, non-accredited, non-professional individuals as the sources. There's no chance that this could be a suitable source for a Wikipedia article. Hyperspacey (talk) 00:35, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

MGO
In the latest PlayStation Magazine, it has been reported that MGO and MGS4 will be shipped together. Not sperately. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.226.8.105 (talk) 22:44, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Kinda, the mag also says the "starter pack" will come with 5 maps, so it mite be predominantly downloadables... John.n-irl (talk) 03:15, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Release Date
What is the actual release date for the game? 198.88.216.104 (talk) 02:19, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Quarter 2, 2008. Any time between April 1 and June 30. Hyperspacey (talk) 01:02, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

Small edit war
Apparently an anonymous user keeps adding this section:

"It has been rumored that Metal Gear Solid 4 will be appearing on Xbox 360 as well as Playstation 3. It was originally announced in Electronic Gaming Monthly's December 2006 issue, and several months later in Official Xbox Magazine. Both magazines stated that the Xbox 360 version was being developed for 360 by a second Konami team (not led by Hideo Kojima) and that it would ship several months after the PS3 version. The speculated reason for the port is that Konami thinks not enough Playstation 3 units have been sold to turn a profit for the company, but they have not commented on this, and have not released any information regarding whether the game is really coming out for 360 or not."

They keeps adding it after it gets deleted, and every time they do add it, they fail to add a source. I'm not an administrator or anything and I don't know Wikipedia's rules but shouldn't this page be temporarily protected so we can discuss this instead of having a game of tug-of-war?
 * Also, didn't Kojima deny all rumors of a 360 port? Doesn't it make more sense to listen to what Kojima says instead of a stupid magazine? After all, Kojima knows everything about the project. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.34.217.222 (talk) 02:13, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Okay, that was me, and the only reason I wasn't adding sources was because I was kind of expecting someone else to do it. But I'm honestly not making any of this up. I did, however, notice that the it's been blocked, so I can't put it on anymore. So do you want to make a little deal? If I can find sources for it, will you unblock it for me so I can put it back on? Barneyandfriendz (talk) 15:37, 28 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Then why are you putting it there as an anon instead of under your WP account? "kind of expecting someone else to do it"? Have the sources at hand as you make the edit, not wait for someone else to put them in for you. Mr 74.34.217.222 and several editors have pointed out that Kojima himself is The Best Source for any development regarding MGS4, so it would rather be appreciated if we don't see any connections between the game and the 360...not even baseless speculation. My two cents. Eaglestorm (talk) 01:45, 29 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I was anonymous because I was at my cousin's house, and I didn't really think about not being logged in (because I'm always logged in here). Okay, so I could probably find sources for it, but none from Kojima. I will say that since this was leaked from some 'bankable source' neither Konami or Kojima have commented on it, but I think it was IGN that mentioned it was anonymously leaked from an executive at Konami. So I'd say that's pretty easy to trust, but if it's bugging you so much, I won't re-post it until we get an oficial announcement from Konami. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Barneyandfriendz (talk • contribs) 15:08, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
 * They said this Bankable source like a month before E3,and Kojima Said it was pS3 Exclusive,and ryan Payton said it. We all remember this from june. It's in the archives thingies. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.252.198.194 (talk) 22:25, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

Don't dignify the fanboys with an answer. If you want to play this game, get a PS3. If you are unwilling to get a PS3, then don't play it. Stop hoping PS3 games will eventually come to XBOX 360. If you want to play PS3 games, get a PS3. Simple. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 08:02, 30 December 2007 (UTC)


 * A lot of exclusives actually are coming to 360. Think about DMC4. So I wouldn't be surprised to see MGS4 in the coming months either. Remember Substance? That was orginally supposed to be PS2 exclusive, but it came out on Xbox and PC too. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Barneyandfriendz (talk • contribs) 14:52, 30 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I wouldn't be surprised if someone shot George Bush in the face, but I sure as hell can't put it in the George bush article. No confirmation, no addition. Them's the rules. Hyperspacey (talk) 14:25, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

I think the only truly RS in this regard would be word from Konami/KojiPro †he Bread 3000 08:11, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Wiki is an encyclopedia, not some kind of rumor tabloid. As long as there's no confirmation from Mr. Kojima or Konami it's a rumor and therefore unfit to be added to this article. ~Anon 83.116.117.212 (talk) 07:11, 2 January 2008 (UTC)