Talk:Michael Clarke (musician)

Repartee on "Notorious" Byrds CD?
What's this about repartee on the CD? Someone shoudl elaborate. I have the CD, and I never heard this dialog. Where is it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.72.18.95 (talk) 22:20, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

It's now been taken out, courtesy of a detailed review and edit of the page by User:Kohoutek1138.

Dreadarthur (talk) 16:57, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

It's a hidden section of Track 17 "Universal Mind Decoder", followed by an album advertisement at 5:41 and the in-studio fighting starts at the 6:42 mark. You can hear it on YouTube if you type in Byrds Fight.115.64.25.61 (talk) 05:34, 29 December 2017 (UTC)

Birth Year; Age at Death
His obituary in the Los Angeles Times reports his birth year as 1944 and his age at death at 49. Meriting footnote reference? LA Times Obituary

Dreadarthur (talk) 16:53, 4 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Hmmmm...that's interesting but probably incorrect, I have to say. Clarke's birth date is given as June 3, 1946 in Johnny Rogan's Byrds' bible Timeless Flight Revisited (1998), in Christopher Hjort's exhaustive So You Want To Be A Rock 'n' Roll Star: The Byrds Day-By-Day (1965–1973) (2008), in John Einarson's biography of Gene Clark (2005), on the Allmusic website, and even on the memoriam from Clarke's friends and family that is linked to in the "External links" section of the article. Given this overwhelming consensus among noted experts on Clarke's life and even those who knew him personally, I think it's probably safe to say that the LA Times has simply got it wrong. --Kohoutek1138 (talk) 13:14, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

Fired or Left after Notorious Byrd Brothers
The page currently involves a referenced assertion that Clarke was fired during the recording of The Notorious Byrd Brothers. However, recordings for the album occurred at various points during 1967. After David Crosby was fired later in the year, it appears that Gene Clark came back for a few weeks, shortly followed by Clarke. After Clark left, Clarke became disenchanted again, but stayed long enough to co-write "Artificial Energy", before departing for good. Some support for this is found in the date references relating to Clarke's successor in The Byrds, Kevin Kelley. Suggest that the blanket statement that Clarke was fired might be reconsidered/revised, with appropriate references.

Dreadarthur (talk) 20:39, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

I just noticed on The Notorious Byrd Brothers page referenced assertions that imply that Clarke initially quit during the recording of the album (this being when he went to Hawaii?), then came back briefly, only to be fired after the album was completed. One way or another, the unqualified assertion on the Michael Clarke page that he was fired would appear to merit refinement.

Dreadarthur (talk) 20:47, 4 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Simply saying that Clarke was fired is sort of technically true I suppose, but is also a massive oversimplification and as such, a bit misleading. There's a lot of confusion about this and you often see erroneous info about Clarke's comings and goings during the Notorious sessions in otherwise well researched books. The accepted version of events, as supported by Byrds' biographers Johnny Rogan and Christopher Hjort, as well as Ric Menck's book about The Notorious Byrd Brothers, is that Clarke initially walked out of the group in August 1967 and was temporarily replaced in the studio by Jim Gordon and Hal Blaine. However, Clarke did not leave LA during this period and, according to Hjort, even made a handful of live appearances with The Byrds at the Whisky A-Go-Go during late August/early September 1967.


 * What we do know for sure is that Clarke had returned from his self-imposed exile just prior to Gene Clark rejoining the band (but after Crosby's dismissal in October 1967), and was with the group during their late October mini-tour of the Midwest. Clarke didn't return to the studio, however, until early November, when he contributed drums to the song "Artificial Energy", which was also the last song recorded for The Notorious Byrd Brothers album. Once the album was "in the can", Clarke was then fired by McGuinn and Hillman...who probably both felt that his heart wasn't really in it. Clarke had been complaining throughout the latter half of 1967 that he was dissatisfied with his role in the band and didn't even particularly like the recent material that the band had recorded. I don't believe that Clarke went to Hawaii until after the Flying Burrito Brothers split up in 1971, but don't quote me on that. --Kohoutek1138 (talk) 13:53, 5 November 2010 (UTC)


 * OK, I've had a go at adding some of the above information to the article with supporting refs. --Kohoutek1138 (talk) 12:20, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Byrds name being in Clarke estate
McGuinn's assertion on the Clarke page is presently unreferenced. The original source for the sentiment comes from the Ask Dr. Byrds discussion forum, where McGuinn is quoted as follows:


 * "When we went to court to get the name of the band, we didn't establish ownership. The judge ruled in favor of Michael Clarke because he had been using the name and we [Crosby, Hillman and McGuinn] hadn't used it in years. When Michael died, the name went to his estate..." --McGuinn in Cleveland Scene.

The quote is undated, and when I searched the current Cleveland Scene website, it didn't come up in terms of articles currently electronically indexed. If someone has library-based access to earlier editions of Cleveland Scene or can otherwise substantially reference McGuinn's sentiments here, suggest that this is important, in terms of ultimate ownership of The Byrds name--prior to the rights being purchased by David Crosby in 2002 (another point for which independent reference is required).

Dreadarthur (talk) 22:20, 4 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Yeah, we really need a reference for the primary source of this quote, not just some guy quoting it on a message board. If we can find another source that supports the assertion that The Byrds' name ended up with Clarke's estate until Crosby bought it, that would be OK because we're not actually quoting McGuinn in the article. Only the facts need support, not the actual quote itself. --Kohoutek1138 (talk) 14:07, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

At least two lawsuits: against Clark and Clarke, and against Clarke only
The injunction denial in relation to lawsuits over the name appears to relate only to the later action against Clarke alone. The nature of the earlier action(s) by McGuinn, Hillman and Crosby against Clark and Clarke have not yet been particularized. I have limited the footnote reference at present to the action against Clarke alone.

17:15, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

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