Talk:Midget

Archived stale material related to old version of the article
Stale discussions relating to an old version of the article have been archived to Talk:Midget/Archive 1. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom  02:52, 2 April 2013 (UTC)

https://www.littlepeopleoftheworld.org/TheOffensiveMWordHistory - For more information on the affects and other forms people with dwarfism or skeletal-dysplasia deal with on a daily basis. This also covers areas of how you can approach and be educated properly on the ways to interact with those with dwarfism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:341:C280:6F80:F975:9155:B755:CF4F (talk) 17:17, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

Pejorative?
I think this article is probably incomplete. It shows only one instance in which "midget" is used in a non-pejorative way, but I've encountered others. Trouble is, I can't track down references, because most of the time it was the term "midget" in fiction, used factually to refer to dwarfism with proportionately smaller body instead of simply shorter limbs, and I pretty much suck at remembering titles and authors. I think we could probably say that when the term "midget" is used in this way (as a synonym for "proportionate dwarfism"), it is usually non-pejorative. There are also a good many older instances from before "midget" became an insult to begin with, including people with dwarfism referring to themselves that way. Unfortunately, I can't edit because I don't have references, so hopefully somebody sees this who has more information than I do.65.185.154.183 (talk) 19:40, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

Completely agree that that the affectionate/positive use of the word which really means compact is missing. WHY IS SMALL BAD? clearly it is a purely cultural bias. Certainly, that bias would ONLY pertain to a diminutive sized person.. What about a COMPACT car or appliance. Many examples exist, both current and historical. I've attempted to correct this by offering the definition of the word as an adjective as well as a noun. Small is not negative. It is Compact and Efficient.

I also added the etymology - it came from the word MIDGE the smallest biting fly -THE MIDGE - It is Midge-like or Smaller than a Midge ( A midge-ett). I think this is progress on a reference that was lacking half it's meaning. I would go further and downplay the circus reference stuff - its not contemporary and hardly relevant, except anachronistically / historical. DShantz / Magnity 07:44, 6 August 2018 (UTC)


 * we go by what the reliably published sources about the subject say, not coming up with our own conclusions based on how we see the term used in a primary source document such as a novel. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom  19:45, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

The opening sentence, that the term midget "is widely consisidered pejorative", is unsupported by the current references. First of all, most of the references don't even mention the word "midget". Secondly, the word "pejorative" implies (intentional) hostility or contempt (Wikipedia's current definition). At best the term "offensive", which allows for unintentional harm, should be substituted, but it remains to be shown (through references) that the vast majority of people are aware of the term's offensive nature. 99.88.5.242 (talk) 10:22, 21 December 2013 (UTC)

Agreed, and on top of that, no alternative common term (or euphemism) is given for midget here--because there isn't one. This is the "correctness" run rampant in our culture (USA), and it screws things up rather than helping. 01:11, 5 July 2017 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.24.242.20 (talk) 07:44, 6 August 2018 (UTC)DShantz / Magnity

This article should be split into a page for the pejorative usage and this one for the definitional noun. Conflating the two usages only confuses and angers. Sensitivities to the meaning of the word have no place here. 2601:182:4381:E60:F439:47A3:5C70:E788 (talk) 02:07, 5 December 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 June 2014
Midget sources: Kate Ryan (Rossmore, Ireland)

213.94.179.47 (talk) 12:37, 21 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. — &#123;&#123;U&#124;Technical 13&#125;&#125; (e • t • c) 14:53, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

Hervé Villechaize on the word 'midget'.
It was well established that Hervé Villechaize insisted on the word 'midget' vs. 'dwarf'. The source is the book "Within Reach" about Billy Barty. I'm unfamiliar with how to do a proper reference, but please don't remove factual material because the source cited was a blog citing the book. The reference is good, don't remove it because the citation is wrong... FIX THE CITATION. --Winged Brick (talk) 03:01, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

actually dwarves are mythological persons, says my dictionary, and don't exist in real-life.

Grammar
There is a sentence in the article referring to Singer's Midgets troupe (which is highlighted, so easy to find), which used the article 'which' in referring to the cast of 'Wizard of Oz'. Although grammatically correct, it seems to use 'which' to refer to the midgets, creating a disturbing dissonance.132.239.153.57 (talk) 18:12, 5 May 2015 (UTC)Remitrom, first-time contributor.

Alleged pejorative nature of "midget" revisited
The article states in the intro that some consider it pejorative while the "History" section states "...the word became to be considered as a pejorative term when in reference to people with dwarfism.", the latter seeming to state the more the just "some" find it pejorative. So which is it? Is there some majority who currently who find the term offensive? If so, then we need to be clear who these people are. Are they the a majority of general public? Dwarfs/little people/midgets themselves? It not clear to me that there is a general acceptance that the term midget is no longer seen as acceptable by the majority of the public just yet. While I a number of advocates for dwarfs/little people do consider the term offensive and/or outdated, it's not clear that this view has caught on with the general public in the same way words like n-word or negro/colored have become taboo or considered at least very outdated. It might be more accurate to state that many dwarf/little people advocates hold this view and urge it's removal from the lexicon (at least in reference to people) and their is a growing view among the general public that supports this position if not yet a large majority. Notcharliechaplin (talk) 23:44, 6 October 2018 (UTC)

Another nonpejorative use, active until relatively recently was The Midget Mets Club. Drsruli (talk) 09:19, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 19 December 2018
Put the other terms for midget like leprchaun, ect Lil boiiiiii (talk) 19:14, 19 December 2018 (UTC)
 * This article isn't about mythology.- gadfium 19:52, 19 December 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 30 July 2023
Remove the sentence about Bill Walton. It's just WP:NOTNEWS, WP:PROSELINE tabloid fodder and adds nothing to the article other than "omgz this public figure said 'midget' and people got outraged!". 35.139.154.158 (talk) 15:00, 30 July 2023 (UTC) 35.139.154.158 (talk) 15:00, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
 * ✅ because the New York Post is not used as a reliable source on Wikipedia. Randy Kryn (talk) 15:07, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

short proportionally or just short limbs (legs)
I had some idea from the 1960s, that there were two different terms -- one for midgets (proportional size of all parts) and another for those whose trunks are usual size but legs are shorter, but haven't seen any reference to the latter term. Anybody else know? 2604:3D09:887C:7B70:0:0:0:6A17 (talk) 22:30, 28 October 2023 (UTC)


 * I remember that too. The latter was dwarf. —Tamfang (talk) 07:06, 30 January 2024 (UTC)