Talk:Midlife crisis

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 20 April 2021 and 23 July 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): MandyGuymon312.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 04:05, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

I think that this article could use some work with their sources. There was one place that needed a citation. Additionally, there was some imbalance with the sources and it could use some more variety in the sources to increase its credibility. I also noticed that it could have been better at remaining more neutral. There seemed to be some biases and I think that it needs to have more simple facts that merely inform the reader rather than trying to convince the reader.Charliejo99 (talk) 07:13, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

I agree with what you have said in regards to the article needing more sources. I also think that this particular article does not have the correct level of neutrality. The underlying assumptions made from the article suggest that a mid-life crisis is not a "crisis", but more of an average emotional reaction to change. Lilasmith44 (talk) 04:26, 23 January 2024 (UTC)

Life half over?
There is some dispute here as to whether midlife crisis actually exists. Assuming it does: The article begins by saying that the trigger is the realization that one's life is half over. This seems doubtful to meet. People have no sense of life being half over. I think people sense the youthful part of their life is over, and they happen to sense that at what is coincidentally the midpoint of their life expectancy so that's label that gets applied.

No such thing as a mid life crisis????
Currently the article has been edited by someone that just doesnt believe in Mid life crises and is trying to make them out as nothing more then a half baked psuedo psychological buzz word. It calls Mid Life crises a 'notion in certain cultures', a 'popular belief', and says that there is no 'evidence that it exists'.

I am not sure why this person wants to discredit mid life crises. It is somewhat like saying there is no evidence that people get depressed by finacial problems. But some people (and i would guess if we are all honest that all of us) do at a certain point in their life look back at the loss of youth, and must come to grips with their own mortality.

Anyway, the wording should be changed and more refrences to studies in mid life crises should be added. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.5.88.10 (talk) 17:09, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Personal experiences
It is related to golden age (menopause in) women or andropause in men.

I'm only 36 but I'm definitely seriously panicking and haven't slept in months over major life regrets and the realization that I'm past the point where I can fix it all. Too late to find love and have a family. Too late to enter a certain profession and be successful.

Regardless, I want to point out something about the car. Read the comments. It is very clear to me that that was posted by someone taking a personal jab at someone he knows. He's trying to publicly shame this person for messing with the brand on the car. The license plate is visible. To me, that car serves no purpose but to publicly shame someone specific. --- I dont see why there should be a link to sports car in this page. I can only think that it has been added as humorous reference to sexist stereotypes. I do not think that is adequate for an encyclopedic article and I am deleting it.

I'm at 47, and I don't want a sports car. I want power. I want to leverage my experience and wisdom in some way to hold more power over my life. People look at me and see modest wealth, atrophy, gray hair and ambition adrift. That's from the outside. If they could see inside, they would see youthful ambition and imagination, tempered with two things: the realism of my own limitations, and limitation imposed upon me by the subjective judgement of my peers. My mid-life crisis is my realization of how thoroughly unfair both of these are, and how the effects of these two things imposes more on my life, with each passing day.--64.160.120.212 05:33, 19 August 2006 (UTC) --- The thought of being in a mid life crisis is kind of ironic to me. At 50 years old and struggling at length with major clinical depression that may in fact be the experience of a midlife crisis is almost a relief for me. That's not to say that my depression, anxiety, anger, frustration, insecurity, boredom, spending sprees, et al aren't very disconcerting to say the least, but after going through every medical test that I could imagine, trying traditional and non traditional therapy, psychoactive drugs, etc. all with little positive change, just knowning that what I maybe experiencing something that a lot of other men go through at my age and may eventually pass gives me some hope that I may eventually return to some level of "normalcy" whatever that maybe. --- All the links go to the same site. It seems a little unbalanced...

I agree that this page is very unbalanced, to the extent that it is misleading. It also seems to ignore the psychodynamic understanding of midlife that has been around for 50 years. It mentions Jung's idea of 'individuation' but then ignores or rejects the entire Jungian view of what is actually happening within the psyche. It also ignores the Levinson view which has basic similarities with Jung. Both see the midlife transition as the process in which the false identity we adopt during the earlier part of our lives is replaced with our true identity. In that regard, the opening sentence is simply wrong. --Alistair Campbell 06:10, 2 February 2007 (UTC) --- I'm looking here at my entry-level college psychology book (Psychology, 8th ed. by David G. Meyers) and it states that most people do not undergo a mid-life crisis, those who do can attribute it to environmental changes. I'm no Wikipedia editor but I think someone should at least add a section on criticism, or obtain information from more than one source. --- I think expanding on Jung to include Myer-Briggs personality types, the approximate age of 40 is when another attribute begins to develop (intuition, sensing, thinking, feeling). The primary function is developed at around age 10, the second at about age 20. The third hits around 40. For an INTJ like myself, that third function is feeling (already having a well-developed intuition and thinking functions). Re-examination of life as the third function is developed seems natural and normal to some extent. How people cope with it is different. Honestly, I'm nearly 41 and I'm not doing too well with it. Some of it is good (like calling my grandparents and letting them know how much I care about them), but I have these insane desires to see other things in life. I tried to START smoking yesterday. I didn't do very well at that... all I felt was dizzy and sick. I've done better with expressing rage - I called three different TV networks (ABC, FOX, and CBS) and gave them a piece of my mind as to their treatment of certain shows (Traveler, Drive, and Pirate Master respectively). I'm probably doing better with flirting as well - I've never been very good at it, but at least now I'm willing to give it a shot.

86.141.180.187 18:26, 30 August 2007 (UTC) It's just the endless tasks associated with being a wife and mother. Tidying, preparing food, shopping, ensuring kids get to school on time, etc etc, of course most people have some of all of these things (and many many more mundane tasks),  you have to ask yourself where is that fun person I used to be years ago? 86.141.180.187 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.141.180.187 (talk) 18:26, August 30, 2007 (UTC)

In response to--Alistair Campbell 06:10, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
...the last sentence is simply wrong. According to who, YOU? Wikipedia is simply a "one person's perspective/definition" if you will. The first line in particular was a very simplified definition that helped me to understand what my 50something year old mother may be going through. I, and I'm sure many others, are not looking for the deep meaning of mid-life crisis. From what I understand, you can add to the definition if you feel others need to know that deeper meaning. Just my OPINION, nothing more~C.J. Coleman April 14, 2007

Still needs work
I've made extensive edits the last two days (August 15-16, 2007) to reflect the current academic thinking about midlife crisis: that it's something that (at most) less than 10% of middle aged adults go through.

There is certainly debate about this. Psychologists and others who study massive surveys like MIDUS find no evidence of widespread midlife crisis. Therapists and other counselors will tell you that they see people going through them. These are not irreconcilable.

What's lacking in the literature -- and I've looked -- are large clinical studies of people going through a midlife crisis. What's out there are either very small samples or completely anecdotal (see Gail Sheehy's "Passages," which popularized midlife crisis thirty years ago). I have not updated the symptoms section with anything from these small group studies -- perhaps on another day.

There could also be more explanation of the findings that people who do suffer a midlife crisis are often people who have had crises at other turning points or stressful periods in their lives. In other words, their psychological issue is more generalized than a "midlife crisis."

Greg y 18:09, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Cleanup spam tag
Have the problems with spam been addressed? I didn't see any evidence of spam (except a heavy reliance on lifetwo.com as a source). Without understanding the history of this article, I was hesitant to remove it.--Ishi Gustaedr (talk) 12:31, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

American Beauty
While this movie is often mentioned as an example of mid-life crisis (and arguably is), I still doubt its inclusion in this article. What happens to Lester (?) is not a crisis in the conventional sense, but more of a re-evaluation, based upon which he takes positive and constructive action. Arguably, he is the least troubled character in the movie, certainly less so than his wife. (It can even be argued, his infatuation notwithstanding, that he is being chased by a young girl rather than the stereotypical reverse...)

Based on what I heard before seeing the movie myself, I would also argue that it is often misunderstood or misrepresented in media with regard to the character and behaviour of Lester. 88.77.143.247 (talk) 04:57, 9 January 2010 (UTC)


 * As someone who dislikes this article as a whole (its largely dismissive of the phenomenom, even though its a popularly accepted construct -- and therefore worthy of in-depth explication -- regardless of academic criticism), I think American Beauty is a good example from popular media. I agree that the character of Lester deviates from the stereotype of a midlife crisis -- but that's part of the genius of the movie. The movie deliberately sets up Lester as a cliched example of the stereotype, and then proceeds to deconstruct that cliche by unfolding Lester's unique personality and personal enlightenment.  Nonetheless, the entire premise of the movie relies on an audience that understands what a midlife crisis is, and has certain expectations of a plot revolving such a crisis.


 * But of course, like most Wikipedia articles dealing with matters of criticism and interpretation, there is no exploration of the true cultural significance of the subject of the article... after all, that would be original research. 24.199.122.123 (talk) 06:03, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

Blaming others?
I have no references to back this, but in my experience, what is colloquially coined a "midlife crisis" in the United States has little to do with blaming others. Just the opposite is true. It seems to be a realization that what is done is done and that only by pulling oneself up "by the bootstraps" can things be changed. Someone who always wanted a sports car but couldn't buy it--because of obligations to bills, the wife, and the children--now suddenly finds that it's possible. Someone who grew fatter and fatter because of poor choices now finds that getting thinner is only a matter of eating less and moving more. To quote the article existential crisis, such a crisis may result from "awareness of one's freedom and the consequences of accepting or rejecting that freedom."

I'll be removing this line in the article shortly, and it should only be replaced with an appropriate reference. kevinthenerd 16:15, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

Percentage of Population Affected?
The article states, repeatedly, that fewer than 10% are affected.

References would be nice.

Popular literature would seem to indicate a much higher percentage.

WriteManWriting (talk) 16:44, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

Article on number 5 cited clearly states 40-60 and not 30-60
Thirty is still relatively young and it is kept on here despite me fixing it. Administrators please read the articles that are cited. It almost seems like you guys are purposely trying to turn me into an old man on here long before my time. (Bjoh249 (talk) 20:08, 3 September 2010 (UTC))


 * Hi. Upon reading the cited ref, I now am OK with your edit, because although the ref doesn't specifically state 40-60 as the range, the gist of the ref doesn't disagree with your edit. Just to provide perspective on my earlier reversion, I wanted to share these points (to reassure you that Wikipedia isn't as bad as it may currently seem to you on the surface). (1) The edit is not about you in particular (age-wise)—just about the topic and defending what I figured was probably sound existing text, in line with the cited refs. (2) You may see people like me reverting edits that seem dubious to us on the surface, even if we haven't read the refs in an article, and that's not wrong of us to do—it just reflects that most of what we revert is vandalism and personal opinion. Reversions of edits like yours are just the minority false positives of the process, but rest assured that the process works well overall, and it's not aimed against you in particular. I could see how my edit summary might seem to someone not used to watchlisting on Wikipedia. Like "didn't you read close enough before reverting?" But it's really just based on sound heuristic clues (± anon, ± no edit summary, ± possible test edit or personal opinion, ± apparent contradiction of existing referencing), which are accurate more often than they're wrong, and we volunteers do quick first-line defense of random articles tangentially related to our primary interests even if we're not delving into the topic deeply. The thing to do if you are one of the minority of people who are actually coming here to contribute constructively (as opposed to just winging in to drop vandalism or opinion, which is what most people do) is to have patience, always give descriptive edit summaries, and understand that heuristic quality defenses are not aimed at you personally. Thanks for bringing your concern to the talk page and being patient about it. Happy editing! — ¾-10 23:45, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

I don't really agree, most people don't live to be 90-120 years old if 45-60 is midlife/middle-aged, wouldn't it be 32.5 and older? The snare (talk) 12:22, 28 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Article refers to the middle of Adult Life, not total lifespan, i.e, Childhood, Early Adult, Middle Adult, Old Adult. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.120.30.140 (talk) 00:55, 21 May 2016 (UTC)
 * That would still imply a life expectancy of ~90. The middle of adult life would be more around 45–50, but not 55–60. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 21:04, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

Treatment
I think this article should talk something about the treatment of a midlife crisis. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.172.133.176 (talk) 19:14, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

Biological Underpinnings
It is astonishing that article omits hormonal and other changes (ie., Dopamine levels associated with aging) (mainly deterioration) in 1) Understanding "why" people become aware of their aging and the consequent expression psychologically as is virtually exclusively focused upon here, and 2) Its treatment. Diminishing levels of thyroid and testosterone level in males, for example in "andropause." Similarly, for both sexes, declining growth hormone levels, and in the brain, dopamine levels. Other neuro-chemical changes might play here as well, I am not familiar with those though. While I am conversant to bring these issues up, someone with the legitimate expertise should address the sub-topic. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.84.118.124 (talk) 14:28, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

Odd Edits
There's some odd images somebody has added with some decidedly unobjective captions in this article — Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.87.181.59 (talk) 00:06, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

I agree. See section below... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.120.30.140 (talk) 00:50, 21 May 2016 (UTC)

"Monetary costs" section
The section 'Monetary costs' contains a lot of top-of-the-head blather, stereotypes, myths and not one citation. Would somebody please excise it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.120.30.140 (talk) 00:48, 21 May 2016 (UTC)

Effect on Spouse
I recently made edits to include information on the effect of a midlife crisis on a spouse. I found the information from a reputable source who is noteworthy in the field and has her own Wikipedia entry as she has been covered by multiple international media outlets and meets criteria for notability. Three user accounts were created, immediately removed this update, and have made no other entries. I suspect this person is not a fan of the source and I suspect this to be Sock puppetry. To avoid going against the edit warring rules, I am reporting the issue there to administrators. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Eric1985 (talk • contribs) 16:21, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

Education level
Can we get a source on the 3rd paragraph under "Crisis vs Stressors"? Specifically the line stating education level correlates to likelyhood if a midlife crisis? Seems like pure speculation especially with the wording making it sound like it's a hard fact. Samnotanonymous (talk) 21:13, 22 October 2017 (UTC)

Occurence section
Is it me, or this section is sort of over-using the "or lack of" wording? I mean, it currently reads as "A mid-life crisis could be caused by...regrets over...lack of death of parents." It's understandable that death of parents could trigger a crisis. But addition of "or lack of" implies that some people get a midlife crisis because they regret the lack of death, i.e. regret that their parents are still alive. Maybe it's better to limit "or lack of" to career, spouses and children? The same way as there is no "or lack of" when it's about "physical changes associated with aging."

Unclear sentence.
I have a problem with the word "feel" here:

"This may produce feelings of intense depression, remorse, and high levels of anxiety, or the desire to achieve youthfulness or make drastic changes to their current lifestyle or the wish to change past decisions and events."

Is it a verb or noun? The word "feel" is clearly connected with some other word in this sentence, but I do not know which one.

If it is a verb, connected with the verb "desire", then "the desire to the wish to change past decisions and events" does not make much sense. You would rather wish to change something than feel the desire to. Let's look at the sentence in detail (the indentations matter):

This may produce
 * feelings of
 * intense depression,
 * [and] remorse,
 * and high levels of anxiety,
 * or the desire
 * to achieve youthfulness
 * or make drastic changes to their current lifestyle
 * or the wish to change past decisions and events.

But if it is a noun, connected with "produce", then "produce the wish" is ungrammatical:

This may produce
 * feelings of
 * intense depression,
 * [and] remorse,
 * and high levels of anxiety,
 * or the desire
 * to achieve youthfulness
 * or make drastic changes to their current lifestyle
 * or the wish to change past decisions and events.

I understand, that you, native English speakers, acquired your language completely mindlessly, but - as a rational beings - you could (and should) do something about it. After all, you have some ideas to convey here, as clearly as possible, right? 85.193.252.19 (talk) 16:05, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

Treating those going through a midlife crisis/preventing it from occurring
I was curious in the "treatment and prevention" section, if it would be better to lengthen this section. I believe adding information about CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy) would be helpful to individuals struggling in this area of their life. QualityContent24.7 (talk) 01:04, 17 January 2023 (UTC)

Number 1 reference leads to fictional article
Apparently the first article added on this revision (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Midlife_crisis&diff=prev&oldid=753676530) is a fictional article made for a book called "Critical Thinking About Research: Psychology and Related Fields" (2018) by authors Julian Meltzoff PhD and Dr. Harris Cooper PhD. Specifically for the second part of the Book called "Critical Thinking Using Practice Articles".

It has a big footnote saying "NOTE: This is a fictional article to be used only for purposes of research education" Sunaipatieftu (talk) 21:48, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Adult Development Fall 2023
— Assignment last updated by Charliejo99 (talk) 21:58, 7 November 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Adult Development winter 2024
— Assignment last updated by Lilasmith44 (talk) 22:34, 21 January 2024 (UTC)

Discrepancy
I've noticed that the occurrence age range in the lead is different to the age range in the occurrence section. Does anyone know what happened here and how it may be fixed? —Panamitsu (talk) 08:33, 19 February 2024 (UTC)