Talk:Midnight Cowboy/Archive 1

Where's that Joe Buck?
I'm really not sure that I agree that Joe Buck "comes to terms with his sexuality" during the movie, or even that he's clear on what his sexuality is at all. User:Moncrief, 9 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I saw the movie the other day, and I agree. I just replaced that line with a slightly more informative plot overview. ... ah, looks like I wasn't logged in, but anyway... Ed Halter 20:25, 3 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Was this really 'X' rated? HighInBC 01:56, 17 March 2006 (UTC) It would be nice if the article included some mention of why it was considered great enough to win Best Picture, unless it's just that the performances and that Talkin' song are good. 70.248.232.127 00:35, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Just look at the poster. (Ibaranoff24 20:33, 1 July 2006 (UTC))
 * While the film today might seem a bit dated, even awfully tame, compared to what's come since, in 1969 the material seemed mature and unconventional. The film's visual and aural style utilized all the photographic, editing, location shooting, sound recording and music editing techniques that then struck filmgoers as completely modern.  The acting, primarily by Mr. Voight and Mr. Hoffman seemed to be the epitome of "method" realism.  The score included not one but two popular hits, Harry Nilsson's "Everybody's Talkin'", a country-ish pop hit, and the ever evocative "Theme From Midnight Cowboy" by the great film composer, John Barry, both of these were record and radio staples during the era.  I'm not sure if the film holds up well today, although as recently as the mid-1980's, I had still counted the picture as one of my personal favorites (at this point in my life, I appreciate films produced in the thirties through the early sixties much more than those from what had been my favorite period, the late sixties through late seventies. Nearly everything from the mid-eighties on is ultimately forgettable!) I'm not prepared at the moment to translate this into a NPOV encyclopedic entry, but if someone else has the time or knowledge, please go ahead and do so.  Thank you.71.249.144.11 (talk) 21:34, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

X Rating
yes, the film was originally x-rated and the director approved the rating. this is also the only film to win an academy award with an x rating. these and many other facts can be found in uncle john's legendary lost bathroom reader under the article accidentally x rated. page 632 i believe. or if you simply have the seventh reader (although not many people do) you can find it in there too.

Recent Changes
I notice that the passage regarding Joe's story in the film has been changed, with a statement that some of the things didn't happen in the film. One of the things that was removed was that Annie and Joe were raped in the parked car scene; that did in fact occur in the film, Joe was thrown over the hood of the car, and Annie was seen being pursued and captured, with the suggestion of an assault obviously.

There was also a scene with Annie with the police pointing at Joe saying 'He was the one, he was the only one' - I took it that he'd then been run out of town rather than prosecuted for a rape allegation (of which he was innocent).

Thanks for a good article by the way Gomez2002 15:01, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Entourage
Someone could add the quotes/references from Entourage to the list of references. 128.113.146.196 08:17, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

What?
Are we really going to enumerate every time someone says "Hey, I'm walkin' here!" in any other film or TV show? What a waste of time and effort. 24.243.187.152 14:56, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Helps if you read the book
If the person who claimed that Sally Buck had some kind of "improper" relationship with Joe, and other things they detailed about Joe's relationship with Crazy Annie, had actually read the book, they would have known better. The dream sequence mixed Joe's real memories with his present-day fears and worries. Childhood spankings can be traumatic, especially when the person giving them does so coolly, as Sally did in Joe's dream. Being caught intimate with one's girlfriend and roughly separated would be about as traumatic, so naturally they could become associated in one's own thoughts. It doesn't mean Joe had any prior sexual relationship with anyone, much less his grandmother. The big tipoff should have been when Ratso is seen among the gathered crowd as Joe and Crazy Annie are being taken away. Zephyrad 08:17, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

Implied Homosexuality
"Nothing in the film hints at any type of homosexual relationship between Joe and Ratso"

I think this is a far too sweeping (not to mention inaccurate) statement to make, that there are no hints of homosexuality between the two leads at all in the film. In one scene, Rizzo fantasizes about a shirtless Joe running beside him on the beach (with no women present around them), and if I recall correctly Rizzo is being messaged by Joe. Rizzo in another scene makes an acerbic, anti-gay critcism of Joe's choice of clothing (possibly indicative of the insecure sexuality of Rizzo). Then there's the scene at the end where Rizzo nestles his head onto Joe's shoulder (of course, two good friends should be allowed to do this without being thought of as gay, but nonetheless this scene could still count as a possible gay implication). I find in some articles on wikipedia that the writers seem to make deliberate efforts to attempt to, rather pointlessly, refute a previously thought-out and established consensus on something without really backing it up. This can be very annoying, not to mention averse to what an encyclopaedia is supposed to provide, and I hope this is not happening here. Perhaps the writer of this should watch the film a bit more closely; either that or cite an article by a professional film critic or maybe some academic who wrote something about the implied homosexuality issue. Otherwise, this absolute and out of left-field refutation doesn't really stand. I might find something, and change it myself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.137.100.126 (talk • contribs)

References In Popular Culture
I have a problem with the way the "Legacy" section of this entry is littered with "References In Popular Culture". In fact, this is a problem with Wikipedia articles as a whole. There is absolutely no purpose in listing every time a movie or book is referenced in a popular telivision comedy show such as Seinfeld, Family Guy, or Futurerama. Nothing against popular telivision comedies, but Wikipedia entries for movies such as this should stand on their own merits. The "References in popular culture" cliches are irrelevant to the true article, and if they are really worthy to be in wiki, belong in the article they are relevant to (i.e. Seinfeld, Family Guy, or Futurama). At what point do the references in popular culture end? Rhetorically, should references by talking heads in crappy VH1 clip shows be included too? Perhaps a bot could go around and take all of these references out. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.2.229.41 (talk) 00:06, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Fringe Fare
What the hell is this shit? Why does this article need a second plot summary written in short sentences? The final sentence also goes against the non-spoiler policy. If someone can't say why this is here, I'm removing it. 24.196.146.119 (talk) 21:04, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Requested move
This article has been renamed from Midnight Cowboy (film) to Midnight Cowboy as the result of a move request. 
 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was unopposed move as article is the primary topic Keith D (talk) 13:22, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

Request Move Midnight Cowboy (film) to Midnight Cowboy. (Midnight Cowboy (novel) can be covered by a hatnote).

After a cut and paste move. Midnight Cowboy is a seminal American movie (launching the careers of Jon Voigt and Dustin Hoffman, Oscar-winning, X-rated etc). The only notability the novel has is because of the movie (note that most of the Midnight Cowboy (novel) page is about the movie). At the moment there are several hundred incorrect links to the disambiguation page at Midnight Cowboy, the vast majority referring to the film, a prime example of WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Tassedethe (talk) 23:57, 4 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Agree with the above. And a disambiguation page is unnecessary in this case as hatnotes can address the ambiguity. older ≠ wiser 03:29, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

"Lay Lady Lay" on soundtrack?
The article posits that the Bob Dylan song "Lay Lady Lay" may have been considered for the movie's theme instead of "Everybody's Talking." Given that the entire first act is cut around the Nilsson song (a time-consuming process) — and that the Dylan song was released some three months after the film was released — is this a plausible claim? Also, the claim is uncited. Does anyone else think it should go? --HarringtonSmith (talk) 20:44, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

"Lay Lady Lay" on MidCow soundtrack?
The article posits that the Bob Dylan song "Lay Lady Lay" may have been considered for the movie's theme instead of "Everybody's Talkin'." Given that the entire first act of the film is edited around the Nilsson song (a time-consuming process) — and that the Dylan song was only released some three months after the film was released — is this a plausible claim? Also, the claim is uncited. Does anyone agree that it should go? --HarringtonSmith (talk) 12:42, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

"Lay Lady Lay" on MidCow soundtrack?
The article posits that the Bob Dylan song "Lay Lady Lay" may have been considered for the movie's theme instead of "Everybody's Talkin'." Given that the entire first act of the film is edited around the Nilsson song (a time-consuming process) — and that the Dylan song was only released some three months after the film was released — is this a plausible claim? Also, the claim is uncited. Does anyone agree that it should go? Please answer before yet another robot sends this off to archive oblivion! --HarringtonSmith (talk) 13:55, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

What's with the bots on this page?
How come legitimate question postings on this page get swept off to archive oblivion after just seven days? I've been trying to start a discussion about music in Midnight Cowboy, and bots keep jamming it into archive after just a week.--HarringtonSmith (talk) 12:33, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

Allmovie
Reference available for citing in the article body. Erik (talk) 20:18, 10 January 2010 (UTC)
 * ... plot synopsis, review, cast, production credits, awards

Elvis as Joe Buck in Midnight Cowboy?
An item was added today claiming that Elvis Presley was offered the role of Joe Buck but declined through Col. Parker. The cite is a book by Elvis's former friends and bodyguards. I'd be more comfortable with the info if it came from Jerome Hellman than from the so-called "Memphis Mafia." How does everyone else feel about this dubious claim? — HarringtonSmith (talk) 21:32, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Elvis as Joe Buck in Midnight Cowboy?
An item was added June 14th claiming that Elvis Presley was offered the role of Joe Buck but declined through Col. Parker. The cite is a book by Elvis's former friends and bodyguards. I'd be more comfortable with the info if it came from Jerome Hellman than from the so-called "Memphis Mafia." How does everyone else feel about this dubious claim? — HarringtonSmith (talk) 22:22, 21 June 2010 (UTC)


 * If no one defends this claim in the next few days, I'll be deleting it. — HarringtonSmith (talk) 22:22, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Elvis as Joe Buck in Midnight Cowboy?
An item was added to the MC article on June 14th claiming that Elvis Presley was offered the role of Joe Buck but declined through Col. Parker. The cite is a book by Elvis's former friends and bodyguards. I'd be more comfortable with the info if it came from Jerome Hellman than from the so-called "Memphis Mafia." How does everyone else feel about this dubious claim?


 * If no one defends this claim in the next few days, I'll be deleting it. — HarringtonSmith (talk) 02:27, 29 June 2010 (UTC)
 * I deleted the Elvis claim after it went a month undefended. — HarringtonSmith (talk) 00:48, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

==== I remember seeing a version where the opening scene is a black & white rape scene.

Nantucketnoon (talk) 06:54, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

Plot length
The plot is entirely too long, currently sitting at 1,019 words, far exceeding the maximum length of 700 words. It also makes entirely too many references to the film as a film, when it should be a straight summary of the events of the film. The plot needs to be rewritten to address these concerns. --- The Old Jacobite The '45  17:00, 18 May 2013 (UTC)