Talk:Miguel Induráin

Did he ever test positive for Salbutamol?
i deleted the following line from the article: "In 1994, he was once tested positive with Salbutamol." because i would consider this a major claim and it came from an ip address only. (not a registered user) if someone else can confirm this, we can put it back into the article.uri budnik 15:05, 25 September 2005 (UTC)
 * I believe he actually did, but I think he had a doctor's note for it (pre-dated though?) Evito 07:05, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

source: http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/drugs-in-sport-indurain-allowed-to-use-banned-drug-1379584.html 
 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result of the nomination wasMoved -- Kim van der Linde at venus 04:22, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

No accent
His name is Miguel Indurain and not Miguel Induráin. I'm to lazy to make the move myself. Švitrigaila 12:00, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
 * This is not so clear to me. Actually, according to the rules of accents in Spanish (see the current rules by the Spanish Real Academia), "Induráin" should be spelt with an accent. This may not have always been the case because I remember older rules used to have exceptions for names of Catalan or Basque origin with unusual endings (like, say, "Milans" or "Bernabeu"). I don't know if names like "Induráin" or "Beguiristáin" were ever exempted from being accented by the Real Academia rules, but certainly the current rules no longer contemplate any exceptions. "Induráin" is stressed in the last syllable, which is "rain" (because of the diphthong), and it ends with an "n", so an accent on top of the "a" is required. There is, however, a valid rationale for spelling it without an accent, which is the fact that this surname is of Basque origin, and if we follow the spelling rules of Basque, then it should have no accent. This is a tricky question, but I would say that we should treat his surname as Spanish since his official name, and the one he apparently uses himself, is "Miguel" in Spanish, rather than "Mikel" (some Basque newspapers used to refer to him as "Mikel Indurain", using his Basque name, though). But unless anyone can prove that he prefers to be called by his Basque name, I think this article should be kept as "Miguel Induráin". For those who are interested, this interesting article in Spanish discusses the treatment of Catalan, Basque and Galician names in the Spanish media, and mentions the Induráin/Indurain controversy. --AngelRiesgo 22:50, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Yesterday I brought up this issue at the Spanish Wikipedia's Village Pump, after realising that the article there uses the spelling without an accent. In the discussion that followed, it was pointed out that his name is spelt as "Miguel Indurain Larraya" in his personal website. That seems to prove that he prefers to spell it like that, so I have to change my position on this. If he spells it "Indurain", then we should respect that. --AngelRiesgo 10:07, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

Ángel
His personal website does not have the Ángel name. Are you sure? --Error 02:48, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Miguelón?
Someone replaced "Big Mig" with "Miguelón" - I'm not familiar with the latter nickname... GregorB 21:47, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
 * It was used in Spain. It was so popular that a cranium found in Atapuerca around that time was nicknamed Miguelón. --Error 01:18, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Is his nickname not "Flaxplutzine"?
End of the first paragraph: "...which earned him the nickname 'Miguelón'". This is a meaningless sentence. "Miguelón" has no meaning in English, so there is no connection between this group of letters and the discussion of his size. ...or do Basque/Spanish cyclists get more letters according to their height? And it is significant that this horse of a man has earned an eight letter name? Give me a hint. It is Spanish or Basque? (Looks Spanish). I give up, please clarify. Gronky 12:58, 28 December 2006 (UTC) It's Spanish. The "ón" attached to "Miguel" is an augmentative suffix that has colloquial and affectionate connotations. Roughly translated it would be "Big Miguel" in english. Gnipahellir 10:42, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

VO2 max
This page claims it is 88 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VO2_max#VO2_max_Levels claims it is 96 for Miguel Indurain I hope someone who is interested but more knowledgable than me, can reconcile this. Cheers! Phil —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)
 * It's 88. I think VO2max gets it wrong, I've never seen the 96 figure for Indurain. Will mark it with fact. GregorB 23:44, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

smile
For us who remember him, his smile while riding was very famous, posters of him with the peculiar grimace being sold. I think it's worth mentioning in the article. --User:Euyyn
 * A photo would be even better, if anyone has one which Wikipedia could use! SeveroTC 11:57, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Needs an additional section on his training technique
A useful section would be one about his training technique which allowed to achieve a resting heart rate of 29 beats per minute. Winning500 22:02, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

Delgado comment
The article says: "In 1992 fans reported overhearing him say "Mi bano es su bano" after big stages concluded especially to fellow countryman and domestique extraordinaire, Pedro Delgado" Is P.D., winner of the TdF ja twice winner of the Veulta, really considered a "domestique extraordinaire" in some circles? 82.181.150.151 20:24, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, Perico Delgado is (with good reason) the most popular Spanish Cyclist in the last 30 years, second only to Indurain. 128.195.56.102 23:08, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

"Mi bano es su bano"
That sentence has no meaning at all in Spanish. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)
 * I'm guessing it should say baño, although it's quite odd... I'm changing it. Pablodiazgutierrez 23:09, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
 * for those of us who dont speak spanish what does it mean? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)
 * It means "My bath is your bath", why would he say that after a race? I still don't get it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 89.128.4.223 (talk) 14:25, July 30, 2007

In Spanish he stated, "My bathroom is your bathroom". I presume he meant it as a sign of friendship to other riders. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.76.80.122 (talk) 21:10, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

5 Tours Wins and Almost Nothing About Them
I know we have individual articles about each tour but come on, at least add a little meat about his tour wins or time trial expertise. 69.150.59.88 (talk) 02:42, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Everyone is free to add this. --EdgeNavidad (talk) 09:44, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Criticism
This article is terrible. As it stands, it is nothing more than a hagiography. It contains only unfettered praise and not an ounce of criticism. What's more, most of the praise seems to be entirely unsourced and nothing more than the writer's opinion. This is not encyclopaedic, it is a fanzine. BearAllen (talk) 10:25, 31 March 2010 (UTC)
 * You're free to modify the article as you see fit, and remove or tag any inaccurate 'praise' or add any valid criticism. Bear in mind, however, it stands to reason that if you aren't knowledgeable enough on the subject matter to provide sourced criticism, you probably lack the credentials to evaluate the merit of the information in the article. Just a thought. --71.234.195.17 (talk) 23:52, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

To the first point - no, I do not feel qualified to write an entire article about Indurain, nor do I have the inclination. Also, it is not a question of removing individual points. In my opinion, the entire article lacks balance.

To the second point, I do not agree. I know enough about Indurain, and professional cycling in his era, to be aware a significant amount of criticism of him exists, none of which is even touched upon. Even if I had no knowledge of him, or any cyclist, I would only have to read the article to note the reverential tone and lack of sourcing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.104.59.154 (talk) 17:02, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

I agree with BearAllen's comment above. I find the section "Physical attributes" particularly questionable. Its source for MI's alleged superior physics is the very institute that has been credited with introducing EPO in international cycling (see the wikipedia articles on EPO and Francesco Conconi for more on this). At the same time the article does not mention any of the doping allegations that has been brought against MI. I do not have sufficient knowledge to edit the article myself, but I have added a POV-tag. -NW — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.111.79.158 (talk) 01:42, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

Tidy and expansion
I've done my best to tidy and expand the article, and to remove the hagliography. If you can suggest anything else, I'll see if I can do it. If not, maybe someone else? Les woodland (talk) 15:54, 10 November 2010 (UTC)les woodland
 * I have added some things, mainly about his early years. I think his 1992 and 1993 Giro wins deserve some more prose. One problem I had: "Indurain took two months to consider his future, particularly the seven million pesetas (€4.5 million)". €4.5 million corresponds to roughly 700 million pesetas, so one of these numbers must be wrong, but I don't have access to the sources to find out what is right. --EdgeNavidad (Talk · Contribs) 11:44, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

I think the euro figure is probably the more accurate. Since it certainly is inaccurate to leave both figures - thanks for the observation, incidentally - I'll delete the pesetas and leave it to anyone who knows better. Les woodland (talk) 06:24, 19 November 2010 (UTC)les woodland

Number of tour de france's stage won
It is said in the article that he only won a few stages, but I remember some mountain stages where he clearly let other competiters won the stage while retaining the yellow jersey. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.7.24.150 (talk) 11:12, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

L'Équipe, France, July 2004
From where comes this reference? In a Google search I only find it at en:WP and some blogs. L'Équipe is a French journal I know but we must believe it because is written in WP? In electro-physiology 28 bpm a sinusal rhythm at rest is strange because AV-node would take the control of heart rate at a rate 40-60... 28bmp is His-Purkinge rate which permits life in supine position. I would like to understand better. Doc Elisa ✉ 11:24, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

........" took "...... - and " 28 BPM ?
Physical attributes Indurain had a physiology superior to fellow athletes, according to the Ferrara institute. His blood took seven litres of oxygen around his body per minute,[28] compared to 3–4 litres for an ordinary person and 5–6 litres for fellow riders. His cardiac output was 50 litres a minute; a fit amateur cyclist's is about 25 litres. Indurain's lung capacity was 7.8 litres,[2] compared to an average of 6 litres. His resting pulse was as low as 28 BPM,[2] Q. Surely this: " His blood took seven litres of oxygen around his body per minute " " took " - should it be pumped. Also 28 BPM is very low. I heard Tour de France commintators saying he had BMP of 48 or 49 at rest. And over 200 BPM Max. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.183.246.19 (talk) 23:18, 26 December 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Miguel Indurain. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110311044743/http://www.memoire-du-cyclisme.net/palmares/indurain_miguel.php to http://www.memoire-du-cyclisme.net/palmares/indurain_miguel.php

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot  (Report bug) 04:29, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

Again about the accent
Hi. Miguel Induráin Larraya writes his name with accent, like you can see at its fountation page: Greetings from the President, and in the cover of this authorised biography. He prefers orthographic rules of the Spanish language, instead ot that of the basque language. In WP:ES we moved the article to Miguel Induráin with accent. Can someone move the article, please? Thank you. Pompilos (talk) 22:17, 3 September 2017 (UTC)

Donati was a cheater.
therefore his statements have no value, and above all they are not criticism, but opinions. 151.16.37.196 (talk) 12:31, 15 August 2022 (UTC)