Talk:Mihai Suba

Name
This guy lives in England, and writes in English. The name of the author, in the book he wrote, is Mihai Suba. Gene Nygaard (talk) 03:44, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

My name in Romanian is Mihai Şubă (sounds like "Shuber") The lack of diacritics in English makes the spelling Suba. Some English editors use the original spelling (for signs included in the Central Europe code map). The citizenship has little to do with the residence, I always was Romanian. The country one represents has also little to do with both citizenship and residence. A few years I represented England and after the changes in Eastern Europe I represented Romania (since 1992, to date) MS —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.31.208.154 (talk) 02:13, 12 March 2009 (UTC)

Improper page moves by User:Husond
See Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents. Gene Nygaard (talk) 14:19, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

British or Romanian citizen
Does anyyone know the status of citizenship. Was assuming from the sentence 'sought political asylum in Britain' that he was British however the edit from Husond implies otherwise. SunCreator (talk) 16:26, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
 * If he was born in Romania, has a Romanian name and is listed as a Romanian player, then I guess we should assume he's a Romanian citizen unless proved otherwise. Hús  ö  nd  18:58, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't think we should assume anything, but rather try and establish some facts. SunCreator (talk) 19:09, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Romanian citizenship is acquired by birth, which means that this person either is a Romanian or was a Romanian. Therefore, if he no longer is a Romanian, we should have a source for that. Because unless that information surfaces, people have no reason to presume that he's no longer Romanian. I think it's common sense. Hús  ö  nd  19:21, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Citizenship isn't the issue here. Gene Nygaard (talk) 13:12, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Husond's skirting of the three-revert rule
Husond has skirted the three-revert rule by making his third revert in six hours,   and then in the very same minute as his last reversion going to [Wikipedia:Requests for page protection]] and requesting that his version be protected (gaming the system to his advantage what he knows from handing such requests on a regular basis).

Even that has some appearances of collusion beforehand. Within five minutes of his request, before Husond even there were two different editors who protected the page (one of them three times)—one of them before Husond decided to reword the request he had just written, four minutes later. There might, of course, be a perfectly logical explanation, but that is not the norm for those requested moves, and there wasn't much time for any editor granting the protection to make an independent investigation fo the circumstances.

After making his second revert, Husond has added a source with the "Mihai Şuba" spelling in the Romanian language. Still no evidence whatsoever of the use of anything other than "Mihai Suba" in the English language, anywhere untainted by Wikipedia.

That is sufficient to get the variant spelling included in the article, and probably in the lead section. But that is all that has been established so far. We still need to name the article by the name in which he is best known in English, and that name is the name under which he authored his English-language book, and the name by which he is known in at least the vast majority, if not all, of the English language sources which have not taken their information from the misleading pages of Wikipedia. Gene Nygaard (talk) 13:12, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Krakatoa's statement
Hmm, I appear to have quite accidentally ignited World War III. I was the original author of the article in question. Husond notified me on my talk page of the resulting controversy. In case anyone cares about my views and the genesis of my use of "Şuba" rather than "Suba," this is what happened. I wrote the article First move advantage in chess and cited therein a book by Mr. _uba. I have a copy of that book, "Dynamic Chess Strategy" by Mihai Suba (that's how it's spelled on the title and cover page). I accordingly spelled the name "Suba" in First move advantage in chess. Upon seeing a redlink in the article, I searched Wikipedia for "Mihai Suba" and found that there was no article on him, but that he was mentioned (as "Mihai Şuba") in the article on the Romanian Chess Championship. Knowing how obsessive people are about proper punctuation of names and not wanting to offend anyone (Hah! Silly me!), I wrote the article on "Mihai Şuba" and went back and changed my spelling of the name in First move advantage in chess. Gene Nygaard promptly went ballistic and moved the article from Mihai Şuba to Mihai Suba; evidently Husong went counter-ballistic and changed it back. FWIW, all the sources I saw, other than the Romanian Chess Championship article here on Wikipedia, used "Suba" rather than "Şuba." I don't really give a @#$%, myself, about the resolution of this tempest in a teapot. Krakatoa (talk) 02:48, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Copied here from Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents by  Jonathunder (talk)


 * Thanks for the explanation. No quibbles with Krakatoa's descriptions of his own actions, but of mine.


 * On 14 April, I merely fixed the article's name, and simply explained why I did so on its talk page. I did not go ballistic until 18 April, when Husond cam to my talk page, threatening to block me for this to keep me from reverting his move back. Just like him to use his admin tools as a lever to try to gain the upper hand in a content dispute, threatening a block in a dispute in which he is involved. And he did so with addressing the reasons addressed on the talk page.  It was only then that  I erupted (pun intended, Krakatoa). Gene Nygaard (talk) 16:10, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

It seems to me the way to move forward here on this article and getting it unprotected is to focus on what sources have as the subject's name as typically given in English, rather than on who did what. I realize there may be grievances there, but on this talk page, let's move forward. Jonathunder (talk) 23:31, 20 April 2008 (UTC)


 * All the English-language sources I'm aware of use "Suba", including Suba's own book, published in English (not a translation). It's clear that "Suba" is preferred in English, just as Gene Nygaard pointed out. Quale (talk) 02:55, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you, Quale. I agree. That the author himself uses this in his book is persuasive. Jonathunder (talk) 03:49, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Moved back to Mihai Suba
I have moved the page back to the title without diacritics. In the section above, the comments are against having diacrtics in the title, but Mycomp bade the move anyway some months later. Also objectively, applying WP:USEENGLISH appears to support the diacritic free title:
 * The use of modified letters (such as accents or other diacritics) in article titles is neither encouraged nor discouraged; when deciding between versions of a word which differ in the use or non-use of modified letters, follow the general usage in reliable sources that are written in the English language (including other encyclopedias and reference works).

I Googled "Mihai Suba" with and without the diacritics, and the only English sources using the diacritics were Wikipedia and its mirrors. In addition, the books that have been authored by Suba (Dynamic Chess Strategy, The Hedgehog, and Positional Chess Sacrifices) give the author as Mihai Suba without diacritics. So, the "usage in reliable sources that are written in the English language" are unanimously (not only generally) without the diacritics. Sjakkalle (Check!)  18:51, 24 April 2012 (UTC)


 * I made the change to index of chess articles. It is important that the listing there be exactly the same as the title of the actual article, not a redirect.  The reason is that "recent changes" to the index show changes to that exact article.  We want that to show changes to the actual article, not changes to a redirect page. Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 20:11, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for that fix! I have gone ahead and removed the diacritics from the other article-space articles as well. Not for any technical reason, but because nobody, including Suba himself, uses the diacritics on his name in any English source outside of Wikipedia or its mirrors. Sjakkalle (Check!)  05:05, 25 April 2012 (UTC)