Talk:Minnie Pwerle

Links to commercial galleries
People regularly attach links to commercial galleries selling the works of Australian Indigenous artists to the WP entries about these artists. As a rule, this is not consistent with WP policy. Unless someone wants to come up with a compelling argument otherwise, I will continue to edit these links out of pages such as that for M Pwerle. For an outline of the policy see: Links to be avoided Please discuss here if you think this isn't the right approach. hamiltonstone 09:06, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Pronunciation guidance
I've removed the guidance on pronunciation of Atnwengerrp ' (pronounced a-NOONG-a-pa)' as it really isn't accurate -- where did it come from? I'm not sure it's a good idea to try to give pronunciations of words which contain sounds (or sequences of sounds) which are going to be entirely new to English speakers -- a more accurate one would be 'a-tnoo-ngurrp' but I doubt it helps much. I'll try to put an IPA representation there. It would also be good to have an audio file of a native speaker saying it, but that might be difficult to obtain. Anyway I'm afraid there's no way around it, people who are unfamiliar with Arandic languages are going to find it difficult or impossible to pronounce, much as with Emily Kngwarreye's name. Dougg (talk) 08:30, 3 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Though now I think of it, orthography info at the Anmatyerre and Alyawarr language pages (with a link from difficult words like this one) wouldn't hurt. Dougg (talk) 08:34, 3 July 2009 (UTC)

Post FA issues
The article was promoted to FA, but in the FA discussion Ucucha raised some issues, which I am reproducing in italics here, since the FA discussion is now archived, and providing some responses.
 * If there are so many estimates of her date of birth, why do you only put the c. 1915 one in the lead and the persondata?
 * I felt that all of these are estimates and including the various dates in summary locations (such as the lead) would add clutter without really adding valuable information. hamiltonstone (talk) 01:48, 4 August 2010 (UTC)


 * I would have put in the lead that Utopia is in the Northern Territory.
 * Agreed and done. hamiltonstone (talk) 01:48, 4 August 2010 (UTC)


 * An actual normal map would be better than a handwritten one.
 * Yes, but I don't know how to create maps, and actually generating one that delineates Utopia station might be quite difficult (not the sort of thing that, eg, Google Maps appears to include). But if there's anyone out there who can make such an improvement, i'd be happy to see it. hamiltonstone (talk) 01:48, 4 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Updated map has been added. Summerdrought (talk) 06:05, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks. hamiltonstone (talk) 01:48, 4 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Congratulations on the FA and thanks for the diligence in replying to my comments. I'd like to comment again on the first one, though. I agree that we can't put all estimates in the lead and the persondata, but why choose the one you chose? How is it inherently better than another? Perhaps you can put in a range instead. Ucucha 05:36, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Fair use image
I believe currently used in the article needs to be shrunk to meet fair use protocol. Its 2,500 by 2,000 currently. AaronY (talk) 13:37, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
 * I have shrunk the image. AaronY (talk) 11:31, 27 November 2010 (UTC)

Photo? Where's the photo?
It seems strange that a biography wouldn't have a photo. I've seen photos of Minnie online. Is there some sort of problem? Could I upload a photo under Fair Use?? Mr. Harman (talk) 23:35, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm not aware of any free-use images of her. A fair use image would rely on meeting the fair use criteria. I wasn't sure that it would, but didn't explore that much. Which brings me to the other issue - Indigenous people can be distressed by seeing images of deceased ancestors. I had felt an image wasn't essential to the bio, so I avoided tackling that issue. But if you believe you can satisfy the non-free use criteria and can locate a suitable image, i expect it would be considered acceptable. hamiltonstone (talk) 23:47, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks! I saw one photo when I did a search.  Let me check my time budget.  : )  Mr. Harman (talk) 00:52, 27 November 2010 (UTC)


 * If there is no free use images than a fair use image can be used. As for distressing Indiginous people, that is irrelevent.  The aim of this page is to write the best article possible, not to pander to the sensetivities of different groups.  Wikipedia is not censored. Mtaylor848 (talk) 13:09, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, gee, thanks for that thoughtful contribution. The question of censorship is not relevant to this discussion - I suggest you look up a definition of the term. Building a good encyclopedia is our goal - which involves weighing up lots of factors. Incidentally, you seem to have ignored how I ended my post, which indicated that I anticipated that including an image would be considered acceptable. The inclusion of any non-free image will need to meet NFCC#8: "Non-free content is used only if its presence would significantly increase readers' understanding of the topic, and its omission would be detrimental to that understanding." Given that the article makes no reference to the artist's visual appearance, I don't know whether this criterion could be met. Contrast this with the situation at Makinti Napanangka, also an FA about an indigenous artist, and also lacking a photo of the artist, but with text that refers to her "infectious smile" and to her sitting as the subject of a portrait. As Makinti is still alive, non-free image use is ruled out, but in the event that she dies, I think those text references to her appearance would help support inclusion under NFCC#8. Whether editors would choose to do so, bearing in mind Indigenous sensitivities around iamges of the dead, would be up to the community. No-one is going to "censor" it - it would be matter of wiki-community judgement whether it benefitted the encyclopedia more than it cost. It would be helpful if everyone approached the issue with some care and sensitivity. hamiltonstone (talk) 22:00, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

External links modified
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I have just modified 3 external links on Minnie Pwerle. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.smh.com.au/news/arts/hightech-battle-against-fakes/2007/04/15/1176575681460.html
 * Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.theage.com.au/news/arts-reviews/the-pwerle-sisters/2006/02/17/1140151801265.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080719114739/http://www.mbantua.com.au/artists.php?artist=25 to http://www.mbantua.com.au/artists.php?artist=25

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External links modified
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I have just modified one external link on Minnie Pwerle. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20101101184244/http://www.aph.gov.au/Senate/committee/ecita_ctte/completed_inquiries/2004-07/indigenous_arts/report/index.htm to http://www.aph.gov.au/senate/committee/ecita_ctte/completed_inquiries/2004-07/indigenous_arts/report/index.htm

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This article does not say anything about her years on the Grand Ole Opry. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.98.222.33 (talk) 04:34, 6 May 2022 (UTC)