Talk:Miss Cleo

Source for the character "Miss Cleo"
At present the article has "The Psychic Readers Network is said to have coined the title 'Miss Cleo'" and cites I checked the web sites goerie.com and timespublishingcompany.com for "Phone psychics' scam follows script" or "Miss Cleo" but neither of them has this article on line.

The puzzle is this seattlepi.com article which says "Back then, she was known as Ree Perris and had written a play called 'For Women Only.' In it, Perris played a Jamaican woman named Cleo." If that's accurate then Youree Harris created the character and the Psychic Readers Network adopted it.

For now, I decided to not update the article as I'd want to see better sourcing for who developed the character. At one time the Psychic Readers Network seems to have owned the rights to it.

FWIW, the same seattlepi.com article says she was also known as Ree Perris, Youree Cleomili, Youree Dell Harris, Youree Perris, Rae Dell Harris, Cleomili Perris Youree, Cleomili Harris, and finally, well known as Miss Cleo. --Marc Kupper&#124;talk 20:13, 5 February 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 4 December 2022



 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

No consensus to move. After much-extended time for discussion, there is no consensus for a move at this time, and no reason to believe that a consensus will form if discussion is extended further. BD2412 T 23:53, 31 December 2022 (UTC)

Miss Cleo → Youree Dell Harris – Proposing rename because the article is about actress/media personality Youree Dell Harris, and "Miss Cleo" is essentially a character she frequently played. I don't think it would fall under WP:COMMONNAME and WP:PSEUDONYM because Miss Cleo wasn't a stage name she could freely use, it was a character created and owned by Psychic Readers Network who Harris was hired to play, and her other credits like voice over have been under her real name. In recent high quality entertainment sources like EW, it refers to the portrayer as Youree Dell Harris and Miss Cleo as a character. For another precedent for a performer primarily known for one character, Cassandra Peterson's article is not named Elvira. --Shivertimbers433 (talk) 23:06, 4 December 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. – robertsky (talk) 16:40, 15 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Support per nom.--Ortizesp (talk) 14:43, 5 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Miss Cleo is what's notable; Youree Harris is only notable because of Miss Cleo.  If we want to make a separate article for Youree Harris the person, that's fine, but I suspect it may fail WP:N. I'd rewrite the article from this point of view, something like "Miss Cleo was a spokeswoman for psychic pay-per-call service Psychic Readers Network, portrayed by Youree Dell Harris in a series of television commercials that aired from 1997 to 2003." 162 etc. (talk) 17:53, 5 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Support per Cassandra Peterson, Larry Vincent. Those are actors who portrayed a character, but their articles are biographies of the actor, like this is a biography of Harris. For a character, we can see how articles like Flo (Progressive) have no biographical detail of the actor. I don't think there's enough content to justify separate pages for Harris and Miss Cleo, but I could be mistaken. – Muboshgu (talk) 20:45, 6 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Support per Muboshgu. Shwcz (talk) 15:54, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Support per nom, Muboshgu, and my 2015 comments at Talk:Miss_Cleo/Archive_2. ~  ONUnicorn (Talk&#124;Contribs) problem solving 17:39, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose. We should keep this at Miss Cleo because it is the well established WP:COMMONNAME - Google search indicates 19,600,000 results for "Miss Cleo" compared to  39,900 results for "Youree Dell Harris" (most of which say stuff like Miss Cleo ... real name was Youree Dell Harris, Miss Cleo ... Born Youree Dell Harris, etc). And per WP:STAGENAME: "The name used most often to refer to a person in reliable sources is generally the one that should be used as the article title, even if it is not the person's "real" name". There is nobody else who played Miss Cleo, and Harris is widely known by that name - her obituaries are essentially for Miss Cleo. Harris is notable for being Miss Cleo, and that is what most readers will be looking for, as is made clear by PageView Analysis: |Miss_Cleo - Youree Dell Harris was created in July 2006, and has attracted 534 views since then; Miss Cleo, which was created only two years earlier than Youree Dell Harris, has attracted 1,608,633 page views. Miss Cleo attracts an average of 591 views a day, which is more than Youree Dell Harris has attracted in 16 years. Per policy, guideline, usage, principle of least astonishment, and plain common sense, this article should remain at Miss Cleo. SilkTork (talk) 18:28, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Support per others above and consistency with articles such as Flo (character). This is about the actress, not the character. We have it at Phil McGraw not Dr. Phil, we have Mehmet Oz not Dr. Oz, etc. cookie monster   755  02:16, 16 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. VideōEtCorrigō (talk) 02:31, 16 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose - the persona is the notable topic here. -- Netoholic @ 07:09, 16 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose per above. And call me now! Rreagan007 (talk) 20:45, 16 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose per above as well. We know Miss Cleo. We were never introduced to Youree, and most people don't even know that is her birth name. GuinanTheListener (talk) 16:40, 21 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Youree Dell Harris is only notable because of "Miss Cleo", the "persona" in  Psychic Readers Network infomercials .... 0mtwb9gd5wx (talk) 02:03, 27 December 2022 (UTC)
 * pageviews: Youree_Dell_Harris; Miss_Cleo; Psychic_Readers_Network; .... 0mtwb9gd5wx (talk) 11:28, 26 December 2022 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.