Talk:MissingNo./Archive 1

MissingNo.'s moves
Does MissingNo. have any moves in Red and Blue? I only got the Yellow version from the first generation. GamerPro64 (talk) 22:22, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
 * He'll have two Water Gun moves and Sky Attack, and can learn from a list of TMs/HMs. I didn't mention this though because none of the sources I've found have noted any of that. :\--Kung Fu Man (talk) 22:33, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

C-Class assessment
Following your request, Kung Fu Man, I'm going to assess this as C-Class and recommend not submitting it to a GAR review; I think it will have issues with points two and three. Here are some reasons why:
 * My biggest issue is probably with sources. Not having a fair number of the books in front of me, I can't verify their statements, so I'll avoid those discussions.  But as examples,
 * Does the Pokechat source really prove that the '99 issue of Nintendo Power was the first time it was documented? Or just the first time Nintendo acknowledged it?  Either way, there should be an inline citation there.
 * There really should be more inline citations in the whole "History" section.
 * "...the glitch has had a lasting impact"
 * The Playing with Videogames book needs more than just one link.
 * It's a hard, thin line to tread, but there are major issues of whether MNo is a glitch or a pokémon. Now, clearly, it's both, but it isn't defined anywhere as both, and the name is getting used interchangeably.  Having discovered it myself I can read it fine, but non-experts may have issues.  Especially noticeable in the lead and in the "Characteristics" section (which, as roughly 1/3 of the article, definitely detracts from the overall quality).
 * "...the sixth item in the player's item menu will be increased from it's current value to 255..." That ref actually says it makes 128 copies, not 255.
 * The fanpic isn't free (not beer) and I don't think it's necessary to the article - simply referencing the page in the book would, imo, be sufficient. A picture of a bird, with no context (basic readers won't get the Normal/Bird connection), is very far removed from the topic at hand.

Anyway, those are some reasons I don't think it's ready for GAR, not a criticism of it overall although it did influence my grading. It's a great piece of work, and I feel it's really close to B-Class, but doesn't fulfill "suitably referenced" and "defined structure." You (and others) have put some really excellent work into this, it looks great! Amory  (user • talk • contribs) 06:30, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Alrighty, took awhile but I think I nailed everything you mentioned.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 09:39, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

History
The first part of the 'history' subsection is probably redundant. Perhaps history of the programming error (i.e. background) is useful but history of pokemon (e.g."the Pokémon franchise revolves around the concept of capturing and training various species of creatures called Pokémon, and using them to battle other wild Pokémon or those of other "Pokémon Trainers", other human players or non-player characters within the game") has nothing to do with the phenomenon known as missingno. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Yili2943 (talk • contribs) 14:18, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Still, it helps a reader who may not be familiar with Pokémon understand this concept. That's why I think the sentence is necessary.  Artichoker [ talk  ] 15:15, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree with Yili that it seems a bit out of place, but also with Artichoker that it is a necessary addition. Perhaps we could somehow squeeze it into the lead? MelicansMatkin (talk) 16:13, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Do it how it's done in the lead with every other Pokémon species article. Tezkag72 (talk) 16:36, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Well I think I fixed the problem. Given the year first before stating what the paragraph is about threw it off, since the reader would immediately expect it to be about MissingNo. Does it flow better now?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 17:31, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

MissingNo. picture
Does anyone think that this is a good picture to show what MissingNo. looks like? GamerPro64 (talk) 20:02, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I've only seen the top left one in the games, but if it appears in all those forms then they should all be included.  The Le ft orium  20:06, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Nevermind, I agree with the comments below, though I think it should be mentioned in the article that the glitch appears in Pokémon Yellow as well.  The Le ft orium  20:25, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, the image in the article should use "the most common" version seen. Most people without the assistance of cheat devices generally never see the versions using the fossil or ghost sprites, and the Yellow version is even rarer. I'd really say leave it as is or add the image to the prose, but even with the latter the yellow version seems horribly out of place. There's nothing even documenting that one that we can cite, so how do we explain it in the prose?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 20:10, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Why not just say something like "The various forms of MissingNo. (l-r): Block, Yellow, Aerodactyl fossil, Kabutops fossil, Ghost."? MelicansMatkin (talk) 20:20, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * (Edit conflict) All those forms are possible sprites for MissingNo., but the image we currently have is the most commonly occuring one. There's only one sentence currently mentioning the alternate forms, and none of them are described in detail. The above image may be a bit confusing to readers at the moment unless the prose is expanded a bit more to contain those details. Perhaps keep the current image as the main one, and add the above to the "Characteristics" section with an appropriate caption? (Fair-use depending; I'm not too hot on my image policies and whether that would be okay or not). MelicansMatkin (talk) 20:11, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

I like that idea. GamerPro64 (talk) 20:21, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I'd like someone who is more knowledgeable about our fair-use policies and other image policies to comment first before any possible implementation. MelicansMatkin (talk) 20:25, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * What do you mean? Both images are pretty much indentical in their current Fair-Use rationale.  The only difference is that the amalgam seems to indicate that copyright is indefinite.  I'd favor the current one as it is the form easily and most recognized, but including the picture of all five would:
 * Be more correct
 * Encourage us to expand and edit the article to encompass more full coverage
 * (Disclaimer: IANAL, although I do have experience in the IP Law field) Now, since these aren't free, we should err on the side of safety. The compilation picture is usually preferable over individual ones, but since this one appears to be a photoshopped(?), user-created image, it counts as five, not one.  Still, I think we need more thorough coverage of the other forms of MNo, and if we have it in the article, that increases the justification for having that image.  Our best support for either of these images is that, as a glitch, the pictures provide solid, visual representations of that status for (hopefully) critical examination that would be hard without an image.  Moreover, neither image appears to be harming Nintendo's ability to earn a profit.  I do feel, however, that the current image should have the text, Ash, and pokéballs excised; doing so would boost its IP credibility. ~ Amory  (user • talk • contribs) 04:24, 10 June 2009 (UTC)
 * To clarify, what I meant is that Wikipedia prefers articles to use as few fair-use images as possible. While including one of the images would not be terrible because there is no free alternative, it may be determined by others that having both is an excessive amount of fair-use images. It's the same rationale that has limited each Pokemon video game article to dsplay just one of the generational boxarts. I just want to err on the side of caution, hence my asking for feedback from other editors who are more knowledgable about the display of fair-use images. MelicansMatkin (talk) 04:31, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Lvl 140 Randomz
Has anyone else had experiences of strange Pokemon preceding Missingno? The Pokemon before Missingno is usually a Level 140 Rapidash or Snorlax, with power exceeding that of a level 100, although it reverts to level 100 when it is leveled up. This is a notable associated glitch, and it should be integrated in there somewhere. Wild Lvl 140 User appeared! It's 2D Backfire Master (talk) 02:01, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
 * The type of Pok[e]mon depends on the player's name. For example "DxDyDx" will yield level 254, 255, and 256 Mewtwos. However, I don't think the glitch is as notable, and rather irrelevant to Missingno. unless supporting sources can be found.  Artichoker [ talk  ] 16:02, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Whatever the wild overleveled Pokemon is, it still shows that the glitch is becoming activated. The Pokemon appear almost directly before the Msgno, and it must have something to do with it. If you can mention the after-effects, you can say other related ripples caused by the glitch. Level 200 = Ripple. Simple. 2D Backfire Master (talk) 19:24, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
 * ...Did you read my comment in full? Provide reliable, supporting sources and then this discussion may bear fruit.  Artichoker [ talk  ] 19:27, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
 * LOL After leveling up at 255, it will become 256, but since it has 8 bits, it becomes 0. --116.14.183.192 (talk) 12:52, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
 * If your name is D早DxDy, it will yield a Level 245, 254 and 255 Mewtwo. 早 is a female sign, I could not get it in emoji. --116.14.183.192 (talk) 12:58, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

MissingNo. the Substitute
Hello. I mentioned I would leave something on the Talk page, so I might as well chime in. It's possible to photograph MissingNo. in Pokemon Stadium 1, and in this game, it has the same form as the move "Substitute" as performed in the game. I know this because I tried it a while ago, but I don't remember 100%. I know it works only in 1 because 2 lacks the photograph mode. If possible to source it, would you like to mention it? Hurricane Angel Saki (talk) 05:52, 13 June 2009 (UTC)
 * If we can find a reliable source, I don't see why it shouldn't be added. MelicansMatkin (talk) 14:14, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

File:Missingno-ny.png

 * '''The image has been listed for discussion here. Please refrain from further comments at the current page, in order to keep the discussion centralized. All participants are welcome to make a statement at the NFCR entry linked above, but please keep it brief since we have already said our piece here and we want to leave room for uninvolved editors to voice their opinions. Thank you, r ʨ anaɢ talk/contribs 01:34, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

It looks like the AfD for this has essentially been withdrawn; I don't see how this image meets fair-use criteria, though, and am tempted to re-nom it for a new reason (the original AfD reason was just because of another similar image, and didn't address fair-use issues). The image doesn't "illustrate the missingno phenomenon" (as the NFUR claims); File:Missingno.gif at the top of the article does, but this image just shows some of the forms missingno apparently takes sometimes. Three of those images are, as far as I know, the same as existing Pokemon, and the other is already shown in the image at the top of the article&mdash;thus, this image could be replaced, with no loss to the reader, by a text description. r ʨ anaɢ talk/contribs 18:50, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree. This piece of information in the Characteristics section is enough: "When viewed, it will commonly appear as a scrambled "d" shaped rectangle, though certain encounter values will result in a MissingNo. with the appearance of one of three 64×64 pixel sprites used elsewhere in the game."  The Le ft ori um  18:57, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually none of those are used for existing pokemon (two are shown when you examine fossils in the game's museum, the ghost is encountered in the Lavender Town tower when you lack the Silph Scope). Stating "Kabutops fossil found in Pokemon Museum" means absolutely nothing to someone unfamiliar with the game without having to explain a lot of nn details, and could potentially cripple the article during a FAC.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 19:01, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Ok, so not actual pokemon, but still other images from the game. A rewording such as TheLeftorium's is just what I was suggesting; if more specificity is need, something along the lines of "the sprites that can appear include the Kaputops fossil found in the Pokemon museum, the ghosts encountered in Lavender Town before the character acquires the Silph Scope, and [etc.]". r ʨ anaɢ talk/contribs 19:12, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Well that's still comes across as a lot of name dropping for folks that might be unfamiliar with the series. They're not going to know what Lavender Tower is or the significance of the Silph Scope (I got a little liberal with this sort of thing for Reptile and it sure as heck got brought up during the peer review).--Kung Fu Man (talk) 19:20, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * That's why I suggested putting it in a footnote. The main text would be "one of three 64×64 pixel sprites used elsewhere in the game", which is plenty of description for a normal reader and just as informative as the pictures (also note that, to an unfamiliar reader, the pictures don't make it clear that these are sprites used elsewhere in the game, so in a way the picture is even less informative than text). For knowledgeable readers who really want to know which ones are used, they can follow the footnote, but the detailed information can be kept out of the way of the main article text which needs to flow nicely and not be bogged down with in-game details. r ʨ anaɢ talk/contribs 19:24, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah, but look at that: you're suggesting nixing an image that conveys the forms of the thing and has some significance to the depictions argument in the article and relatively straightforward, to a footnote that includes a bunch of text using names casual readers unfamiliar with Pokemon won't understand? Being in a footnote won't make it any easier on readers, and possibly the contrary when considered from their view. I'm interested to see what others say though.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 19:29, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Ok, linked this discussion at WikiProject Video games and WikiProject Pokemon talk pages. r ʨ anaɢ talk/contribs 19:35, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * The image does not really go against fair use policy, however I do think the image that repeats the same garbled missingno on top should be removed and the caption changed to "other possible MissingNo forms". That might be the most controversial aspect as it is already shown at the top of the page. 陣 内 Jinnai 19:53, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Can you explain why you feel it doesn't go against fair-use policy? TheLeftorium and I stated above why we feel it does (specifically, that it's not necessary and that the same information can be conveyed as well, or better, by text).
 * As for the image at the top of the article...I actually feel that one is better than this one, and certainly meets fair-use criteria. It illustrates the actual situation of encountering the MissingNo glitch. r ʨ anaɢ talk/contribs 20:09, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think it's necessary, since the forms are basically the exact same as the Pokemon. You could just state the names of the Pokemon, and there is no need to demonstrate how they look because there is no identifiable difference. As for people not knowing how the Pokemon look, well, there's Google for that...--ZXCVBNM (TALK) 20:53, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * For someone who is more visually inclined it can prove more difficult to understand from text how you describe something, especially when it has multiple forms. Furthermore the image is also not very large, isn't self-serving, etc. If we have articles on those particular pokemon (or specific images of them), then that's another matter. However I believe they were all merged/deleted/redirected (with few exceptions) and only the group images remain. 陣 内 Jinnai 22:05, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I think I'll add my opinion that the lede image should be removed with this image to replace it. The first is the one that has little value in my opinion (zomg, missigno [missey-no :o] appeared). --Izno (talk) 23:32, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * But the lede image is only one non-free image, the other one is four. Plus, the lede image actually shows an encounter with missingno, which makes sense considering that this article is mainly about how/why it is encountered. r ʨ anaɢ</b> talk/contribs 23:39, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
 * There should only be one image in this article, that of the MissingNo glitch. As I said before, showing what Pokemon sprites it uses is irrelevant since they themselves are not glitched in any way.--ZXCVBNM (TALK) 23:55, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

I'm not really a big fan of non-free images, but I'd agree with Kung Fu Man. The thing that several people don't seem to grasp is that these graphics were not used for any actual Pokemon in the game. I do think it needs a much more descriptive caption, though. ▫  Johnny Mr Nin ja  00:14, 25 June 2009 (UTC) Furthermore if what User:JohnnyMrNinja says is true, then its more reason, though again, the first missingno image, which is a dupliate of the encounter version, should be removed. 陣 内 Jinnai 00:17, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Do we have a link to what a pokemon looks like normally otherwise? Someone who did not know much about Pokemon (hard to imagine, but those people exist), would not be able to tell from the top image what an encounter should look like.
 * I have to agree with Kung Fu Man. If you used text, it runs against the article because it's jargon. And even if you make notes of it, it's too non-notable to note that the fossils are found in the museum (and what's more, you have to pay to get in IIRC, so that's less people who want to go in) or that the ghosts in the tower are dispelled/revealed with the Silph Scope, and even at that, if you stay ONLY with the main plot of the game, only one of those four can be seen during the main plot, that being the ghost (the Marowak fight in the Lavender Tower starts with Marowak being in the "ghost" form). Having all four forms shows the "glitch" forms of a Pokemon "glitch", and while I agree the encounter pic shows the context of the encounter, the four scrolling forms shows the context that MissingNo has several forms, and that, in itself, is a glitch as well, since there's supposed to be only one form in the game per Pokemon. In general, I do not support the picture being removed, and DEFINENTLY don't support it being nommed for deletion. Hurricane Angel Saki (talk) 06:18, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
 * So, for the purpose of showing that a glitch has four forms, using four non-free images works and saying "the glitch shows up in four forms" doesn't? <b class="Unicode">r ʨ anaɢ</b> talk/contribs 12:11, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
 * At the very least that requires the visual representation of another one because as it stands its not clear that someone seeing the image at top and seeing that there are 3 other forms will think that they look normal. Even if you say they aren't glitched, there is still no idea based on garbled graphics what it would look like without assuming someone has played Pokemon red or green/blue. 陣 内 Jinnai 23:35, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think using actual company images is particularly useful in this case. SharkD (talk) 21:08, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

There seems to be no consensus here&mdash;more or less the same number of editors on both sides of the fence, and as far as I can tell both sides have equally convincing points (of course, I happen to agree with my own point, but I'm biased). I think the most productive thing to do now would be to list this at Non-free content review to get broader input from more experienced editors, if that's ok with everyone. I only ask that, if I do list it there, we refrain from continuing discussion here (in order to keep the discussion centralized), and try to only make brief statements over there since we have all pretty much said our piece here. Does this sound ok to everyone involved? <b class="Unicode">r ʨ anaɢ</b> talk/contribs 00:56, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Sounds fine. I would like it noted there have been a couple alternatives to complete removal/deletion proposed as well. 陣 内 Jinnai 01:06, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Ok, listed here. I'm closing off this discussion so that we don't end up with discussions spanning multiple pages. <b class="Unicode">r ʨ anaɢ</b> talk/contribs 01:34, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

wrong info
visit bulbapedia, and you will learnthat missingno. was in pokemon yellow. Lu-igi board (talk) 14:14, 5 July 2009 (UTC)
 * The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth.  The leftorium  14:34, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

A class assessment
The introductory sentence describing it as a pokemon rather than a glitch irks me. As does the pokemon species template. This is not a pokemon. It is a glitch, belonging in the Glitch dept and categories.

The first paragraph of the history section is of the good length, but the kind of summary it gives doesn't have to do much with the article. Introduce the franchise, the role of the video games within the franchise, and don't focus on the details of the gameplay too much. Needs a see also thingy too.

In "Characteristics", it is completely unclear what precisely is the first 'event' when the second 'event' is introduced, beyond that it has something to do with the location described near an island or so.

The full stop after MissingNo is incredibly annoying to a smooth read. I suggest removing it, it's common sense and Wikipedia does it elsewhere too. (For example, in trademarks with punctuation, the punctuation is usually dropped).

The language of the last paragraph on sociology is markedly different from the rest of the article, probably because it uses a lot of the (horrible) phraseology from the sources. Drop it, use common sense. "Hand drawn images, in turn inspiring creativity" .. made me laugh.

Not promoting pending changes. User:Krator (t c) 11:22, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Going to tackle the other bits later, but actually the article is treating it as a Pokemon, not a glitch. The glitch is what causes MissingNo. to appear and is being discussed in the same context here. Even Nintendo refers to MissingNo. as a pokemon in their troubleshooting and even the help line. So I really don't understand why you would have issue with it when official sources would back it up.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 11:29, 20 July 2009 (UTC)


 * As for the history bit, I'm wary about removing it because I could see it confusing people not familiar with the series' gameplay at all, especially when I'm mentioning bits like the Fly ability that are necessary to know about for it.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 11:51, 20 July 2009 (UTC)


 * As for the matter of having "a full stop after MissingNo.", I couldn't find anything in policy that really covers something like this. It really doesn't come across as a full stop, and WP:TRADEMARK doesn't seem to have a guideline for it in this case. There are several articles with "No." in their title and body, though the closest example with FA status I've been able to find was H.M.S. Pinafore and that's a full-on abbreviation. I just disagree with removing the period when it is clearly part of the name.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 08:14, 21 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I tweaked the other two problems you mentioned, hopefully Characteristics and Reception flow much better now as a result. I also modified two sentences that implied MissingNo was a glitch due to bad wording on my part. Sorry about seeing like I'm being stubborn about the other three, I just want to make sure I do this right on the first shot.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 08:44, 21 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm not too happy about the first three, but if you can get someone decent to agree with you on those issues I'll drop it. User:Krator (t c) 11:48, 21 July 2009 (UTC)

For what it's worth to be safe I took up the matter of the period at the end of MissingNo. to WT:MoS here, and they apparently state it should remain to retain accuracy.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 15:36, 23 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Kung Fu Man, I wonder if I should just keep it GA. I looked at this and I dont know. My only Comment would be the picture of the others appearances, about taking the L-block out of the picture. But again I dont know. GamerPro64 (talk) 04:00, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Not a problem, it's an odd article.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 04:04, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I will be Neutral on this. GamerPro64 (talk) 04:11, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Pre-evolved form of... Khangaskahn!?
I was looking at GameFAQs' user created 10 tens and [|this] says if MissingNo. gains a level, It'll evolve to Khangaskahn. I just wanna know if that's true or not. GamerPro64 (talk) 21:14, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
 * M-Block/M' can, which is a little different (it'll appear as level 0 and so forth). You can actually catch one and "evolve" it to create a Khangaskahn with Fly.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 21:18, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

What does M-Block/M' can mean? GamerPro64 (talk) 21:23, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
 * It's something else that occasionally pops up when doing the MissingNo. trick: looks like MissingNo., but the name is M' with a bunch of garbled data on the sides. It's the result of the game finding some data for it and attempting to rationalize it as a Pokemon (unlike MissingNo. where it gets called up if nothing appears). That explain it?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 21:31, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

But don't they both become Khangaskhan if they gain a level? And I was under the impression that 'M' was the Blue version counterpart to Missingno, although both could be encountered in either versions. Seb0910 (talk) 15:25, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
 * No, MissingNo. will stay MissingNo.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 15:26, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
 * This is untrue. MissingNo. evolve into Khangaskahn.  I don't consider it article-worthy to mention, but just want to clear this up. Gpia7r (talk) 14:28, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Has anyone else tried trading MissingNo to a later version of the game? I used the time capsule in Gold to trade it, and I got a message saying "User's Miltank is deformed. Trade will not be completed." Just thought that was worth noting, if we are trying to figure out what MissingNo could be. -Quentin —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.251.65.67 (talk) 14:48, 3 September 2009 (UTC)
 * The game uses the invalid number for the MissngNo. when you trade it, so it'll correspond to one in that game. I think someone pointed out the ghost one comes out as shiny Lugia and can be traded, but there's nothing confirming that in stuff we can cite and it's kinda non-needed in the long run.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 16:07, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
 * --'M -- would also evolve into Clefairy @ Lv128. --'M -- -- The editor who likes cosplay  XX Pikachu (pika!)  #  2568 XX @ 11:53, 9 March 2015 (UTC)

Remember This
Yep — Preceding unsigned comment added by Philip1992 (talk • contribs)

A-class Assement - 2nd reviewer
Since the 2nd image has been dealt with, which is I had taken part in the discussion of, for which I abstained from the assessment, I will go ahead and assess the article.


 * The first paragraph in the history of Pokemon could still be further condensed. Basically who and when it was first developed and what the most basic gameplay elements that are fundamental to understanding the game in relation to MissingNo - basically remove info about trainer skills and non-trainer skills. That aspect doesn't contribute to the understanding of MissingNo.
 * It gives enough background information for anyone unfamiliar with the subject of video games at all. Removing further information from it may confuse readers later on in the article as aspects regarding it are discussed.
 * There is nothing later in the article that warrants the reader needing to know some skills are given by leveling and others by trainers. 陣 内 Jinnai 23:46, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Good point, removed it.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 00:02, 27 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure that quoting the abilities is appropriate grammatically.
 * Done.


 * The route for the old man route to find should be moved to statics. The process to fining it is really a part of the history, but the characteristics. That or remove it as it might be seen as too much as a game guide. Noting that Nintendo Power hand an article and commented on it is completely appropriate for history - the rest not so.
 * I'm really not sure what the complication is there, as that is a rather key part in this whole event "working". Can you be clearer?
 * Basically it's not "history" because it's detailing a step-by-step method on how to reproduce the event which also falls under WP:GAMEGUIDE, even though it's a glitch. In essence it's reading as a "how-to" in that section which is not what Wikipedia is about and even if you could say it's not enough to warrant removal per WP:NOT, it's still not talking about the history of MissingNo. 陣 内 Jinnai 23:46, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * This is the only bit I'm iffy about removing...both the aspect of seeing the tutorial (which puts the bad data in the buffer to begin with) and the fact you'll need to go from that location to the spot on the island are needed to work (to avoid the buffer being) are kinda integral to grasping how it works. I'm afraid removing this would just confuse someone less familiar with games and don't see it as a "how-to". Only bit I can think that could be removed is pointing out it's Viridian City: would that suffice?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 00:02, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I think I've more-or-less taken care of this. JimmyBlackwing (talk) 01:40, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Yea, i guess that's okay. 陣 内 Jinnai 02:15, 27 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Problem links:
 * 1 - webcite archive link is down. Normally I'd say this doesn't matter given the recent problems with webcite, but this is going for an A-class assement, so it is a serious issue as it is to represent among the best video game articles.
 * Changed it to webarchive's backup.


 * 8 - why is Hank Schlesinger reliable? I can't find anyone citing him. Publishing a book doesn't automatically make you an expert.
 * He's actually published several books of the same tone. A google news search turns up a few sources as well:


 * 9 - can you cite why this article is reliable as it's a blog site.
 * I was under the impression Destructoid would be fine as a source for this instance as it's backing up the corrupt Hall of Fame aspect solely, but if need be the Hank Schlesinger book does as well.
 * Destuctoid is a blog site so you have to show that the writer is an expert. I found a bit more on Schlesinger's publisher. Looks to be a branch of St. Martin's Press which is a reputable publisher so it's fine. 陣 内 Jinnai 23:46, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I moved the Schlesinger ref link up there alongside it, but I could remove the Destructoid reference entirely if you want: main reason to cite it was to avoid relying solely on that one book to show "this happens", and it's the only reliable source discussing that aspect we have online. As far as I know the Destructoid writer is just a staff member there.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 00:02, 27 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Other citation problems
 * You have links like 4 link to the Pokemon article, but not 2 and 3. Make certain all your links are consistant. 陣 内 Jinnai 20:32, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm actually not sure what you mean there, could you be more concise?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 22:59, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Some of the links link to Pokemon Red and Blue and others do not. They all should be conistant. 陣 内 Jinnai 23:46, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Fixed?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 00:02, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Yea. 陣 内 Jinnai 02:15, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Also please sign each comment you post as it's easier to know that it's you who commented and not some random person. 陣 内 Jinnai 23:47, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * That seems to be everything you mentioned. Since Krator's support was situational on another reviewers, does this get a ye or nay on A-class now?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 02:21, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Yea I give my support. For future reference his support whether conditional or not would have required a 2nd reviewer agreeing anyway as A-class requires more than 1 reviewer - that's what sets it apart from b-class. 陣 内 Jinnai 03:32, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

This Article shouldn't be under the Catagory Control Flow
(Undid revision 310764186 by 72.224.22.250 (talk) It's an example of error handling, which is under the category) (undo)

Except Missingno. isn't a type of control flow, or a notable example of error handling since there was no error handling. Mzxrules (talk) 20:27, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
 * It's called up in the even no pokemon data exists for whatever the current in-game battle calls for. How is there no error handling?--Kung Fu Man (talk) 20:29, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Maybe I shouldn't have said there was no error handling, but I don't see why you think that because this glitch is an example of error handling that the article should be catagorized under control flow. By that reasoning, every notable program ever made would be catagorized under control flow. Mzxrules (talk) 22:13, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Well I guess one way to look at it is this is citing a specific example on the matter that's been made notable by reactions to it, which makes the article a unique case. The example of "every notable program" doesn't because generally such material isn't discussed in the context of the article to this degree (or at all even). Do you understand what I mean? (Not really wanting to argue with you, more debating it).--Kung Fu Man (talk) 22:17, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Notable to the gaming world, not the computer science world. And I still don't see the justification for putting this article on the Control Flow Category page because it has a paper-thin association to exception handling. But if you think something about the Missingno. glitch would benefit the exception handling page, add something there.Mzxrules (talk) 06:36, 20 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I support the removal of the category control flow. Encountering missingno in the game does not throw an exception as there is no error-checking within the red/blue framework to check if an encounter is valid. The data is read, regardless of what is in the encounter buffer under the assumption that no invalid (I only say invalid in that the range of the data falls without normal operating bounds but not such that it overflows the stack or calls an invalid pointer, which would utterly crash the system) data would be passed. Lastly, I argue that missingno. was not an intended part of the red/blue framework explained thusly: A single byte integer is passed as the current encounter. All said and done there are only 151 pokemon in the cart, and the nearest binary number that could be the index for them is 256. That leaves (256-151) holes in the index. So long as no encounter ever called those places in the index, the invalid data would never be used to generate an encounter. (And given that EVERY encounter and EVERY region was pushed into the buffer can we blame them for believing that could happen?) Spetheric (talk) 08:05, 3 November 2009 (UTC)
 * "there is no error-checking within the red/blue framework to check if an encounter is valid [...] I argue that missingno. was not an intended part of the red/blue framework"
 * Debunked by the sourced statement of
 * "if the game selects a value from the data buffer that is not an existing Pokémon, a subroutine is triggered that causes the appearance of a Pokémon named MissingNo., short for 'Missing Number'"
 * MissingNo. is an error handler that, outright, prevents the game from crashing in the event a value not related to an existing character is called due to one event or another (such as a gameshark or the "Mew glitch trick", which both can also cause such an encounter). Oh, and the fragile status of the original R/B source code is cited in Power-Up: How Japanese Video Games Gave the World an Extra Life. So straight up, MissingNo. is a specific example of error handling in R/B in that it keeps the game still running and has even been stated as exactly such. And error handling falls under the category of (Dum-dum-DUM!) control flow.
 * We tend not to stick with speculation here on wikipedia. Thanks.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 11:39, 3 November 2009 (UTC)
 * The problem with the above is twofold. 1) The assumption that an invalid encounter would crash the game, 2) The blatant misinterpretation of the term subroutine. You extrapolate far too much. For argument, lets call this chunk of data all of the pokemon in the game: (imagine the names are in hex I'd rather not type it all out) [Pikachu 04 05 A4 FF v(7434#@ 3A 0B 22 03 Charmander 12 32 74 BB] Okay, to explain: The first chunk is species name, the next four are something like base stats or who cares, and the random looking symbols are a deleted pokemon in the index. There were 256 possible entries and only 151 were used, so we can agree some deleted or empty values exist. When an encounter is called that looks up one of these deleted indexes(ces?), the only real error catching is to name it missingno if it falls out of bounds sometimes the player runs into 'M' or just garbled names because the code to rename it on the fly isn't always executed. My point is, missingno was not planned for, is read randomly from garbage data and the player name, and only the naming mechanism (which doesn't fire reliably anyway) can be called an error catching mechanism. IE NOT missingno it's stats or item duplicating effect, level or any of the effects thereof. Spetheric (talk) 05:55, 5 November 2009 (UTC)

Appearance in Pokemon Yellow
Missingno can also be encountered in Pokemon yellow, however it looks different. Should this be added? Also It can be found looking like kabutops fossil and like the ghosts from lavender town. 122.58.115.32 (talk) 06:32, 8 November 2009 (UTC)
 * If you look in past discussions you will see that that is a different type of MissingNo. So it wont be added to the article. <sub style="color:#00008B;">Blake (Talk·Edits) 15:22, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

A different kind of MissingNo?
Hello, I was playing pokemon Emerald on GBA and suddenly encountered a ? Pokemon. Could this be related to MissingNo from previous games? I have also had it appear in my DS games of pokemon as well with similar results to the MissingNo mentioned in the article. Master1001 (talk) 23:55, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * No; there are numerous different glitch Pokemon in each version of the game. Normally they can only be found by hacking, but not always. MissinNo. is only found within Red, Blue, and Yellow, so it was a different glitch; since it was Emerald you were playing the Glitch Pokemon was probably ? MelicansMatkin (talk, contributions) 00:04, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
 * This article is only about the Red and Blue MissingNo. Any other types of glitch Pokemon would have no place here. <sub style="color:#00008B;">Blake (Talk·Edits) 01:20, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Well aware of that; Master1001's enquiry was on whether MissingNo. was in games other that Generation I or whether they were different glitches. MelicansMatkin (talk, contributions) 01:41, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Indeed. Generally the other glitch Pokemon that showed up in later games are still called MissingNo.'s by fans despite not being the same (see: GameFAQs). So the question is understandable.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 03:09, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Not all GLITCH POKéMON are MISSINGNO. If the name is not MISSINGNO. then it is not MissingNo. The name you are looking for may be ??????????. -- The editor who likes cosplay  XX Pikachu (pika!)  #  2568 XX @ 11:56, 9 March 2015 (UTC)

Oak glitch
A different glitch in Red/Blue involves finding/catching a mysterious "Professor Oak" Pokemon, which eventually evolves into a Missingno. Should this be mentioned? S*T*A*R*B*O*X (talk) 18:50, 10 January 2010 (UTC)
 * If it can be reliably sourced. MelicansMatkin (talk, contributions) 18:59, 10 January 2010 (UTC)


 * I doubt that, but there IS a glitch trainer called Prof. Oak whose sprite looks like professor Oak. Look it up on Bulbapedia! 71.214.104.203 (talk)random dude —Preceding undated comment added 03:29, 3 April 2011 (UTC).

MissingNo Encounters
I caught a MissingNo and it froze. What's wrong? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.222.109.60 (talk) 15:25, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Likely everything. Why would you ask us? This ain't no party, ain't no disco, ain't no foolin' around. And it's not a forum.  2J Bäkkvire Maestro  communications accomplishments 15:28, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
 * MissingNo. is a glitch. By catching it, you risk glitching your game. <sub style="color:#00008B;">Blake (Talk·Edits) 15:27, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Depends on which game: later glitches tend to be called "MissingNo." but aren't *the* MissingNo. But yeah this isn't a forum.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 19:06, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

Missingno. does not ruin your game. All it does is corrupt hall of fame data and glitches up graphics. but the graphics can be fixed by viewing the stats of another pokemon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.47.66.199 (talk) 23:24, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

Level 129 Golbat.
In Pokemon red, I attempted the series of events leading up to finding a Missingno. During the glitch, I had not seen a Missingno. Instead, I saw a level 129 Golbat. However, the multiplying of the 6th item in your bag happened. What happened? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.101.159.239 (talk) 13:08, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Meh, a glitch is a glitch. This isn't the place to discuss it (try the reference desks in the future) but given the nature of the glitch it can't very well be expected to be 100% predictable. ~  Amory ( u  •  t  •  c ) 13:48, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
 * @208.101.159.239: It's because of your name, e.g. If your first letter of your name is D, then it is a Mewtwo. If your second letter of your name is x, it is Level 254. If your first letter is /, it will be a trainer battle. --116.14.183.192 (talk) 13:02, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

M
I've also encountered a pokemon called "M". AmericanLeMans (talk) 17:15, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
 * This is a different Pokemon. This article is only about MissingNo. Not all glitches. <sub style="color:#00008B;">Blake (Talk·Edits) 17:22, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
 * M is often mistaken for MissingNo, so it could very well be relevant. - The New Age Retro Hippie used Ruler! Now, he can figure out the length of things easily. 20:07, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
 * There are very little if any references that cover M' (I can think of only one player's guide that even covers it) and even then it's extremely brief. M', while similar, is very different in how it affects the game...but we don't have any references stating how that we can cite. It's better to just leave the glitch out.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 21:47, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Actually 'M is pretty much the same as MissingNo. which is why it hardly gets any attention. MissingNo. has the advantage of occasionally appearing with a real Poké sprite if the right person with the right name gets to it. Also, 'M's name is full of glitchy blocks. Because of this, the illusion that MissingNo. might actually be a real Pokémon is added, so people think about it more. An interesting fact is that, if you have a one-letter/whatever name, you can actually have a game when 'M is the only one to appear and MissingNo. doesn't (apart from the trading thing). However, 'M, like I said, is hardly ever referenced. MissingNo. hogs all the attention, the greedy glitch. A brief note about 'M wouldn't be entirely harmful, but its not really needed. Harry Blue5 (talk) 10:05, 30 September 2010 (UTC)


 * The method described to encounter Missingno. commonly comes up with the 'M Pokemon at either Level 0 or Level 70, and Missingno. may not even show up at all depending solely on the player's name. Curuiously there is no mention made of the second method of acquring a Missingno, which is to perform an in-game trade and then fly to Cinnibar without entering another route. This method will always, and only, result in encountering Missingno. ggctuk (2005) (talk) 13:42, 30 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Ah, yes. The trade one. I've done that. The thing is, as far as I can tell, you can only do that one once, and is less likely to happen by pure coincidence. The Old Man trick is not unlikely to happen by chance, though admittedly hardly anyone actually talks to the old man after being forced to first time round. Also, 'M appears a lvl 80 or 0, if memory serves correctly. Harry Blue5 (talk) 09:53, 5 October 2010 (UTC)


 * This is a total necro right here, but you will always encounter 'M when doing the Old Man Trick, unless you've used a memory hack (GameShark, etc.) to get a name longer than seven characters. Please see the explanation (and the sources it cites, though they're probably not Wikipedia-grade) here. 68.49.184.29 (talk) 07:53, 30 December 2010 (UTC) (DavidJCobb, logged out)


 * Check out Bulbapedia's list of glitch Pokémon. There's Z4, Q, 3TrainerPoké, G'Mp, Glitchy Charizard... the list goes on and on. Probably the most deadly is Invisible Shiny Bulbasaur. Missingno's only one of at least 40 other glitch species. Here's a link... . 71.214.104.203 (talk) 03:24, 3 April 2011 (UTC)random dude


 * There's more. |\8, Ng'mp, ????? (FC[252], FE[254], FF[255], 00[FB, FD and FE evolves into 00.), Bad EGG, Glitch Unown, -, B óE AN, Glitch Egg and 4 4 4 4 4. -- Pikachu2568 (talk) 09:36, 2 March 2015 (UTC)


 * If your name is RED, R = MissingNo. and E = L146; D = Mewtwo and Blank = Lv?. Others are MissingNo. or 'M. -- Pikachu2568 (talk) 09:44, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

WRONG.
MissingNo is NOT an "error handler", but a dummy used by the programmers to test various Pokemon-related functions. Also, he is not found whenever the game attempts to access nonexistent Pokemon data, and is not a 'subroutine'.

MissingNo is a functioning Pokemon, programming-wise. The glitches are caused by the process of finding him, which also loads plenty of garbage data parsed as Pokemon data. Pokemon data is stored in a list of 256 items. Only 152 items in this list store actual Pokemon data (the 151 Pokemon, and MissingNo.) The rest stores fragmented or "broken" Pokemon data, such as 'M, PkMn, and broken MissingNo's. The Pokemon that appear depends on the players name, which is used in place of actual buffer data when you enter the "undefined" tile on Cinnabar. The hex values for the letters in your name tell the game where to get Pokemon data from in the Pokemon list. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.130.195.180 (talk) 17:42, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

RIGHT.
statement retracted, ientify confirm as ghost poemin —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.192.31.43 (talk) 00:37, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

"Error handling"?
The statement on error handling implies that all MISSINGNO. are the same Pokemon. This is not true; there are about twenty or thirty glitch Pokemon that bear the name MISSINGNO.. Here's an example of a MISSINGNO. that varies a bit from the standard one (seen in the article's image); this MISSINGNO. has a hex identifier of. That hex corresponds to the letter "w", as seen here. Now, I know that YouTube is looked down upon as a source on Wikipedia, but... Come on -- you can't get a much better source than a ROM screen capture of the very thing the article describes! 68.49.184.29 (talk) 07:48, 30 December 2010 (UTC) (DavidJCobb, logged out)
 * You are correct, there are a total of 39 (0x27) [blank] values in the encountered Pokémon byte which activate the 'MISSINGNO.' error handler. All other (256-39)- 151 values are invalid, so aren't called MISSINGNO. The article is vague; it says that one of the computing events for MISSINGNO. is the game attempting to withdraw a non-existing Pokémon but this only applies to those 39 blank examples in the 8-bit species byte. It needs improving; as many familiar players of Pokémon Red and Blue know that pseudo-random glitch Pokémon aren't affected by this 'error trap' such as the well documented (but not by 'reliable sources'?) 'M. These are actually derivations of the game ROM itself where the game is trying to decompress the wrong data as if it was a Pokémon sprite, hence the 'glitch art' caused by a #000's sprite for instance.


 * RE only 39 MISSINGNO. The only problem is finding a 'reliable source' in terms of general Wikipedia consensus. I tried referencing "glitchcity.info" only to have it rejected by Kung Fu Man as an 'unreliable source'. See this. I have another idea for here; it is rather valid and elaborates well on some of the more technical details of the MISSINGNO. error handler itself but would Wikipedia ever class it as a reliable source unless it received media attention or something =[ ? I find the process of deciding reliable and unreliable sources a little bureaucratic but that's just me! I would reference this game RAM address itself but I do not know whether Wikipedia allows it. As far as I know, you can quote the game dialogue itself to back up claims but does this still apply to the game's internal coding? --81.103.186.25 (talk) 17:16, 6 January 2011 (UTC) (Chickasaurus signed out)
 * While I think everyone can appreciate the want to add the info, it just isn't that necessary? The fact that there are 39 slots in which this could possibly happen really adds nothing to the article, and instead would confuse the casual reader and offer too highly technical information for most people to understand. The nuances as well between the different MissingNo.'s the game can generate are also negligible with the exception of certain values linking to different sprites, which is mentioned in the article and was initially more detailed, but trimmed down for the same reason during the FAC process.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 14:13, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Actually the fact that there are 39 slots adds quite a bit to the article, when you think about the fact that there were originally going to be 190 Pokemon. Scientific Alan (talk) 20:35, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

More on "Error Handling"
MissingNo. is not error handling at all in the first generation, and possibly the second. When the player talks to the old man, the player's name must become OLD MAN, so the player's name is stored temporarily in the slot for wild Pokémon data. Usually, this is not a problem, because the wild Pokémon data is reset to what it should be when you enter an area with Pokémon, but because the coast of Cinnabar does not reset the Pokémon data, the game loads the player's name as a Pokémon. Obviously, this causes many errors. Later on in the series (Gen 3 onward, from what I've tried), a relatively harmless version of MissingNo. is used as the player's Pokémon if they get in a Pokémon battle without any Pokémon. 99.241.137.247 (talk) 14:58, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
 * "MissingNo. is not error handling at all"..."Obviously, this causes many errors"
 * You kinda just defeated the argument you started with. MissingNo. appears specifically so the game won't crash in these instances. As for the gen 3 one you're referencing, that's more similar to "M'", in that the game is drawing upon null data to try and fill in the empty field (null stats, null hp etc). It's similar but still different.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 15:02, 14 July 2011 (UTC)

Featured?
How the heck is this a featured article? I suppose that it is comprehensive, but there just isn't that much information on a topic this specific. 8 paragraphs and 18 references, seriously? Isn't there some way to recognize that an article is as good as it's going to be without declaring it featured and plastering it over the main page? I mean no offense to the authors, but someone had to ask. 74.131.181.240 (talk) 18:25, 14 September 2011 (UTC)
 * There is a way to evaluate the article to see if it is "featured". The process is called Featured Article Candidacy. This article went through that process at Featured article candidates/MissingNo./archive1. (Guyinblack25 talk 18:34, 14 September 2011 (UTC))
 * I am more familiar with Wikipedia's processes than you would seem to believe, and had actually read the FAC before posting in the first place. I was simply agreeing with Noisalt's comment that "I almost think the fact that this article meets the FA criteria is a sign they need to be improved somehow". 74.131.181.240 (talk) 10:50, 22 September 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, the real issue here is that Noisalt and Rjanag's comments are basically about how "Reaction and reception" fails to deliver. I'll focus on depth of coverage. It feels odd that a topic about an error handler in a Pokemon game talks about sociology, but leaves out how MissingNo. was received by critics in the 90s. Print media was more prominent in those days, so what did gaming magazines like EGM and GamePro had to say? <font color="#666666">« ₣M₣ » 19:14, 22 September 2011 (UTC)
 * GamePro and EGM said nothing other than to occasionally list the cheat (even EGM didn't mention it in it's retrospective issue of the series). This game however was released in October 1998, and MissingNo. would have been found some time after that: there's not going to be many reactions from the 90's, and those that did are covered in here.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 20:26, 22 September 2011 (UTC)
 * If you think it fails the criteria, you can always nominate it for FA-status removal. – Harry Blue5 (talk • contribs) 23:18, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

"Pokeyourmom"?
Uhm, somebody replaced the word pokemon with pokeyourmom in the history section. Fixed, but it's obviously a case of vandalism, so watch out, I guess — Preceding unsigned comment added by  Escozzia  (talk • contribs)  19:45, 14 September 2011
 * It happens all the time, especially with TFAs. —<font size="2" face="Times New Roman" color="black"> WP: PENGUIN · [ TALK ]  19:51, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

"this was not in the Japanese ver."?
Regarding 's edit: Are you sure? What sources say it is English only? I mean, I never heard of it happening in the JP version, but are we sure? It seems odd the glitch only happens in the English version. <sub style="color:#00008B;">Blake (Talk·Edits) 03:11, 26 September 2011 (UTC)
 * To be honest I'm not quite sure it can't happen in there (players are shown in videos still getting MissingNo. through other methods), but this topic still doesn't really fall under the Japan wikiproject when everything citable, even the reactions, is relating to the NA localization of the games.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 03:52, 26 September 2011 (UTC)
 * It is possible from my own experiences, but not with the old man glitch. You have to use the Mew glitch or select button glitches. The Japanese Wikipedia article on Ketsuban (Missingno.) けつばん is indeed ethnocentric, i.e. the placeholder entry "コメント さくせいちゅう" only appears in Missingno.'s Pokédex entry Japanese Blue, but it doesn't reference any sources. On Wikipedia, the policy is verifiability not truth. 81.103.186.25 (talk) 22:06, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Not two games, but three
Article says that it was only in two games. This is incorrect. Both red and blue can get it through the Old man glitch and the Mew glitch, but Yellow can also do it, but it must be the Mew glitch, as I understand. That's 3 games total. 64.134.243.209 (talk) 17:13, 24 October 2011 (UTC)
 * I feel the same way as you do, having performed the Mew glitch on all three games, as well as the Japanese games. Unfortunately, the Wikipedia article must rely on 'creditable' sources and there isn't much leniency now that this is a 'featured' article, I wish that there was some sort of disclaimer on Wikipedia for that. Unfortunately, reliable sources are not necessarily objective and may be dogmatic. For example, the book Playing with Videogames referenced in this article was a qualitative analysis; and it took its findings from sources which were not necessarily reliable, such as the now defunct fan-site TRSRockin. See Verifiability, not truth. 81.103.186.25 (talk) 21:55, 31 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The glitch in Yellow is very similar, but has distinct differences. The Yellow version causes more glitches, looks different, and has a different type(Normal/999 instead of Bird/Normal). For the purposes of this article, we only mention the Red and Blue instances because that can be sourced, while the Yellow version can not. <sub style="color:#00008B;">Blake (Talk·Edits) 16:15, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

software bug or easter egg
It sounds like Game Freak put a lot of effort into this Pokemon, so that software bugs would be a feature rather than a game destroying event. As a result, it sounds like this is more of an easter egg rather than a software bug. John Vandenberg (chat) 02:32, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Easter eggs tend not to be followed with the company warning that it can potentially destroy your game (mind you it really can't, but there is the fact too this wasn't in Yellow).--Kung Fu Man (talk) 04:02, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
 * In FireRed Version, you do the same thing (no need for the old man). Use the surf HM on the east of Cinnabar island and surf up and down. You will encounter a MissingNo. (Right spelling) at Lv5. Please watch the video of how to catch MissingNo. (easter egg) --116.14.183.192 (talk) 10:34, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

MissingNo. in Pokemon Yellow
How come the page doesn't mention the fact that you can find MissingNo. in Pokemon Yellow? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Scientific Alan (talk • contribs) 20:08, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

MissingNo. myths and legends
I was wondering, should this article have some information on the "myth" side of missingno? Such as the rumor about missingno being a baby kangaskan but last minute changes made them remove it and place the code in a random area, or also some of the fanfic 'Creepypasta' stories. (Lunashy (talk) 03:00, 27 March 2012 (UTC))
 * None of that has official citations if anything...to be honest it's not unusual for fanon to exist about anything, but unless the subject's covered somewhere in such a manner from a reliable source...it can't be cited.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 03:09, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

'M
'M should not redirect to MissingNo., as they are not the same thing. Gus the Goat (talk) 21:21, 6 October 2012 (UTC)

They are both extremely similar. The only differences are the moves. PoolalaDerp (talk) 01:58, 21 November 2012 (UTC)
 * They are similar, but not the same. 'M also evolves into Kangaskhan and Clefairy while Missingno. does not, and the two have different cries. These are not the only differences, but are more than just the moves. -- Snorlax Monster  10:32, 4 January 2013 (UTC)

Capitalization
Why is Missingno. written as "MissingNo." (with the capital N) here? The games themselves have it all-caps (MISSINGNO.) like every other Pokémon name. Even in the more recent games where the all-caps format has been dropped, no Pokémon has a letter in the middle of its name capitalized (unless it's separated by a dash or space, like in Mr. Mime or Ho-Oh.) The Nintendo help sources do spell it "MissingNO." (which is noted as an alternate spelling on this page), but the "MissingNo." spelling used on this page seems to have come completely out of nowhere (I've been playing the Pokémon games and visiting Pokémon sites/forums ever since 1998, and this Wikipedia article and its talk page are literally the only places I've ever seen it capitalized as "MissingNo.") It seems a little messed up to me that the commonly-used "Missingno." (used in most of the sources linked at the bottom, most other Pokémon websites, etc.) is completely absent, while some rarely-used alternate capitalization is being presented as the "normal" capitalization by being the title of the page and the spelling used throughout it. --FnrrfYgmSchnish (talk) 01:37, 6 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Hmm. Turns out "MissingNo." is used in one of the linked sources... well, almost.  On that one they added a space, making it the even-more-awkward "Missing No."  Still, "Missingno." is by far the most common way of writing this thing's name. --FnrrfYgmSchnish (talk) 01:41, 6 July 2013 (UTC)
 * This capitalization certainly isn't as uncommon as you make it out to be. As for linked sources not using it, MissingNo, MissingNo., Missing No., and MissingNo, Missing No. The one thing the two different formattings in Nintendo's statement have in common is that they all have a capital N. -- Snorlax Monster  18:22, 11 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I'd propose having a "Synonyms" section similar to firearm cartridge articles, maybe noting frequency of each variant of nomenclature, which is preferred in different language releases, other official variations, and so on. 71.229.23.9 (talk) 15:13, 5 September 2013 (UTC)


 * I actually don't think this is all that important. As you pointed out, the games are in all caps so we can't represent the "correct" capitalization anyway. What's important is that people can find the article and all others are valid for this purpose. Radiodef (talk) 16:31, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

Missingno in Pokemon Yellow.
We pretty much all know MissingNo. is in Yellow, so when can someone add that, along with a citation? I found a source, and *someone* (hint) thinks it's unreliable, even though it's just as reliable as anything else on the internet. Scientific Alan 2 (Click here to talk)  (What have I done?)  14:54, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Wikias are never reliable sources. It'd be like wikipedia citing itself. The MissingNo. in yellow may as well be a separate character anyway, as if access via glitching or cheating it breaks the game, completely different from the reaction here (and the method used to find it here, which has become synonymous with it).--Kung Fu Man (talk) 16:18, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
 * It is like saying this article is about Golden Delicious apples, and you want to put information about Granny Smith apples. Yes, they both exist, but in this case, they are different things, and only one is notable. I wish people would leave it alone. <sub style="color:#00008B;">Blake (Talk·Edits) 19:34, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
 * MissingNo. in Yellow is different, but so are the Fossil and Ghost MissingNo. in Red and Blue. They're all still MissingNo., but they do have quite different properties. But that's not the problem here: the problem is that reliable sources do not support Yellow MissingNo., even though you and I know it exists. Bulbapedia is not a reliable source as it is a wiki; it can be accurate, but that does not make it reliable. -- Snorlax Monster  17:02, 1 November 2013 (UTC)
 * What, exactly, is considered a reliable source around here? A few years ago I spent around a year or so "edit warring" false information in this article (I "won" in the end, but I won't tell you which part for fear that someone will edit it back out of spite), which was deemed to be true because there was an article of layman speculation that supported it on a certain famous video game site. Both you (as project leader of Project GlitchDex over on Bulbapedia) and I (hi, blahpy/OwnageMuch here from GCLF/Bulbapedia) know that there is much more up to date information relevant to the article than random IGN articles written by people with no understanding of the bug (see: the cited IGN article that claims you need to go to the Safari Zone to find Missingno.), and yet these former sources (*cough* GCL *cough*) are considered "unreliable" while uninformed layman speculation over on IGN is considered "reliable".  This is a featured article.  A featured article should be factually accurate.


 * P.S. This IP is shared with my whole university, so I might come back with an account if an actual discussion starts here.130.195.253.25 (talk) 03:26, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Incomplete is better than inaccurate. As long as the article says it can be obtained in Red and Blue and doesn't say that it cannot be obtained in Yellow, it's fine. As for reliable sources, publicly editable wikis should never be used as sources for other wikis, simply because it makes it very easy to get caught in a "reference loop". Forum posts aren't very good either, unless made by important people to the topic at hand. I wasn't going to mention that, but since OwnageMuch brought it up, I am in charge of glitches on Bulbapedia, and as such am very familiar with the accuracy of Bulbapedia; however, I do not think it should be used as a source on Wikipedia. -- Snorlax Monster  05:14, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi, OwnageMuch again (different IP though). My gripe isn't with Bulbapedia being unusable as a source. I wouldn't cite Wikipedia as a source in most cases for the same reasons. My gripe is with citing articles where the author has no idea what they are talking about rather than factual research notes. I am referring to inaccuracy, not incompleteness. 202.56.34.99 (talk) 03:37, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
 * If you think a source is unreliable, you can remove it (as long as you state why you think so). -- Snorlax Monster  19:07, 17 November 2013 (UTC)
 * That particular article isn't even being cited for that mistake. It's being cited for reception and why it's on the list...which is accurate (the item duplication).--Kung Fu Man (talk) 07:48, 18 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Cite glitch city labratories. Most of the information on bulbapedia is sourced from there.  (Link).  --Pokechu22 (talk) 14:48, 13 March 2014 (UTC)
 * Ignore above. I didn't even bother to read the above section.  Due to GCL being self-published, it can't be used.  Though there aren't any other places really.  --Pokechu22 (talk) 21:42, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

The article includes the Japanese name, but does not state that it can be found in the Japanese games
Either the existence there should be added, or the Japanese name removed. I recommend the former, although that may be an issue due to the reluctance to include Pokémon Yellow. The Japanese name is uncited at this time. --Pokechu22 (talk) 01:12, 25 May 2014 (UTC)


 * On a related note, we haven't specified that the method to encounter it in Japanese games is different. Surfing on the coast of Cinnabar Island doesn't trigger wild Pokémon. Theclaw1 (talk) 04:05, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
 * We can only report on what reliable sources report on. Also, not even Bulbapedia's page shows the information you claim. <sub style="color:#00008B;">Blake (Talk·Edits) 23:12, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Yeah not much we can do about such things that are easy to confirm via playing the game, yet nobody cares enough about to document in a way that qualifies as a source.Theclaw1 (talk) 09:11, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

Even more on "Error handling"
Would error handling even be an accurate term for this? There isn't any actual code that handles MissingNo., it's just a dummy entry in the index->Pokedex array. The suggestion that there's actually an error handler that loads MissingNo. is wrong, the game treats it (wrongly) like any other Pokemon. It does have a defined name and Pokedex number, and a bad name might cause a crash so it that sense it could be an error handler, but I get the impression from reading the text display subroutine that it couldn't care less. --143.44.70.199 (talk) 16:30, 6 June 2014 (UTC)


 * True. It's kind of an error handle, but it isn't exactly.  It's more something that the put in to removed data.  The text-drawing routine doesn't detect something invalid and thus say "Missingno."; it just places whatever is next.  It's blanked data.  Though there are a few indexes that have separate cries.  (There's some information on Bulbapedia about that)  "Error handler" works ok because it flows better than "Dummied-out data".  --Pokechu22 (talk) 21:46, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Seen in Pokémon Diamond
It is seen in Pokémon D/P when you have no pokémon (including no starter), you try to battle the first gym leader (by cheating, going through wall), Roark, your pokémon (MissingNo.) is Lv:0 with 0/0 HP, 0 HP. When you try to attack, it will show "?????????????????????????????????? has no moves left!" And when it's your opponent's turn, it will say no target, then you lose and pay 8 Pokémon Dollars to Roark. Then you blackout and scurry back to Twin Town and Mom says you need to rest. --116.14.183.192 (talk) 12:58, 9 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Oh It is also seen in HG/SS. --116.14.183.192 (talk) 09:39, 10 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Not every glitch Pokemon is MissingNo. If it is not named "MISSINGNO.", then it's not MissingNo. -- Snorlax Monster  17:58, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

Pokémon Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald difference
It is not a scrambled "d" in the remakes. Instead it is a (?) ball. --116.14.183.192 (talk) 13:04, 9 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Not every glitch Pokemon is MissingNo. If it is not named "MISSINGNO.", then it's not MissingNo. -- Snorlax Monster  17:58, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

Level 245 Mewtwo
Click here. --116.14.183.192 (talk) 12:31, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
 * The glitch used to obtain MissingNo. can do other things too, yes, but they're not relevant here. -- Snorlax Monster  17:58, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

GoldSilverCrystal MissingNo
In New Bark Town, use a Pokemon with a Surf HM. Surf up and down the river to Route 27 (do not go to Route 27, just surf up and down. MissingNo appears as ?????, only with junked sprites in a square. When you try to catch it, a punch effect will occur (rare occasion, as in a trainer battle), and it will say you have caught it. The battle will continue, until you run. You will be at a glitchy version of New Bark Town and, you can't move unless you have a Pokemon with a Fly HM. --116.14.183.192 (talk) 21:59, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

Pokemon XY
Easter egg! I found a MissingNo. shape (GB) right inside after a door, (don't go in, or you won't be able to see it unless you go out). --116.14.183.192 (talk) 22:10, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

Name
I remember seeing it with the name "M.". AmericanLeMans (talk) 19:38, 28 January 2016 (UTC)
 * M-block is a related but different glitch entirely, though.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 21:38, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Quality
As as a Pokemon glitch enthusiast, I cringed many times while reading this article. It's just really inspecific and full of errors (contrary to popular belief, Missingno. is not an error handler). Very soon I'll be correcting this a lot, because right now, it's an excruciatingly bad quality. Edit: Whoops, forgot to sign mysf. Oh well. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Telinc1 (talk • contribs) 14:47, 22 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Hi there, . Thanks for editng to the article; however, the edits you made to the page have been reverted for two reasons:
 * A lot of information added are not referenced.
 * The sources you added are fansites, Bulbapedia and Smogon University, which are not considered reliable for wikipedia.
 * If what you added is true, then you should be able to provide reliable sources to back it up. Any information added without a source will be removed. Thanks! --  Hounder4  16:49, 27 March 2016 (UTC) -- <font face="Papyrus"> Anarchyte  <font color="#000"> ( work  &#124;  talk )   08:59, 9 July 2016 (UTC)