Talk:Moero! Nekketsu Rhythm Damashii Osu! Tatakae! Ouendan 2

=2007=

Awkward correlation?
According to the original Ouendan's discussion page, the manga artist for teh series is Atsushi Saito, of the same name as Atsushi Saito, the man with the eye patch on the Evening City Ouendan. Can somebody verify this? Luigi6138 18:21, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I now have verified that it is true. Look on the Elite Beat Agents site, under "Behind the Scenes" Luigi6138 19:00, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

Old stuff
I know this is an odd question but...how do we know this isn't just Elite Beat Agents with Japanese text/Ouendan moves instead of dancing?
 * They didn't release Ouendan outside of Japan, so why would they release Elite Beat Agents in Japan? --Guess Who 17:35, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

I dunno, maybe American music would sell better? We don't know whats popular in Japan, you know?

--well, from all accounts that I have read, non japanese poducts, including music, tend to do poorly inside of Japan. while their culture may borrow a lot from the West, they still do rely on Japanese institutions to be better than outside sources. One good example is the 360 vs PS3 and Wii and DS in Japan...the 360 is getting slaughtered. That being said, my japanese teacher regularly confesses her love for Harrison Ford and Eric Clapton. I have almost certain that this will not be EBA translated to Japanese... I do not know why they would change the name to Ouendan 2 if that were the case. For example, Gears of War doesn't get a new name because it is released in Japan. --- Phil
 * - A Link to the Past (talk) 00:40, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Please reorganize this top section. It looks awkward up here. Luigi6138 23:48, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Track listing
It needs a citation. I know those two songs have been said to be in the game, but I've never once seen a source except 2chan, which isn't known for its accuracy given its nature. --Guess Who 00:10, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

im with you on that, it needs a citation. I read about those songs on 2chan via gamefaqs.

Recent magazine scans have revealed those 2 songs, so Zenryoku Shonen and VISTA are confirmed.

Well, 3 new songs are supposedly confirmed, and are currently awaiting a citation. Groudon199 04:11, 7 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Those songs shouldn't be there without a citation. I could say that there are five Michael Jackson songs in the game and my claim would be no less credible. Removing until a decent citation can be provided. --Guess Who 07:30, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Someone actually tried to add those three songs? I'm just not sure which is worse: The idiot at GameFAQs who originally posted that there was "confirmation" of these three songs (D-technolife, Onegai! Senorita, Tentai Kansoku), or the idiots who spread it around despite the fact that the aforementioned original idiot has yet to post any confirmation links, and has not even logged in since making the original post. Until someone out there posts a source, the three songs should be considered the product of someone's wishlist. LupinConq 07:41, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Okay then, but here is another thing that bugs me...Osu! Means Go! Not Hey! Just because it was Hey! in EBA doesn't mean it applies here. If you were to ask any fan of Ouendan, Otaku or not, they would say the same thing! And its "Tamashii" with a "T." ie Tamashii means "Spirt" while "Damashii" means soul (Example: Katamari Damashii=Clump SOUL.).
 * Same thing. Ever heard of rendaku?

NeoGAF scans have confirmed a bunch of new songs. More New songs confirmed http://touch-ds.jp/mediagallery/st68.html Go to the 2nd ad in this link and be amazed! -Unsigned

Going Under Ground
I've fixed a small typo involving the group "Going Under Ground". Going Underground is apparently a single by some English band. Going Under Ground is a Japanese band that sang 'Vista'. There's currently no article for it here at Wikipedia. Lupyne 11:09, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Believe
Sources at the end: The track is actually "Believe" not "I Believe". Japanese sites (and a few english sites citing the japanese sites) aren't sure which version it is as there are many many songs by this name. It wouldn't be that impossible for it to be the Cher song from EBA either.
 * 
 * info based off famitsu
 * This page bases its info from famitsu and lists it as AI, but it is a guess on their part as is indicated further down. For what it's worth, Believe by AI is a slow R&B song which might fit for the "emotional" stage ala "Over the Distance" or "You're the Inspiration"
 * Cher's "Believe" wasn't exactly the most popular song in EBA. I really doubt that they would use it again in Ouendan 2. --Guess Who 05:53, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
 * At the gamepro link, it does mention a remote possibility of it being the Cher song. Although it's very unlikely, it has a small chance. Groudon199 18:43, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Although I agree that the chances of 'Believe' by Cher appearing in this game is slim, "Believe" was apparently released in Japan as well, and is quite popular. I might be wrong about this though. Lupyne 11:09, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I'd think it's probably Believe by Nami Tamaki, going by the kind of music they usually use. - Onmyounomichi 23:54, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Kotaku/The Platformers called it "I Believe" and named the artist Ayaka. .24.62.79.31 23:07, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
 * The article that The Platformers, and by extension Kotaku, cites is the Famitsu article that simply says "Believe". --Guess Who 00:46, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

There's a video of the "Believe" level here: http://touch-ds.jp/mfs/ouendan2/mft5.html I don't have much time to compare, but it certainly sounds like Ayaka's I Believe. LupinConq 06:52, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

The official site reveals that "Believe" is the one performed by A.I., in the song listings.

Colors of the Heart
User:62.194.129.229 added Colors of the Heart to the track list. Anyone have a source for this? Confucious 19:15, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Tried google, but couldn't find any.24.62.79.31 23:57, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I propose we remove that, as there's no proof it is in the game. Lupyne 08:42, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Agree. Should be removed until information can be cited. Confucious 22:27, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I will remove it. We'll add it in again if it is ever confirmed. Lupyne 02:15, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Fixed link to 'Go My Way' article
I have fixed the link to the Wikipedia article for 'Go My Way', because hitomi and Yaida Hitomi are not the same artist. It's just a coincidence that they both share the same name and even sang different songs with the same name. The link now links to Yaida's version of the song.Lupyne 14:09, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Official site
The official site has been put online. Included is gameplay footage of the game, and in another video, there is revealed the situation for POP STAR, in which you help what appears to be a doctor. Wheeliedude 11:41, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

Download demo
The download demo was released, along with new information. This is the hairstylist one, to the Checkers song. Wheeliedude 13:15, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I thought the hairstylist stage was to the song Pop Star by Ken Hirai? Lupyne 07:36, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I was mistaken. Wheeliedude 23:46, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
 * My bad. The hairstylist stage is indeed to Julia ni Heartbreak. Lupyne 07:48, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Believe
In the demo of the Believe song it is clearly hearable that it's a cover of the song by AI. So I corrected it. Source. -Unsigned

New songs confirmed
Orange Range - "Monkey Magic" Nana starring Mika Nakashima - "Glamorous Sky" Sambomaster - "Sekai wa Sore wo Ai to Yobunda ze" Porno Graffitti - "Music Hour"

Wheeliedude 22:22, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Kibun Jojo situation
According to the title of the song's situation, it is about a werewolf. Wheeliedude 23:42, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Final three songs

 * Kishidan - "Zoku"
 * ZZ - "Samurai Crew"
 * hyde - "COUNTDOWN"

I'm not entirely sure, however. Please wait until I get confirmation... Wheeliedude 00:53, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I can confirm that "COUNTDOWN" is the final regular stage, having just reached it. --Guess Who 23:35, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Or at least half of it (it's split in to two, like EBA's final stage). --Guess Who 00:57, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Difficulty compared to past games
I don't believe that the difficulty has been "toned down", but the beats are actually a little smaller. I also got to the last song, and COUNTDOWN is very hard XD209.91.61.251 02:10, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Actually, it wasn't hard but my hands were tired at the time >_> hyde will have the last laugh again at the end of Hard Mode though.(For those of you who don't know, hyde is the vocalist of L'arc~en~Ciel)209.91.61.251 04:26, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

I think the reason I thought it was "toned down" might be my regular playing on the "unfair" prequel that improved my gameplay?I am sure that a new beginner who never played the prequel or the EBA would have frustrating time on the first few tracks. By the way, great game. hanchi 18 May 2007
 * Eh-hem, Ouendan was really unfair skillwise. The game was... harder. Somehow. But I suffer from the same "massive improvement" condition. I S-ranked, on my first try, all of the songs on Easy/Normal/The first half of Hard on EBA. It's not just you.Luigi6138 23:37, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh, are spinners Ouendan-difficulty, or EBA-difficulty? Luigi6138 23:48, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * It's like after you play Insane mode, everything below that difficulty feels "slow". I felt that READY STEADY Go was unfair because you had to sit through ten seconds before attempting to beat it again.209.91.61.251 02:22, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The spinners feel a little bit harder on "Hard" or I'm just out of practice XD I didn't have a problem at all on Normal and got like 16,000 Bonus points209.91.61.251 02:22, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

I think the biggest change is actually the "Life bar", in the prequel, for example in th Easy and Normal level, if you just miss one beat, your energy drop really quick. In this sequel, if you miss one, you wouldn't notice much energy drop. Also yes, the spinner bar has slow down a bit now in the normal mode.hanchi 19 May 2007
 * Notable on Sekai wa Sore wo Ai to Yobun Da Ze. You can miss 6 in a row before you die. In READY STEADY GO of the original, 2 in a row screws you over. Luigi6138 18:29, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Another note, the spinners are harder than the original Ouendan's. The bar behind the thing seems shorter, but if one freaks out and attempts to spin really fast, the marker will "stick", and even though you are spinning very fast, the bar behind will not advance, and your life bar will still drop. Luigi6138 18:29, 1 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Unfortunately, all these statements qualify as original research, even though I agree with this assessment. If you can find a reviewer(s) that says that the difficulty has been increased, we can then cite that, but otherwise, it's not appropriate to include at this point. --Masem 18:45, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

List heavy
The article as it currently is, is list heavy. Someone should convert the Cheeleaders and New Characters section to prose.24.62.79.31 19:12, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Prose will screw up all of the organization. Think. That information in paragraphs?!? Luigi6138 23:37, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Cheerleader section in Ouendan is mostly prose.24.62.79.31 02:08, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * It looks like most of the article is prose now. Thanks. 24.62.79.31 02:00, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

When
When do you use the regular Ouendan, or the Blue Ouendan? Or do you choose? Luigi6138 23:48, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The map is divided into two. You play the regular Ouendan on the left half and the blue Ouendan on the right half. The only exception is the final stage. Ketsumaru 01:16, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Beat patterns
Is this the first time they overlapped beats onto tracks or did they do this in EBA?209.91.61.251 02:25, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * They did that in EBA, see Jumpin' Jack Flash on Sweatin'/Hard Rock. --Guess Who 03:13, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Cover Versions
Which songs are cover versions, and which are real (by the original artist)? I have a feeling that Sekai wa Sore wo Ai to Yobun Da Ze is a real version. Luigi6138 01:44, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Someone who's beaten the game and can read some name kanji should be able to tell. If I had the credits on-hand I could easily tell you if it were a cover or not, but the actual singer...—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 02:47, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Sekai wa Sore has a good cover artist, but it's still definitely a cover. The cover vocalist doesn't have as good of a scream. :P --Guess Who 03:44, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

The effect of Xs and Os on the final ending
"At the end of the story, the amount of Os and Xs will determine the outcome (for example, all Os will result in the true ending whilst all Xs get a bad ending.)" - This seems to be incorrect. I have passed some songs with multiple Xes (including failing all the partial stages and getting the "consolation scroll" on the graph screen), getting good endings only. Can someone confirm/deny it? -Arael
 * I dunno about Ouendan 2, but in EBA, if you get any Xs you won't get a bad ending, per se, just one that isn't as good. For example, in "Material Girl" perfect Os results in the girls saying "we love taming wild beasts" upon arriving back in port followed by a large graphic taking up both screens, whereas getting Xs results in them saying "um...it was tropical?" without any sort of artwork.—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 03:48, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
 * And if you get all Xs in Material Girl the Airplane crashes back onto the island, so the sisters are stuck there with the animals. Just thought I'd add that. -- Rabin 20:04, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Really then. o.o; Well...I've never gotten all Xs and survived, so...guess I've been trumped.—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 22:25, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
 * In Ouendan 1, they did not have different endings based on your Xs and Os. Whether it's the same for Ouendan 2, I am not sure. 67.167.181.126 05:45, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
 * There are different endings in Ouendan 2. For example, if you clear the pro wrestler's stage and get all Os, the pottery master will present the wrestler's mother-in-law with a new vase. If you get at least one but not all Xs, he'll give her the ceramic record/plate he made during his stage in Ouendan 1. --4.243.33.68 01:41, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Samurai Blue and Vista?
Is there any source that says these aren't covers? They sound like the originals and all, but that doesn't mean they must be the original artist. And from what I understand, the credits bunch the cover artists at the end and don't show you who did which song. So does it actually say anywhere that those aren't covers? --Impossible 09:58, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
 * They sound EXACTLY the same as the original tracks, and then I mean perfectly the same. So unless there are two artists out there who can cover each song perfectly, without even making a slight difference in tone, I would guess they are not covers. The source is my ears, and maybe yours too if you compare the original songs with the tracks you hear in Ouendan 2. It's just like Melody in Ouendan 1; An original song that has been cut here and there to fit the 3 minute length of the stage.
 * The only thing I don't understand is why Rirura Riruha and Countdown also have been denoted as originals, since I cannot make out the original artists from those. Clamticore 00:35, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Rirura Riruha might be, COUNTDOWN is definitely not. HYDE has more of a "surfer dude" voice than the cover artist. Get the original and listen to the choruses of both. COUNTDOWN: http://208.53.158.138/soundtracks/osu-tatakae-ouendan-2/yyiqelyloo/07.hyde-countdown.mp3, Rirura Riruha: http://208.53.158.138/soundtracks/osu-tatakae-ouendan-2/qukhkaipdo/15.kimura-kaera-rirura-riruha.mp3. Luigi6138 00:48, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Rirura Riruha isn't. You can definitely hear differences in the guitar sound and the singer's voice. Vista and Samurai Blue are definitely originals, though. --Guess Who 22:12, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Stage descriptions
I see that Urutapu is, in HTML comments, prepping stage descriptions for the songs. I will point out that the other two Ouendan/EBA articles at one point had stage descriptions but these were removed based on the reasoning they were game guide type material. --Masem 13:43, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Game guide..? They're what make up the plot (how ever convoluted it may be)...—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 00:28, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I fail to see how stage descriptions are "game guide" material when they do not provide gameplay advice or strategies. Wikipedia articles for other games, including games that have become featured articles, have rather detailed storyline sections.--4.242.18.52 16:58, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
 * The main story and focus of the game is the Ouendan squads. The stages are the individual levels, and per CVG guidelines, these are not to be spelled out within WP articles. --Masem 19:44, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I still fail to see how describing a particular scenario is "game guide" material. Perhaps it might be if the article were to discuss all possible endings for the stages, but surely identifying the basic nature of the scenarios isn't game guide-esque. When I think game guides, I think the high technical (and frequently story-less) guides found on GameFAQs.--4.242.63.183 22:54, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I was actually the person who went through and deleted the episode titles from the track listing in the Ouendan and EBA articles, but I am starting to question my actions. Without the translated episode titles (or perhaps a brief description of which song goes to which episode), those of us who know no Japanese do not know the name/artist of the song being played for each stage (unless part of the song title is in English).  This may be a bit too detailed for Wikipedia, however, so I'm just throwing my thoughts out there. --DarkAdonis255 17:24, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Songs; a lot of them aren't covers
I've been looking over this for awhile now, and I think I've figured some things out about which songs are covers and which aren't in the game. In the back of the game manual it lists the songwriter and the composer for each and every song, in that order (songwriter, then composer). Quite a number of the songs list the songwriters (which I'm sure are the original artists) and the composers as being the same group for each part of the song. Specifically: Zenryoku Shonen, POP STAR, Go my way, VISTA, Zoku, COUNTDOWN, and Sekai wo Sore wa Ai to Yobundaze. Also, Shonen Heart, Kibun Joujou, Believe, and Samurai Blue have either some/all of the songwriter(s) listed as a composer along with other artists' names (cover artists, obviously). After studying all of the original versions of the songs, I've come to the conclusion that all of the songs that I listed are either: the original version of the song cut down to suit the level, a similar-sounding version of the song performed by cover artists on the instruments (although in Kibun Joujou's case, one of the two singers is a cover artist, while the other is not), or the song was remixed to make it better-suited for use in the game. If anyone thinks that I am incorrect on this matter, either check the manual (in the case that you actually have a copy), or I could scan my copy of the manual if need be. But in any case, I believe that the songs that I mentioned should be denoted as being performed by the original artists (or for the second set of songs that I mentioned, performed by some/all of the original artists along with cover artists). D i saster K i rby 19:26, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Cut downs include Vista and Samurai Blue (Underneath the song's descriptions in the credits, these two say "Licensed by [record company]). In Kibun Joujou, Miyake is definitely there, whereas Hiroko sounds completely different. Thought that I wanted to point that out. I think you missed on the second part, for the other artists under "Composers" could just be writers who wrote the song along with them. That's my take. 67.82.34.205 21:29, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Miyake is definitely covered as well. The real Miyake has a more "vacant" voice. Luigi6138 18:59, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Except that the composers are the ones that compose the songs, as in they do the actual making of the music. The songwriters are the only ones that contribute to the lyrics of the songs, which would mean that the songwriters have to be the original composers (although Samurai Blue is likely an exception; perhaps ZZ composed the original version, but weren't involved in the creation of the lyrics). Also, VISTA and Samurai Blue aren't the only songs that have been cut down; a number of the songs that I mentioned have at least one section of the lyrics removed in the in-game version. D i saster K i rby 22:19, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Composers and songwriters are the same thing. Composers don't perform the music, they compose it, meaning they write it. If I write a song, and another band performs it, I'm still the composer. Also, the term you're looking for is lyricist, a person who writes lyrics. --Guess Who 10:00, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
 * ...Oh. But if that's the case, then they're essentially writing down two different groups for doing to same exact thing, and that is writing the music. Perhaps I mistranslated what the first term means? D i saster K i rby 16:20, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
 * You must have. Luigi6138 18:59, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Like I said, one of the credits is the composer and one is the lyricist. For instance, for READY STEADY GO in the first Ouendan, tetsu wrote the music, making him the composer for the song, while hyde wrote the lyrics, making him the lyricist - hence there is one listing in the credits for tetsu and one for hyde. If one person wrote the song, or if the band wrote the song together, then the same person or group would get both credits. --Guess Who 06:40, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh oh oh!... So in that case, I have no idea what I'm talking about then. Disregard, only VISTA and Samurai Blue are originals because they are licensed, yadda yadda yadda. D i saster K i rby 02:08, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

Title translation
Osu means Go not Hey. There is clear proof if you listen to the girls from Very Hard mode. They shout GO! witch is the real engilish word for Go. IGNORE EBA'S HEY THING! IT'S TOTALLY DIFFRENT! I'd fix it but I don't know how. Same goes for the first game. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.85.139.4 (talk • contribs)
 * Obviously you didn't even attempt to translate the word 'Osu'. It is translated as 'Hey'. It is sometimes used as a casual greeting. Believe me, I know. The girls just say 'Go' instead for some unknown reason. D i saster K i rbyTalk 17:25, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I would only guess the girls say "Go!" because a Western cheerleader would stereotypically yell that ("go team!" etc...)—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 01:47, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Just never touch Google Translate's translation: Burn! Thermal blood rhythm soul pushing patience! Fighting obtaining! Cheer group 2.Luigi6138 16:25, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
 * It's like they're translating the individual kanji and not words.—Ｌｏｖｅはドコ？ (talk • contribs) 16:46, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah, really.Luigi6138 02:40, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Reopened controversy
The article title has been played around with by Amake. They switched it to Ōendan 2 per Wiki manual of style. Wasn't there a controversy when somebody changed the title of the Original O1 article? And then it was reverted? Please look into this matter. Personally, everyone knows this as Ouendan 2. What happened. Revert if necessary. Luigi6138 17:22, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Hm, while it's technically the correct way to spell the title in English, according to WP:MOS-JP #6.2, if the title is normally translated differently in English-speaking areas, then the article should be spelled as the subject is referred to in English (or so I've just read). Also, I think that #6.6 may come into play here as well, but I'm not entirely sure. The title should probably be reverted back ASAP, yeah. D i saster K i rbyTalk 17:30, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Same thing on the original Oeundan article. And I agree, 6.2 says use the English trade name first, which "ouendan" is clearly correct.--Masem 17:32, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, I've taken the liberty to move the article back to its old article name (although now the article doesn't even appear on my watchlist... must be a glitch) . Oh wait, there's the talk page. I guess the article is being treated as if it were never moved, so it's staying at whenever it was last edited... No, it actually was a glitch, I guess, since the article reappeared for me after I edited it a little bit. Odd. D i saster K i rbyTalk 17:39, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Characters section
The characters section for the Yuuhi Town Ouendan has lots of omake information on the backgrounds of those characters from the Ouendan 2 website. Can someone do the same to the Asahi Town Ouendan, or delete the information altogether? Luigi6138 21:40, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Reika's hair isn't purple
Done deal. It just isn't. Please stop adding this in at once! Especially you IP users. And this includes silver-purple. It's not. Luigi6138 19:17, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

WP:MOS-JA on song titles
Spelling, including macron usage, of the name of a modern figure should adhere to the following, in order of preference: Focus on numbers 1 and 5. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Luigi6138 (talk • contribs) 21:40, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
 * 1) Use the official trade name if available in English/Latin alphabet;
 * 2) Use the form found in a dictionary entry from a generally-accepted English dictionary;
 * 3) Use the form publicly used on behalf of the person in the English-speaking world;
 * 4) Use the form publicly used on behalf of the person in any other popular Latin-alphabet-using language (French, Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, German, and Dutch, or variations); or
 * 5) If none of the above is available, use the macronned form.


 * Wow, good job ignoring this section:
 * Titles of songs, and the names of singers, companies and so forth are often capitalized when written in Roman script within a Japanese-language context or (in flyers, posters, etc.) for a Japanese audience, and the relevant publicity departments or fanbases may vehemently insist on the importance of the capitalization. However, these names and name elements are not excluded from the guidance provided by the main manuals of style for English-language Wikipedia, listed above. Words should not be written in all caps in the English Wikipedia. For example, although the title of the manga Bleach is always written as "BLEACH" in Japanese (e.g. in its article within Japanese-language Wikipedia), it should be written as Bleach within the English-language Wikipedia.
 * Reverting. -Amake 00:50, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Is this still Start-class?
Yeah. I think it's B-class. Some B-class articles are worse than this. Like Drake & Josh. That article is terribly written and trivia heavy. Luigi6138 18:07, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Not going to comment on its quality, but will say that you should compare the article to the BEST B article, not the worst. - A Link to the Past (talk) 18:37, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

=2009=

Kaoru Kiryūin
Is this a character in the game? He's listed in Kaoru as being in it but I can't find any Kaoru on the page, is there a character page? I'd like to find out of this is real or not. Tyciol (talk) 22:06, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Yes that is the name of a character in this game. http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/9733/ouenmemberseq2.jpg KingKon97 (talk) 00:33, 30 August 2009 (UTC)