Talk:Mont Blanc massif/GA1

GA Review
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Reviewer: Cwmhiraeth (talk · contribs) 08:44, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

I propose to take on this review and will make a detailed reading of the article shortly. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 08:44, 4 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Initial comment - in the "Flora" section, the species names, and any genera names that may be used there or elsewhere, should be in italics. I have never seen other language Wikipedias linked in that way. Is there a precedent? Cwmhiraeth (talk) 08:51, 4 April 2016 (UTC)
 * You are quite correct; I will address this. Now ✅ Parkywiki (talk) 21:47, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

First reading
Leaving the lead for the time being: -
 * For a start, the article is very well written and most of the points listed below are minor errors.
 * "The southern side the massif lies within Italy" - missing word.✅ Parkywiki (talk) 01:14, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
 * "The borders of all three countries converge at a tripoint on the summit of Mont Dolentat an altitude of " - missing word.✅ Parkywiki (talk) 01:14, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
 * "Across the massif there are now more than two thousand different mountaineering routes to the summits, and of a wide range of difficulties and lengths." - this sentence does not need the "and". Please deal with the "citation needed" tag.✅ Parkywiki (talk) 01:14, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
 * In the first paragraph of "Glaciers", you express areas in three different formats. You should choose one (with imperial equivalents) and stick to it.✅ Parkywiki (talk) 01:14, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
 * "Two of the bodies were discovered forty years later on the Bossons glacier in 15 August 1861." - "on" rather than "in", and it has already been stated that it was 1861.✅ Parkywiki (talk) 01:14, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
 * "having been carried 10,000 feet downhill" - You should stick to one main unit system; metric would be more suitable because the article is about continental Europe.✅ Parkywiki (talk) 14:00, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
 * "shielding provided by the 4,800 feet (1,500 m) " - ditto. ✅ Parkywiki (talk) 14:00, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
 * this is a tricky one to get looking right, as the correct units are meter water equivalent - I'm relectant to explain this concept in the article, and hope that the wikilink to the cosmic ray measurement article would suffice? Parkywiki (talk) 14:00, 7 April 2016 (UTC)


 * "collected over 600 pounds of specimens" - ditto.✅ Parkywiki (talk) 14:00, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
 * "The crystal museum (Musée des Cristaux) opened to the public in 2006, tells the story" - Punctuation needed. ✅ (reworded) Parkywiki (talk) 14:00, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
 * The sentence starting "However, near the summit of Mont Blanc" is a bit confusing because it is somewhat unclear where the "1,100 mm" refers to.✅ Parkywiki (talk) 02:00, 8 April 2016 (UTC)
 * The section "Climate" seems to be almost entirely about precipitation, although it does mention weather systems. It would be useful to include information on temperature, wind and other meteorological features. However, GA does not require an article to be comprehensive, so don't feel obligated to add this. In fact, you could just rename the section "Precipitation".✅
 * Fair point. I have temporarily renamed this section 'Precipitation', as you suggest, but will research this further and update the article when I have amassed sufficient data to meet the FA criteria. Parkywiki (talk) 02:00, 8 April 2016 (UTC)


 * " from the valley bottoms at 500 m (1,600 ft) above sea-level," - safest not to mention these figures as they differ from those in the previous section.✅ I think this was a typo in the original source - the IGN maps clearly show all valley bottoms starting over 1,000m Parkywiki (talk) 12:43, 8 April 2016 (UTC)
 * "one of the loftiest patches of vegetation in Europe upon an islet of rock in the midst of a wilderness of snow and ice". - This statement needs a citation. ✅ Parkywiki (talk) 12:43, 8 April 2016 (UTC)
 * "with the designation of the Pavillon du Mont Frety protected area" - Perhaps add "as a" before "protected area". ✅
 * "7,000 m²" - I thought that was the area of the protected area but in fact it is the size of the botanic garden. ✅ (reworded) Parkywiki (talk) 12:43, 8 April 2016 (UTC)
 * That's all for now. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 10:31, 6 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Thank you for this feedback, Cwmhiraeth. I'll address each of your points and mark each one when 'done'. Parkywiki (talk) 14:04, 6 April 2016 (UTC) ✅


 * Continuing -
 * I am struck by the great gap in the "Human culture" section between 1741 and the 1930s. On further thoughts, I think the last two paragraphs of that section are out of place, because the next section deals with the gap. The final two paragraphs are not tourism-related so could perhaps form a short section later on. ✅
 * "A trade in selling local items to visiting foreigners soon developed, with items such as horn objects, honey, and especially crystals from the mountains, collected from across the massif being much in demand." - This sentence is a bit convoluted and needs more punctuation.✅
 * "It also reported that in that year the railway service to Chamonix, which had previously been suspended in winter, had begun to run two trains per day." - Perhaps it might be better to say that it ran throughout the year.✅
 * Its not really logical to put the "Recent enhancements to tourist infrastructure" paragraph where it is because the article at this point hasn't mentioned the existing infrastructure. ✅
 * "It was renovated in the aftermath, reopening 3 years later." - The subject of the previous sentence was the "fire".✅
 * "From Chamonix the Aiguille du Midi Cable Car (fr) rises to the 3,842m summit of the Aiguille du Midi, and holds the world record for the highest vertical ascent of any cable car (2,807m)." - A citation is needed for this fact. ✅
 * "It was carried out by jointly by academic institutions from France," - Too many "by"s. ✅
 * "No evidence was found linking uranium contamination either to the 1986 Chernobyl disaster or to other nuclear power plants." - I think this sentence would be better as "No evidence was found that the 1986 Chernobyl disaster or nuclear power plants had caused significant uranium contamination." or somesuch. ✅
 * "The Mer de Glace has retreated 2,300 m (7,500 ft)metres in length since 1820 and, at Montenvers, has reduced in thickness by 150 metres." - This sentence needs attention. Be consistent in how you write units. ✅
 * "In the last 20 years it has been retreating at a rate of around 30 metres per year and, since 1994, has lost 500 m in length and 70 m in depth." - Ditto. It would be good to have conversions for all these measurements.✅
 * Finally, looking back at the lead and assessing whether it successfully summarises the article, I find:
 * There is information on the "Tour du Mont Blanc " which is not mentioned in the body of the article.✔️
 * The lead is too short. The first two paragraphs are adequate but the third paragraph needs expansion to cover the major points of the "Human history" and "Environmental protection" sections. ✅
 * Altogether it's an excellent article and I look forward to passing it for GA when these points have been dealt with. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 10:29, 9 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Le Petit Journal 4 August 1901 cover.jpg Thanks for all your help, Cwmhiraeth. I believe I've now addressed all the points you raised. It's taken 4 months of solid work to turn this from a quite appalling list article to the state it's in today - there's still more that could be done, of course. (next stop: climate). Parkywiki (talk) 01:47, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

GA criteria

 * The article is well written and complies with MOS guidelines on prose and grammar, structure and layout.
 * The article uses many reliable third-party sources, and makes frequent citations to them. I do not believe it contains original research.
 * The article covers the main aspects of the subject and remains focussed.
 * The article is neutral.
 * The article is stable.
 * The images are relevant and have suitable captions, and are either in the public domain or properly licensed.


 * Final assessment - The points that I have made in this review have been addressed. I believe this article surpasses the GA criteria. Well done! Cwmhiraeth (talk) 05:15, 11 April 2016 (UTC)