Talk:Mozart's starling

The American Scientist article also mentions the presence of veiled mourners. Of course one would like to know who they were, but the article does not say. One would also like to know what music was apparently performed at the occasion (there were hymns, according to that article; IIRC there are also some suggestions that Mozart composed some music. If so none of it survives.) (Irrelevant P.S.: I actually like the starling's G♯, which also makes harmonic sense, if a little unexpected! It would have been so cute if Mozart had decided to change the last occurrence of the theme as a result!) Double sharp (talk) 14:29, 7 November 2014 (UTC)


 * Thank you. I've finally figured out the original source for this (Niemetschek's early biography seems to be the fullest) but I need a minute to find my copy.  Opus33 (talk) 03:01, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

Let's not mention only "one theory".
Alfred Einstein (in Mozart: His Character, His Work, to use the English-language title) argued that Mozart, on hearing the starling, was concerned that someone (an orchestral musician in rehearsal seems likely) had copied the (closely-to-the-chest-held) parts to the concerto (or just memorized the tune, of course), which had gotten to one of the former owners of the starling, which had learned the melody- so Mozart while liking the bird was not so happy overall, and upset about possible piracy. Schissel | Sound the Note! 16:03, 10 September 2017 (UTC)


 * Hello, Schissel, It would be fine to put this in, since it's sourced. On the other hand, it seems awfully unlikely to me, especially the bit about Mozart being piqued about piracy.  To steal a concerto in a way that would have any commercial value, you would have to obtain all of the parts, not easy for any one musician. Beyond this, it seems an enormous coincidence for Mozart to have encountered a starling singing his music simply at random; if the teacher of the bird was not Mozart, then it is far more likely that this person first taught the bird the tune, then brought Mozart to hear it. Even granting this possibility, I still think it far more likely that Mozart, like many people who encounter a mimic-bird, tried teaching it something, just for fun, and was delighted when he succeeded.  Thanks,  Opus33 (talk) 17:47, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

(Hrm. Alfred Einstein seems to say very little about the concerto, unless I am mistaken. Was going by memory. Maybe I'm thinking of Girdlestone. Double-checking :) Though you have a point...) Schissel | Sound the Note! 19:31, 11 September 2017 (UTC) (Nope - Girdlestone - no mention of piracy etc. there ... not sure where, then...!)


 * Thanks for checking. Opus33 (talk) 16:44, 12 September 2017 (UTC)

Sketch for Lilyponding the music example


Image for reference:



Did the bird have a name?
I'm somewhat baffled that Robert Spaethling, who clearly knows what he's doing, apparently felt that "Vogel Star" was the bird's name. The only source we have is the expense book, which surely is merely saying something like "I just bought a starling-bird for 34 kreutzer," and nothing like "What a cute bird! Constanze and I have decided to name him Vogel Star".

So I replaced "Vogel Star" in the Spaethling quotation with ..., to avoid this can of worms. Correction from better-informed people is welcome. Incidentally, there is a similar name/designation issue at Eine kleine Nachtmusik. Opus33 (talk) 17:30, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

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