Talk:Mus'ab ibn al-Zubayr

Date of Birth
Hi, thanks for adding info on his early life. Can you find anything on his birth year or place of birth in the sources you've just added?  AhmadLX - )¯\_(ツ)_/¯) 15:22, 2 June 2019 (UTC)
 * I couldn't find anything about his date of birth. From the Ibn Sa'd source I only have snippet access, not sure if he mentions his birth year or age at death. I did add find little gems about his early life, including his youth studies with Abd al-Malik. In all likelihood, Mus'ab was born in Medina. His elder brother Abd Allah was born in the city and all indications are that Mus'ab spent his life there until being assigned to Iraq. But alas we have no source that explicitly says it was his birthplace. The Elad source contains a lot of information about Mus'ab's descendants during the Abbasid era, by the way. This might be useful later. Al Ameer (talk) 16:10, 2 June 2019 (UTC)

Sukayna bint Husayn
The sources you cited are non-RS, but they say the exact opposite of what you say. This one says: "Some historians mention that she planned to marry her cousin Kassem Ben Al Hassan but he was killed with his father before the wedding; she then married Musa’ab Ben Al-Zoubair."" The other one says: ""Historically speaking, in Karbala she had been around 11 years old. According to Tabari, Ibn Khallekan, Ibn Athir and many other historians she died in the year 117 A.H."" and it further says ""There is again a common mistake among people that Sakina died in the prison in Damascus . They also mistakenly hold that she was not more than 5 years old."" Whether she married Hasan's son before Mus'ab is irrelevant to this article. Your claims that "she was 5 years old when she died" and "she only married Hasan's son" are groundless. I suspect you don't read sources that you cite. Go read or ask someone who actually knows history, before returning back for edit war. Hope that helps. -- AhmadLX-(Wikiposta ) 17:05, 6 November 2019 (UTC)


 * The source which I have mentioned says that:


 * ""Imam Husain had two daughters. Fatima, and Sakina the younger one. When Hassan Mothanna, her cousin asked for the hand of Sakina in marriage, Imam Husain suggests Fatima, the older one, the reason being ‘I suggest Fatima who resembles my mother more. She is such a worshipping girl that most of the nights she prays and most of the days she is fasting. And about Sakina, she is engrossed with the Divine beauty of God and hence is not ready to marry anyone at this stage.' 4


 * However, she married later, her other cousin Abdullah Akbar, son of Imam Hassan, who was apparently martyred in Karbala.""
 * See it here:The role of Women in Karbala'


 * Also you have quoted that Sakina didn't died at prison of Damascus and was not five years old when she died. Hussain had three daughters i.e. Sakinah bint Hussain (Fatima al-kubra), second one Fatima bint Hussain (Fatima al-sughra) and the youngest one Ruqqayah (also known as Sakinah). The last daughter of Hussain, Ruqyyah (Sakina) died at the the age of 5 in prison of Damascus, not the eldest daughter Sakina (Fatima al-kubra). This is what the source is trying to say. At first there was confusion between the elder and youngest daughter of Hussain as both had same names. Ruqqayah was never married and died at the age of 5 in Damascus, whereas Sakinah the eldest one was married to Hassan's son Abdullah as satetd by the source. Moreover the other source that you have mentioned sate that Some historions have satetd that she was married to Mus'ab, but not all of them. Therefore this matter is disputed. Al Mufid (Shaykh Mufid) in Al-Irshaad (book) have denied this marriage of Sakina to Mus'ab. Also Al-Baladhuri in Ansaab ul ashraaf (Baladhuri, Ansab al-ashraf, vol. 2, p. 195) and Qadi Nuaman in Sharh al-Akhbar (Maghribi, Sharḥ al-akhbār, vol. 3, p. 180-181) mentioned that Sakina was married to Hasan's son Abdullah. Ibn e Hazam in Ansaab ul Arab also states the same and the list goes on. Therefore it is also important to meniton these references and this matter which a disputed one should be mentioned as disputed in the article. You should state the belief of both sects. If you want to say anything else, please inform me on my talk page. Thanks User:Tubi719
 * There is still the WP:RS issue which AhmadLX had touched on. I urge you to find a published secondary source to use instead of what you had previously cited. Google Books would be a good place to start looking. Alivardi (talk) 14:41, 7 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Firs off, As I said before, her marriage to Hasan's son doesn't concern us here. Whether she married him or not, is relevant to article on her and on the son of Hasan. So please don't divert the subject. Also, as I said before, these are blog-like sites written by people like you and me, and do not constitute WP:RS. That mathaba.net article contradicts itself: It says she was born in 47AH and died in 60AH [sic] in the opening para. Further down, it says she died in 117AH. I quoted these article because, although they are non-RS, you skewed them and portrayed them to be supporting what they actually don't. Check RS link, read it to get sense of what RS means. Then, when you find RS that say that her death year/marriage to Mus'ab is disputed, bring those RS. RS like EI2 don't say it is disputed, so it won't be changed based on websites of dubious credibility. And again, please don't make up stories; EI2 cites Baladhuri and Abul-Faraj Isfahani for her marriage to Mus'ab. Don't create bogus claims out of thin air that Baladhuri denies this. Also, article talk page is the venue for discussion on issues related to articles. AhmadLX-(Wikiposta ) 19:18, 7 November 2019 (UTC)

I reverted your recent edits because you removed information cited to Reliable Sources. The subject of Mus'ab's marriage to Sukayna has been discussed, as you can see in this thread. Before attempting to remove this information, please discuss here first. However, nothing will likely change unless reliable sources are cited which argue for its removal or modification. Al Ameer (talk) 20:59, 2 June 2022 (UTC)